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On October 01 2012 23:24 gonzaw wrote:Show nested quote +On October 01 2012 22:20 iamperfection wrote:On October 01 2012 20:28 Mementoss wrote:On October 01 2012 08:53 iamperfection wrote:
@ memen why did you not include strongandbig when you mentioned that i did not include anything of "value" yet. Because the difference between you and him at that point was you were active at 3 different occasions in the thread and chose not to say anything. S&B was active at the very start of the game, and then never posted, theres a difference I consider that inactive. Anyways, needless to say, I really disagree on the meta arguement that you are town, by their point, it would seem that you are fitting your scum play. At least when you posted in Rockband mini you had a purpose and you're one liners had something to do with the important discussion in town. Here is the quote im referring to: On October 01 2012 14:35 Keirathi wrote:On October 01 2012 14:33 strongandbig wrote:
oh also keirathi i think you said you have a slight meta-based townread on iamperfection, could you tell us about his meta in your opinion? if you didn't say this then whoever did say this pls answer that question but i think it was keirathi. It was me. I've played with scum iamperfection in a newbie game a couple months ago, and observed a few of his recent townie games. In his townie games he is cocky, while in his scum game he was careful and lurky. I know it was a while ago, and that doesn't necessarily mean he wouldn't be cocky if he rolled scum again if he was more confident in his play, but my initial read was town. His play sure looks careful and lurker to me. Compare to this game: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=369250 where he is pretty agressive and constantly active throguhout the discussion from the get go. ##Unvote: Austinmcc
##Vote: Iamperfection its not my fault no one seems to give a fuck about ghost. Guy comes into the thread makes the worst case i have ever seen. Let me break it down how it looks from my perspective the sequence of events. Keirathi makes shitty case. (i thought it was shitty at the time) Keirathi explains what he was trying to accomplish fairly well. Ghost enters thread Ghost says keirathi is scum because he is trying to hard (wtf) Ghost say hiro is town because hiro is to dumb(wtf) Ghost abandons thread. Can someone explain to me how the fuck ghost can be town (preferably ghost) I see no town motivation in the way ghost is acting and i think he just tried to act stupid on purpose and skate by day 1 by using the stupid "oh scum would never act that dumb" argument. ghost is scum in my eyes. Voting ghost is too easy. I can easily find both scum and town motivation behind his actions, here: Scum motivation:-Create confusion with a terrible vote -Act "arrogant" to avoid doing anything productive and get away with it -Maybe use that "oh scum would never act that dumb" argument to skate by later Town motivation:-Thinks he's rough and all awesome and dandy and is trying to appear "cool" by using those "fuck you scum I don't care" attitudes many "vets" use in D1 hoping people go "oh ghost you are so awesome! I'm going to sheep you all game now" or something -He's trolling and doesn't really care since it's the beginning of D1 -Like said before, he doesn't care and is just spouting anything that comes to his mind, whatever it is, without proof-reading or analyzing it before posting it I can see why someone would vote for him and why you would vote for him, but something doesn't fit. His "Hiro is town" post doesn't strike to me as scum at all. I don't think scum would call someone town out of nowhere without any scum motivation behind like the way he did, at least not in how I expect ghost to behave like scum. He could still be scum for all I know, but I'd prefer we have some discussion behind it instead of going "ghost is dumb, lynch him". For instance iamperfection, what do you think of the above?
This is practically more text written ABOUT ghost than has been written BY ghost
Gonzaw, this post was all focused on the vote. What about ghost's play in GENERAL? Keirathi has been discussed at a couple different junctures, but ghost has just parked his vote and not engaged in any further talk. All we know is that he wants to lynch Keirathi for putting in effort, and wants to lynch mementoss tomorrow for absolutely no given reason.
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@austin: what's your position on me now? You jumped from not scummy, to questioning my explanations, and even through out a (laughable) scum motivation for my actions. But you completely didn't even mention me now that you're back.
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gonna hop right back into the thread with some analysis
I believe iamperfection is scum and I would like everyone to click on his filter
On October 01 2012 05:43 iamperfection wrote:Show nested quote +On October 01 2012 04:22 ghost_403 wrote:
I'm pretty happy lynching Keirathi right now. He's putting way too much effort into scumhunting on Day 1 to build up towncred. Looking through previous filters when there's been, what, twenty posts in this game? No, that's not something that townies do. I vote we lynch him today, and mementoss tomorrow. WHO'S WITH ME.
##vote keirathi We are seriously going to allow this crap? Ive played about 6 games of tl mafia and this is the biggest pile of crap ive seen yet. ## Vote ghost_403
This post clearly mis-reads what ghost is trying to say and jumps on him with a hyperbole and what feels like a very fake sense of confidence. The way this post is worded is not as much anger as much as it reads "grab your pitchforks and bandwagon with me"
After this, his teeth are sunk into ghost, and he is afraid to move. He also has failed to comment on literally anyone else in the thread. His reasoning is bad, his contributions are next to nothing.
Honestly I don't think anything more needs to be written. Enough time has past for iamperfection to comment on other players, or contribute to actual discussion. His reasoning for pushing a ghost lynch is bad and grasping at straws.
##unvote
##vote Iamperfection
S&B is probably not scum because he is confused on his read on me but has a direction on the basis of that.
+ Show Spoiler +On October 01 2012 04:43 HiroPro wrote:Show nested quote +On October 01 2012 04:40 ghost_403 wrote:
Alright, Hiro, so who do you think we should be lynching today? So far, all you've done in this game is setup speculation (a big no-no), and what else? no one in particular right now. On October 01 2012 04:46 ghost_403 wrote:
Hiro goes on my town list because no anti-town faction would be dumb enough to say that.
Still wanna lynch Keirathi.
Ghost is correct in this response. Scum would probably make an excuse or pull a read out of their hat. Hiro is too confident in his statement to be scum imo.
Also, I dont find anything scummy about ghost's play. He wasn't saying that keirathi was trying too hard overall, he said keirathi was forcing effort in order to look townie. Huge difference.
I am heavily underwhelmed by crossfire's play.
Jinglehell I dont want dead as bad as I did before. His actively lurking and woe is me attitude dont give me good feelings, however he is explaining his thought process pretty thoroughly which is really hard to do as scum. I am not getting a filtered or nervous feeling (of him writing his thoughts) from his posting.
Keirathi is another person of interest still. I think austin did a very good job pointing out the inconsistencies in his said-plan and his actual actions.
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On October 02 2012 00:36 JingleHell wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2012 00:31 austinmcc wrote:
Why exactly do you find that performance embarrassing, and how is it driving you to play the way you are this game? Is it just the constant pushing of Grush and trying to get people on that lynch? I led several rather key mislynches. As town. Pushing Grush was about the least embarrassing part of my performance, because frankly, he's useless. I do wish he'd died earlier in the game, though. I don't remember all the specifics at this point off the top of my head, but almost every time I convinced people on someone, it made the overall situation worse. Clearly, if I make too much case out of too little, it doesn't serve the town , so I'm letting things solidify in my mind and in the thread a bit more before going into hardcore push people mode, because once I do that, there's a tendency for someone to get lynched. Being in a town-leader-ish position is only good if I don't also get nominated as the scumteam's MVP as town for it.
How long, exactly, do you plan to wait? Theres only 7.5 hours until the deadline.
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On October 01 2012 23:45 Drazerk wrote:
If we don't lynch S+B my next target would probably be JH because I just hate the wounded survivor act but its not really telling of alignment.
I would like you to completely drop S&B from your vocab until tomorrow and literally forget he is in the game. I think this will improve your play and allow you to look at the game better.
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On October 02 2012 00:40 Keirathi wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2012 00:36 JingleHell wrote:On October 02 2012 00:31 austinmcc wrote:
Why exactly do you find that performance embarrassing, and how is it driving you to play the way you are this game? Is it just the constant pushing of Grush and trying to get people on that lynch? I led several rather key mislynches. As town. Pushing Grush was about the least embarrassing part of my performance, because frankly, he's useless. I do wish he'd died earlier in the game, though. I don't remember all the specifics at this point off the top of my head, but almost every time I convinced people on someone, it made the overall situation worse. Clearly, if I make too much case out of too little, it doesn't serve the town , so I'm letting things solidify in my mind and in the thread a bit more before going into hardcore push people mode, because once I do that, there's a tendency for someone to get lynched. Being in a town-leader-ish position is only good if I don't also get nominated as the scumteam's MVP as town for it. How long, exactly, do you plan to wait? Theres only 7.5 hours until the deadline.
How long do I plan to wait to go into hard-push mode on someone? Until I'm reasonably confident in my assessment. I'm not going to suddenly play differently just to make you happy, so deal with it.
If you really want someone slammed into the floor, take a case and run with it, and slam someone into the floor. Don't wait for a scapegoat to lead the case.
At any rate, my favorite target right now would probably be Gonzaw, between the stuff I've already pointed to, his wishy-washy voting everywhere, and his public "Oh, the person who's most interested in me is going to be my placeholder vote, I'll be back some time after the deadline, which might make that person look scummy if they decided to push". That's survivor play, not town-win play.
In fact, speaking of such, ##Vote Gonzaw
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EBWOP Oh wait
##Unvote
##Vote Gonzaw
Sorry, need more caffeine.
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On October 01 2012 06:54 Nisani201 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 01 2012 06:25 Keirathi wrote:
As a bonus answer, Nisani is the other person (besides ghost) that I am particularly interested in right now. I feel like him jumping in to defend me against Drazerk because I was a "newbie" was taking advantage of an easy situation.
I recently played a game on another forum where I was pushed hard throughout the entire game because I made a small "newbie mistake" at the beginning. This game seems very similar and I don't want us to make the same mistake. Not sure what to think of ghost, I think it's pretty stupid for anyone to vote Kei. I'm also not sure why drazerk took his vote off kei, since it doesn't look like anything really changed his mind. I also think that Mementoss's "analysis" post was really stupid. It was a bad case on austin and the other half was him calling people town. He's on my radar but I'm still more confident in Drazerk.
Can we talk more about this guy?
1) Jumps in to white-knight the "newbie". Such an easy thing for scum to do, especially on day 1 in a relatively inactive game. Admittedly, a townie could do that too, but I find it hard to believe that a townie would have that strong of a conviction that I was town making a "newbie mistake" rather than a scum making a dumb one.
2) "I think its pretty stupid for anyone to vote Keir, but why did drazerk unvote Keir?"
Can anyone explain that logic? If its dumb for someone to vote me, why is it also dumb for someone with their vote on me to unvote me?
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On October 02 2012 00:38 Keirathi wrote:
@austin: what's your position on me now? You jumped from not scummy, to questioning my explanations, and even through out a (laughable) scum motivation for my actions. But you completely didn't even mention me now that you're back.
Those jumps are based on what you did in the meantime. Here's my initial post:
On September 30 2012 15:44 austinmcc wrote:
...
I appreciate things getting off to a nice start, but really? Was I the only person who assumed that Keirathi didn't actually have some giant scumread on Mattchew? Given the reasons that he decided to vote mattchew (amg mattchew has used the term town and hasn't claimed a role that doesn't exist), I don't see the unvote as scummy. Vote for weak reasons, unvote for weak reasons.
Drazerk you ACTUALLY think it's anti-town to do that?
I didn't see your unvote for weak reasons as scummy. Drazerk had just posted that it was third party or idiot, I didn't find it to be telling at all because the reasoning behind the vote in the first place didn't seem strong.
Then after that post, you give your explanation and justification. THAT is what I feel is scummy, reminds me of scum. I'm not concerned about you unvoting based on some weak comments from matt (What drazerk mentioned and what I didn't find scummy), I'm concerned about you based on your later explanation where you claim to have wanted discussion and opinions yet unvote before any of that ever appears.
Right now, I'm scummy on you. I'm not going to lead a crusade to lynch you because the way you explained a plan reminds of what a scum player in another game did, however. For now I'm looking elsewhere for today's lynch, and I'm watching you. I'm alright with the way you discussed Ghost when talking to Gonzaw, I don't think someone can get a free pass for a terrible vote and then not pushing it at all.
If you want me to keep looking at you, fine. What's up with this?
On October 01 2012 06:03 Keirathi wrote:Show nested quote +On October 01 2012 05:59 gonzaw wrote:
At Keirathi:
1)Are you going to start scumhunting soon? When I feel like there's enough for me to make an actual case that I believe in. Until them, I'm content to ask questions and discuss the current goings-on in the thread to build my reads.
On October 02 2012 00:40 Keirathi wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2012 00:36 JingleHell wrote:On October 02 2012 00:31 austinmcc wrote:
Why exactly do you find that performance embarrassing, and how is it driving you to play the way you are this game? Is it just the constant pushing of Grush and trying to get people on that lynch? I led several rather key mislynches. As town. Pushing Grush was about the least embarrassing part of my performance, because frankly, he's useless. I do wish he'd died earlier in the game, though. I don't remember all the specifics at this point off the top of my head, but almost every time I convinced people on someone, it made the overall situation worse. Clearly, if I make too much case out of too little, it doesn't serve the town , so I'm letting things solidify in my mind and in the thread a bit more before going into hardcore push people mode, because once I do that, there's a tendency for someone to get lynched. Being in a town-leader-ish position is only good if I don't also get nominated as the scumteam's MVP as town for it. How long, exactly, do you plan to wait? Theres only 7.5 hours until the deadline.
You've been doing more in thread, but it seems like you're getting on JH for saying he's doing exactly what you've said you're doing. Why is it fine for you to wait to scumhunt until you've got enough to make a case, but it's not alright for JH to wait before pushing someone?
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On October 02 2012 00:58 austinmcc wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2012 00:38 Keirathi wrote:
@austin: what's your position on me now? You jumped from not scummy, to questioning my explanations, and even through out a (laughable) scum motivation for my actions. But you completely didn't even mention me now that you're back. Those jumps are based on what you did in the meantime. Here's my initial post: Show nested quote +On September 30 2012 15:44 austinmcc wrote:
...
I appreciate things getting off to a nice start, but really? Was I the only person who assumed that Keirathi didn't actually have some giant scumread on Mattchew? Given the reasons that he decided to vote mattchew (amg mattchew has used the term town and hasn't claimed a role that doesn't exist), I don't see the unvote as scummy. Vote for weak reasons, unvote for weak reasons.
Drazerk you ACTUALLY think it's anti-town to do that? I didn't see your unvote for weak reasons as scummy. Drazerk had just posted that it was third party or idiot, I didn't find it to be telling at all because the reasoning behind the vote in the first place didn't seem strong. Then after that post, you give your explanation and justification. THAT is what I feel is scummy, reminds me of scum. I'm not concerned about you unvoting based on some weak comments from matt (What drazerk mentioned and what I didn't find scummy), I'm concerned about you based on your later explanation where you claim to have wanted discussion and opinions yet unvote before any of that ever appears.
You're making a mountain out of a mole hill. But I've said all that I can say about it, you're just choosing to interpret it as some super-pro scum motivation. I've been completely open with my thoughts and opinions throughout the entirety of the game, and haven't shied away from having people talking about me.
On October 02 2012 00:58 austinmcc wrote:
Right now, I'm scummy on you. I'm not going to lead a crusade to lynch you because the way you explained a plan reminds of what a scum player in another game did, however. For now I'm looking elsewhere for today's lynch, and I'm watching you. I'm alright with the way you discussed Ghost when talking to Gonzaw, I don't think someone can get a free pass for a terrible vote and then not pushing it at all.
I'm not really sure what you mean by the bolded part. You think my explanation is similar to what scum did in another game, and you think I'm scummy, but you don't want to lynch me?
On October 02 2012 00:58 austinmcc wrote:If you want me to keep looking at you, fine. What's up with this? Show nested quote +On October 01 2012 06:03 Keirathi wrote:On October 01 2012 05:59 gonzaw wrote:
At Keirathi:
1)Are you going to start scumhunting soon? When I feel like there's enough for me to make an actual case that I believe in. Until them, I'm content to ask questions and discuss the current goings-on in the thread to build my reads. Show nested quote +On October 02 2012 00:40 Keirathi wrote:On October 02 2012 00:36 JingleHell wrote:On October 02 2012 00:31 austinmcc wrote:
Why exactly do you find that performance embarrassing, and how is it driving you to play the way you are this game? Is it just the constant pushing of Grush and trying to get people on that lynch? I led several rather key mislynches. As town. Pushing Grush was about the least embarrassing part of my performance, because frankly, he's useless. I do wish he'd died earlier in the game, though. I don't remember all the specifics at this point off the top of my head, but almost every time I convinced people on someone, it made the overall situation worse. Clearly, if I make too much case out of too little, it doesn't serve the town , so I'm letting things solidify in my mind and in the thread a bit more before going into hardcore push people mode, because once I do that, there's a tendency for someone to get lynched. Being in a town-leader-ish position is only good if I don't also get nominated as the scumteam's MVP as town for it. How long, exactly, do you plan to wait? Theres only 7.5 hours until the deadline. You've been doing more in thread, but it seems like you're getting on JH for saying he's doing exactly what you've said you're doing. Why is it fine for you to wait to scumhunt until you've got enough to make a case, but it's not alright for JH to wait before pushing someone?
The difference is there's less than 1/4 of the day left, and JH hadn't done much at all so far besides making excuses as to why he isn't playing to his town meta.
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austin why arent you voting iamperfection with me?
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On October 02 2012 01:15 Mattchew wrote:
austin why arent you voting iamperfection with me?
thoughts on Nisani and Jinglehell?
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I'd love to know where you get the absurd notion that all I've done is "make excuses". Providing my reasoning for being careful (when you yourself pressed for that reasoning to be explained no less) is hardly making excuses.
Or do you want townies to lead mislynches?
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EBWOP, that last was directed at Keirathi, by the way.
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On October 02 2012 01:18 JingleHell wrote:
I'd love to know where you get the absurd notion that all I've done is "make excuses". Providing my reasoning for being careful (when you yourself pressed for that reasoning to be explained no less) is hardly making excuses.
Or do you want townies to lead mislynches?
we want you to promote discussion. which exactly what discussing your reads and making cases does.
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On October 02 2012 01:18 Mementoss wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2012 01:15 Mattchew wrote:
austin why arent you voting iamperfection with me? thoughts on Nisani and Jinglehell?
gave thoughts on JH,
no thoughts on nisani
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On October 02 2012 01:10 Keirathi wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2012 00:58 austinmcc wrote:On October 02 2012 00:38 Keirathi wrote:
@austin: what's your position on me now? You jumped from not scummy, to questioning my explanations, and even through out a (laughable) scum motivation for my actions. But you completely didn't even mention me now that you're back. Those jumps are based on what you did in the meantime. Here's my initial post: On September 30 2012 15:44 austinmcc wrote:
...
I appreciate things getting off to a nice start, but really? Was I the only person who assumed that Keirathi didn't actually have some giant scumread on Mattchew? Given the reasons that he decided to vote mattchew (amg mattchew has used the term town and hasn't claimed a role that doesn't exist), I don't see the unvote as scummy. Vote for weak reasons, unvote for weak reasons.
Drazerk you ACTUALLY think it's anti-town to do that? I didn't see your unvote for weak reasons as scummy. Drazerk had just posted that it was third party or idiot, I didn't find it to be telling at all because the reasoning behind the vote in the first place didn't seem strong. Then after that post, you give your explanation and justification. THAT is what I feel is scummy, reminds me of scum. I'm not concerned about you unvoting based on some weak comments from matt (What drazerk mentioned and what I didn't find scummy), I'm concerned about you based on your later explanation where you claim to have wanted discussion and opinions yet unvote before any of that ever appears. You're making a mountain out of a mole hill. But I've said all that I can say about it, you're just choosing to interpret it as some super-pro scum motivation. I've been completely open with my thoughts and opinions throughout the entirety of the game, and haven't shied away from having people talking about me. Show nested quote +On October 02 2012 00:58 austinmcc wrote:
Right now, I'm scummy on you. I'm not going to lead a crusade to lynch you because the way you explained a plan reminds of what a scum player in another game did, however. For now I'm looking elsewhere for today's lynch, and I'm watching you. I'm alright with the way you discussed Ghost when talking to Gonzaw, I don't think someone can get a free pass for a terrible vote and then not pushing it at all.
I'm not really sure what you mean by the bolded part. You think my explanation is similar to what scum did in another game, and you think I'm scummy, but you don't want to lynch me? Show nested quote +On October 02 2012 00:58 austinmcc wrote:If you want me to keep looking at you, fine. What's up with this? On October 01 2012 06:03 Keirathi wrote:On October 01 2012 05:59 gonzaw wrote:
At Keirathi:
1)Are you going to start scumhunting soon? When I feel like there's enough for me to make an actual case that I believe in. Until them, I'm content to ask questions and discuss the current goings-on in the thread to build my reads. On October 02 2012 00:40 Keirathi wrote:On October 02 2012 00:36 JingleHell wrote:On October 02 2012 00:31 austinmcc wrote:
Why exactly do you find that performance embarrassing, and how is it driving you to play the way you are this game? Is it just the constant pushing of Grush and trying to get people on that lynch? I led several rather key mislynches. As town. Pushing Grush was about the least embarrassing part of my performance, because frankly, he's useless. I do wish he'd died earlier in the game, though. I don't remember all the specifics at this point off the top of my head, but almost every time I convinced people on someone, it made the overall situation worse. Clearly, if I make too much case out of too little, it doesn't serve the town , so I'm letting things solidify in my mind and in the thread a bit more before going into hardcore push people mode, because once I do that, there's a tendency for someone to get lynched. Being in a town-leader-ish position is only good if I don't also get nominated as the scumteam's MVP as town for it. How long, exactly, do you plan to wait? Theres only 7.5 hours until the deadline. You've been doing more in thread, but it seems like you're getting on JH for saying he's doing exactly what you've said you're doing. Why is it fine for you to wait to scumhunt until you've got enough to make a case, but it's not alright for JH to wait before pushing someone? The difference is there's less than 1/4 of the day left, and JH hadn't done much at all so far besides making excuses as to why he isn't playing to his town meta.
Some of that "mountain" is because apparently I'm flip-flopping. You hadn't given your explanations at the time of my original post, so it was difficult to use them in getting a read on you.
As to the bolded, Gonzaw mentioned this when he came into the thread, and I keep mentioning it in my posts. Yes, a chunk of my scumread on you is because I found someone in another game scummy for the same thing (Talismania, can't believe it's not themed mini) - having incongruent explanations for this "plan" of his that was to generate activity. Still figuring out how much of my read on you is based on it being similar to that, and I need to do that before I push a lynch on you. What we don't need is more votes being spread around because of offhand references to one person's experiences in another game. There's too much of that already.
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On October 02 2012 01:20 Mementoss wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2012 01:18 JingleHell wrote:
I'd love to know where you get the absurd notion that all I've done is "make excuses". Providing my reasoning for being careful (when you yourself pressed for that reasoning to be explained no less) is hardly making excuses.
Or do you want townies to lead mislynches? we want you to promote discussion. which exactly what discussing your reads and making cases does.
I wanted Keirathi's answer. And I have promoted and joined discussion. I'm just being less aggressive and pushy about it.
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On October 02 2012 01:18 JingleHell wrote:
I'd love to know where you get the absurd notion that all I've done is "make excuses". Providing my reasoning for being careful (when you yourself pressed for that reasoning to be explained no less) is hardly making excuses.
Or do you want townies to lead mislynches?
I specifically said hadn't. IE, prior to my question, your lack of contribution in the thread in general was different than your town meta, and you made some excuses as to why that was.
I didn't say your excuses were bad. They were just excuses.
And no, I want townies to lynch scum. You hadn't been active or engaged in conversations and refining your reads. You were just content to let other people talk about stuff and only make comments when pressed about it.
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EBWOP: add "for the most part" to the end of that. You did jump in and give an opinion about Draz early.
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EPT
