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Overall I think the TL staff did an awesome job with the TSL, even moreso in lots of areas than the TSL 1... I tuned in and watched every single broadcast, where last time I barely tuned in to half the matches, so I think there's definitely something to say there (not saying that I am anyone special but just speaking to the fact that TL was able to draw a viewer like me and many thousands of others like me who became really interested in following the results and watching the broadcasts).
After the Ro16 many of the games were thrilling and exciting to watch. There were technical difficulties each week but honestly that's not really much of a problem and in fact I think it speaks to the fact that the TSL was SO awesome that it was able to keep drawing in more and more people, I can imagine how hard it is to set up a broadcast with 10-20k people watching.
One point of criticism I have though is that a lot of the time the staff didn't handle criticism very well. Especially since the TL admins are the biggest attack dogs in the community, criticizing every tournament that has faults and deficiencies. I think that in general you should just ignore the stupid people who bitch and complain about what you do because it makes you look unprofessional lashing out at people who complain.
I think today's example of the accidental spoiler of results says a lot. Instead of creating a bogus cover story (we generate random brackets... seriously if you think about it, what does that even mean?) - just say "ya we messed up sorry guys" , and so what if a ton of people bitch and moan... coming from someone who's hosted more than 10 LAN events and 20 online tournaments over the years (nothing as big as TSL obv), I've learned that people will ALWAYS complain and it's really not worth it to attack the people who attack you. Nobody wins.
Just enjoy the fact that tens of thousands of people like me really appreciate the work that the staff did to make the TSL great. So what if there are 10-100, or whatever people who want to complain about everything, the haters are probably less than 1% of the total people who come to the site and followed the tournament.
So ya, great work guys... but I just think in general the staff gets too defensive over criticism sometimes!
<3 !
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Austin10831 Posts
I'm guessing part of your complaint stems from the fact that you don't understand their cover story. They were saying that they pre-generated result brackets so that they would have the correct one ready for the end of the broadcast no matter the outcome, and that one of those brackets was accidentally placed in the slideshow.
While it's not the most rock-solid story, it's certainly plausible, and was done so that maybe a few viewers would believe that they weren't actually spoiled.
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Thank you teamliquid staff, it was very professional and I feel privileged to have access to such type of entertainment for free!
Spectacular job!
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Kennigit
Canada19447 Posts
What BroOd said. On the fly damage control. But thanks for the feedback (see how well i reacted to your criticism LOL)
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United States24680 Posts
On March 01 2010 07:10 BroOd wrote:
I'm guessing part of your complaint stems from the fact that you don't understand their cover story. They were saying that they pre-generated result brackets so that they would have the correct one ready for the end of the broadcast no matter the outcome, and that one of those brackets was accidentally placed in the slideshow.
While it's not the most rock-solid story, it's certainly plausible, and was done so that maybe a few viewers would believe that they weren't actually spoiled.
Yeah definitely. When intrigue said it in irc chat I thought it was semi-plausible so I started telling everyone it. Honestly... what's to gain from not believing it? I enjoyed the finals much more because I believed that we didn't know the results yet :p
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haha kennigit. I actually got spolied by the posts in the thread, not by the stream and after kennigts posts I didnt think too much and believed what he wrote, so in the end only the final game was kinda spoiled to me. so its not such big deal, that several people are trying to make out of it.
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I managed to stay away from the spoiler. Someone on IRC mentioned it and I was like "oooh no TL until finals is done for me".
I just love the TSL, I missed one broadcast due to falling asleep but I leeched the torrent first thing the morning after and I enjoyed every single second of it. The tournament had everything. You had the young rising star, Koll. You had the oldschool player, Mondi. Had players you've never really heard about before. You had the IdrA v. NonY back and forth. And you had dramatic games (SEn's 0-2 to 3-2 and nonys now classic reverse-kill.
I wish I could write something better, but I'm at a loss for words. I can't describe how awesome this was.
Thank you for letting SC:BW go down with a bang instead of a empty hole. I just know people will talk about TSL2 long after SC2 has been released.
THANK YOU TL STAFF!
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I cant express the awesomness of TSL. Thank You for the great time. Good Job. Keep it that Way!!!!!!!!!
And congratz for Nony, and Mondi.
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To be honest (and I don't know why exactly) I enjoyed Razor TSL 1 more. Maybe "the first child is always the sweeter" but it just seemed that way. Maybe Brood War had another twist in that time, maybe the animation triggered my feelings better that time or something else was in air.
This TSL was satisfying. I hope there will be another one for StarCraft 2 as we can't expect another TSL for StarCraft 1 (or maybe we can *wink*, *wink*). Only thing I was annoyed by were delays and technical difficulties.
Overall great job.
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Philadelphia, PA10406 Posts
Thank You TL. An example to the entire esports community.
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Kick-ass tournament, kick-ass organizers, kick-ass commentators, kick-ass players, kick-ass games! Overall kick-ass experience, thank you!
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Good job by everyone! Loved it, can't wait for next years.
I'm feeling mondi's pain atm :C
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intrigue
Washington, D.C9933 Posts
On March 01 2010 07:22 ShoCkeyy wrote:
Good job by everyone! Loved it, can't wait for next years.
I'm feeling mondi's pain atm :C
back pain from having to carry his fat check around?
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Germany / USA16648 Posts
In reply to the op, I wrote the following in the live report thread + Show Spoiler +
Ok. This is what happened:
Everything was set up perfectly. I had run through all the videos with R1CH watching, we had soundchecked early, were ready in perfect time.
Cheerful video is running, music is playing and I switch to the Probe intro to start the cast. Probe intro ends, I switch to the NonY vs Mondi screen and sound on stream for absolutely no reason at all is gone. I start getting mad, because the stream gods apparently hate us (or we really should have sacrificed GTR over a fire!).
Restarting Wirecast (and thus restarting the stream) instantly fixes the sound problem. We decide not to use the Probe video again, because we think it's what made the sound crash (despite it working perfectly in earlier casts and during the test before today's cast as well). I thus remove the Probe video from the Wirecast video list. Since it was one of the first ones in my list everything else moves up one slot.
The stream is restarted with the Nony vs Mondi screen on. I want to switch to the Cheerful video again, but with everything having moved up one slot the bracket video is now in the slot the cheerful video was in before. Visual memory is a bitch, so I run it, instantly recognizing my mistake.
I yell at R1CH to take the stream down instantly, but alas it's too late, the data has already been processed by the streaming server.
Most people were still reconnecting at that time though, so only a minority caught a glimpse of it. The reason posts were deleted and Kennigit posted earlier in this thread was not to hide anything, but to avoid spoilers for the majority who had not yet reconnected. Users mentioning it in this thread over and over again while the cast was still going only made it worse (risk of spoiling to the mahority that didnt see it).
I don't think anyone outside the people involved realize the fragility of our streaming environment, obs, casters & tech crew spread all over the world. Nor does anyone understand the pressure when stuff suddenly goes wrong for no good reason (I still don't understand why Wirecast decided to crash the sound after the Probe vid....) at all with thousands of people watching.
If anyone is mad they got spoiled put yourself in my shoes, thanks.
Kennigit's "on the fly damage control" pretty much sums it up.
That aside: I loved TSL. Loved most of the matches, loved the upsets, loved the casters.
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Have said this many time already but really gj to everyone who worked on the TSL and to all the participants!
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Braavos36375 Posts
I think today's example of the accidental spoiler of results says a lot. Instead of creating a bogus cover story (we generate random brackets... seriously if you think about it, what does that even mean?) - just say "ya we messed up sorry guys" , and so what if a ton of people bitch and moan... coming from someone who's hosted more than 10 LAN events and 20 online tournaments over the years (nothing as big as TSL obv), I've learned that people will ALWAYS complain and it's really not worth it to attack the people who attack you. Nobody wins.
Xeris, if we say this its essentially confirming 4-2 and we are basically asking every immature kid to post 4-2 spoiled!!! in the LR thread or the IRC. That would undoubtedly ruin/spoil it for a huge portion of the viewership. The way we handled it, it was only spoiled for quite a small subsection of viewers, which would've really been much smaller had everyone just used their heads and not kept repeatedly saying the score in the threads.
We can't "just ignoring criticism." We know that our product not perfect (yet) and we're trying to improve on it, and the only way to do that is to take suggestions and criticisms seriously. Still, I feel that a lot of the things that were fixed between Razer TSL and this one (fewer stream crashes, better caster coordination, more broadcast games, more interviews/coverage, live post-interviews, etc) largely got overshadowed by a few negatives (abusers, a few obs errors, caster screen/audio issues, and unexpected delays). Some of these negatives we had control over, but many of them were just freak situations.
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Braavos36375 Posts
Secondly, I feel that errors are magnified, since things going right is the "norm." For instance, a situation where users helped us improve was the thread about obs/caster coordination (criticizing us). It was something we definitely improved upon as the tournament went along. Our obs, casters, and others really focused on this problem. We may have argued with one or two bad apples who were being idiots in the thread, but we did accept the point -- the obs/caster sync had to get better. And it did, as evidenced by the lack of comment/complaint about it ever since then. Once it got better, nobody mentioned it again (as expected).
Another example would be the mass of people claiming "imba!! idra and ret shouldn't play, they are progamers, its completely not fair and none of the other players have a chance." Now, those people look pretty stupid, but obviously they aren't going to make a thread "Sorry for whining so much, I was wrong to say other players had no chance against these two." Similarly, nobody is going to make a thread "wow the caster audio didn't drop at all during semis and finals!" because these sorts of things only get highlighted when things go wrong.
All that said, we enjoyed it tremendously. It was a huge learning experience for us as well, and I'm sure the next TSL (whether its for SC2 or not) will have another great leap forward in every aspect. I'm also very happy PS sponsored us -- they were the perfect sponsor. They were very professional, worked with us on many things, and let us sort through any errors we had. Thanks to them, and of course to everyone that watched.
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On March 01 2010 07:25 intrigue wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2010 07:22 ShoCkeyy wrote:
Good job by everyone! Loved it, can't wait for next years.
I'm feeling mondi's pain atm :C
back pain from having to carry his fat check around?
That and we both lost first place T_T!
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I think it was a great final to one of the best SC tournaments I have ever seen. My thanks go to the teamliquid staff members for their hard work and to PokerStrategy.com for sponsoring.
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I am waiting eagerly Nongminzerg vs winner of Nony vs Mondragon game. I hope its streamed as well.
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This TSL will certainly be remember as the one with a huge amount of upsets.
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TSL was indeed great. Okay there were a few times the stream was delayed but nothing serious. There are a few minor things I would have liked as extra's but that just leaves something to hope for in the next TSL.
Every cast I had around 10 people over to watch the games on my big TV screen and we all had a blast every time so TL your mission of entertaining me and my friends is totally accomplished. I just kicked the last ones out and they made me promise to host them again next TSL.
Edit: Ow and this match was absolutely final worthy. Great games and very good commentary.
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On March 01 2010 07:52 Hot_Bid wrote:
Secondly, I feel that errors are magnified, since things going right is the "norm." For instance, a situation where users helped us improve was the thread about obs/caster coordination (criticizing us). It was something we definitely improved upon as the tournament went along. Our obs, casters, and others really focused on this problem. We may have argued with one or two bad apples who were being idiots in the thread, but we did accept the point -- the obs/caster sync had to get better. And it did, as evidenced by the lack of comment/complaint about it ever since then. Once it got better, nobody mentioned it again (as expected).
Another example would be the mass of people claiming "imba!! idra and ret shouldn't play, they are progamers, its completely not fair and none of the other players have a chance." Now, those people look pretty stupid, but obviously they aren't going to make a thread "Sorry for whining so much, I was wrong to say other players had no chance against these two." Similarly, nobody is going to make a thread "wow the caster audio didn't drop at all during semis and finals!" because these sorts of things only get highlighted when things go wrong.
All that said, we enjoyed it tremendously. It was a huge learning experience for us as well, and I'm sure the next TSL (whether its for SC2 or not) will have another great leap forward in every aspect. I'm also very happy PS sponsored us -- they were the perfect sponsor. They were very professional, worked with us on many things, and let us sort through any errors we had. Thanks to them, and of course to everyone that watched.
I completely agree, and I did post about how good the observers had gotten in these recent games.
I'll repost it here so that perhaps people can think about the drastic improvement and maybe the volunteer team can enjoy the fruits of their labor (our enjoyment)
On March 01 2010 07:53 MannerMan wrote:
Just want to mention how good the observing was these last few weekends. During the RO16 there was tons of criticism on the observer, and I myself thought it was extremely bad, I noticed things a ton of times on the minimap that the observer wasn't cognizant of. Everything was completely turned around after that criticism and the observation was as near perfect as I think it could have been. I just wanted to make sure this was said, even if it might not reach the intended target.
Amazing event. Can't thank everybody involved enough.
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United States12607 Posts
Thank you fellow TL staffers, for making the TSL such an enjoyable event. So many hours of high-quality entertainment…and a finals that did NOT disappoint despite massive hype.
Fantastic job guys, seriously. Wish I could've helped more.
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Braavos36375 Posts
On March 01 2010 08:05 MannerMan wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2010 07:52 Hot_Bid wrote:
Secondly, I feel that errors are magnified, since things going right is the "norm." For instance, a situation where users helped us improve was the thread about obs/caster coordination (criticizing us). It was something we definitely improved upon as the tournament went along. Our obs, casters, and others really focused on this problem. We may have argued with one or two bad apples who were being idiots in the thread, but we did accept the point -- the obs/caster sync had to get better. And it did, as evidenced by the lack of comment/complaint about it ever since then. Once it got better, nobody mentioned it again (as expected).
Another example would be the mass of people claiming "imba!! idra and ret shouldn't play, they are progamers, its completely not fair and none of the other players have a chance." Now, those people look pretty stupid, but obviously they aren't going to make a thread "Sorry for whining so much, I was wrong to say other players had no chance against these two." Similarly, nobody is going to make a thread "wow the caster audio didn't drop at all during semis and finals!" because these sorts of things only get highlighted when things go wrong.
All that said, we enjoyed it tremendously. It was a huge learning experience for us as well, and I'm sure the next TSL (whether its for SC2 or not) will have another great leap forward in every aspect. I'm also very happy PS sponsored us -- they were the perfect sponsor. They were very professional, worked with us on many things, and let us sort through any errors we had. Thanks to them, and of course to everyone that watched. I completely agree, and I did post about how good the observers had gotten in these recent games. I'll repost it here so that perhaps people can think about the drastic improvement and maybe the volunteer team can enjoy the fruits of their labor (our enjoyment) Show nested quote +On March 01 2010 07:53 MannerMan wrote:
Just want to mention how good the observing was these last few weekends. During the RO16 there was tons of criticism on the observer, and I myself thought it was extremely bad, I noticed things a ton of times on the minimap that the observer wasn't cognizant of. Everything was completely turned around after that criticism and the observation was as near perfect as I think it could have been. I just wanted to make sure this was said, even if it might not reach the intended target.
Amazing event. Can't thank everybody involved enough.
Thanks for your positive comment. I want to clarify what I said, I mean it's completely fine that people don't point out the obs improving -- it's completely fine to expect our obs to be great. Thus, once our obs improved, and we saw no complaints, that was a clear message to us that it was better.
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Overall, I think I might prefer a bo5 finals in the future, to the bo7 we had today. I don't have much of a reason why, I liked all the games, I just think bo5s are more common and accepted in starcraft. Fantastic tournament, from start to finish. I don't even want to think about how much volunteer work was put into this to make it run smoothly.
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Austin10831 Posts
On March 01 2010 09:15 CDRdude wrote:
Overall, I think I might prefer a bo5 finals in the future, to the bo7 we had today. I don't have much of a reason why, I liked all the games, I just think bo5s are more common and accepted in starcraft.
haha, that's... pretty weird man.
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I think the person who had sit and watch the games live while they were being played deserves more credit. He (is it Carnac?) was not able to fully experience the TSL with the commentaries, IRC chat, and the hundred-posts-per-second in the live report threads because he already knew the results.
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if the great players didn't cheat and get dropped, and if the stream wasn't always delayed and crashing, it would have truly been the best foreigner starleague
but all the problems made it kind of NATE MSL FINALS-like, kind of shabby
but still a great event
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A bit disappointed that Nony didn't GG on Andromeda, but it was a great final and a great tournament, thanks for the  EffOrt.
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On March 01 2010 08:10 Hot_Bid wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2010 08:05 MannerMan wrote:On March 01 2010 07:52 Hot_Bid wrote:
Secondly, I feel that errors are magnified, since things going right is the "norm." For instance, a situation where users helped us improve was the thread about obs/caster coordination (criticizing us). It was something we definitely improved upon as the tournament went along. Our obs, casters, and others really focused on this problem. We may have argued with one or two bad apples who were being idiots in the thread, but we did accept the point -- the obs/caster sync had to get better. And it did, as evidenced by the lack of comment/complaint about it ever since then. Once it got better, nobody mentioned it again (as expected).
Another example would be the mass of people claiming "imba!! idra and ret shouldn't play, they are progamers, its completely not fair and none of the other players have a chance." Now, those people look pretty stupid, but obviously they aren't going to make a thread "Sorry for whining so much, I was wrong to say other players had no chance against these two." Similarly, nobody is going to make a thread "wow the caster audio didn't drop at all during semis and finals!" because these sorts of things only get highlighted when things go wrong.
All that said, we enjoyed it tremendously. It was a huge learning experience for us as well, and I'm sure the next TSL (whether its for SC2 or not) will have another great leap forward in every aspect. I'm also very happy PS sponsored us -- they were the perfect sponsor. They were very professional, worked with us on many things, and let us sort through any errors we had. Thanks to them, and of course to everyone that watched. I completely agree, and I did post about how good the observers had gotten in these recent games. I'll repost it here so that perhaps people can think about the drastic improvement and maybe the volunteer team can enjoy the fruits of their labor (our enjoyment) On March 01 2010 07:53 MannerMan wrote:
Just want to mention how good the observing was these last few weekends. During the RO16 there was tons of criticism on the observer, and I myself thought it was extremely bad, I noticed things a ton of times on the minimap that the observer wasn't cognizant of. Everything was completely turned around after that criticism and the observation was as near perfect as I think it could have been. I just wanted to make sure this was said, even if it might not reach the intended target.
Amazing event. Can't thank everybody involved enough. Thanks for your positive comment. I want to clarify what I said, I mean it's completely fine that people don't point out the obs improving -- it's completely fine to expect our obs to be great. Thus, once our obs improved, and we saw no complaints, that was a clear message to us that it was better.
Often the observers were looking at things the caster wasn't seeing that were important to the match. I was very happy with observers, especially when casters would go off on tangents because they weren't following the nuances of the game.
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On March 01 2010 10:02 Fzero wrote:
Often the observers were looking at things the caster wasn't seeing that were important to the match. I was very happy with observers, especially when casters would go off on tangents because they weren't following the nuances of the game.
yeah that's gonna be unavoidable with the current set up because of the nature of not have all the casters in the same place. in order for that to not be a problem they'd need to do something like stream just for the commentators for a consistent video, and then from that have another stream directed at the audience. you'd always need an extremely good observer directing it all; one benefit of this set up is the commentators can look around for themselves and it's probably gives their commentary an extra edge in terms of strategy since they'll have a better sense of what's going on.
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i hate tsl because i am an idra fanboy :'( </3
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I thought Chill was really good throughout all the casts, and I've gotta agree with DJWheat's praise. I dunno if he practiced in front of a mirror or if he's just that baller, but he really brought excitement and professionalism to the cast. Really, I can't say anything bad about his casting, even if I were to try to be picky. I also loved his update on the hockey game 
On the negative, I felt tasteless and artosis sometimes didn't take the cast as seriously as I would have liked (probably due to lack of sleep), and that made it harder to really care about the results of the games. I think their kind of casts would be more appropriate for the earlier stages of the tournament, but when there is 1000 dollars starting to be on the line every game, I prefer intensity over old jokes and memes. I did think they did quite a good job, but this is where I found them lacking.
Day9 was quite entertaining too, but I felt some of his tangents were a bit distracting. His talk about how nervous and crazy the players must be feeling would have been better suited to the pre-game, rather than during the game. It's okay to mention it for 10 seconds during the game, but when you go on for a minute about it I start wanting to say "I know! I know! I've been following TSL for over a month!" During worker split is fine too, just don't do this in the mid game haha..
Of course these are just my opinions and preferences. I'm super grateful to all the work that was put in, and for everyone who made my weekends a little more exciting I also thought the obsing was spot on during the finals, which makes me happy since that's such a significant part of the experience.
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WHY WERE THE FINALS ON AT THE SAME TIME AS THE CANADA VS OLYMPIC HOCKEY GAME? OMG;;;;; i only saw the first 2 games of mondi vs nony lame
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good thing i was too drunk to notice any spoilers and or things like that, just went over to a friends house and forced him and another friend to watch TSL while drinking even though they haven't the slightest clue about BW, was fun times, thanks.
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Saying "yea we fucked up it really was the results" and spoiling it for everyone could not have been the right decision.
OT: TSL kicked so much ass. Have never been so hyped up by a foreign tourney.
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I never watched the games live so I never experienced any stream problems. I just download the VODs and watch them, which is as good as watching them live imo. I really don't care too much about getting spoiled or whatever.. I'm more interested in how the games went.
Overall, the TSL was a great tournament and I barely have any complaints.
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Kennigit
Canada19447 Posts
On March 01 2010 10:31 duckhunt wrote:
WHY WERE THE FINALS ON AT THE SAME TIME AS THE CANADA VS OLYMPIC HOCKEY GAME? OMG;;;;; i only saw the first 2 games of mondi vs nony lame
Real SC players multitask. Chill was casting and watching it at same time haha.
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Was very awesome. I loved this TSL and hope the next one will be sc2  .
Even with the spoiler it was great games to watch. I really enjoyed idra losing to nony but was sad with the sen vs ret. Great tourney, lots of good games and was very fun to watch ^^.
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On March 01 2010 07:03 Xeris wrote:
I think today's example of the accidental spoiler of results says a lot. Instead of creating a bogus cover story (we generate random brackets... seriously if you think about it, what does that even mean?) - just say "ya we messed up sorry guys"
im confused about this, what was he stating??
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On March 01 2010 11:13 Kennigit wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2010 10:31 duckhunt wrote:
WHY WERE THE FINALS ON AT THE SAME TIME AS THE CANADA VS OLYMPIC HOCKEY GAME? OMG;;;;; i only saw the first 2 games of mondi vs nony lame Real SC players multitask. Chill was casting and watching it at same time haha.
LOL In part of the casting you actually hear him say "Yea 1-0canada" or something like that haha.
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Great tournament overall. Had many hours of fun watching the stream. Luckily I also had the perfect final as PvZ is my favorite Match Up and Mondi is my favorite player.
Thanks to all TL staff who put countless of hours of work into it in order to make it as perfect as possible.
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TSL was amazing in everything.
The best players, the drama, the suprise, qualitiy, the casters (my english is not enough to express what i fell LOL)
Thx for this probably the last big tournament before bw "dies" 
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I wasn't insinuating that mistakes weren't fixed and that the constructive complaints weren't actually listened to - I definitely noted improvement in quite a bit of things as the tournament progressed, most notably actually... there were no random crashes and bugs going on in the Day / Chill cast today! It was the first time Day didn't have to solo cast for 10 mins or so, that was very cool.
I really loved the Day/Chill combo, and Artosis / Tasteless were hugely entertaining as well. I think it was very cool to have two sets of casters both with pretty good chemistry and charisma, but each adding their own individual elements to the casts : I.E Day/Chill more technical analysis and Artosis / Tasteless more entertaining and commentary.
Quite awesome. !
I do understand the cover story, it was just a silly one.
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Baltimore, USA22254 Posts
On March 01 2010 16:15 Xeris wrote:
I do understand the cover story, it was just a silly one.
TBH I don't think it was bad at all for how instantaneously they needed one.
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Bit disappointed with the results but overall was good.
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great job TSL staff and really good quality of the games too, I thought the 3rd place match and the final were the 2 best series of the TSL, fittingly
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Yeah, thanks a lot tsl team. That was an awesome job, and I just loved it.
:-)
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Thank you for the second TSL, everyone who had anything to do with it TSL > Korean SC for me!
+ Show Spoiler +Although you really should get someone to cry PLAGUUUUUUU etc ^^
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On March 01 2010 08:01 Too_MuchZerg wrote:
I am waiting eagerly Nongminzerg vs winner of Nony vs Mondragon game. I hope its streamed as well.
are you sure nongming is going to play Nony ? i am so excited
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On March 01 2010 16:17 EvilTeletubby wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2010 16:15 Xeris wrote:
I do understand the cover story, it was just a silly one. TBH I don't think it was bad at all for how instantaneously they needed one.
I didn't see the cover story or the spoiler. Did the spoiler say the score was 4-2 or just that NonY won? It seemed like a decent cover story, I mean its not like the fuck up was prepared for.
Anyway, great event overall the only thing I thought was bad was seeding basically 1/4th of the money positions to people who did good in the previous tournament. I mean when we look at Draco he didn't practice and just showed up to take a free 250$ and then said he quits which seems unfair to give someone money for his previous accomplishments.
I do understand that in order to have prestige like OSL/MSL TL felt that seeding was a necessity and I agree to that, but I think seeding them into the Ro48 would of been more fair since they essentially didn't even have to work in order to get money. For example in Poker Tournaments with seeds I believe people are seeded one round out of the money, instead of into it.
That was my only complaint about the entire TSL, I felt it wasn't fair to rest of the players. I couldn't stand listening to the Tasteless/Artosis casts but that was just personal preference.
Anyway guys, thanks for everything except for making me a social recluse for the last two months.
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i'm not pleased with TSL because it showed foreign sc scene gone few steps backward.. you can kill me but that's my opinion..
but organization, commentary and news were great, it was pure pleasure
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Netherlands13554 Posts
On March 01 2010 21:56 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2010 16:17 EvilTeletubby wrote:On March 01 2010 16:15 Xeris wrote:
I do understand the cover story, it was just a silly one. TBH I don't think it was bad at all for how instantaneously they needed one. Anyway, great event overall the only thing I thought was bad was seeding basically 1/4th of the money positions to people who did good in the previous tournament. I mean when we look at Draco he didn't practice and just showed up to take a free 250$ and then said he quits which seems unfair to give someone money for his previous accomplishments.
This keeps getting brought up, but afaik, Draco played a lot of iccup games in preparation for TSL. Him losing 0-3 doesn't mean he did not practice.
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but it was obvieusly he didn't practice enough.. that games were so bad i can't belive.. and it was only pvz from 1/16 till the final.. fkin brackets
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On March 01 2010 22:02 Twisted wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2010 21:56 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:On March 01 2010 16:17 EvilTeletubby wrote:On March 01 2010 16:15 Xeris wrote:
I do understand the cover story, it was just a silly one. TBH I don't think it was bad at all for how instantaneously they needed one. Anyway, great event overall the only thing I thought was bad was seeding basically 1/4th of the money positions to people who did good in the previous tournament. I mean when we look at Draco he didn't practice and just showed up to take a free 250$ and then said he quits which seems unfair to give someone money for his previous accomplishments. This keeps getting brought up, but afaik, Draco played a lot of iccup games in preparation for TSL. Him losing 0-3 doesn't mean he did not practice.
It wasn't so much the results. I just used that as a crude example. Generally I didn't like seeding that many people just right into money. I just felt like it could have ruined the quality and was wondering what you guys were saying about it behind the scenes. I never really saw it talked about. So why did you guys decide to Seed into Ro16 instead of Ro48? I am interested by the discussion behind it.
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On March 01 2010 22:18 purgerinho wrote:but it was obvieusly he didn't practice enough.. that games were so bad i can't belive.. and it was only pvz from 1/16 till the final.. fkin brackets
I thought the brackets were pretty good. It sucked that we saw ZvZ for almost the entire bottom half of the bracket, but I assumed we would anyway. I was honestly so happy when Ret/IdrA got knocked out. If just Ret lost the finals would of been IdrAvZ which would of been rape. I don't even think Mondragon's amazing ZvT at that point could of held a candle to him. When NonY beat him i was so excited, it guaranteed us two amazing matches for the 3rd place and finals. Although I didn't really enjoy the 3rd place match since I couldn't watch it live. The final was amazing though. Loved the games, loved the players.
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TSL was awesome and you guys did a great job. I wasn't affected by the mistake at the finals since I watched it on youtube so for me it was all good, but the discussion afterwards disapointed me a little.
A post explaining why the mistake happened and then defending your choice is rarely a good idea in my opinion. Just make a post stating you're deeply sorry, assure that you've learned from the mistake and then shut up. As soon as you put in something like "we did it in our own free time without pay", "we worked so hard on this and then this happened " or "we did the right choice considering the circumstances though right?" the apology doesn't seem sincere anymore. You can't win as an organizer when this happens, you just have to make the best of it. Making a correct decission after a huge mistake is only good if you don't try to convinve the crowd afterwards.
People behind the scenes who just says "we're sorry" and then shut up should be respected the most and I salute those who did!
I'm sorry I mostly focused on the only downside this tournament had here. All in all it was a great tournament and I had a lot of fun watching it Me and my friends defintely look forward to TSL3 in the future.
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Braavos36375 Posts
On March 01 2010 22:39 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2010 22:02 Twisted wrote:On March 01 2010 21:56 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:On March 01 2010 16:17 EvilTeletubby wrote:On March 01 2010 16:15 Xeris wrote:
I do understand the cover story, it was just a silly one. TBH I don't think it was bad at all for how instantaneously they needed one. Anyway, great event overall the only thing I thought was bad was seeding basically 1/4th of the money positions to people who did good in the previous tournament. I mean when we look at Draco he didn't practice and just showed up to take a free 250$ and then said he quits which seems unfair to give someone money for his previous accomplishments. This keeps getting brought up, but afaik, Draco played a lot of iccup games in preparation for TSL. Him losing 0-3 doesn't mean he did not practice. It wasn't so much the results. I just used that as a crude example. Generally I didn't like seeding that many people just right into money. I just felt like it could have ruined the quality and was wondering what you guys were saying about it behind the scenes. I never really saw it talked about. So why did you guys decide to Seed into Ro16 instead of Ro48? I am interested by the discussion behind it.
We seeded into Ro16 because we promised them seeds into the Ro16. If you take a look at how our seeds did:
JF: finished #4, beat a lot of "in shape" players like Terran and White-Ra
Draco: lost badly, but lost to our 3rd place finisher
Brat: lost in Ro16, but lost to our runner-up
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On March 01 2010 07:52 Hot_Bid wrote:
Secondly, I feel that errors are magnified, since things going right is the "norm." For instance, a situation where users helped us improve was the thread about obs/caster coordination (criticizing us). It was something we definitely improved upon as the tournament went along. Our obs, casters, and others really focused on this problem. We may have argued with one or two bad apples who were being idiots in the thread, but we did accept the point -- the obs/caster sync had to get better. And it did, as evidenced by the lack of comment/complaint about it ever since then. Once it got better, nobody mentioned it again (as expected).
Another example would be the mass of people claiming "imba!! idra and ret shouldn't play, they are progamers, its completely not fair and none of the other players have a chance." Now, those people look pretty stupid, but obviously they aren't going to make a thread "Sorry for whining so much, I was wrong to say other players had no chance against these two." Similarly, nobody is going to make a thread "wow the caster audio didn't drop at all during semis and finals!" because these sorts of things only get highlighted when things go wrong.
All that said, we enjoyed it tremendously. It was a huge learning experience for us as well, and I'm sure the next TSL (whether its for SC2 or not) will have another great leap forward in every aspect. I'm also very happy PS sponsored us -- they were the perfect sponsor. They were very professional, worked with us on many things, and let us sort through any errors we had. Thanks to them, and of course to everyone that watched.
this so much. i have some experience running tournaments and doing other administrative stuff for a different internet game, and it is honestly one of the most thankless jobs ever. the vast majority of players just bitched and moaned about any nitpicky fault they could find; if everything went smoothly, they just chilled and reaped the benefits. fortunately the sc/tl community seems to be a bit better about that in gen, but there are still a good number of these "bad apples" intent on causing a scene.
that said, congrats to the winner, and much love to tl+ps.com for a tremendous tournament!!
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On March 01 2010 23:43 mijellin wrote:
this so much. i have some experience running tournaments and doing other administrative stuff for a different internet game, and it is honestly one of the most thankless jobs ever. the vast majority of players just bitched and moaned about any nitpicky fault they could find; if everything went smoothly, they just chilled and reaped the benefits. fortunately the sc/tl community seems to be a bit better about that in gen, but there are still a good number of these "bad apples" intent on causing a scene.
that said, congrats to the winner, and much love to tl+ps.com for a tremendous tournament!!
I have never run a tournament or anything like it because I believe it is a thankless job like you say (also I would suck). I need money or thanks most of the time, rarely the work itself is reward enough and therefore I don't do it. I am glad there are people like you who does though. The problem is that you should really start to think WHY you do it if you have to be defensive about mistakes or bad work. You don't get paid, you don't get appreciation... What is it then? You obviously do it for something and that is obviously reward enough since you do it...
The point beeing that the line "we do it for free, without pay or anything so you should be greatful" always can be countered with "you do it voluntarily though and there is obviously some sort of reward that is enough for you."
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Thanks to TL.net, Pokerstrategy.com and all the contestors for an awesome tournament!!! Had a lot of fun watching it! (Looking forward to TSL 3!)
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I was just wondering if there's a Mondragon interview anywhere? It would really be nice to hear his side of the story as well. Eventhough he lost, he played an amazing match and the games were tight. He was well ahead with 2-0 and the third game was on a knife's edge. I'm sure we'd all like to hear from him.
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On March 01 2010 23:55 Krigstar wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2010 23:43 mijellin wrote:
this so much. i have some experience running tournaments and doing other administrative stuff for a different internet game, and it is honestly one of the most thankless jobs ever. the vast majority of players just bitched and moaned about any nitpicky fault they could find; if everything went smoothly, they just chilled and reaped the benefits. fortunately the sc/tl community seems to be a bit better about that in gen, but there are still a good number of these "bad apples" intent on causing a scene.
that said, congrats to the winner, and much love to tl+ps.com for a tremendous tournament!! I have never run a tournament or anything like it because I believe it is a thankless job like you say (also I would suck). I need money or thanks most of the time, rarely the work itself is reward enough and therefore I don't do it. I am glad there are people like you who does though. The problem is that you should really start to think WHY you do it if you have to be defensive about mistakes or bad work. You don't get paid, you don't get appreciation... What is it then? You obviously do it for something and that is obviously reward enough since you do it... The point beeing that the line "we do it for free, without pay or anything so you should be greatful" always can be countered with "you do it voluntarily though and there is obviously some sort of reward that is enough for you."
well there is an inherent reward in bringing something to the community and knowing that people are enjoying your efforts. i don't mean that in an entirely altruistic way. tangible contribution is sort of selfishly gratifying.
on the other hand, from the perspective of the administrator, he puts in SO MUCH work for free to make all of this a reality; why can't the participants just show some gratitude and appreciation once in a while? saying thanks doesn't cost any money either! this issue only compounds if/when the community not only doesn't say thanks, but complains and moans about trivial details.
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awesome TSL. thanks a lot guys!
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On March 01 2010 23:14 Hot_Bid wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2010 22:39 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:On March 01 2010 22:02 Twisted wrote:On March 01 2010 21:56 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:On March 01 2010 16:17 EvilTeletubby wrote:On March 01 2010 16:15 Xeris wrote:
I do understand the cover story, it was just a silly one. TBH I don't think it was bad at all for how instantaneously they needed one. Anyway, great event overall the only thing I thought was bad was seeding basically 1/4th of the money positions to people who did good in the previous tournament. I mean when we look at Draco he didn't practice and just showed up to take a free 250$ and then said he quits which seems unfair to give someone money for his previous accomplishments. This keeps getting brought up, but afaik, Draco played a lot of iccup games in preparation for TSL. Him losing 0-3 doesn't mean he did not practice. It wasn't so much the results. I just used that as a crude example. Generally I didn't like seeding that many people just right into money. I just felt like it could have ruined the quality and was wondering what you guys were saying about it behind the scenes. I never really saw it talked about. So why did you guys decide to Seed into Ro16 instead of Ro48? I am interested by the discussion behind it. We seeded into Ro16 because we promised them seeds into the Ro16. If you take a look at how our seeds did:
All I needed to hear :D I didn't realize it was a prize from last TSL tournament.
JF: finished #4, beat a lot of "in shape" players like Terran and White-Ra
Draco: lost badly, but lost to our 3rd place finisher
Brat: lost in Ro16, but lost to our runner-up
I wasn't disputing the results. Draco did lose to the third place guy, but the games weren't even slightly impressive. Thanks for the answer though HB, were this tournies top 3 seeded into TSL3 as well?
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That was just great. I've been away from TL and the BW scene for more than 2 years and it's amazing to see ppl still competing and just having interest in the non-korean scene.
Congratulations !
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Yep I think it was quite the good tournament as well! Maybe not the same hype etc that the first TSL but still one of the best foreign tournaments ever (the best?). The price money was off the hook too
A couple of things I would like to bring up:
I know it's probably not possible but the distance in time between the games being played hardly makes it seem like a tournament. It's more like a couple of games here and there and no continuity. Then again this might be an impossible obstacle to move around so it's no ones fault really. Real life happens etc
Some casting was quite bad; ie some of the later casts by Tastosis were joke-fests with no real quality to them. It was quite immature and it got to the point where I turned off the sound because it felt like they weren't even watching the games, just competing in being the funniest in some sort of constant friendly power struggle they got going on. I know it's 5 am in Seoul but seriously though, casting Starcraft is not rocket science after all, which Tastosis definately showed us. They are both amazing on their own or with DJWheat but together it doesn't really work. I was disappointed.
Chill/day9 worked much better and it's not because they are better casters than Tastosis but maybe they took the whole thing more seriously or their personalities just create a calm, relaxed atmosphere. I dunno. Sure there are some jokes, and hey that's fine lol! But they are much more into the game in general and discuss strategies and the things that happen in the game more.
In case anyone misunderstands this post. I think all these 4 casters are great. Tasteless for his enthusiasm, Artosis for his passion for SC, Chill for creative and insightful logical reasoning, and Day9 for being an eloquent and entertaining/funny speaker who loves SC.
I definately wonder how Tasteless/Chill or Artosis/Day9 would turn out.
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On March 02 2010 02:31 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2010 23:14 Hot_Bid wrote:On March 01 2010 22:39 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:On March 01 2010 22:02 Twisted wrote:On March 01 2010 21:56 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:On March 01 2010 16:17 EvilTeletubby wrote:On March 01 2010 16:15 Xeris wrote:
I do understand the cover story, it was just a silly one. TBH I don't think it was bad at all for how instantaneously they needed one. Anyway, great event overall the only thing I thought was bad was seeding basically 1/4th of the money positions to people who did good in the previous tournament. I mean when we look at Draco he didn't practice and just showed up to take a free 250$ and then said he quits which seems unfair to give someone money for his previous accomplishments. This keeps getting brought up, but afaik, Draco played a lot of iccup games in preparation for TSL. Him losing 0-3 doesn't mean he did not practice. It wasn't so much the results. I just used that as a crude example. Generally I didn't like seeding that many people just right into money. I just felt like it could have ruined the quality and was wondering what you guys were saying about it behind the scenes. I never really saw it talked about. So why did you guys decide to Seed into Ro16 instead of Ro48? I am interested by the discussion behind it. We seeded into Ro16 because we promised them seeds into the Ro16. If you take a look at how our seeds did: All I needed to hear :D I didn't realize it was a prize from last TSL tournament. Show nested quote +
JF: finished #4, beat a lot of "in shape" players like Terran and White-Ra
Draco: lost badly, but lost to our 3rd place finisher
Brat: lost in Ro16, but lost to our runner-up
I wasn't disputing the results. Draco did lose to the third place guy, but the games weren't even slightly impressive. Thanks for the answer though HB, were this tournies top 3 seeded into TSL3 as well?
Draco was actually in quite good shape - if you watched his Nostalgia games and his other tournament matches around this time he was looking REALLY impressive. He was also streaming his practice games a lot
I think it just happened that he had an off day when he was playing Sen and produced mediocre games. Everyone has their bad days, Draco just had his at an inopportune moment.
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thanks to TL, PS.com, the casters and all the players
really entertaining event... mondragons games were always so funny once he got defilers
keep the good work up
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On March 02 2010 03:18 Foucault wrote:
Yep I think it was quite the good tournament as well! Maybe not the same hype etc that the first TSL but still one of the best foreign tournaments ever (the best?). The price money was off the hook too
A couple of things I would like to bring up:
I know it's probably not possible but the distance in time between the games being played hardly makes it seem like a tournament. It's more like a couple of games here and there and no continuity. Then again this might be an impossible obstacle to move around so it's no ones fault really. Real life happens etc
Some casting was quite bad; ie some of the later casts by Tastosis were joke-fests with no real quality to them. It was quite immature and it got to the point where I turned off the sound because it felt like they weren't even watching the games, just competing in being the funniest in some sort of constant friendly power struggle they got going on. I know it's 5 am in Seoul but seriously though, casting Starcraft is not rocket science after all, which Tastosis definately showed us. They are both amazing on their own or with DJWheat but together it doesn't really work. I was disappointed.
Chill/day9 worked much better and it's not because they are better casters than Tastosis but maybe they took the whole thing more seriously or their personalities just create a calm, relaxed atmosphere. I dunno. Sure there are some jokes, and hey that's fine lol! But they are much more into the game in general and discuss strategies and the things that happen in the game more.
In case anyone misunderstands this post. I think all these 4 casters are great. Tasteless for his enthusiasm, Artosis for his passion for SC, Chill for creative and insightful logical reasoning, and Day9 for being an eloquent and entertaining/funny speaker who loves SC.
I definately wonder how Tasteless/Chill or Artosis/Day9 would turn out.
I... don't understand how you can say that. I didn't feel that way about the Tasteless/Artosis casts at all.
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On March 02 2010 03:26 Xeris wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 02:31 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:On March 01 2010 23:14 Hot_Bid wrote:On March 01 2010 22:39 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:On March 01 2010 22:02 Twisted wrote:On March 01 2010 21:56 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:On March 01 2010 16:17 EvilTeletubby wrote:On March 01 2010 16:15 Xeris wrote:
I do understand the cover story, it was just a silly one. TBH I don't think it was bad at all for how instantaneously they needed one. Anyway, great event overall the only thing I thought was bad was seeding basically 1/4th of the money positions to people who did good in the previous tournament. I mean when we look at Draco he didn't practice and just showed up to take a free 250$ and then said he quits which seems unfair to give someone money for his previous accomplishments. This keeps getting brought up, but afaik, Draco played a lot of iccup games in preparation for TSL. Him losing 0-3 doesn't mean he did not practice. It wasn't so much the results. I just used that as a crude example. Generally I didn't like seeding that many people just right into money. I just felt like it could have ruined the quality and was wondering what you guys were saying about it behind the scenes. I never really saw it talked about. So why did you guys decide to Seed into Ro16 instead of Ro48? I am interested by the discussion behind it. We seeded into Ro16 because we promised them seeds into the Ro16. If you take a look at how our seeds did: All I needed to hear :D I didn't realize it was a prize from last TSL tournament.
JF: finished #4, beat a lot of "in shape" players like Terran and White-Ra
Draco: lost badly, but lost to our 3rd place finisher
Brat: lost in Ro16, but lost to our runner-up
I wasn't disputing the results. Draco did lose to the third place guy, but the games weren't even slightly impressive. Thanks for the answer though HB, were this tournies top 3 seeded into TSL3 as well? Draco was actually in quite good shape - if you watched his Nostalgia games and his other tournament matches around this time he was looking REALLY impressive. He was also streaming his practice games a lot I think it just happened that he had an off day when he was playing Sen and produced mediocre games. Everyone has their bad days, Draco just had his at an inopportune moment.
I actually didn't even know he was active lately. His last active period I remember was last TSL and some guy posting a stream of him which I never saw get truly active so I assumed he quit again.
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I really want to thanks the staff for this most amazing. TSL1 at best is a bit shadowy in my mind, but as far as I recall this one was much much more impressive. The casters were really great, we had pretty amazing games, and an epic final.
On the subject of obs/caster sync, I did notice how much it had improved in the later casts. I remember a few times saying to myself "oh, they are really working together great now" which I dont remember doing in the earlier part of t he TSL. So great job there.
Also, on the spoiler subject, I was one of those that didn't get spoiled by the stream but almost got spoiler by the post that was linked in IRC, Started to read the post, saw what it was about, and thought: "oh well, whether its true or not, i really dont wanna know" so i stopped reading But I guess for those that were spoiled it was the best that could be done at the moment.
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On March 02 2010 07:47 Zozma wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 03:18 Foucault wrote:
Yep I think it was quite the good tournament as well! Maybe not the same hype etc that the first TSL but still one of the best foreign tournaments ever (the best?). The price money was off the hook too
A couple of things I would like to bring up:
I know it's probably not possible but the distance in time between the games being played hardly makes it seem like a tournament. It's more like a couple of games here and there and no continuity. Then again this might be an impossible obstacle to move around so it's no ones fault really. Real life happens etc
Some casting was quite bad; ie some of the later casts by Tastosis were joke-fests with no real quality to them. It was quite immature and it got to the point where I turned off the sound because it felt like they weren't even watching the games, just competing in being the funniest in some sort of constant friendly power struggle they got going on. I know it's 5 am in Seoul but seriously though, casting Starcraft is not rocket science after all, which Tastosis definately showed us. They are both amazing on their own or with DJWheat but together it doesn't really work. I was disappointed.
Chill/day9 worked much better and it's not because they are better casters than Tastosis but maybe they took the whole thing more seriously or their personalities just create a calm, relaxed atmosphere. I dunno. Sure there are some jokes, and hey that's fine lol! But they are much more into the game in general and discuss strategies and the things that happen in the game more.
In case anyone misunderstands this post. I think all these 4 casters are great. Tasteless for his enthusiasm, Artosis for his passion for SC, Chill for creative and insightful logical reasoning, and Day9 for being an eloquent and entertaining/funny speaker who loves SC.
I definately wonder how Tasteless/Chill or Artosis/Day9 would turn out.
I... don't understand how you can say that. I didn't feel that way about the Tasteless/Artosis casts at all.
I did. I really enjoyed the Chill/Day9 casts because they actually explained what was happening in the game and why it happened. If Tasteless/Artosis also did this I missed it and it was to a much lesser degree and totally snowed under by the jokes.
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The final was excellent. I loved Nony's Mass DT zealot opening. It was so pimp.
Casting in the Finals and the 3rd place match was excellent! [though can't help to think what it would have been like if Canada wasn't playing for the gold in hockey].
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United States42685 Posts
TSL brought the UK community together for the first time in the history of bw. I just wanna say thank you to everyone who made this possible.
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Thanks for getting the VODs up almost instantly! For those of us, who rely on those torrents really appreciate the speed at which they become available. Going to be spreading these vods to as many South African starcraft players as possible!
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I'm especially glad that Nony won, that no-gg was quite anti-climatic, but still, i think that money is in really good hands there.
I'm also happy for Mondragon, he almost won this, but Nony could get his shit together and turn the series around. It would have been funny if Mondi wins this TSL, in which most ppl counted him out, after losing the first one where he was the favorite, or amongst the favorites at worst.
I feel bad about Ret though...
And white-ra should have beaten JF i feel
But still, quite satisfing results overall
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it feels like paragraph 1,2,5,6 and 7 were written after paragraph 3 and 4
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On March 02 2010 08:04 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2010 03:26 Xeris wrote:On March 02 2010 02:31 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:On March 01 2010 23:14 Hot_Bid wrote:On March 01 2010 22:39 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:On March 01 2010 22:02 Twisted wrote:On March 01 2010 21:56 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:On March 01 2010 16:17 EvilTeletubby wrote:On March 01 2010 16:15 Xeris wrote:
I do understand the cover story, it was just a silly one. TBH I don't think it was bad at all for how instantaneously they needed one. Anyway, great event overall the only thing I thought was bad was seeding basically 1/4th of the money positions to people who did good in the previous tournament. I mean when we look at Draco he didn't practice and just showed up to take a free 250$ and then said he quits which seems unfair to give someone money for his previous accomplishments. This keeps getting brought up, but afaik, Draco played a lot of iccup games in preparation for TSL. Him losing 0-3 doesn't mean he did not practice. It wasn't so much the results. I just used that as a crude example. Generally I didn't like seeding that many people just right into money. I just felt like it could have ruined the quality and was wondering what you guys were saying about it behind the scenes. I never really saw it talked about. So why did you guys decide to Seed into Ro16 instead of Ro48? I am interested by the discussion behind it. We seeded into Ro16 because we promised them seeds into the Ro16. If you take a look at how our seeds did: All I needed to hear :D I didn't realize it was a prize from last TSL tournament.
JF: finished #4, beat a lot of "in shape" players like Terran and White-Ra
Draco: lost badly, but lost to our 3rd place finisher
Brat: lost in Ro16, but lost to our runner-up
I wasn't disputing the results. Draco did lose to the third place guy, but the games weren't even slightly impressive. Thanks for the answer though HB, were this tournies top 3 seeded into TSL3 as well? Draco was actually in quite good shape - if you watched his Nostalgia games and his other tournament matches around this time he was looking REALLY impressive. He was also streaming his practice games a lot I think it just happened that he had an off day when he was playing Sen and produced mediocre games. Everyone has their bad days, Draco just had his at an inopportune moment. I actually didn't even know he was active lately. His last active period I remember was last TSL and some guy posting a stream of him which I never saw get truly active so I assumed he quit again.
Remember the only reason Sen vs JF seemed a lot closer was due to Sen playing like complete shit because he didnt practice for this series at all. He actually practiced vs Draco and it paid off.
Also
Thanks a whole lot Pokerstrategy, TL, the coding team,the obs, and the casters for making this an awesome experience and one of the most fun foreign tourneys of all time. I stayed up every night even when I had university to watch every single game in the ro16 and up live.
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I watched a little less than half of the 'televised' matches due to other activities I couldn't skip. Wish I could have because I just loved it. Good job and thanks to everyone who made this possible, players, staff, and sponsor!
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On March 01 2010 07:35 Carnac wrote:In reply to the op, I wrote the following in the live report thread + Show Spoiler +
Ok. This is what happened:
Everything was set up perfectly. I had run through all the videos with R1CH watching, we had soundchecked early, were ready in perfect time.
Cheerful video is running, music is playing and I switch to the Probe intro to start the cast. Probe intro ends, I switch to the NonY vs Mondi screen and sound on stream for absolutely no reason at all is gone. I start getting mad, because the stream gods apparently hate us (or we really should have sacrificed GTR over a fire!).
Restarting Wirecast (and thus restarting the stream) instantly fixes the sound problem. We decide not to use the Probe video again, because we think it's what made the sound crash (despite it working perfectly in earlier casts and during the test before today's cast as well). I thus remove the Probe video from the Wirecast video list. Since it was one of the first ones in my list everything else moves up one slot.
The stream is restarted with the Nony vs Mondi screen on. I want to switch to the Cheerful video again, but with everything having moved up one slot the bracket video is now in the slot the cheerful video was in before. Visual memory is a bitch, so I run it, instantly recognizing my mistake.
I yell at R1CH to take the stream down instantly, but alas it's too late, the data has already been processed by the streaming server.
Most people were still reconnecting at that time though, so only a minority caught a glimpse of it. The reason posts were deleted and Kennigit posted earlier in this thread was not to hide anything, but to avoid spoilers for the majority who had not yet reconnected. Users mentioning it in this thread over and over again while the cast was still going only made it worse (risk of spoiling to the mahority that didnt see it).
I don't think anyone outside the people involved realize the fragility of our streaming environment, obs, casters & tech crew spread all over the world. Nor does anyone understand the pressure when stuff suddenly goes wrong for no good reason (I still don't understand why Wirecast decided to crash the sound after the Probe vid....) at all with thousands of people watching.
If anyone is mad they got spoiled put yourself in my shoes, thanks.
Kennigit's "on the fly damage control" pretty much sums it up. That aside: I loved TSL. Loved most of the matches, loved the upsets, loved the casters.
Loved the obs too
seriously in the last few matches the obsing was great. Like in the finals you switch to nonys base to show a templar archives being built at the EXACT second that it was being built (or maybe it was 3rd/4th dunno. )
I was like *wtf* thats impressive.
In the 3rd/4th game we got to see like twice as much info as what tastosis commentated on, like when the DT of JF had snuck in.
and artosis was like "oh lol guess we missed that, but well sen did too " (He hadn't)
so ridiculous but so funny at the same time, I laughed so hard at tastosis cast of the jf sen matches, enjoying it thoroughly, while at the same time being quite happy that chill day9 are casting the finals since thats a bit more serious
Anyways I thought about making a big blog post but I'm too lazy /dont have the time for that so I'll just post here.
THANK YOU SO MUCH TEAMLIQUID YOU FUCKING ROCK HELL FUCKING YEAH
Thank you tl for the countless hours you put into this, thank you tl for getting such a sick sponsor, thank you pokerstrategy for being such a sick sponsor, thank you starcraft gods for producing such great games - the beginning had some bad onesided rapes but then it just got better and better.
If bw is really gonna die now that SC2 is out, it will die at its peak.
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was there a TSL wrap-up article by tl.net?
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Kennigit
Canada19447 Posts
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yup tsl rocked I enjoyed it much more then the last tsl. I would bring it up no matter how many tables I had open in poker lol. I hated the chill/day vent issues in the beginning but after that got fixed everything was awesome. I pretty much agree with everyone chef said earlier about the casting.
Now all tsl has to work on is getting it started on time 
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I just never opened any tl.net live report thread during the finals again the instant I saw those first "OMG WAS THAT THE FINALS RESULT???!!!" posts. Didnt read more than 2 of them either cus you know there will be some douchebag in the next few posts spoiling the result. Would have been nice to check the live report thread in between games, but I just used my head and didnt for this finals, so I could still feel all the hype when mondi went up 2-0 and the bitter taste of disappointment when he proceeded to lose the next 4 ^^
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I stayed up every night even when I had university to watch every single game in the ro16 and up live.
HAR HAR kids like this crack me up "AWW I have UNIVERSITY IN THE MORNING!!!!" Seriously, I'm taking an engineering degree, working 1 full-time night job and a part time day job, and I still ace tests.... kids these days are pathetic
ANNYYWAYS back to topic, I personally think that this TSL was purely amazing. I bet you the commentators, the people behind the scenes, and even most of the wonderful SC players we got to watch got NO money or VERY LITTLE. I would LOVE to see what the TL staff would be able to do if some big company actually paid them to organize such a tournament. I bet you it would make kespa, MLG, and any other big gaming tournaments look like amateurs. If I were Blizzard, I would forget about organizing any tournaments or leagues and just pay TL.net organizers to do it all. To put this much heart into something where you get no money simply shocks me. I don't think I would be able to do it , I won't even help some random who comes up to me in the library asking to help me with a JAVA flow chart; yet TL gave me at least two months of purely entertaining starcraft for NO payment. It saddens me that SC2 is going to destroy these kind of events Some random kids will be able to do so well off such ridiculous strategies. I wish SC2 promod was considered by Blizzard lol , some of their ideas were wack, but most are really necessary
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I was reconnecting at that time when the results were spoiled, and I didn't turn the chat on because it had some bugs previously, so I watched the whole finals w/o getting spoiled and I'm super happy about it ;D! (The only place where I thought "wtf?" is when Day9 said something like "ok, now the final game" and it was 6th game with nony 3:2 =D).
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I found it really easy and professional to find a way to watch the WHOLE tournament without spoilers.
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After I saw IdrA beat NoNy, I was like, "NoNy, heh, he will never win the TSL, I think he will only make it to the second round in my bracket, but no further because he will have to face IdrA again, who will of course win the TSL without a doubt."
I was wrong.
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On April 05 2010 20:39 eXNewB wrote:Show nested quote +
I stayed up every night even when I had university to watch every single game in the ro16 and up live.
HAR HAR kids like this crack me up "AWW I have UNIVERSITY IN THE MORNING!!!!" Seriously, I'm taking an engineering degree, working 1 full-time night job and a part time day job, and I still ace tests.... kids these days are pathetic
lol
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EPT
