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On February 28 2012 17:43 TheBrofessor wrote:
This might be the grossest community overreaction i've seen in a long time.
I don't know, how would you feel if someone at your job went to your boss or customers or someone who might hire you in the future and stated something along the lines of "I'm not saying that TheBrofessor is bad at his job, but look at how awful TheBrofessor's results are and have you heard what TheBrofessor did a few year ago and how bad TheBrofessor's looks, but I'm not saying or implying anything".
This is Dragon's career right now, I feel this is rather serious.
I don't know if the degree of reaction is completely appropriate, but after listening to the cast I most definitely can't say it's not justified.
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This does not hurt Dragon or his career in any form at all.
The caster made a dumb comment, that's it. It was a single sentence in one of the hundreds of playhem dailies that have come and gone. The caster acknowledged it was a bad idea, and now people are calling for his head on a pike and boycotting playhem. The only way people are even going to remember that this even happened a week from now is because of all this ridiculous nonsense.
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564 Posts
i'm not support playhem if "katu" cast again.
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Yeah I'm not watching any tournament this guy is a part of anymore. You should never be able to be that big of a dick and get away with it. (watched the VOD)
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On February 28 2012 18:05 TheBrofessor wrote:
This does not hurt Dragon or his career in any form at all.
The caster made a dumb comment, that's it. It was a single sentence in one of the hundreds of playhem dailies that have come and gone. The caster acknowledged it was a bad idea, and now people are calling for his head on a pike and boycotting playhem. The only way people are even going to remember that this even happened a week from now is because of all this ridiculous nonsense.
Pretty juvenile way to look at this dude. If you want SC2 to be taken seriously in any sort of way as an ESport, then you understand the ramifications of the incident today. Katu made a stupid mistake, Playhem at least should publicly consider action against him for it. This negatively affects Playhem quite a bit, as is VERY apparent by the community reaction. Not a dumb reaction at all, in fact this is a very mature subject to take offense to as it is about professionalism on the job and not stupid probe rush drama.
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Registered just to say this.
Not giving playham any business anymore until a more appropriate apology is given. That apology given 3 pages back was the most pathetic explanation ever; it basically blamed the viewers for over reacting to the trolling by the caster (he was not trolling). It is OBVIOUS Katu was not joking. Anyone listened to the VOD can tell that. Katu was damaging someone's professional career and he shall be deem responsible for his wrong doings. What's the role of a CASTer? It's to CAST, not bash players joking or not.
Not watching playham stream anymore.
ADBLOCK all playham ads and I recommend everyone to do that until Katu is punished and Playham gives a real apology.
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I've never watched anything with Katu in it, and now I never intend to.
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Definitely not a Katu fan after this :\ My opinion of him was already treading on thin ice after a giant gay-bashing filled rant a couple months back. Wish casters would show more respect.
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I will not watch anything this immature brat casts ever again.
What kind of excuse is it anyway? "He said it but he didn't mean it"? Sorry, but you're doing the damage control completely wrong here.
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On February 28 2012 18:18 JSC1214 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 28 2012 18:05 TheBrofessor wrote:
This does not hurt Dragon or his career in any form at all.
The caster made a dumb comment, that's it. It was a single sentence in one of the hundreds of playhem dailies that have come and gone. The caster acknowledged it was a bad idea, and now people are calling for his head on a pike and boycotting playhem. The only way people are even going to remember that this even happened a week from now is because of all this ridiculous nonsense. Pretty juvenile way to look at this dude. If you want SC2 to be taken seriously in any sort of way as an ESport, then you understand the ramifications of the incident today. Katu made a stupid mistake, Playhem at least should publicly consider action against him for it. This negatively affects Playhem quite a bit, as is VERY apparent by the community reaction. Not a dumb reaction at all, in fact this is a very mature subject to take offense to as it is about professionalism on the job and not stupid probe rush drama.
All this "this is important if we want to be taken seriously" isn't true at all, there's plenty of immature shit, as well as actual cheating, that goes on in "real" sports. If i recall correctly, this Katu guy has done a countless number of casts for go4sc2 and playhem, and now he and playhem are being crucified for what is, again, just a dumb comment.
If, Djwheat or someone says while casting a game on the main stage at MLG "Oh he just switched tech i think he's looking at his opponents monitor", then yes, that should be taken very seriously with the scale and level its on, just like in other professional sports, a professional baseball team throwing a game for example. If a caster for a daily tournament with a couple hundred viewers makes a mistake, it does not need to be blown so horribly out of proportion that it leads to the boycotting of a company. Its the equivalent to minor league baseball player admitting to using steroids. The guy made a mistake. A single mistake. Ease the fuck up on him.
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Boycotting playhem until he is removed, already talked with other people I know in the scene who are doing the same.
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On February 28 2012 18:29 phar wrote:
Definitely not a Katu fan after this :\ My opinion of him was already treading on thin ice after a giant gay-bashing filled rant a couple months back. Wish casters would show more respect.
@TheBrofessor, this was more than "A single mistake." Katu has been alienating the viewers and players for quite a while. This guy is doing a JOB. His job entails that he act professionally, which he has not done on multiple occasions. There is more to this than just some guy being an idiot on stream, if he wants to do that, fine, he should do that on HIS stream not one that he is paid to represent a company on.
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weak ass excuse from PlayhemTV. it doesn't matter if Katu on a personal level thinks Dragon cheats or not. He as the caster should not utter the words, and actions needs to be taken. And it's not just that, he threw out this ridicoulus story about why dragon is not participating on events and why he is not with slayers anymore. furthermore continuing to respond to the chat saying something in the lines of: "if you dont belive me, continue living in your fantasy world, but what im saying is the truth" and it's so far from the truth. i feel i have so much to say, but my english is not steady enough to put my thoughts into words. i just feel really bad for dragon, and if Playhem tries to sweep this under the carpet by saying: "what he said was wrong and we understand that now, please lets all move on" its an outrage.
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On February 28 2012 16:30 PlayhemTV wrote:
Hi everyone (and reddit),
I want to clear up a few things about what happened tonight, and explain the full details to those who may have missed some of it and only joined part way through.
Before I start, please be aware that I do not agree with the way Katu acted and we agree that he handled the situation badly, however I want to stress more than anything that Katu did not at any point actually believe Dragon was cheating. I want everyone to know this above all else because Dragon should not be dragged into this, he was not stream cheating and did nothing wrong.
What happened:
Dragon ended up on our stream as he has many times in the past, his viewers often multi-view our stream with his and so we got a large influx of viewers entering chat. Dragon's fans began criticizing Katu and his co-caster heavily during the cast and this later escalated into insults and trolling to which Katu responded by "trolling" them back. The members in chat didn't take well to this and began taking what he was saying to heart and further insulting Katu, unfortunately Katu did not step away from the situation but got caught up trying to incite the viewers with intentionally ridiculous claims (eventually hinting at him stream cheating as a cause for what we already knew was just bad lag on Dragon's part) from which point chat digressed to name calling, death threats, and pitch forks; chat became entirely unmanageable and things went down hill fast.
I want to stress again, while what Katu said was disrespectful and unprofessional, and he handled the situation very poorly, he did not actually think Dragon was cheating, or sincerely mean the other remarks he was making, they were all directed at angering the people flaming him in chat.
It's extremely unfortunate that the games we saw tonight were tarnished with childish arguments and poor behavior on our part, but what's done is done and we can't undo what transpired. Normally, respect for the players is our highest rule and one of the few we enforce with time-outs in chat, and having an incident like this occur was very out of character for how our casts normally transpire. If you were a first time viewer tonight I cannot blame you if you don't return to our stream, however I want to ask that everyone can try to put this behind us and give us a chance to improve our mistakes in the future.
From everyone that works on the production behind the PlayhemTV stream to the viewers, followers, fans, and players in our tournaments: we hope you'll accept our sincerest apologies and know that we recognize the mistakes that we made and don't intend to let them happen again.
It's a shame you're defending your caster here. Just get rid of him, because a lot of us just don't wanna hear about him ever again, tbh
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watching the stream, i feel that Katu did not show a lot of professionalism within the games. Even though he may be troll in nature, When you cast games, there is an ounce of being professional. Although there is a disparity between say MLG and Playhem, i would say that in order for Playhem to really get on the same level they must have casters adhere to a standard that MLG, GSL, and other major tournaments has set. Katu is a troll, and that is fine but we can see in higher tier games, they do not joke about the players map hacking or doing some illegal behavior. Hopefully Playhem does something that can show Katu that he did in fact show a terrible way to cast, and he understands why all of us are so mad at what he has done.
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On February 28 2012 19:26 SolidMustard wrote:Show nested quote +On February 28 2012 16:30 PlayhemTV wrote:
Hi everyone (and reddit),
I want to clear up a few things about what happened tonight, and explain the full details to those who may have missed some of it and only joined part way through.
Before I start, please be aware that I do not agree with the way Katu acted and we agree that he handled the situation badly, however I want to stress more than anything that Katu did not at any point actually believe Dragon was cheating. I want everyone to know this above all else because Dragon should not be dragged into this, he was not stream cheating and did nothing wrong.
What happened:
Dragon ended up on our stream as he has many times in the past, his viewers often multi-view our stream with his and so we got a large influx of viewers entering chat. Dragon's fans began criticizing Katu and his co-caster heavily during the cast and this later escalated into insults and trolling to which Katu responded by "trolling" them back. The members in chat didn't take well to this and began taking what he was saying to heart and further insulting Katu, unfortunately Katu did not step away from the situation but got caught up trying to incite the viewers with intentionally ridiculous claims (eventually hinting at him stream cheating as a cause for what we already knew was just bad lag on Dragon's part) from which point chat digressed to name calling, death threats, and pitch forks; chat became entirely unmanageable and things went down hill fast.
I want to stress again, while what Katu said was disrespectful and unprofessional, and he handled the situation very poorly, he did not actually think Dragon was cheating, or sincerely mean the other remarks he was making, they were all directed at angering the people flaming him in chat.
It's extremely unfortunate that the games we saw tonight were tarnished with childish arguments and poor behavior on our part, but what's done is done and we can't undo what transpired. Normally, respect for the players is our highest rule and one of the few we enforce with time-outs in chat, and having an incident like this occur was very out of character for how our casts normally transpire. If you were a first time viewer tonight I cannot blame you if you don't return to our stream, however I want to ask that everyone can try to put this behind us and give us a chance to improve our mistakes in the future.
From everyone that works on the production behind the PlayhemTV stream to the viewers, followers, fans, and players in our tournaments: we hope you'll accept our sincerest apologies and know that we recognize the mistakes that we made and don't intend to let them happen again. It's a shame you're defending your caster here. Just get rid of him, because a lot of us just don't wanna hear about him ever again, tbh
Okay guys, he messed up, and I've been very critical of the caster's statements in this thread, but don't overreact.
If you got fired from your job or instantly failed a class because you were late once, it certainly would not be fair.
I agree that this topic shouldn't be completely overlooked and ignored, but this is Katu's job as well and he clearly wants to do well, but made a mistake.
I try to think of this from a different perspective too, like what happened to Coca. He didn't realize how serious his actions were during a tournament (throwing a match to a friend), where Coca couldn't gain anything from winning, but his friend would have a chance at a Code A seed. Coca was removed from Code S and temporarily left the team house. He was not fired, but he was punished.
Coca didn't realize how serious it was what he was doing, but accepted a very steep punishment once understanding of the situation. He was not let go with a slap on the wrist either.
Just another way to look at the topic.
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+ Show Spoiler +On February 28 2012 16:30 PlayhemTV wrote:
Hi everyone (and reddit),
I want to clear up a few things about what happened tonight, and explain the full details to those who may have missed some of it and only joined part way through.
Before I start, please be aware that I do not agree with the way Katu acted and we agree that he handled the situation badly, however I want to stress more than anything that Katu did not at any point actually believe Dragon was cheating. I want everyone to know this above all else because Dragon should not be dragged into this, he was not stream cheating and did nothing wrong.
What happened:
Dragon ended up on our stream as he has many times in the past, his viewers often multi-view our stream with his and so we got a large influx of viewers entering chat. Dragon's fans began criticizing Katu and his co-caster heavily during the cast and this later escalated into insults and trolling to which Katu responded by "trolling" them back. The members in chat didn't take well to this and began taking what he was saying to heart and further insulting Katu, unfortunately Katu did not step away from the situation but got caught up trying to incite the viewers with intentionally ridiculous claims (eventually hinting at him stream cheating as a cause for what we already knew was just bad lag on Dragon's part) from which point chat digressed to name calling, death threats, and pitch forks; chat became entirely unmanageable and things went down hill fast.
I want to stress again, while what Katu said was disrespectful and unprofessional, and he handled the situation very poorly, he did not actually think Dragon was cheating, or sincerely mean the other remarks he was making, they were all directed at angering the people flaming him in chat.
It's extremely unfortunate that the games we saw tonight were tarnished with childish arguments and poor behavior on our part, but what's done is done and we can't undo what transpired. Normally, respect for the players is our highest rule and one of the few we enforce with time-outs in chat, and having an incident like this occur was very out of character for how our casts normally transpire. If you were a first time viewer tonight I cannot blame you if you don't return to our stream, however I want to ask that everyone can try to put this behind us and give us a chance to improve our mistakes in the future.
From everyone that works on the production behind the PlayhemTV stream to the viewers, followers, fans, and players in our tournaments: we hope you'll accept our sincerest apologies and know that we recognize the mistakes that we made and don't intend to let them happen again.
So because the chat is maybe being negative about something with his cast, Katu goes apeshit and insults the player? Nobody thought he was trolling... seriously.
His co-caster was trying to get him to stop and distanced himself from what was going on.
There is a screenshot of the chat moderators saying they have been trying multiple times to stop him, but he that he wouldn't stop.
Sorry guys, the guy needs to sit in his mothers basement and be excluded from future casts, this just doesn't cut it!
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On February 28 2012 19:31 MrCash wrote:
Okay guys, he messed up, and I've been very critical of the caster's statements in this thread, but don't overreact.
If you got fired from your job or instantly failed a class because you were late once, it certainly would not be fair.
I agree that this topic shouldn't be completely overlooked and ignored, but this is Katu's job as well and he clearly wants to do well, but made a mistake.
I try to think of this from a different perspective too, like what happened to Coca. He didn't realize how serious his actions were during a tournament (throwing a match to a friend), where Coca couldn't gain anything from winning, but his friend would have a chance at a Code A seed. Coca was removed from Code S and temporarily left the team house. He was not fired, but he was punished.
Coca didn't realize how serious it was what he was doing, but accepted a very steep punishment once understanding of the situation. He was not let go with a slap on the wrist either.
Just another way to look at the topic.
Coca is a kid though.
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As with many other viewers, I won't watch Playhem with Katu casting. I won't watching KSL either because of him.
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Personally I think it's a massive insult to the intelligence to the SC2 community for playhem to try and brush off Katu's blatant disrespect and uninformed bias as trolling. It was very very obvious to anybody that it wasn't trolling. It was one of those obvious 'oh shit' moments where you realize you're a fucking idiot and try to brush it off, and that makes it even worse.
This clueless idiot needs to own up to it and maybe, just maybe then will the PR damage control be able to work, because right now I'm actively talking between a group of friends that watch have been regularly watching the playhem streams and we're gone until some maturity, ownership or punishment is dealt.
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EPT
