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Sneijder's part of the story, as posted above, is of course not the whole story. But not at least we know what Sneidjer thought.
I don't understand the love of vMarwijk for Afellay. He played a bad last season for PSV. Really below his level of talent.
Then he somehow got a miracle transfer to Barcelona.
At the WC he never got a starting spot in the squad.
Then next season at Barcelona he almost never played and when he did they skipped him most of the time because he can't play the Barcelona style yet.
Then he got injured and didn't play a whole season.
So then Euro 2012 comes and he is completely undisputed and doesn't even have to show he has match fitness to be selected? So puzzling.
And now according to Sneijder he was one of the catalysts for all the troubles.
I always disliked vMarwijk even when he had super results. He was always praised for being able to create a team and being able to play result football. In the mean time the team played conservatively and combination play was non-existant.
Count out your profit.
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It sounds like they really need a new coach or all this shit will never be resolved.
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On June 23 2012 04:29 Logros wrote:
It sounds like they really need a new coach or all this shit will never be resolved.
I don't think this is all van Marwijk's fault. I place the blame largely on the players who are lazy, unprofessional and mentally weak. It's possible that van Marwijk has completely lost this team and that he will need to be replaced, but I certainly don't fault him for his tactics. We saw what happened in the game versus Portugal when you play without a midfield that is able to press and recover the ball, disaster. I blame van Marwijk for not properly assessing the players he had, namely van Bommel and Afellay. Mark van Bommel was over the hill and too slow to do his job in midfield which was clear as day especially in the game against Germany. Afellay is not match fit yet in my opinion, dealing with injury for a long time with Barcelona.
Regardless of these errors by van Marwijk, the players are responsible for effort, desire and passion on the pitch and they lacked all semblance of it. The Dutch team is incredibly talented on paper and they should have showed far, far, better then what they displayed in Euro2012.
I don't see a good replacement for van Marwijk at this time so I have a feeling that he will stay on if the situation with the players is still manageable. I hope in the preparation for WC2014 he shows the guts he should have shown in this tournament, and replaces several veteran players including malcontents like Huntelaar and Van de Vaart and Afellay if that is necessary.
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On June 23 2012 03:26 Pantagruel wrote:
Perhaps it's a bit harsh to ditch them, especially Huntelaar because he can still be a great player for Oranje. I feel like if Bert van Marwijk stays on as coach however both of them will be dumped from the team because they caused so many problems. I understand their frustrations at not being in the starting line up but you need to be professionals and do what is best for the national team.
A lot of reports are coming out of the Dutch press (no doubt half of them are completely unfounded or half-truths) that bring to light some of the problems within the team. Huntelaar especially but also Van de Vaart apparently caused a big stink about not being in the basis and the coach get incredibly fed up with it, to the point of threatening to send Huntelaar back home.
Other reports coming out :
Gregory van der Wiel was apparently more interested in his new clothing line and his music then in football. He rarely spoke to the rest of the team and they were irritated by that.
Mark van Bommel was not respected as captain of the team and was snidely referred to as "assisstant-coach", no doubt in reference to the fact that he is van Marwijk's son in law.
Afellay was outrageously arrogant because he plays (haha...) at Barcelona. He was heard asking in a mocking tone "Where do you play?".
Robin van Persie too was arrogant repeatedly saying how he was the best player in the premier league.
Johnny Heitinga leaked information about the team to his wife who is a journalist in an effort to help her land a job with RTL.
I also read that there were two cliques that formed behind Wesley Sneijder and Robin van Persie. Sneijder group wanted to play more traditional Dutch football while the van Persie group preferred to play with van Marwijk's style.
Wesley Sneijder was apparently the only player who tried to mediate all the dissent within the group and really cared about winning the Euro2012.
Now, I take all this with a grain of salt since most of this information comes from Johan Derksen at Voebal International, but I do believe there is a core of truth to a lot of these accusations, and this really showed on the field. Holland looked uninterested and disorganized, and ultimately, mentally frail. This would seem to indicate some serious issues within the team. I guess it's just like old times.
Derksen while a journalist promoting his magazine all the time is actually pretty well informed.
Anyway I understand both huntelaar and vdv not being happy when they both played well this year but still get surpassed by affelay who played like 15 minutes.
Van martijk could've known this would've caused a lot of unhappiness in the team.. This unhappiness only gets worse when the team starts losing Ofc I hear people say he isn't to blame but I disagree he made plenty of questionable decisions this euro which shouldn't be taken lightly.
Also you missed the news where robben was critical on the way they should've played but when people said he played bad he thought he would be the deciding factor in the game... Which greatly annoyed he rest of the team.
Edit: sorry for the sloppy writing im on my phone
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I think vMarwijk did almost everything wrong.
He has been a coach for like 6 years now. He always plays with 'his' system against every opponent. He can never change the tactics to change the match with a sub. He literally denies the existence of tactics.
Secondly, he managed the players wrong. He never faced the problem that some players will have to be benched during the WC or Euro. With the WC he had a Robben injury. With qualifying matches there was always someone injured or abscent. He never told the players what to expect. At least two players were tricked into being on the bench. If they knew they would be on the bench no matter what they both wouldn't have been available. But they were lied to by vMarwijk and they became mad when they found out they didn't have a shot at a spot in the team.
Van Marwijk's actions lead to the explosion of this team. And that's all he had going for him on the WC. He has world class players but the level of play at the WC was bad. Just go to the NOS page and watch all the matches of 2 years ago. Most people's memories will have been polluted by the memory of making the final. And then also look at the opponents. Minor countries like Japan, Denmark, Uruguay, Slovakia and then almost losing vs a very weak Brasil. They would have lost vs Germany at the WC. Germany doesn't have a Robben or a vPersie or a Sneijder. They only have Ozil, who back then was a little known player back then.
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On June 23 2012 10:17 alderamin wrote:
I think vMarwijk did almost everything wrong.
He has been a coach for like 6 years now. He always plays with 'his' system against every opponent. He can never change the tactics to change the match with a sub. He literally denies the existence of tactics.
Secondly, he managed the players wrong. He never faced the problem that some players will have to be benched during the WC or Euro. With the WC he had a Robben injury. With qualifying matches there was always someone injured or abscent. He never told the players what to expect. At least two players were tricked into being on the bench. If they knew they would be on the bench no matter what they both wouldn't have been available. But they were lied to by vMarwijk and they became mad when they found out they didn't have a shot at a spot in the team.
Van Marwijk's actions lead to the explosion of this team. And that's all he had going for him on the WC. He has world class players but the level of play at the WC was bad. Just go to the NOS page and watch all the matches of 2 years ago. Most people's memories will have been polluted by the memory of making the final. And then also look at the opponents. Minor countries like Japan, Denmark, Uruguay, Slovakia and then almost losing vs a very weak Brasil. They would have lost vs Germany at the WC. Germany doesn't have a Robben or a vPersie or a Sneijder. They only have Ozil, who back then was a little known player back then.
I disagree with this. You can make the excuse for every successful team on how they were fortunate. They all are in some way or another. To be sure, van Marwijk deserves blame, but not all of it. It is completely unacceptable the fashion in which the players behaved off the field and played on it. They deserve the most blame, they need to be professionals or they need to leave. In WC2010 Holland was excellent in defense and quite good in midfield, only in the attack were they woeful. I know a lot of people don't like to see this, but undeniably, it was successful. I have no issue with van Marwijk's tactics.
You are right in saying that van Marwijk could have prevented a lot of the problems that have occurred within the group by being more open with his players and communicating more and in that regard he utterly failed. But let's be honest, Huntelaar and Van der Vaart don't deserve to be in the team anyways. Robin van Persie and Wesley Sneijder are both superior players playing the same position in the team. Even if you are disappointed that you don't get a spot in the starting 11 you can never behave like they did. According to many reports, Huntelaar will never be selected for Oranje again (though I believe that is extreme and won't happen).
I think Bert made a number of errors in his selection but not in regards to VdV and Huntelaar. He should have used Strootman instead of Mark van Bommel and Narsingh on the flank instead of Afellay. Furthermore, there are a lot of great talents in the Eredivisie which he refuses to even consider. That is his biggest mistake in my opinion.
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Just in, Van Marwijk resigns as national coach!
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I'm curious who they're going to replace him with. de Boer should stay at Ajax (Hup Ajax!), and van Gaal, well, I don't know. Rijkaard is off doing his own thing too. I'm just sad and resigned over the individualism and infighting that continuously plagues our elftaal...
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EPT
