EPTOfficial Singapore StarCraft Community Thread - Page 29
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pangshai
Chinatown5333 Posts
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Dfgj
Singapore5922 Posts
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pangshai
Chinatown5333 Posts
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Dfgj
Singapore5922 Posts
For example, the army is full of it, but when there's a report to write or announcements to be made, comprehensible speech rears its head. That is kind of important for a commentary that many may be listening to. | ||
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Derme
United States41 Posts
On October 06 2010 19:42 Dfgj wrote: There's a reason it's only used colloquially and not present in any sort of large occasion. The reason is that there's still a huge inferiority complex in Singapore nowadays(stemming from our colonial past?). This complex is pretty obvious if you look around. This inferiority complex causes ministers and economically-minded leaders of our country to abandon a product of our multiracial society in favour of so-called proper English. The official justification for doing so is highly capitalist (hurts our ability to deal with foreigners) and simply untrue. It's fairly ironic how anybody can claim an absolute standard of English for Singlish to measure up against when one big reason English is the lingua franca is that it's highly flexible and readily accepts new words. | ||
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pangshai
Chinatown5333 Posts
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Dfgj
Singapore5922 Posts
However, this is no place for an ideological debate on something that is very practical. A commentary needs to be easily understood by the entire audience; if yours is 100% local Singaporean, perhaps, but that's not necessarily the case. pangshai: I find it one of the more repulsive aspects of what is otherwise a generally modern culture. There are far more ways to show your national pride than garbling the working language of your country, as I see it. From an international viewpoint, it does make you sound rather thick, and that's not the sort of national identity I'd want to develop. | ||
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Derme
United States41 Posts
Therefore, "proper" English is less advantageous to communication. Why use it for announcements then? It seems to me "proper" English is used in business communiques because this "proper" English is deemed high-class enough for official decisions. Which I have already claimed is due to a cultural inferiority complex. What I really take issue with is your claim that Singlish represents bad English and should be considered unworthy, when I feel that different forms of English should not be evaluated based on Queen's English or whatever else you consider worthy of being used as an absolute scale. Whoever is in charge of this thread, are we still allowed to discuss it here, or should we take it to PM/MSN? | ||
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mezza
Singapore49 Posts
firstly, thanks pangshai, i did it for kicks, because someone said I sound Jamaican, and I stated that I was Singaporean, and I had to prove it, so I did it. So you guys do know I'm a born and bred Singaporean. However, I have to agree with Dfgj on some counts. English spoken with a Singaporean accent is a different thing altogether compared to English which has its grammar and vocab contorted and sprinkled with colloquials. Singlish, in its true form as spoken by an ah beng, is nothing to be proud of, and I don't see how it should be made into a national identity. However, adding a "Lahhhh" at the end of stuff, can instantly endear yourself to a fellow countryman especially when you meet them overseas and it can instantly break the ice. That being said, I'll do it for fun? Or maybe a full Singlish cast with Kelly :D But definitely won't do something regional/international stuff in singlish, because as Dfgj said, the other party might just find it hard to understnad. on another note, since we're done with Nationwars and have to sit and wait for the result of the AU vs NZ matchup to find out if we're 1st or 2nd (i think gg also lar, they're fielding all the big guns), a couple of people are looking to form up tournaments and looking for location sponsors and gift/prize sponsors for local events. Malaysia, Aus and NZ seem to have tons of stuff and tournaments going on, but the local scene in Singpaore is still abit muted, so if anyone have suggestions, or willing to put up a cash kitty in exchange for advertising/plugging time on stream, there are some of us who will be more than happy to discuss stuff with you :D just pm me and i'll put you in touch with those people. LASTLY, nirvAnA's king of the hill will be live @ 8pm SGT, stream to be confirmed, won't be mine as I'm still at work. check www.sc2sea.com for live updates, i'll post when i can | ||
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Dfgj
Singapore5922 Posts
Anyways, Derme, you've built a whole post on the idea that the only people in the world are Singaporeans. That's great, but they're not the only ones who might watch a SEA stream, and not the only people you'll deal with. I'm not even going to touch the whole point about how speaking normal english is somehow 'high class' and due to an 'inferiority complex'. There's nothing pretentious about having passable sentence structure and grammar. I'd much rather hear streams in clear english. If the commentators want to toss in some local slang (hokkien, whatever), go for it, so long as it's understandable. I do agree with Mezza that it's fine to toss in the occasional slang term, but Singlish is far more than the slang - it's the entire manner of speaking (as he also brings up). I wish I could play koth but I'm still in camp :| | ||
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Derme
United States41 Posts
Why aren't you going to touch the point about inferiority complexes? Seems to me it has everything to do with why the army uses "proper" English in its communiques, which was what you based your original argument on. | ||
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Dfgj
Singapore5922 Posts
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Derme
United States41 Posts
I'll assume its the latter. Okay then. In your example of how the army prefers "proper" English(heretofore known as p.English) over Singlish, what other reason is there the army prefers p.English over Singlish? It sure as hell isn't communication, because p.English doesn't help you communicate with soldiers better than Singlish. I'd bet it's worse for communication. | ||
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Dfgj
Singapore5922 Posts
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Derme
United States41 Posts
2. Yeah I am, explain why since speaking in p.English doesn't have any benefits communication-wise. 3. Clear language is highly subjective. Try telling your bunkmate "The uniquely-Singaporean Creole derivative of English is ubiquitous in our tropical island". Then tell him "Everyone say Singlish, lor". Which is clearer? | ||
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mezza
Singapore49 Posts
Speaking Greek to an Aborigine is bad for communication, similarly, speaking the Queen's English to a Hokkien-peng is bad for communication. However, international relations/politics and in cases such as streaming games that are regional/multinational, perhaps pure Singlish would be a poor choice. but whatever, we do stuff for fun, its lighthearted and its a game, so please lets just enjoy the game, even if its in Korean, if you see beautiful play, it still works :D anyway the stream is live now for nirvAnA's KOTH. http://www.ustream.tv/channel/unstable-tv1 | ||
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Dfgj
Singapore5922 Posts
On October 06 2010 21:35 mezza wrote: uhm guys, i think we all need to take a chill-pill/chillax. Speaking Greek to an Aborigine is bad for communication, similarly, speaking the Queen's English to a Hokkien-peng is bad for communication. However, international relations/politics and in cases such as streaming games that are regional/multinational, perhaps pure Singlish would be a poor choice. but whatever, we do stuff for fun, its lighthearted and its a game, so please lets just enjoy the game, even if its in Korean, if you see beautiful play, it still works :D anyway the stream is live now for nirvAnA's KOTH. http://www.ustream.tv/channel/unstable-tv1 Yeah I agree, if it's a local event or cast, do it any way you want (it's your cast, after all) :p | ||
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.CheckMate.
Singapore6 Posts
damn this is a lot of singaporeans. i got hooked on this game now and play more than my rl friends. hope to meet ppl better! | ||
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Dante08
Singapore4128 Posts
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madnessman
United States1581 Posts
On October 06 2010 19:08 Dfgj wrote: Why promote bad english =( god look what you started. :D Stop arguing about Singlish. Just let mezza do his thing and cast the way he's familiar with. | ||
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