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On November 10 2013 16:44 avilo wrote:Show nested quote +On November 10 2013 12:02 Hollow wrote:
I gave this stream a chance as best as I could. I find avilo's play to be quite interesting, especially when he mechs, he is very good at it. Unfortunately he is often so childish and a bad loser (he hits pause on purpose before leaving the game he lost, seriously). He often makes excuses at the beginning of a game and acts like if he's getting sniped all the time. He overreacts to pretty common plays that others do as if they were mindblowing, just to rationalize his defeats. He will say that people are 'psychic' for playing a particular way against him. It's like he expects to surprise people with his drops and stuff all the time. He's often making it sound like people are cheating against him if he's getting beaten hard. Disappointing. He'll never improve much with this kind of attitude.
Don't post truthful remarks (as constructive criticisms) on his stream either, you will get timed out by him. I usually analyze my losses, there's usually points in games where if i lost i made a dumb mistake or a mistake i feel i should not be making that i did make. As for the stream cheaters/snipers, i've had a lot of them (again) lately. It is annoying when you know the other person is either sniping you and trying to blind counter your opening builds or has someone ghosting or is literally watching/listening to the stream. I agree with you - i should complain less about it and just ignore it or switch servers to EU when it happens. Thanks for the feedback.
I saw a delay option for your stream that you are not using. If you are so worried about people sniping and cheating to see when you are gonna drop and stuff, you could just use a slight delay. I can't think of a good reason why not to use a delay. Personally, I think that instances where people are not queueing up right after a game against you and you get them a couple minutes later, or a few times in a row is insufficient to claim for sure that they are sniping you. For example, yesterday someone didn't queue up immediately after, and you got him after someone failed to 6 pool you and your first thought was that he waited to snipe you. You aggressively challenged him about it. It's like he couldn't have gone to the bathroom or checked his mails or whatever else he could have done instead of being focused on sniping you. It's really a little too much. I think you own yourself mentally and can't play your A-game when you get suspicious about people sniping/stream cheating like that. It's energy spent on drama instead of the game.
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Well said, Hollow...now if I may enlighten you a bit -
When people come to chat and say:
"Hey I'm watching their stream and they're on skype and others are telling them what you're doing,"
or "Wow avilo they're trash talking you so bad on other stream,"
or, when ingame, opponents literally say (and I've seen it more times than I wish to count) "lol I just sniped you," or "hey dawg I'm watching your stream while we play."
These are just a few examples
Avilo has had his share of known hackers (as I'm sure others have had) and after a while it does make one a bit suspicious. Sorry, if you can't understand that, but hopefully someday you will.
As far as the delay is concerned, I don't see why avilo's viewers should be penalized because someone is cheating or sniping or hacking. He has it on a slight delay, but it really makes a big difference when avilo interacts with his viewers.
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On November 11 2013 04:54 Arkansassy wrote:
As far as the delay is concerned, I don't see why avilo's viewers should be penalized because someone is cheating or sniping or hacking. He has it on a slight delay, but it really makes a big difference when avilo interacts with his viewers.
thanks for having the balls to keep the delay short.
it makes the show more fun.
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Avilo I'm a big fan of your style of play and charisma bun your constant, nonsensical balance whining is EXHAUSTING. You sound like a child when you go on your famous rants.
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On November 12 2013 15:57 Aveng3r wrote:
Avilo I'm a big fan of your style of play and charisma bun your constant, nonsensical balance whining is EXHAUSTING. You sound like a child when you go on your famous rants.
It's always odd how pros can be cheered for pointing out things such as how bad the oracle buff is but then those same supporters will act like avilo should remain silent about it.
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Dominican Republic34 Posts
On November 20 2013 01:43 dvorakftw wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2013 15:57 Aveng3r wrote:
Avilo I'm a big fan of your style of play and charisma bun your constant, nonsensical balance whining is EXHAUSTING. You sound like a child when you go on your famous rants. It's always odd how pros can be cheered for pointing out things such as how bad the oracle buff is but then those same supporters will act like avilo should remain silent about it.
Bomber says it? everyone laughs
Avilo says it? Everyone calls him a whiner
Reminds me of when Brood Lord & Infestors become dominant. Avilo called it out first and everyone called him a balance whiner. Six months later all the tournaments being dominated by Zergs and everyone saying: "Oh we knew all along it was OP"
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well he only complains about it like 60times during a game and never shut up about it..
bomber whined about the firebat drops being hell to deal with and that was that.. he altered his playstyle to fit and counter..
something "certain" entertainers cant seem to do.
how do you not see a difference?
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Dominican Republic34 Posts
On November 20 2013 06:32 Izerman wrote:
well he only complains about it like 60times during a game and never shut up about it..
bomber whined about the firebat drops being hell to deal with and that was that.. he altered his playstyle to fit and counter..
something "certain" entertainers cant seem to do.
how do you not see a difference?
So you don't condemn the action just the times hes done it...
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well siting on a stream and whining and talking and bitching non-stop about balance issues yes i condemn it..
bomber said once that the he finds it unbalanced.. again.. how do you not see the difference?
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Dominican Republic34 Posts
On November 20 2013 07:16 Izerman wrote:
well siting on a stream and whining and talking and bitching non-stop about balance issues yes i condemn it..
bomber said once that the he finds it unbalanced.. again.. how do you not see the difference?
I don't see the difference since it's still the same thing even if it's done 20 times or 1 time. I follow Avilo not because of his famous "Balance whines" but because hes one of the few Terrans who goes Mech on a consistant basis on his stream and pulls wins vs opponents who should in theory be winning against his style.
I stopped playing SC2 5 months after BL/Infestor started rolfstomping all Ladders and the only guy who called it out from the beginning was Avilo. Hell I only log on to SC2 to play arcade game with avilo because I got tired of playing Bio every game since WoL.
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ok im not getting anywhere in this discussion. have fun watching the stream
and Avilo.. good luck in WCS and hope you get further sometime!
ps im not a hater dude..
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On November 11 2013 04:54 Arkansassy wrote:
Well said, Hollow...now if I may enlighten you a bit -
When people come to chat and say:
"Hey I'm watching their stream and they're on skype and others are telling them what you're doing,"
or "Wow avilo they're trash talking you so bad on other stream,"
or, when ingame, opponents literally say (and I've seen it more times than I wish to count) "lol I just sniped you," or "hey dawg I'm watching your stream while we play."
These are just a few examples
Avilo has had his share of known hackers (as I'm sure others have had) and after a while it does make one a bit suspicious. Sorry, if you can't understand that, but hopefully someday you will.
As far as the delay is concerned, I don't see why avilo's viewers should be penalized because someone is cheating or sniping or hacking. He has it on a slight delay, but it really makes a big difference when avilo interacts with his viewers.
Meh. Even if I give him and you the benefit of the doubt, I guess I can't take a streamer seriously if he does things like pausing the game before leaving when he lost. This kind of irrational, childish behavior just rubs me the wrong way. There is no excuse for that kind of bming, it's just nerd rage which is force of habit for him. Foolish to expect anything good out of someone who is so obviously dissatisfied with his gaming experience. I guess I don't understand people who don't quit despite having more frustration with a game than fun with it.
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On November 20 2013 07:16 Izerman wrote:
well siting on a stream and whining and talking and bitching non-stop about balance issues yes i condemn it..
bomber said once that the he finds it unbalanced.. again.. how do you not see the difference?
How many times do we see Bomber outside of tournament settings?
And your example was Bomber dealing with hellbats, but that got nerfed out of existence REALLY quick, didn't it?
avilo doesn't complain non-stop about things like Protoss advantage in early TvP. He only brings it up when it happens. If he didn't have to deal with it 3 out of every 4 ladder games you wouldn't hear it as much.
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I have to agree with Izerman. Avilo does talk about the same balance issues a little too much. It's not just about the opening against protoss, but it's also when a bio terran does a doom drop or something silly. I agree with what he says for the most part, but hearing it every time I turn on his stream does get tiring. I think the stream would be a lot more popular than it is currently if he lightened up on it a bit (but not completely!).
Overall that's the only criticism I have. Other than that, great stream! I watch very often.
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I think Avilo should be unfeatured from TL.net.
A) He's not an A class progamer,
B) He accuses half the ladder of maphacking and streamcheating,
C) Every single game he loses is because of balance and not because of his own mistakes.
I don't think a player that has zero respect for the competition and doesn't respect the game he's playing enough to go 5 minutes without complaining is deserving of a spot as a featured streamer and as such obtains more viewers that other streamers are in my opinion more deserving of.
Anybody open for serious discussion?
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I've been a long time fan of Avilo's. I will agree on some points you made though toastie. Recently i have turned the stream off when i can see why he lost, whether it be bad positioning, upgrade deficit..whatever, but he will be claiming maphacking & balance issues blahblah. It does get tiring to hear constantly. I do think there are definitely issues with TvP mech however. But i do enjoy his stream and his antics for the most part and do think he deserves to have his stream featured. I just hope he can bite his tongue a bit and just be like "Well, i lost that game, that fkn sucked, anyway". Instead of being "MAPHACKER, BALANCE, ANYTHING BUT MY OWN FAULT". Also the whole pause, leave game thing is a bit lol.
Regardless of all this, Avilo is still my favorite streamer. He's a passionate lad  .
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So you agree he claims balance issues and maphacking and blabla that he shouldn't be featured, but the arguments for him to be featured are that you do enjoy his stream?
Thus, there's no real argument there, IMO. He might be passionate, showing your passion by bashing everything around it is weird.
I don't think that such behaviour should be rewarded with being featured on a respectable site as teamliquid.net. There's better players everywhere and there's more than enough streams that are not being featured whilst the quality of play is higher and they are clearly more respectful to the game and the competitors. Avilo has nothing going for him but an unorthodox playstyle (no reason to be featured) and drawing viewers by screaming imbalance at 33% of the game (again, not worth being featured for).
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Questionable or not - there are still plenty of people who obviously enjoy the stream, the bigger question here is why are you watching it if its so bad.
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EPT
