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Computer Build Resource Thread - Page 1441

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When using this resource, please read FragKrag's opening post. The Tech Support forum regulars have helped create countless of desktop systems without any compensation. The least you can do is provide all of the information required for them to help you properly.
bjyhwang
Profile Joined August 2009
United States5 Posts
April 01 2013 08:54 GMT
#28801
On April 01 2013 15:30 Myrmidon wrote:
A workable build for that kind of money is not really possible without scrounging around used markets and so on (well, not really for closer to $400), so just be warned. Even with an unlimited budget it's not possible with currently-available hardware to get close to 60 fps solid even in 1v1. Turning up graphics-related settings is just going to exacerbate things.

Overheating is pretty much not a concern for any desktop build unless you're packing multiple graphics cards or are really abusing a generic OEM case or equivalent with high-end hardware it was never intended to house, heatsinks are dusty or otherwise falling off or not in working order, and/or you're overclocking significantly.

SC2 is not a demanding game compared to most others on the GPU (even more so if you're talking screen resolutions much lower than 1080p like Belial is), but that's not true for the CPU.

Just as a reference, what were the specs of the laptop?


Thanks for the reply. It was my old HP pavillion dv7 series laptop with Intel Core 2 Duo P8600 / 2.4 GHz and NVIDIA GeForce 9600M GT - 512.0 MB and 6gb RAM. On lowest settings, It would be okay for a while, then after my laptop heated up too much, it would either shut down or lag like crazy. I wasn't able to play more than 5 games in a row cuz of the ovearheating. Pretty much every time a massive zerg army attacked at me, I had the opportunity to micro in slow-mo. I don't know how I got to grand master with this junk. I must've really liked this game.
Cyro
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United Kingdom20285 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-04-01 09:09:11
April 01 2013 09:08 GMT
#28802
Well you can max the game, the question is if you can max it well. I mean, all of the graphics settings dont really affect framerates where they matter once you have an adequate GPU, it's just physics and effects that murder framerates (yes, you can have twice as much fps on low as extreme staring at workers, go re-test it during any time FPS is below 60), so basically if you get a low performing CPU like the Phenom II x4 965 BE and a decent graphics card (and especially running on lower resolutions) then you can switch from low/med to max settings without your FPS being penalized (if we exclude physics, effects), but you still have like half as much minimum and average FPS as an overclocked 3570k system.

A phenom II would not be a massive upgrade from 2.4ghz core 2 duo, but still a noteable one, there's no point upgrading into a dead socket while simultaneously getting a weak-ish GPU, so there's not much that can be done at that kind of price point, not for a big improvement. The real juice comes with ivy bridge/haswell i5, and if you want to max sc2, a mid low tier GPU like the 7770 and you just cant build anything close to that for $400
"oh my god my overclock... I got a single WHEA error on the 23rd hour, 9 minutes" -Belial88
Gumbi
Profile Joined June 2012
Ireland463 Posts
April 01 2013 14:20 GMT
#28803
On April 01 2013 18:08 Cyro wrote:
Well you can max the game, the question is if you can max it well. I mean, all of the graphics settings dont really affect framerates where they matter once you have an adequate GPU, it's just physics and effects that murder framerates (yes, you can have twice as much fps on low as extreme staring at workers, go re-test it during any time FPS is below 60), so basically if you get a low performing CPU like the Phenom II x4 965 BE and a decent graphics card (and especially running on lower resolutions) then you can switch from low/med to max settings without your FPS being penalized (if we exclude physics, effects), but you still have like half as much minimum and average FPS as an overclocked 3570k system.

A phenom II would not be a massive upgrade from 2.4ghz core 2 duo, but still a noteable one, there's no point upgrading into a dead socket while simultaneously getting a weak-ish GPU, so there's not much that can be done at that kind of price point, not for a big improvement. The real juice comes with ivy bridge/haswell i5, and if you want to max sc2, a mid low tier GPU like the 7770 and you just cant build anything close to that for $400

Having said that, something might be possible if one goes "Belial-mode" (:D). Try sourcing a monitor an/or a HDD second hand or free from a friend. Get a second hand 460 768MB (I can attest that this does quite well in SC2, and overclocks well too). Can the poster's case be re-used?
Cyro
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United Kingdom20285 Posts
April 01 2013 14:37 GMT
#28804
Even Belial with his rig says at 1360x768 he's maxing the VRAM on his 768MB 460 and simultaneously maxing his 4gb RAM from just playing Starcraft 2
"oh my god my overclock... I got a single WHEA error on the 23rd hour, 9 minutes" -Belial88
Gumbi
Profile Joined June 2012
Ireland463 Posts
April 01 2013 14:48 GMT
#28805
On April 01 2013 23:37 Cyro wrote:
Even Belial with his rig says at 1360x768 he's maxing the VRAM on his 768MB 460 and simultaneously maxing his 4gb RAM from just playing Starcraft 2

It's easy to be conservative with RAM usage. (No Chrome, minimal background programmes running while gaming). I played SC2 on that card and a Phenom II 925 (2.8ghz, not overclocked), on mid-high settings well enough for 2 years at 1080p, never went above 3.5GB.
MisterFred
Profile Joined October 2010
United States2033 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-04-01 15:22:08
April 01 2013 15:21 GMT
#28806
On April 01 2013 23:37 Cyro wrote:
Even Belial with his rig says at 1360x768 he's maxing the VRAM on his 768MB 460 and simultaneously maxing his 4gb RAM from just playing Starcraft 2


SC2 does not take 4gb of RAM. Before I upgraded it ran just fine on 2gb of RAM.

@Gumbi background programs don't take up much RAM at all.
"The victor? Not the highest scoring, nor the best strategist, nor the best tactitian. The victor was he that was closest to the Tao of FFA." -.Praetor
Gumbi
Profile Joined June 2012
Ireland463 Posts
April 01 2013 15:32 GMT
#28807
On April 02 2013 00:21 MisterFred wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 01 2013 23:37 Cyro wrote:
Even Belial with his rig says at 1360x768 he's maxing the VRAM on his 768MB 460 and simultaneously maxing his 4gb RAM from just playing Starcraft 2


SC2 does not take 4gb of RAM. Before I upgraded it ran just fine on 2gb of RAM.

@Gumbi background programs don't take up much RAM at all.

I know, I'm talking about someone having lotsof unnecessary crap running - Skype, Chrome with 20 tabs, etc etc. We are in agreement anyway on SC2's RAM usage anyways.
MisterFred
Profile Joined October 2010
United States2033 Posts
April 01 2013 15:36 GMT
#28808
@bjyhwang

Radeon 7770 ($120)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814202011

2x4gb G.Skill RAM ($49)
http://us.ncix.com/products/?sku=57950

Bit Fenix Merc Beta ($30) A cheap case that's not horrible. Another good option (mATX only) is the Fractal Design Core 1000
http://us.ncix.com/products/?sku=81659&vpn=BFC-MRC-100-KKX2-U3&manufacture=BitFenix&promoid=1334

Seagate 1tb HDD ($60)
http://us.ncix.com/products/?sku=58746&vpn=ST31000524AS&manufacture=Seagate&promoid=1334

PSU: XFX Core 450w ($53)
http://us.ncix.com/products/?sku=63238&promoid=1257

Samusng DVD-burner ($18)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827151256

Subtotal: $330

Ok that's your base "cheap system" for running SC2 as well as possible w/new parts. You might be able to skimp here and there (drop the dvd-burner altogether, re-use old parts from somewhere, maybe drop video card a tad. But basically, it'll keep the rest of your computer running & max SC2 graphics. Now the question is CPU, which is the main thing that determines your minimum FPS when actually playing SC2. This is a problem. You can either overclock an i5-3570k, because overclocking adds useful performance, or go cheap and get a simple locked dual-core. This depends on whether your want something that simply works for as little $ as possible, or if you want the best possible performance.

As little as possible:

Pentium g2120 ($80)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116777

MSI H61 mobo ($47)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130659

Dual-core system total: $457

But like everyone's been saying. So while late game 2v2 will be quite playable with the above setup & you'll even rarely see any problem slowdowns in big 3v3s, it's still not as good as you can do. Particularly if FPS below 30 bugs you.

Overclockable system: $652

i5-3570k + low-end Gigabyte z77-HD3 mobo ($302)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.1236295

Xigmatek Gaia ($20)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835233082

Overclockable system totla:
"The victor? Not the highest scoring, nor the best strategist, nor the best tactitian. The victor was he that was closest to the Tao of FFA." -.Praetor
MisterFred
Profile Joined October 2010
United States2033 Posts
April 01 2013 15:38 GMT
#28809
On April 02 2013 00:32 Gumbi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 02 2013 00:21 MisterFred wrote:
On April 01 2013 23:37 Cyro wrote:
Even Belial with his rig says at 1360x768 he's maxing the VRAM on his 768MB 460 and simultaneously maxing his 4gb RAM from just playing Starcraft 2


SC2 does not take 4gb of RAM. Before I upgraded it ran just fine on 2gb of RAM.

@Gumbi background programs don't take up much RAM at all.

I know, I'm talking about someone having lotsof unnecessary crap running - Skype, Chrome with 20 tabs, etc etc. We are in agreement anyway on SC2's RAM usage anyways.


Is Sticky Notes, Calculator, Gomplayer running Hayden, Opera with 15 tabs & Firefox w/5 lots of unnecessary crap? . These are the programs I basically never close.
"The victor? Not the highest scoring, nor the best strategist, nor the best tactitian. The victor was he that was closest to the Tao of FFA." -.Praetor
bjyhwang
Profile Joined August 2009
United States5 Posts
April 01 2013 16:07 GMT
#28810
On April 02 2013 00:36 MisterFred wrote:
@bjyhwang

Radeon 7770 ($120)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814202011

2x4gb G.Skill RAM ($49)
http://us.ncix.com/products/?sku=57950

Bit Fenix Merc Beta ($30) A cheap case that's not horrible. Another good option (mATX only) is the Fractal Design Core 1000
http://us.ncix.com/products/?sku=81659&vpn=BFC-MRC-100-KKX2-U3&manufacture=BitFenix&promoid=1334

Seagate 1tb HDD ($60)
http://us.ncix.com/products/?sku=58746&vpn=ST31000524AS&manufacture=Seagate&promoid=1334

PSU: XFX Core 450w ($53)
http://us.ncix.com/products/?sku=63238&promoid=1257

Samusng DVD-burner ($18)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827151256

Subtotal: $330

Ok that's your base "cheap system" for running SC2 as well as possible w/new parts. You might be able to skimp here and there (drop the dvd-burner altogether, re-use old parts from somewhere, maybe drop video card a tad. But basically, it'll keep the rest of your computer running & max SC2 graphics. Now the question is CPU, which is the main thing that determines your minimum FPS when actually playing SC2. This is a problem. You can either overclock an i5-3570k, because overclocking adds useful performance, or go cheap and get a simple locked dual-core. This depends on whether your want something that simply works for as little $ as possible, or if you want the best possible performance.

As little as possible:

Pentium g2120 ($80)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116777

MSI H61 mobo ($47)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130659

Dual-core system total: $457

But like everyone's been saying. So while late game 2v2 will be quite playable with the above setup & you'll even rarely see any problem slowdowns in big 3v3s, it's still not as good as you can do. Particularly if FPS below 30 bugs you.

Overclockable system: $652

i5-3570k + low-end Gigabyte z77-HD3 mobo ($302)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.1236295

Xigmatek Gaia ($20)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835233082

Overclockable system totla:



This is actually amazing. I think I'd be able to afford this if I drop the optical drive and go with the cheapest build you've suggested. I only play 1v1 ladder games so as long as I don't have any problems with that, I'd be more than happy. Thank you so much!!
Cyro
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United Kingdom20285 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-04-01 16:58:22
April 01 2013 16:57 GMT
#28811
3570k with decent overclock could be like 50-75% better than pentium in terms of framerates, it's hard to say though. 40% better, no problem, 50%, probably, 75%, maybe. Depends how much you gain from having >2 cores, there's very little testing recently i think, it's an amazing CPU but just too expensive to fit into such a low budget. If you could get a second hard card like the gtx260, maybe 460 then i would not hesitate to go for it (3570k and overclock) for an sc2 monster PC but that's a more difficult option

Oops wasted 5k post :/
"oh my god my overclock... I got a single WHEA error on the 23rd hour, 9 minutes" -Belial88
Myrmidon
Profile Blog Joined December 2004
United States9452 Posts
April 01 2013 19:55 GMT
#28812
btw there's an inefficiency with some prebuilt systems because you're paying for an OS you don't need, but in this price range that can be a better option, especially if you don't insist on turning graphics settings all the way up (which makes almost no difference to image quality other than adding sparkles and effects that obscure the actual action).

e.g. manufacturer refurb Lenovo IdeaCentre for $300 shipped is:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Lenovo-IdeaCentre-H430-Desktop-i3-2120-3-3GHz-4GB-Memory-1TB-Windows-7-2558XF4-/111044214237?pt=Desktop_PCs&hash=item19dac03ddd

Core i3-2120 (a little better than the G2120)
4GB DDR3
1TB 7200rpm
optical drive
motherboard
case
power supply (going to be much better than the cheapest stuff you can find but of course worse than what was linked above at over $50)

Throw in say an HD 6570 for ~$50 and you can cover medium shaders at least.
skyR
Profile Joined July 2009
Canada13817 Posts
April 01 2013 21:13 GMT
#28813
He mentioned he's from Canada just so you all know >.>
feanor1
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States1899 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-04-01 21:42:16
April 01 2013 21:36 GMT
#28814
Alright if someone could give this a look over

LITE-ON Black 18X DVD 48x Cd $20

Cheap ass logitech wired Keyboard $16

CORSAIR Builder Series CX500 500W ATX12V v2.3 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Active PFC Power Supply $49 after promo code and $29 after $20 rebate

Kingston HyperX XMP Blu Red Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 Desktop Memory Model KHX16C9B1RK2/8X $63 (Kingston supports ESPORTS and all of these ram stacks are priced identically anyways)

XIGMATEK Gaia SD1283 120mm Long Life Bearing CPU Cooler $20

Intel Core i5-3570K Ivy Bridge 3.4GHz Combo with GIGABYTE GA-Z77-HD3 LGA 1155 Intel Z77 HDMI SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard with UEFI BIOS $302 after combo discounts

Bitfenix Merc Beta Steel Black ATX Mid Tower Case Best case for around $30 that anyone has mentioned

Seagate Barracuda 7200.12 1TB SATA 32MB Cache 3.5in Internal Hard Drive OEM $60

Then I am trying to decide on the best GFX card to go with between $150-$200

EVGA SuperClocked 02G-P4-2662-KR GeForce GTX 660 2GB 192-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 3.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Support Video Card $200 for a superclocked GTX 660

Total = about $760
skyR
Profile Joined July 2009
Canada13817 Posts
April 01 2013 21:45 GMT
#28815
There's DVD burners available for less.

Corsair and G.Skill support esports as well (probably more so than Kingston lol) but if you want to buy Kingston for whatever reason, get 1.5v kits for less: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820104333

The rest looks fine.
feanor1
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States1899 Posts
April 01 2013 21:49 GMT
#28816
On April 02 2013 06:45 skyR wrote:
There's DVD burners available for less.

Corsair and G.Skill support esports as well (probably more so than Kingston lol) but if you want to buy Kingston for whatever reason, get 1.5v kits for less: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820104333

The rest looks fine.


What would you go with GTX 660 2gb or 7850 2gb? Both are the same price and the 7850 2gb comes with Bioshock & Tomb raider
zoLo
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
United States5896 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-04-01 21:54:32
April 01 2013 21:54 GMT
#28817
What is the difference(s) between the 2?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231314

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231428
skyR
Profile Joined July 2009
Canada13817 Posts
April 01 2013 21:56 GMT
#28818
On April 02 2013 06:49 feanor1 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 02 2013 06:45 skyR wrote:
There's DVD burners available for less.

Corsair and G.Skill support esports as well (probably more so than Kingston lol) but if you want to buy Kingston for whatever reason, get 1.5v kits for less: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820104333

The rest looks fine.


What would you go with GTX 660 2gb or 7850 2gb? Both are the same price and the 7850 2gb comes with Bioshock & Tomb raider


I'd get this combo: http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.1247439

On April 02 2013 06:54 zoLo wrote:
What is the difference(s) between the 2?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231314

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231428


Just the style of the heatspreaders and maybe different ICs (not relevant if you aren't doing hardcore RAM overclocking).
feanor1
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States1899 Posts
April 01 2013 21:58 GMT
#28819
On April 02 2013 06:56 skyR wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 02 2013 06:49 feanor1 wrote:
On April 02 2013 06:45 skyR wrote:
There's DVD burners available for less.

Corsair and G.Skill support esports as well (probably more so than Kingston lol) but if you want to buy Kingston for whatever reason, get 1.5v kits for less: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820104333

The rest looks fine.


What would you go with GTX 660 2gb or 7850 2gb? Both are the same price and the 7850 2gb comes with Bioshock & Tomb raider


I'd get this combo: http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.1247439

Show nested quote +
On April 02 2013 06:54 zoLo wrote:
What is the difference(s) between the 2?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231314

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231428


Just the style of the heatspreaders and maybe different ICs (not relevant if you aren't doing hardcore RAM overclocking).

You da man, thanks for the help
Bentus
Profile Joined May 2012
Germany86 Posts
April 01 2013 22:03 GMT
#28820
Hey guys,

saved up a total of 1,1k Euro and I want to reward myself for my A-levels in 2weeks so after them I want to buy a new gaming PC.

!!I need a monitor aswell therefore it should be included in your calculations and I am open for recommandations.!!

What are you using it for?
So, I will use it mostly for gaming, streaming and little stuff like PPPT-s and Word... Skype, Browser etc.
Only standard stuff....


When do you plan on building it?

As I said before, I want to buy the pieces in 2weeks from today.

Do you plan on overclocking?
Not at all, i ve read what the OP wrote about it but I dont think I will use it.

Do you need an Operating System?
Yes, but I like Windows 7(have it on my laptop)

Do you plan to add a second GPU for SLI or Crossfire?
Do i need this for Starcraft and streaming?

Where are you buying your parts from?
I currently live in Germany, so I can only buy what I get from here.

In conclusion, I would like to build myself a new gaming pc which will be sufficient to stream and play Starcraft and from time to time some shooters with friends at Lan´s.
Greets

I am open for any adivce!

Thanks in advance.

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