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Whats the conversion rate on Esport dollars?
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Prices are a little too high I believe.
Good idea still
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At first I was surprised by the cost, I figured it might be $1 a month. I still got a year subscription. It's not like 57cents a week is going to kill me and it'd be nice to see TL run a larger full-time staff and pay the existing ones more for all their hard work.
In my head I fear that $29.95 might net 1 000 subscribers vs $12 netting 10 000. I hope I'm wrong though  .
On June 22 2013 03:07 zerotol wrote:
Next step pay to post
I am extremely disappointed by this decision. Doesn't make TL have enough money with the merchandising and the sponsors?
Decline of Teamliquid.
I for one hope not a lot of people pay for this. I won't ever pay for this anyway.
edit: looks like the pay to post already started:
+ Private TL+ Forum
In this private forum, all TL+ members will become best friends. What will be in this forum? What does your heart tell you? Follow your dreams.
So tempting to just gift this person so he can't avoid it.
On June 22 2013 05:24 Kiett wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2013 05:20 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:On June 22 2013 05:14 Hellbat wrote:On June 22 2013 04:59 Nakama wrote:
for me this seems like a big step backwards but who can blame tl many other internet sites are doing it nowadays.. capitalism 4tw... thats why i am always laughing about ppl saying our society progresses forward... its not like u have to pay 4 sth that was free before but NOW u have to pay for new features which is in fact the same . TL started as a community page and got this many members due to many ppl doing stuff for free and when they get big they somehow feel the need to make even more money.... i will never get the logic behind this if its not only greed In case you didn't know, this is an AMERICAN website, made by AMERICANS for an AMERICAN made game. We love capitalism I'm Dutch.. No, you're from Númenor.
:D
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I've always read about some existing private forums on Teamliquid for long time members or something, maybe that's what they mean by private forums, and not like some super forums just for TL+ members?
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Awesome initiative and I love the parallels to Reddit Gold. The gifting feature is the best part I think so we can reward members for just being awesome in a more meaningful way.
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On June 22 2013 15:24 lisward wrote:
I've always read about some existing private forums on Teamliquid for long time members or something, maybe that's what they mean by private forums, and not like some super forums just for TL+ members?
The TL+ forum is just another forum where you can create a thread and discuss anything, It's not a set of forums for sc2 dota2 league of legends etc. And yes there are hidden forums for TL staff, there's one for writers, Liquipedia staff, moderators, where they can discuss their work and projects.
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WHAT I CANT USE TL+ AND BE FREE FROM REPERCUSSIONS OF INSULTING OTHER PEOPLE?
Kappa
Nice.. The features are kinda cool
Too poor to afford such luxuries tho :3
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On June 22 2013 05:17 BisuDagger wrote:
We should make TL+ free for a month every 20,000 posts. That would really motivate people to post!
Ye but the quality of the posts would be a letdown!
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I don't care much about the features although they are nice, I just like seeing an easy way to support you guys for all the AMAZING hard work you all put in, im in.
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+ Show Spoiler +On June 22 2013 08:13 Nakama wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2013 06:47 Torenhire wrote:On June 22 2013 06:33 Nakama wrote:On June 22 2013 06:26 Piy wrote:
Don't like the commercialisation at all, but whatever I guess. Whole feeling of the community is so changed from a few years ago, makes me realise why I participate less and less.
Just my opinion, not just on this issue, but also the general trend of modern e-sports. Regardless of how much money people are making now, I had a lot more fun with Starcraft 5 years ago. Now I don't play or watch it, and endless adverts and sponsor shout outs and reddit posts about the stagnation of esports' growth just make me not want to. Was just better when I could watch an hour or so of fresh BW VOD's, play at the A/B ranks and not have to spend forever finding games (back when Iccup was a viable server) and enjoy the community interaction on TL.'
Feels now like something great is gone forever. I would love nothing more than to go back to BW being the niche game it was with a decent, dedicated following and a fun community; the thought of never truly getting to experience my favourite game of all time again is very disheartening and depressing.
Can't wait for the next good competitive RTS tbh, will hopefully be fun again. This... i think sth in my heart died today.. TL was the last site i expected to implement sth like this.. build by fans run by fans... i will miss the good old times.. i always tried my best to support TL with the little i have but now i think i will adblock it again... im not trying to be offensive btw i just cant understand why the old system worked for so long and now suddenly they need to make sth like this other then greed i hope someone can give me some good arguments so i can get my faith back into my so loved number one website. TL has full time paid employees. TL has to get the staff and coverage people to events, plus they have players to pay. I'm not going to speak on their behalf but I'm guessing that Ads and sponsors don't cover the costs. Can you imagine the costs of running a site of this size? That's not cheap either. It's not greed. You aren't being forced to do it. Adblocking because of TL+ just proves you're really cynical more than anything else. You lose absolutely nothing by not buying TL+. You get TL+ because you support TL. If they said "oh non TL+ members can only post 5 times per day then yes we could be upset and hate the site owners for the feature. There's a lot of people making a huge deal about something that doesn't effect anyone unless they are going to buy it. If you're really that upset about not getting access to the features then maybe you should shell out a whole 3 dollars to try it out for a month and see if you're really missing out as much as you think you are. this sadly doesnt answer my question at all. i know running a good website like this cost sth but u also get sth back 4 it or not?? it worked for a long time before didnt it ? and running a sc2 and dota 2 team is costly isnt it ? how could they even start to do sth like this if they didnt make profit out of the website ? so im still w8ing for an argument why this is needed other then greed =) and again no offense im still loving TL and i have a huge respect for its owners,casue they have made sth that big and still im heavily dissapointed by this move. I dotn care if +members get much for their money or not this is the wrong way in my opinion * The team doesn't run off the site revenues.^ * Nazghul already said it worked for a long time because he slaved away for nothing. * If you don't care that members get much for their money, see it as a donation. The fact you're complaining over something you aren't paying for and something you already get for absolutely free (this awesome website) astounds me. Additionally should the site be exactly break even with the staff all volunteers and the full-timers working for minimum wages and scraping the poverty line? Or should Nazghul - heaven forbid - make a small amount of money for the fact he runs the most successful website in the world and sponsors two teams? Those who pay subscriptions do it in appreciation for the years they've spent here especially if they never got around to contributing in a more tangible way. ^ Even if it does in the future that means that tl would be able to purchase more players and pay the existing ones more - something I'd approve of. You shouldn't have to be Flash to make decent money.
Edit: I read your reply to Nazghul's post so I'll spoiler this. You were very nice in your reply.
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...paid forums ?
-.- okay
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Netherlands6192 Posts
Interesting. I have mixed feelings about this. I mean, I can see the benefit of it for TL but people around here don't really like change all that much.
If I had means I would actually subscribe just to support TL, not to get any special features, but since I don't, I can't.
I would love to contribute in some way though. Even if only as an artist/writer. Guess I will just have to up my game
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Yes, but what does this have to do with the price of fish?
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If you subscribe to TL, chances are you are serious about using and contributing to the community. So automatically the TL users will be a select crowd who are like a creme de la creme of TL. There will exceptions, like folks who cant afford the subscriptions and trolls who wanna pay for trolling (who will get banned in any case.)
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On June 22 2013 08:55 zJayy962 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 22 2013 08:20 Cele wrote:On June 22 2013 07:52 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:On June 22 2013 06:33 Nakama wrote:On June 22 2013 06:26 Piy wrote:
Don't like the commercialisation at all, but whatever I guess. Whole feeling of the community is so changed from a few years ago, makes me realise why I participate less and less.
Just my opinion, not just on this issue, but also the general trend of modern e-sports. Regardless of how much money people are making now, I had a lot more fun with Starcraft 5 years ago. Now I don't play or watch it, and endless adverts and sponsor shout outs and reddit posts about the stagnation of esports' growth just make me not want to. Was just better when I could watch an hour or so of fresh BW VOD's, play at the A/B ranks and not have to spend forever finding games (back when Iccup was a viable server) and enjoy the community interaction on TL.'
Feels now like something great is gone forever. I would love nothing more than to go back to BW being the niche game it was with a decent, dedicated following and a fun community; the thought of never truly getting to experience my favourite game of all time again is very disheartening and depressing.
Can't wait for the next good competitive RTS tbh, will hopefully be fun again. This... i think sth in my heart died today.. TL was the last site i expected to implement sth like this.. build by fans run by fans... i will miss the good old times.. i always tried my best to support TL with the little i have but now i think i will adblock it again... im not trying to be offensive btw i just cant understand why the old system worked for so long and now suddenly they need to make sth like this other then greed i hope someone can give me some good arguments so i can get my faith back into my so loved number one website. I created TL in 2002 when thought we could fill a special spot in the BW scene. In the first eight years it was a completely voluntary job for me (first I was an SC progamer, then I supported myself through poker). I think you should know that I worked my ass off the eight years before you created your account, without ever expecting this would one day become a business. Today TeamLiquid.net has become a monster to manage that can't be ran based on anyone's passion alone. As a website offering so much to its users it is impossible to maintain without monetization. We have about 200 staff members the vast majority of whom are voluntary. However as with any organization we absolutely must have paid quality staff to lead and accommodate such a massive group of people, and to create revenue to pay for all the costs involved with running a website as large as this. In terms of monetization I believe we have always stuck close to the principles that drove me to do this for eight years as a hobby. We've never considered doing popups, we have never locked popular public content behind paywalls, and we have never put up donation buttons. I think that we do a decent job at creating revenue sources that do not create negatives for those who don't want to spend money. Think of the store, non-instrusive ads, pay-what-you-want models, and TL+, which takes no functionality away from anyone who isn't interested in buying it. no offense, but we heard the "well this site costs money, it's hard to just break even" argument quite a couple of times. It came up on various occasions, last time i recall was the opening of TL store. I don't buy it. Judging by TL's unique clicks per day and the estimated revenue of the shop and other cooperations, such as papa johns pizza deal and sponsored threads, i assume TL was making quite some (not naming any numbers) in profit before the introduction of TL+. And i did take into account that people get paid as well. If this is hilarious to you, open up your finances to the users. I would be more inclined to support TL by such a feature if i knew this site was having a hard time on breaking even. He never said he had trouble breaking even. He has two pro teams, staff to pay, and a massive site that he must maintain. People have to live their lives. He's trying to do it in the most non-intrusive way possible and still people give TL shit about it. If you aren't going to support it, don't try to discourage others not to also just because you don't think TL should make more than you believe is "just". People like you are poison to any community.
He is not "poison in the community"...he is simply putting forward an opinion that A LOT of people would agree with. Although I agree, I would put it differently...
Everyone is entitled to monetize a skill, a trade, information or expertise in any way they want....this is capitalism at its best. In saying that, the laws of economics will tell you that consumers (ie "we the community") will only pay for something if we see VALUE in it.
It is easy to be sceptical and cynical, but when you drill down and look at what TL+ is offering, most us would ask - - "does the purchase/subscription represent fair value?". From my perspective, no, it does not, and I will not pay for TL+. I love the content, streams, editorial, ads etc just the way they are. Why pay for enhancements that are not valuable to me? In saying all of this - just my opinion. Its all about perspective, not the size of your wallet.
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<3 you TL.
Will buy as soon as the "lifetime TL+" option is available
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I like all the ideas in TL+ except the private forum. I worry that the private forum will fragment TL.
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EPT
