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ghostnuke1234
164 Posts
When I mention "significant tourney," I mean a tournament with the top players of each race competing - for instance: Idra, Sheth, Huk, Kiwikaki, Cauthon, QXC, Slush, Machine, Whitera, etc. Within the US server, if we consider QXC, Cauthon, LZ, Kawaiirice, Drewbie, and Louder the top Terran players, I can't recall any of these players winning a significant tourney for some time. Does anybody have a list of the tourneys won by a top Terran player? | ||
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USn
United States376 Posts
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holy_war
United States3590 Posts
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Fath0m
United States12 Posts
If it was an honest/innocent question, just ignore me  | ||
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MorroW
Sweden3522 Posts
yes, terran is the worst race at the moment but its becoming better every patch | ||
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goswser
United States3548 Posts
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Cade)Flayer
United Kingdom279 Posts
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weeeee
Australia71 Posts
now that is gone the only hope is to make attack after attack at zerg....but their macro is so good that they can have about 10 spine crawlers around there base and just camp. It feels like a perfectly played terran has no chance against a perfectly played zerg. Like zerg could give vision to terran and still be fine where as if zerg scouts the terran army its kinda screwed. | ||
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Bear4188
United States1797 Posts
Obviously there aren't winning 33%* if that's what you're wondering. But notable winners have been DeMuslim, MorroW, CauthonLuck, Lucifron, Jinro. They certainly seem to be doing better on Europe than NA, and it sounds like Asia is just dominated by Zerg. Discounting random, of which there have been some successful players, notably TheLittleOne. Personally, I think there's a huge problem when you get to late macro games for Terran's production capacity where Zerg can stockpile larvae on 3-5 hatches and Protoss has a full warpgate production cycle on standby and chronoboost. Meanwhile Terran has the ability to mass marines, hellions, and vikings through an addon that takes several eons to build and sacrifices their ability to build hi tech units. | ||
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Setz3R
United States455 Posts
MorroW - 1st place, SC2 Beta CraftCup #1 Jinro - 1st place, SC2 Beta CraftCup #6 LucifroN - 1st place, ESL TV Pro Invite Cup 1st, place Go4SC2_ESL March I probably missed a few more. Most of the top players DO compete in craftcups and zotac cups, so just because they aren't "invite" tournaments, doesn't make it any less significant (besides the fact that they might have an "easy" first few rounds vs randoms). | ||
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Smikis
Lithuania117 Posts
On May 09 2010 10:51 Cade)Flayer wrote: I think right now we are seeing the evolution of the Zerg metagame to what we have been hearing about on the Asian servers. The other races will find a solution. lmao.. zerg only won, cuz all of terrans did was go mmm every single game.. not to dis this invitational tourney, but skill lvl from terrans were far from what we were promised.. when they keep massing marauders vs hydras.. when ravens/tanks/helions counters them so badly.. you know zerg will eventually win.. in mid platinum, terrans wont spamm marauders.. yet in tourney they do.. talk about needing another league.. or not | ||
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ZidaneTribal
United States2800 Posts
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NATO
United States459 Posts
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Zergneedsfood
United States10671 Posts
On May 09 2010 11:00 Smikis wrote: lmao.. zerg only won, cuz all of terrans did was go mmm every single game.. not to dis this invitational tourney, but skill lvl from terrans were far from what we were promised.. when they keep massing marauders vs hydras.. when ravens/tanks/helions counters them so badly.. you know zerg will eventually win.. in mid platinum, terrans wont spamm marauders.. yet in tourney they do.. talk about needing another league.. or not I actually agree. But keep in mind that tech switching midgame is incredibly hard. These players have practiced strategies day in and day out, and in a tournament situation, you don't just deviate from a plan that you've specifically created for this tournament. So in a way, you're right. When I saw Marauders against Hydralisks I was getting a bit confused as to the nature of Terran play. But most of us in a high stakes tournament like that would usually not do something so different. Any player likes to stick with what's comfortable, and right now, marauders are much more comfortable. | ||
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weeeee
Australia71 Posts
If terran goes mech its so slow to get out that zerg can get 3 bases quite easily. You think people haven't tried to go mech vs zerg? All the mech players have an even worse record in tornments than mnm players do. All the terran counters to mass hydra can die so fast to zerg counters its not funny. And hellions don't counter hydra when hydras mass beyond a certain point. I am so sick of zerg players complaining about boring mnm play when like what else can terran do? | ||
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MorroW
Sweden3522 Posts
On May 09 2010 11:03 Zergneedsfood wrote: I actually agree. But keep in mind that tech switching midgame is incredibly hard. These players have practiced strategies day in and day out, and in a tournament situation, you don't just deviate from a plan that you've specifically created for this tournament. So in a way, you're right. When I saw Marauders against Hydralisks I was getting a bit confused as to the nature of Terran play. But most of us in a high stakes tournament like that would usually not do something so different. Any player likes to stick with what's comfortable, and right now, marauders are much more comfortable. i dont think most ppl realize how terrible marines actually r against z. i think we all can agree zerg practically has mapcontrol and maphack in this match up in mid+late game. if t makes marines (which takes up raxes with reactors to actually pump out a decent number since they take almost as long time as marauder to build) then zerg scouts it pops banelings and they FUCKING OWN MARINES SO HARD 5baneling alone would kill about 25 marines in a squad of 30 stimmed marines i think its really ignorant of u ppl to actually say that the zerg users r doing better because they r better. its impossible to say whos better because its so damn imba and the maps r just as big in the role i think we all should just assume that the terrans practice as much as the zergs, which is probably true and i think its also statistically proven that zergs has been winning with standard non-innovative strats such as roach hydra against crazy bos with tons of "brilliant" transitioning from terran offtopic but ive been playing mech for long time now and i guess thats a good example of what ur saying is bs... | ||
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metaphoR
United States199 Posts
every zerg unit is built through the hatchery every protoss unit is built through gateway/robo terran sucks because they cant keep up with high tech and production their buildings cost gas, tech labs cost gas, units cost gas. can only get fast units with reactor which also costs gas and a huge amount of time. this is probably why no terrans have won | ||
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ghostnuke1234
164 Posts
On May 09 2010 10:58 Bear4188 wrote: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Invitational_Tournaments Obviously there aren't winning 33%* if that's what you're wondering. But notable winners have been DeMuslim, MorroW, CauthonLuck, Lucifron, Jinro. They certainly seem to be doing better on Europe than NA, and it sounds like Asia is just dominated by Zerg. Thanks for the info. I have been wondering if the top NA Terran players are behind our European counterparts. I can say that for the US tourneys, the top Terran players can't seem to win it all and it is demoralizing at times. | ||
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BigDatez
Canada434 Posts
On May 09 2010 10:49 MorroW wrote: to answer OP's hidden question: yes, terran is the worst race at the moment but its becoming better every patch I think TvZ nearly guarentees a win for a T as long as he plays mech over MMM ATM, unless the Z gets broodlords, But, T can end it before 20 minutes in fairly easily. Protoss is definatly the strongest.. due to the "Volcano" strategy, which is unbeatable if he can get that high of macro (vortex, forcefield around vortex, let storms and/or collosus shoot inside (storms kills all the air units sucked in instantly), which destroys all army compositions. So in a way, you're right. When I saw Marauders against Hydralisks I was getting a bit confused as to the nature of Terran play. But most of us in a high stakes tournament like that would usually not do something so different. Any player likes to stick with what's comfortable, and right now, marauders are much more comfortable. Actually, Marauders do more DPS even against Hydras, than hydras do back with stim, and with medivacs, they get healed super-fast, not to mention, you can get effectively more than a 1:1 ratio of the amount of marauders on 1 base vs a 1 base zerg (half gas cost, mineral cost not as relevent, seeing as Z will always be at a gas deficency while making mutas, as terran wont be) Not to mention they have the amor, and have over 1.5 X the amount of HP as a hydra. Not to mention, they hardcounter Ultras, and roaches just as well, which is why a zerg player would be crazy to get any ultralisks in their current state vs a T player. if you look at terran production, they have it the worst. every zerg unit is built through the hatchery every protoss unit is built through gateway/robo Terran can also constantly be pumping out SCV's all game risk-free, as zerg has to carefully decide to drone-up, or get units. In lategame, it makes zerg more powerful, but all early to mid game, zergs at the disadvantage even with a queen. However, this is why Terran stick to MMM, OR mech (Mech is unbeatable for Z at this point with some marauders mixed up if the T can make the right amount) and not both. Quick techswitch is the only way to win.. Zerg units are ALOT less cost effective than protoss, and terran ones, thats why pretty much all zerg players expand, unless doing 1base tech (which is either for mutas, or baneling busts) | ||
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ghostnuke1234
164 Posts
On May 09 2010 10:58 Bear4188 wrote: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Invitational_Tournaments Obviously there aren't winning 33%* if that's what you're wondering. I hope it gets to the point where they are winning 33% - that is a sign of balance at the top level. To be frank, I could care less about how well balanced the game is at the bottom and even mid level. If we want SC2 to succeed as an E-Sport, we want to see balanced gameplay at the top level. | ||
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