EPTI'm not going to anyone else's thread and writing about how I'm write. This is MY THREAD, that's the difference.
What are your guy's problems? Honestly... this is ridiculous... I hope you guys are all sleeping much better tonight lol.
[Stream] Big T - Page 2
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BigT
United States304 Posts
I'm not going to anyone else's thread and writing about how I'm write. This is MY THREAD, that's the difference. What are your guy's problems? Honestly... this is ridiculous... I hope you guys are all sleeping much better tonight lol. | ||
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iokke
United States1179 Posts
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BigT
United States304 Posts
On July 26 2010 09:14 iokke wrote: I didn't come here to prove you wrong, I came because I liked your stream, how you replied to some of the posts was very disappointing and made me leave a comment like that. Still think you are a good player and hopefully this is not your character but you are just having a rough day. No, your coming to voice your opinion, just like that other guy. Your going out of your way to come to MY THREAD to voice YOUR OPINION when no one asked you to. That's the problem, keep it to yourself. There's a huge difference between constructive criticism and your personal opinion. Learn the difference and keep your opinion to yourself, NO ONE CARES. Like I did NOTHING TO YOU PEOPLE. Why would you go out of your way, come to my thread, and type all of this when I did nothing to you? It's not like I BMed you guys first or something. Like just KEEP YOUR OPINIONS to yourself. I did nothing to deserve this shit and its unbelievably annoying! | ||
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iokke
United States1179 Posts
On July 26 2010 09:17 BigT wrote: No, your coming to voice your opinion, just like that other guy. Your going out of your way to come to MY THREAD to voice YOUR OPINION when no one asked you to. So why did you make a thread if you don't want people posting? Or you just made this to hear how great you are? Anyway, take a deep breath, again, i didn't come here to criticize you. If I wanted to talk shit about you I'd be posting differently. I came because I was gonna see if there is anything new about your stream and probably leave you a "thank you comment"... but ended up not doing so because of how you are acting. I get it, you don't care, go on as you please, but sometimes it is worth taking what others say into consideration.. Not as criticism perhaps, but maybe you'll simply see how some of the fans might react to different behavior. | ||
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cucumber
United States116 Posts
[it might be better if you ignored unsubstantiated put-downs/criticisms or responded more like: ] Viewer A- "BUILD MORE CANNONS NUUUUUUB!" Mr.Big-T- "I see some people suggesting cannons, the reason I didn't go cannons here is because I needed the money more zealots because I saw there was a window in his timing that I could abuse." Now you sound like a confident, intelligent, skilled player who not only plays decently, but can explain the reasoning behind every one of their moves. If you can explain why you did/did not do this based on x, y and z, you accomplish many things. You educate, show your knowledge, and show that you can take any question seriously, even if it's some dumbass spamming "cannons!" in your chat. That's my advice. At the least it sounds better than complaining about the feedback IMO. Seems like reasonable and constructive advice to me. Not that you need to take it though. You created this thread about your stream and now people are discussing it. I understand you're disappointed in the direction it's gone, but people discussing your stream in a thread you created about your stream.... the above responses are sort of foreseeable. I totally understand your frustration but my advice, which obviously you also don't have to take, would be to walk away from TL for a while before you get more angry, because you're not winning any new fans with your rage here. | ||
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BigT
United States304 Posts
On July 26 2010 09:25 iokke wrote: So why did you make a thread if you don't want people posting? Or you just made this to hear how great you are? Anyway, take a deep breath, again, i didn't come here to criticize you. If I wanted to argue with you I'd be posting differently. I came because I was gonna see if there is anything new about your stream and probably leave you a "thank you comment"... but ended up not doing so because of how you are acting. I get it, you don't care, go on as you please, but sometimes it is worth taking what others say into consideration.. Not as criticism perhaps, but maybe you'll simply see how some of the fans might react to different behavior. No, but if you dont have anything nice to say, dont say it at all... Whats the point of coming to my thread and saying something negative out of left field? Just for personal satisfaction? Are you going to sleep better now that you told me your personal opinion? Like I didn't BM any of you... I didn't go to any of your threads saying anything bad about you... So why would you come to my thread and write something negative? Do you feel better about yourself? I just don't understand lol. Just keep it to yourself... | ||
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LumberJack
United States3355 Posts
I dont care to act like im amazing and charge people for lessons. Ive watched your stream, you're a complete tool to your opponents. 80% of the time after every win you say on your stream 'GG FAGGOT' You make TONS of mistakes, and in a moment of weakness, I even sent you a PM helping you with several aspects of your game, many of which i saw you implementing when i checked up on you a few weeks later. Your response? 'omg plz stop messaging me, im going to have to get an admin to ban you, leave me alone' That was also in response to my message about your comment on 'going pro' when you beat ttone or someone like that. You were like 'yea im good, i mean i could go pro, i havent decided yet'. In a respectful way i suggested that there is a huge difference from knowing basic builds and having basic macro to being a pro player. Flames insued from you and threatened for a ban. Your attitude is piss poor and your attempt at making more and more money off of scrubs is really sad. I hope you become a better player, I hope you share your experiences with people by streaming, i hope people become better players (ie learning how to make a gateway) by watching your stream. But please stop acting like god's gift to the little people | ||
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Cpt.Nasty
53 Posts
No one said you had to prove anything to anyone. I just gave you some well thought-out, constructive criticism. Have you seen the the "Noob School" thread? I did the same thing for Mr.Trebis. Instead of dismissing my post because it wasn't all praise, he took what I said seriously and incorporated it into his project. I would say his presentation is many, many times better now than when he began. And why? Because he was willing to listen to honest, mature criticism. You seem to forget that you did indeed say earlier in the thread you would accept constructive criticism. I would say that given how Trebis handled my criticism that it was pretty constructive. All you're proving to people who view this thread is that you can not, in fact, handle criticism of any kind, constructive or otherwise. You aren't walking your talk, Big-T. If you had come out honestly from the beginning and said "I won't except criticism of any kind" then I wouldn't have wasted my time trying to help you. I'm not trying to talk down to you. I'm giving you criticism in the same manner I would give it to a co-worker or classmate who asked me to look at a powerpoint. Do you know how hard it is to get people to peer-review stuff for you? I'm lucky if I can get one student to spend their time looking over a scientific paper I wrote. Honest, constructive criticism takes a lot of effort to give properly. And when you basically throw a tantrum that it's not "nice" enough for you (even though it's perfectly professional) it's almost an insult to the person who went out of their way to help you in the first place. Not that I feel insulted. I can understand your reaction, I just think it's a bit out of line. TL;DR- I didn't come to the thread to insult you. I came here to give you some insight. I did the same thing for Trebis' "Noob School" and he accepted it, incorporated it, and has since become successful. I only offered you constructive criticism because you said you wanted it. Believe it or not, I took time out of my day to give you honest feedback. I even took the time to sugar coat it a bit and compliment your play out of consideration for your feelings. If you can't except criticism of any kind, then you won't improve. | ||
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BigT
United States304 Posts
On July 26 2010 09:34 cucumber wrote: The constructive criticism part of the long post you didn't read was basically this: Seems like reasonable and constructive advice to me. Not that you need to take it though. You created this thread about your stream and now people are discussing it. I understand you're disappointed in the direction it's gone, but people discussing your stream in a thread you created about your stream.... the above responses are sort of foreseeable. I totally understand your frustration but my advice, which obviously you also don't have to take, would be to walk away from TL for a while before you get more angry, because you're not winning any new fans with your rage here. I'm not raging, I'm just defending myself first of all lol. And yes, I want people to discuss my stream (positive or negative). But for the millionth time, there's a difference between criticism and personal opinion. These people aren't giving me constructive criticism, they are personally attacking me... There's a big difference lol. @ Cpt.Nasty: No, that was you going out of your way to voice your opinion. Because I already stated that I do take constructive criticism well. The problem is that most of what i recieve is not constructive criticism its the exact same thing your doing. If you would have acknowledged that first and then said something like, "i agree that most of what you recieve are personal opinions, but you should try to act more appropriately even to them" then I would have listened. You suffer from the same problem too however. You do not know the difference between personal opinion and constructive criticism. | ||
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Cpt.Nasty
53 Posts
This is the best evidence I have. I gave Trebis the exact same kind of honest, blunt, constructive criticism. Look at how he responds to my criticism. He even takes it, and comes up with an even awesomer idea with the unit portrait position! It's not an attack on you personally, it's the way you'd receive criticism in any professional venue. Helping the guy out was even the reason I made the TL account. Some people were harshing on his background. They had a great point, but the way it was presented might have lead someone to believe it was more teasing than an actual problem. So I made the account, and intelligently brought to light the major concern that was being expressed, albeit in an not necessarily friendly manner. It's the same thing I did for you. I didn't do it to hate, I did it because I want you to succeed, believe it or not. Edit- Don't get me wrong. I don't think I'm Jesus to streamers. Giving constructive criticism is as much a skill as knowing how to receive/use it. I practice it when I can/feel like it because it's a very real part of my career, and why not help someone out when it comes to streaming the awesome game that is sc2? BigT- You keep saying that it's us who do not understand what "constructive criticism" means. I'm pretty sure you're operating under a definition that everyone else in this thread but you is unfamiliar with us. Maybe if you were to parse out the exact differences between "constructive criticism" and "personal opinion" the whole issue would be cleared up? | ||
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BigT
United States304 Posts
On July 26 2010 09:41 Cpt.Nasty wrote: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=132256¤tpage=2 This is the best evidence I have. I gave Trebis the exact same kind of honest, blunt, constructive criticism. Look at how he responds to my criticism. It's not an attack on you personally, it's the way you'd receive criticism in any professional venue. Helping the guy out was even the reason I made the TL account. Some people were harshing on his background. They had a great point, but the way it was presented might have lead someone to believe it was more teasing than an actual problem. So I made the account, and intelligently brought to light the major concern that was being expressed, albeit in an not necessarily friendly manner. It's the same thing I did for you. I didn't do it to hate, I did it because I want you to succeed, believe it or not. Edit- Don't get me wrong. I don't think I'm Jesus to streamers. Giving constructive criticism is as much a skill as knowing how to receive/use it. I practice it when I can/feel like it because it's a very real part of my career, and why not help someone out when it comes to streaming the awesome game that is sc2? No, you did it to voice your own personal opinion. Like I just said, most of what i receive is this... people voicing their own personal opinion not constructive criticism. If you would have acknowledged that and instead said, "I understand that most of what you receive is people's personal opinions and not constructive criticism, but I think it would still be more professional to handle them in a more mature manner" THEN I would have most definitely listened to you. But you didnt... You just wanted to voice your own personal opinion so you could feel better about yourself. And your continuing to go out of your way to do so... lol. @Lumberjack: I don't even have a response to what you have to say... I just can only ask why are you continuing to go out of your way to flame me when all I did was start a thread for my stream? I just dont understand... | ||
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iokke
United States1179 Posts
On July 26 2010 09:34 BigT wrote: No, but if you dont have anything nice to say, dont say it at all... Whats the point of coming to my thread and saying something negative out of left field? Just for personal satisfaction? Are you going to sleep better now that you told me your personal opinion? uhh, I was not BMing you (at least I did not think I was).. I was telling you you're not showing yourself in the best light. anyway I'll leave you alone, given that my posts only lead to more negativity, sry & gl p.s. two more things though.. 1 - you wanted constructive criticism and the post we started off talking about was exactly that, though not all of it was realistic (its impossible to respond with detail to all comments, though such responses every once in a while would be very insightful (like in the example with towers)). But I guess you can continue to dismiss it as just personal opinion, w.e 2 - your stream is good (at least when I was watching it I did not see a lot of BM some ppl were talking about) and I learned a few things from watching you, so thanks | ||
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BigT
United States304 Posts
On July 26 2010 09:48 iokke wrote: uhh, I was not BMing you (at least I did not think I was).. I was telling you you're not showing yourself in the best light. anyway I'll leave you alone, given that my posts only lead to more negativity, sry & gl p.s. two more things though.. 1 - you wanted constructive criticism and the post we started off talking about was exactly that, though not all of it was realistic (its impossible to respond with detail to all comments, though such responses every once in a while would be very insightful (like in the example with towers)) 2 - your stream is good (at least when I was watching it I did not see a lot of BM some ppl were talking about) and I learned a few things from watching you, so thanks Your problem was you failed to acknowledge ANYTHING that I said. You just spouted YOUR OWN PERSONAL OPINION. What don't you understand about that... It's pretty clear lol. | ||
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Cpt.Nasty
53 Posts
I thought about my opinion and how it would help you and gave it to you in a well thought out manner. You responded with "I'm not even going to read it yet." My whole point in the original post is that the way you react to criticism reflects badly upon yourself, and this whole thread is my evidence. The reason I'm still doing this is to help you out since you haven't seemed to gotten the picture yet. I mean, you have people being super nice to you pointing out that your reaction isn't the most constructive one. I think you're being a bit more defensive than you need to man, no one here is trying to insult you. | ||
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BigT
United States304 Posts
On July 26 2010 09:53 Cpt.Nasty wrote: Big T, any criticism I give you is going to be my personal opinion. I'm not sure what professional institute you work for where "constructive criticism" isn't automatically assumed to come from personal opinion. I understand that, but your still missing the part where you didnt acknowledge anything i said first. Which thus makes it NON-constructive and therefore totally just your opinion. Pretty straightforward.... That'd be like me saying "I just can't beat mutalisk... I know if I just make stalkers I can beat them!" And you responding, "No, you can't beat them with stalkers, you have to build phoenixes". After I JUST SAID THAT I COULD... Like your completely disrespecting what I had to say.... That's NOT constructive at all.... A constructive response would be, "yeah, your stalker micro just sucks, learn to micro your stalkers better and you can beat mutalisk". Even though thats kind of rude, it takes into account WHAT I JUST SAID. It doesnt completely ignore it and disrespect it... Thats the difference! | ||
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iokke
United States1179 Posts
 again gl | ||
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Cpt.Nasty
53 Posts
On July 26 2010 09:55 BigT wrote: I understand that, but your still missing the part where you didnt acknowledge anything i said first. Which thus makes it NON-constructive and therefore totally just your opinion. Pretty straightforward.... That'd be like me saying "I just can't beat mutalisk... I know if I just make stalkers I can beat them!" And you responding, "No, you can't beat them with stalkers, you have to build phoenixes". After I JUST SAID THAT I COULD... Like your completely disrespecting what I had to say.... That's NOT constructive at all.... I'm not sure I follow. I don't think your definition of "constructive" fits with the way the rest of us use it. My whole post was about the way you deal with you audience/criticism. You responded with "I'm not even going to read that." which kinda goes to prove my point. | ||
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BigT
United States304 Posts
On July 26 2010 09:58 iokke wrote: actually I think I did, but you on the other hand do precisely that continue with "I dont care" and this is just "personal opinion", prolly because you are already are taking everything way too offensively, sorry for an extra post, now I am starting to talk shit lol again glEDIT: Oops getting all the flamers confused lol! And you said all I was doing was proving I was right, right? No that wasn't the case, I was just defending myself at that point... So yes, you just came to my thread to voice your personal opinion... | ||
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TelecoM
United States10825 Posts
Regardless good luck, I hope things work out for you. lol =p | ||
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BigT
United States304 Posts
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