http://www.azleg.gov/legtext/49leg/2r/bills/sb1070s.pdf NBA superstar Charles Barkley and others such as myself are outraged with this new law. Now officers can racially profile anyone who looks Mexican and ask them for their legality papers. I asked my mexican roommate what he would do if a cop asked him, he replied that he would tell the cop, "go fuck yourself."
According to the US Census Bureau, AZ had a 6,595,778 population in 2009. In 2008 30.1% of these people were persons of Hispanic or Latino origin. Furthermore, Arizona used to be in Mexico... "In the Mexican–American War (1847), the U.S. occupied Mexico City and forced the newly founded Mexican Republic to give up its northern territories, including what later became Arizona" (wiki) Then again, countless Native American tribes were deported when we claimed America, so I gather this is standard protocol.
This law has already started protests of the state of Arizona, including one by Pima County Sheriff Clarence Dupnik who refuses to uphold the law, saying it is "unwise", "stupid", and "racist."
Personally, as a non-mexican arizonan i find this law comparable to Nazi Germany's separation and purification techniques, and all together just flat out wack. Thoughts? If anyone is for this law please state your reasoning as it baffles me that a resident of this fine state would support it.
The law is too extreme and will not be enforced due to its unpopularity. I expect the law repealed soon. However, that still leaves the problem of enforcing the immigration laws already on the books. We need to revisit those laws since they aren't being enforced either.
Funny thing is some people fail to separate the idea of "opposing a bad law" vs. "supporting illegal immigration". Just because you do not support this law does not mean you are in favor of illegal immigration.
(didn't watch the vid) Not from AZ, I'm from Ohio, and we have a fair bit of illegals here. Actually, a few years back (3-4) a drunk illegal immigrant and his buddy (maybe legal, at least one was not), crashed their car into my car parked on the street. They were both hammered, and tried to run away from the scene. Police later found them, maybe they were deported, but the insurance company paid for the car (Kelly Blue Book value). Illegals are really just a money sink on society. They receive our benefits, but do not pay taxes.
There's clearly a problem of illegal immigration (especially in AZ), and this is one way to try to stop it. Really, this law doesn't bother me. Sure, if you look illegal, you get stopped and asked to see ID. If you're legal, show them the ID, you're on your way in less than 30 seconds. It's a simple way to try to cut down on illegal immigration, that's all it is. Really, I think they just wanted to get the ball rolling. Get people discussing, get them coming up with better solutions.
I don't understand why people are so upset, sure, they're profiling, but just show them some ID if you're legal and you move on. It happens at airports too. Until there is a better solution, this one seems "good enough" and will get people talking about it, which may have been the intent of lawmakers.
On May 12 2010 09:58 ragnasaur wrote: Personally, as a non-mexican arizonan i find this law comparable to Nazi Germany, and just flat out wack.
I wish you wouldn't say things like this (both because it's an odd exaggeration and it distracts from the main point) but I agree, seems like a ton of bullshit
On May 12 2010 09:58 ragnasaur wrote: Personally, as a non-mexican arizonan i find this law comparable to Nazi Germany, and just flat out wack.
I wish you wouldn't say things like this (both because it's an odd exaggeration and it distracts from the main point) but I agree, seems like a ton of bullshit
Actually, yeah. I missed this, but this is not Nazi Germany. There is no killing. No torture. No genocide. It does not even compare. Not close.
I am really confused as to how illegals in the states get benefits. Someone above mentioned this; when I watched Law and Order this was mentioned countless number of times. Maybe we are talking about different benefits?
In Canada to enroll in schools you need several documents to prove that you are the person you say you are; to get health care you need a health card, which shouldn't be accessible by someone who arrived illegally. To claim employment insurance you need a SIN card.... so unless a person manages to fake all of that (which is pretty hard, I think, because all of them have a number to it, which is probably linked to some databse), I don't see anyone in Canada illegally can get any benefits at all.
On May 12 2010 09:58 ragnasaur wrote: Personally, as a non-mexican arizonan i find this law comparable to Nazi Germany, and just flat out wack.
I wish you wouldn't say things like this (both because it's an odd exaggeration and it distracts from the main point) but I agree, seems like a ton of bullshit
Actually, yeah. I missed this, but this is not Nazi Germany. There is no killing. No torture. No genocide. It does not even compare. Not close.
You are completely right, but you have to admit, asking for people's papers is kind of their catchphrase.
Some changes have been made to the law since it was first passed. The substantive change is that police can only check for illegal status while enforcing some other law or ordinance. Like if you've been caught speeding. Before, police only had to have reasonable suspicion even if you weren't doing anything else illegal.
On May 12 2010 10:21 jpak wrote: Actually, illegal immigrants do pay taxes in the U.S, so people saying that illegal immigrants don't pay taxes are ignorant.
Just throwing that out there.
Is this because they pay taxes for goods and services?
comparable to Nazi Germany solely because asking citizens for their papers and citizenship. This isn't as extreme or severe as regulated extermination, but to me it rivals the separation and purification techniques. Edited the OP.
I dunno what to think of this, but it seems like a question of giving mexicans the benefit of doubt. Illegal immigration is a big issue, and if previous immigration laws were proven futile, this could be seen as a last resort to really crack down on it
How is any of this bad? They're illegal immigrants. illegal. as in, they're not lawfully in the country/state. They're criminals.
And where does racial profiling come in? It states, and i quote, "WHERE REASONABLE SUSPICION EXISTS".
How is it unconstitutional? It basically states "Where a law enforcement officer has reasonable suspicion that someone is a illegal immigrant (criminal), they can ask for ID to confirm." So it basically allows officers to uphold a law that's already in the criminal code.
On May 12 2010 09:58 ragnasaur wrote: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SZ98z4__H-g http://www.azleg.gov/legtext/49leg/2r/bills/sb1070s.pdf NBA superstar Charles Barkley and others such as myself are outraged with this new law. Now officers can racially profile anyone who looks Mexican and ask them for their legality papers. I asked my mexican roommate what he would do if a cop asked him, he replied that he would tell the cop, "go fuck yourself."
According to the US Census Bureau, AZ had a 6,595,778 population in 2009. In 2008 30.1% of these people were persons of Hispanic or Latino origin. Furthermore, Arizona used to be in Mexico... "In the Mexican–American War (1847), the U.S. occupied Mexico City and forced the newly founded Mexican Republic to give up its northern territories, including what later became Arizona" (wiki) Then again, countless Native American tribes were deported when we claimed America, so I gather this is standard protocol.
This law has already started protests of the state of Arizona, including one by Pima County Sheriff Clarence Dupnik who refuses to uphold the law, saying it is "unwise", "stupid", and "racist."
Personally, as a non-mexican arizonan i find this law comparable to Nazi Germany, and just flat out wack. Thoughts? If anyone is for this law please state your reasoning as it baffles me that a resident of this fine state would support it.
1. The law doesn't allow a cop to just walk up to any Mexican and ask for their papers... so I wish ignorant people like the OP would stop saying it would be open season on Mexicans. You can only question someone if it is during a police required situation (like if someone had a car crash).
2. The law specifically says you can't profile based on race. If you don't think this will work then you have a problem with police not the law. Infact, if the police officer can't prove he had merit to ask then he can be SUED. I'm sure they will still run around racial profiling.
3. If you are in the US on a vista or visiting for whatever reason FEDERAL law already says you must carry documentation with you. Last I checked it's still ILLEGAL to be in the country so really all this does is enforce long-standing federal law. What it does is give is officers a legal backing for following up on suspicions.
4. Your roommate is a moron. You can't choose to not follow certain laws just because you don't want to.
5. Comparing this to Nazi Germany is as pathetic as Tea partiers who compare higher tax rates (very low historically) to having genocide commited against them.
6. Noone should give a shit waht the cheif of police's and such say because they are political figureheads. It's widely known that while the CoP are against this law the actual police orginizations are for it.
7. Your example of Arizona being a part of Mexico at one point is absurd and non-relevant. we just magically owned the whole east and north parts of the country from nothingness I suppose.
8. Our state passed it. Most of the people in the state (and apparently the country by many polls) are for this law. This is a democracy. On top of that we have state rights. Deal with it or leave the country or just don't come to Arizona we don't care.
EPT
