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Please remember that while this thread is for QQ and venting about the game, racism is not tolerated here on LD. |
On December 04 2012 22:05 Doraemon wrote:Show nested quote +On December 04 2012 21:56 Erasme wrote:
winrate doesnt matter. Firebolt is under 50% and queue sometimes into known names i want to know why im queued with <20 gamers or even 10 in this case.
As an experiment I made a new account, clicked on Beginner or whatever it is called and wanted to see how fast it adjusts my MMR to where my main account is.
About 10 games later I was on page 3 or 4 in a game with rmN- and Tzar.
So yeah, the MMR system adjusts you quite radically if it thinks you performed better than your teammates or opponents. I don't know how they do it, but to my knowledge it works quite well.
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On December 05 2012 03:12 Bommes wrote:Show nested quote +On December 04 2012 22:05 Doraemon wrote:On December 04 2012 21:56 Erasme wrote:
winrate doesnt matter. Firebolt is under 50% and queue sometimes into known names i want to know why im queued with <20 gamers or even 10 in this case. As an experiment I made a new account, clicked on Beginner or whatever it is called and wanted to see how fast it adjusts my MMR to where my main account is. About 10 games later I was on page 3 or 4 in a game with rmN- and Tzar. So yeah, the MMR system adjusts you quite radically if it thinks you performed better than your teammates or opponents. I don't know how they do it, but to my knowledge it works quite well.
Are you implying that MMR doesn't solely care about winrate?
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On December 05 2012 04:25 itsthewoo wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2012 03:12 Bommes wrote:On December 04 2012 22:05 Doraemon wrote:On December 04 2012 21:56 Erasme wrote:
winrate doesnt matter. Firebolt is under 50% and queue sometimes into known names i want to know why im queued with <20 gamers or even 10 in this case. As an experiment I made a new account, clicked on Beginner or whatever it is called and wanted to see how fast it adjusts my MMR to where my main account is. About 10 games later I was on page 3 or 4 in a game with rmN- and Tzar. So yeah, the MMR system adjusts you quite radically if it thinks you performed better than your teammates or opponents. I don't know how they do it, but to my knowledge it works quite well. Are you implying that MMR doesn't solely care about winrate?
of course it doesnt, or its counted only slightly....why is it your skills fault when you lose 50% of your games due to 4 idiots on your team when solo queueing?also playing as a 5 man stack does increase your winrate significantly, which means that if 1 of your mates is really bad and gets carried by the 4 other, his skill would improve for no reason
also if you become better at the game your winrate will still be around 50% because u get matched with better enemies. where it really starts to count and where it really matters is when you reach the higheer levels in the "very high" bracket
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Lalalaland34503 Posts
On December 05 2012 04:25 itsthewoo wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2012 03:12 Bommes wrote:On December 04 2012 22:05 Doraemon wrote:On December 04 2012 21:56 Erasme wrote:
winrate doesnt matter. Firebolt is under 50% and queue sometimes into known names i want to know why im queued with <20 gamers or even 10 in this case. As an experiment I made a new account, clicked on Beginner or whatever it is called and wanted to see how fast it adjusts my MMR to where my main account is. About 10 games later I was on page 3 or 4 in a game with rmN- and Tzar. So yeah, the MMR system adjusts you quite radically if it thinks you performed better than your teammates or opponents. I don't know how they do it, but to my knowledge it works quite well. Are you implying that MMR doesn't solely care about winrate?
I have <50% winrate and am in Very High.
Some games carry higher weighting on your MMR depending on what you're queued against. If I'm in a game where I'm the highest MMR and everyone else has a much lower MMR, winning is going to give me a very small rise, whereas losing would lose me a lot of MMR points. Make sense?
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On December 05 2012 04:25 itsthewoo wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2012 03:12 Bommes wrote:On December 04 2012 22:05 Doraemon wrote:On December 04 2012 21:56 Erasme wrote:
winrate doesnt matter. Firebolt is under 50% and queue sometimes into known names i want to know why im queued with <20 gamers or even 10 in this case. As an experiment I made a new account, clicked on Beginner or whatever it is called and wanted to see how fast it adjusts my MMR to where my main account is. About 10 games later I was on page 3 or 4 in a game with rmN- and Tzar. So yeah, the MMR system adjusts you quite radically if it thinks you performed better than your teammates or opponents. I don't know how they do it, but to my knowledge it works quite well. Are you implying that MMR doesn't solely care about winrate?
MMR has never cared about "winrate". Plenty of terrible friends of mine have ~52% winrate, and plenty of players very near the top of MM have similar ~52% winrates. To our knowledge, MMR goes up when you win and down when you lose, different amounts based on relative skill levels. However, It sounds like (by anecdotal evidence) other factors in the game may effect how much MMR you lose or gain.
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On December 05 2012 04:38 Sn0_Man wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2012 04:25 itsthewoo wrote:On December 05 2012 03:12 Bommes wrote:On December 04 2012 22:05 Doraemon wrote:On December 04 2012 21:56 Erasme wrote:
winrate doesnt matter. Firebolt is under 50% and queue sometimes into known names i want to know why im queued with <20 gamers or even 10 in this case. As an experiment I made a new account, clicked on Beginner or whatever it is called and wanted to see how fast it adjusts my MMR to where my main account is. About 10 games later I was on page 3 or 4 in a game with rmN- and Tzar. So yeah, the MMR system adjusts you quite radically if it thinks you performed better than your teammates or opponents. I don't know how they do it, but to my knowledge it works quite well. Are you implying that MMR doesn't solely care about winrate? MMR has never cared about "winrate". Plenty of terrible friends of mine have ~52% winrate, and plenty of players very near the top of MM have similar ~52% winrates. To our knowledge, MMR goes up when you win and down when you lose, different amounts based on relative skill levels. However, It sounds like (by anecdotal evidence) other factors in the game may effect how much MMR you lose or gain.
my own guess is mmr is closely tied to winrate, varying depending on: starting mmr(you get to tell dota your experience level when you first make account, presumably affecting starting mmr) and number of games played, meaning a 60% winrate with 100 games played means a much lower mmr than someone with 1000 games and 60% winrate. I'm pretty sure same starting mmr, same winrate and same number of games = very very close mmr.
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To clarify my question, does it actually consider your in-game stats, or does it only count w/l with respect to the relative skill levels?
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Lalalaland34503 Posts
On December 05 2012 04:52 itsthewoo wrote:
To clarify my question, does it actually consider your in-game stats, or does it only count w/l with respect to the relative skill levels?
This has not been 100% confirmed, but I think most people now suspect it's purely due to relative skill level without taking in-game stats into account.
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On December 05 2012 04:53 Firebolt145 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2012 04:52 itsthewoo wrote:
To clarify my question, does it actually consider your in-game stats, or does it only count w/l with respect to the relative skill levels? This has not been 100% confirmed, but I think most people now suspect it's purely due to relative skill level without taking in-game stats into account.
Well, that would make the most sense in terms of difficulty in coding.
I'm curious as to the amount of memory factored into the volatility; i.e. what if I suddenly start improving after 200 games? Will it take me longer than if I had improved after only 50 games?
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On December 05 2012 04:57 itsthewoo wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2012 04:53 Firebolt145 wrote:On December 05 2012 04:52 itsthewoo wrote:
To clarify my question, does it actually consider your in-game stats, or does it only count w/l with respect to the relative skill levels? This has not been 100% confirmed, but I think most people now suspect it's purely due to relative skill level without taking in-game stats into account. Well, that would make the most sense in terms of difficulty in coding. I'm curious as to the amount of memory factored into the volatility; i.e. what if I suddenly start improving after 200 games? Will it take me longer than if I had improved after only 50 games?
Ussually it does work like that, it's easier to go up if you have few games played..
I guess they could also increse your MMR "uncertainty" depending on time without playing or even something like a huge streak that "doesn't make sense" for your theoretical MMR, but I have no idea, that's just what I would consider possible to implement.
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fucking russians again.
i thought like "go cm mode. no russians for sure"
guess who was pick/banning on my side...a fucking russian. he couldnt even speak english so he pick/banned like a random tard.
i just hate russians. like literally hate them. you fucking people just dont want to speak english for some reason. i just hope the worst for you guys out there.
just broke my fucking mouse again after this. its such a joke seriously. why do you people have to be like that...why?
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I don't generally like to QQ, but damn these russians. Was I naive for hoping that queueing for just the western Europe server would mean almost no russians? I seriously believe I meet 50%+ in my games, and they just refuse to coorporate or even communite in English... Sigh
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On December 05 2012 08:56 bailando wrote:
fucking russians again.
i thought like "go cm mode. no russians for sure"
guess who was pick/banning on my side...a fucking russian. he couldnt even speak english so he pick/banned like a random tard.
i just hate russians. like literally hate them. you fucking people just dont want to speak english for some reason. i just hope the worst for you guys out there.
just broke my fucking mouse again after this. its such a joke seriously. why do you people have to be like that...why?
Most epic post of the entire QQ thread right here.
Agreed completely on the russian thing. If they aren't playing with other russians, they literally act like complete fucking social outcasts. Even when they can communicate in english just fine.
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On December 05 2012 09:17 Enzymatic wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2012 08:56 bailando wrote:
fucking russians again.
i thought like "go cm mode. no russians for sure"
guess who was pick/banning on my side...a fucking russian. he couldnt even speak english so he pick/banned like a random tard.
i just hate russians. like literally hate them. you fucking people just dont want to speak english for some reason. i just hope the worst for you guys out there.
just broke my fucking mouse again after this. its such a joke seriously. why do you people have to be like that...why? Most epic post of the entire QQ thread right here. Agreed completely on the russian thing. If they aren't playing with other russians, they literally act like complete fucking social outcasts.
the sad thing is, its been like this forever. Funny thing is, russians actually do have their own server now, but they just dont give a single damn.
And on a sidenote mm feels random like no tomorrow 2 me.
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Why don't you just abandon if you're expecting to qq like that?
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On December 05 2012 03:12 Bommes wrote:Show nested quote +On December 04 2012 22:05 Doraemon wrote:On December 04 2012 21:56 Erasme wrote:
winrate doesnt matter. Firebolt is under 50% and queue sometimes into known names i want to know why im queued with <20 gamers or even 10 in this case. As an experiment I made a new account, clicked on Beginner or whatever it is called and wanted to see how fast it adjusts my MMR to where my main account is. About 10 games later I was on page 3 or 4 in a game with rmN- and Tzar. So yeah, the MMR system adjusts you quite radically if it thinks you performed better than your teammates or opponents. I don't know how they do it, but to my knowledge it works quite well.
well the annoying thing is i won 14 out of 17, against people similar to my MMR...then i get matched with people with <10 games...that's the logic that i don't understand. meh
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On December 05 2012 09:32 Doraemon wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2012 03:12 Bommes wrote:On December 04 2012 22:05 Doraemon wrote:On December 04 2012 21:56 Erasme wrote:
winrate doesnt matter. Firebolt is under 50% and queue sometimes into known names i want to know why im queued with <20 gamers or even 10 in this case. As an experiment I made a new account, clicked on Beginner or whatever it is called and wanted to see how fast it adjusts my MMR to where my main account is. About 10 games later I was on page 3 or 4 in a game with rmN- and Tzar. So yeah, the MMR system adjusts you quite radically if it thinks you performed better than your teammates or opponents. I don't know how they do it, but to my knowledge it works quite well. well the annoying thing is i won 14 out of 17, against people similar to my MMR...then i get matched with people with <10 games...that's the logic that i don't understand. meh
I made an experiment as well and made a new account. Got put in a game with a lol player that got boot first, was killed six times and left saying "this game sucks". In the other team they had a pudge that was obviously smurfing (told me he was in very high and wanted to practice pudge and meepo), and I suspect there were at least 2 other smurf in this game (not including me).
Well anyway, I hope they'll find a way to prevent this because it will make going into the game really horrible for new players (having a good pudge against you when you're a noob can be really frustrating)
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On December 05 2012 03:12 Bommes wrote:Show nested quote +On December 04 2012 22:05 Doraemon wrote:On December 04 2012 21:56 Erasme wrote:
winrate doesnt matter. Firebolt is under 50% and queue sometimes into known names i want to know why im queued with <20 gamers or even 10 in this case. As an experiment I made a new account, clicked on Beginner or whatever it is called and wanted to see how fast it adjusts my MMR to where my main account is. About 10 games later I was on page 3 or 4 in a game with rmN- and Tzar. So yeah, the MMR system adjusts you quite radically if it thinks you performed better than your teammates or opponents. I don't know how they do it, but to my knowledge it works quite well.
Okay, so I have a question... Were you solo queuing or no? You didn't specify. Seems kind of unbelievable and farfetched to be on 3rd page after 10 games of solo queues on a brand new account (regardless of what skill level you clicked). Like.. I'd like to see if even Dendi could pull that off.
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On December 05 2012 10:24 Enzymatic wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2012 03:12 Bommes wrote:On December 04 2012 22:05 Doraemon wrote:On December 04 2012 21:56 Erasme wrote:
winrate doesnt matter. Firebolt is under 50% and queue sometimes into known names i want to know why im queued with <20 gamers or even 10 in this case. As an experiment I made a new account, clicked on Beginner or whatever it is called and wanted to see how fast it adjusts my MMR to where my main account is. About 10 games later I was on page 3 or 4 in a game with rmN- and Tzar. So yeah, the MMR system adjusts you quite radically if it thinks you performed better than your teammates or opponents. I don't know how they do it, but to my knowledge it works quite well. Okay, so I have a question... Were you solo queuing?
Personally I doubt it.. probably carried by his stack's mmr
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On December 05 2012 10:24 Enzymatic wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2012 03:12 Bommes wrote:On December 04 2012 22:05 Doraemon wrote:On December 04 2012 21:56 Erasme wrote:
winrate doesnt matter. Firebolt is under 50% and queue sometimes into known names i want to know why im queued with <20 gamers or even 10 in this case. As an experiment I made a new account, clicked on Beginner or whatever it is called and wanted to see how fast it adjusts my MMR to where my main account is. About 10 games later I was on page 3 or 4 in a game with rmN- and Tzar. So yeah, the MMR system adjusts you quite radically if it thinks you performed better than your teammates or opponents. I don't know how they do it, but to my knowledge it works quite well. Okay, so I have a question... Were you solo queuing or no? You didn't specify. Seems kind of unbelievable and farfetched to be on 3rd page after 10 games of solo queues on a brand new account (regardless of what skill level you clicked). Like.. I'd like to see if even Dendi could pull that off.
It is entirely possible actually, when dendi makes a new account it hits very high in less then 10 games. If you completely outperform your teammates many games in a row it will skyrocket you in mmr until you start losing. My evidence is that on my first smurf account I closely watched the average number of wins of all the people I was matched against, it took me seven games to go from playing with people who had 2-20 wins to people with 300+ like my main.
edit- I played mostly solo queue and maybe 2 or 3 with one friend who was literally brand new to dota.
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EPT
