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Frost Giant dev Q&A w/ Artosis & Pylon supporters

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
CobraVe7nom7
Profile Joined December 2015
36 Posts
Last Edited: 2020-10-22 13:11:29
October 22 2020 12:53 GMT
#1
The Frost Giant Devs answered a TON of questions and asked for feedback/ideas about their new AAA RTS that's in the works on Ep.#109 of ThePylonShow

We deep dived into topics such as how much will the investors influence the company, the making of an RTS with a low skill floor, but also a high skill ceiling and how many races might be included.


★ Timestamps ★
00. 00:00:00 Intro Video
01. 00:01:42 Welcome back / Show road map / Guest introductions
02. 00:09:32 What does Riot Games have to do with Frost Giant?
03. 00:11:54 Why are RTS games hard to make?
04. 00:17:44 Details of our business model / Building a solid game first
05. 00:23:18 Building a game for longevity that stands the test of time
06. 00:28:53 Making an RTS game that's easier to get into / Game that scales correctly
07. 00:37:55 Can we design an RTS that helps players with good habits?
08. 00:41:12 RTS with a low skill floor, but also a high skill ceiling
09. 00:44:35 What is the focus of game design right now? / Creating content and content tools
10. 00:52:16 How many races will we have? / Loot Boxes? Skin and fun content?
11. 01:00:56 Heroes VS Armies? / Resources and economy models
12. 01:08:00 Unique world design and game depth / The social chat system inside the game
13. 01:15:55 Esports!!!
14. 01:20:10 Patreon Q&A
15. 01:20:38 Dear FGG what should SC2/BW communities do in the meantime?
16. 01:33:56 What could you do differently in a nextgen RTS?
17. 01:38:36 How do you balance an RTS with 3 races?
18. 01:44:46 How can the community support your new studio?
19. 01:47:10 Fantasy or SiFi?
20. 01:48:51 What can be improved from the making SC?
21. 01:53:37 Do we know what the pace of the game will be? / A spiritual successor to WC3?
22. 01:58:56 How important is the solo experience to Frost Giant?
23. 02:01:30 What's it take to make a great campaign?
24. 02:03:52 What's the process in creating factions?
25. 02:09:42 How much will the investors influence the company?
26. 02:11:04 Would you sell merch before release?
27. 02:13:02 Thoughts on a sticky mechanic?
28. 02:14:50 How do you design a salty race?
29. 02:15:58 Obligatory sentient hotdog question
30. 02:16:13 Will AlphaStar appear in a Frost Giant game?
31. 02:19:40 Will you use a preexisting engine?
32. 02:24:44 What is your mission statement? / What areas is the team focusing on?
33. 02:27:25 How are you processing the input from the RTS community?
34. 02:31:56 How was SC2 so successful?
35. 02:35:27 What do you think about addressing some of the common things from SC2?
36. 02:37:55 What would you do if Frost Giant got the rights to SC3?
37. 02:39:47 What are the challenges you'll face as a smaller team?
38. 02:42:14 Thoughts on early access?
39. 02:43:49 What should TPS change its name to when the new RTS takes over Esports?
40. 02:44:37 When will hiring ramp up?
41. 02:45:50 How do you feel about building your own engine?
42. 02:47:23 Are there any plans to develop community tools?
43. 02:48:32 Does military theory from IRL play a role when designing an RTS?
44. 02:51:56 What are your plans to introduce an Alpha?
45. 02:52:48 Is there a target engine/language you guys are looking to build the game with?
46. 02:53:44 Final thoughts / Wrap up / Thanks for watching
47. 02:57:19 Day[9] - THAT'S MY MOM! (Clip used with permission)
TelecoM
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States10668 Posts
October 27 2020 21:51 GMT
#2
Amazing, I cannot wait to see the first concepts of this game! This is like team pure passion, I'm sure they will do a lot better for the community than Activision Blizzard has done.
AKA: TelecoM[WHITE] Protoss fighting
AirbladeOrange
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States2573 Posts
October 28 2020 01:45 GMT
#3
I'm excited but we are so far away from the release of their game. The hype is real but will be short-lived until we have something more tangible.
Monochromatic
Profile Blog Joined March 2012
United States997 Posts
Last Edited: 2020-10-28 02:28:49
October 28 2020 02:27 GMT
#4
The biggest question I have is what will you do to set your game apart from the competition and put it in a place to succeed? SC2 had absolutely everything going for it: a thriving, pre-existing esports scene, a marketing budget larger than Frost Giant's enterprise value, tons of hype and passion leading to many independent tournament leagues (NASL, IPL, TSL), and over a year of being the undisputed #1 game on twitch - and despite all of this SC2 has been a failure in terms of an esport, compared to both Brood War (which is still going strong) and League. More people play the co-op mode than the RTS!

How is this studio going to make a modern, competitive RTS and expect to succeed when everything else in the genre has failed? What secret ingredient will Frost Giant use to make their game stand out? If they have an answer to that, I'll be looking forward to their product - if they don't then I'm left to believe this whole venture is a waste of time a la Iron Harvest, Grey Goo, or Dawn of War 3, to name a few.
MC: "Guys I need your support! iam poor make me nerd baller" __________________________________________RIP Violet
Heroprime2
Profile Joined October 2020
1 Post
October 28 2020 08:37 GMT
#5
On October 28 2020 11:27 Monochromatic wrote:
SC2 had absolutely everything going for it: a thriving, pre-existing esports scene, a marketing budget larger than Frost Giant's enterprise value, tons of hype and passion leading to many independent tournament leagues (NASL, IPL, TSL), and over a year of being the undisputed #1 game on twitch - and despite all of this SC2 has been a failure in terms of an esport, compared to both Brood War (which is still going strong) and League. More people play the co-op mode than the RTS!


Imagine actually thinking this. Unbelievable.
Turbovolver
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Australia2393 Posts
October 28 2020 09:00 GMT
#6
What's incorrect about that statement? It's subjective what counts as "a failure of an esport" I guess but the underlying point in that post seems sound to me.
The original Bogus fan.
True_Spike
Profile Joined July 2004
Poland3418 Posts
October 28 2020 13:27 GMT
#7
In terms of monetary value, SC2 esport surpassed BW a long time ago. In terms of an active player base it's orders of magnitude better. in terms of number of tournaments and their relative size it's the same.

I love BW to bits, but don't let that cloud your judgement.
Monochromatic
Profile Blog Joined March 2012
United States997 Posts
October 28 2020 16:24 GMT
#8
On October 28 2020 22:27 True_Spike wrote:
In terms of monetary value, SC2 esport surpassed BW a long time ago. In terms of an active player base it's orders of magnitude better. in terms of number of tournaments and their relative size it's the same.

I love BW to bits, but don't let that cloud your judgement.


Here's the thing: I can go to the store right now and buy a box of cheezits with an Overwatch character on the front telling me to watch OWL. A major US fast food chain (buffalo wild wings) is an official sponsor of LCS. These are mainstream brands and these esports have mainstream recognition. Brood War had an even higher level of mainstream recognition in Korea prior to Starcraft 2.

Now, read this article about investing in Esports. Activision Blizzard is the first name listed, for Overwatch and Call of Duty. Starcraft is not mentioned. The fact is that over the past decade Starcraft has lost it's brand value as an esport. No one cares anymore.

Don't get me wrong, I love starcraft. But when you look at the growth of other esports this past decade and then take a look at starcraft, well, I don't see how you can call it anything but a failure.
MC: "Guys I need your support! iam poor make me nerd baller" __________________________________________RIP Violet
AirbladeOrange
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States2573 Posts
October 28 2020 23:27 GMT
#9
On October 29 2020 01:24 Monochromatic wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 28 2020 22:27 True_Spike wrote:
In terms of monetary value, SC2 esport surpassed BW a long time ago. In terms of an active player base it's orders of magnitude better. in terms of number of tournaments and their relative size it's the same.

I love BW to bits, but don't let that cloud your judgement.


Here's the thing: I can go to the store right now and buy a box of cheezits with an Overwatch character on the front telling me to watch OWL. A major US fast food chain (buffalo wild wings) is an official sponsor of LCS. These are mainstream brands and these esports have mainstream recognition. Brood War had an even higher level of mainstream recognition in Korea prior to Starcraft 2.

Now, read this article about investing in Esports. Activision Blizzard is the first name listed, for Overwatch and Call of Duty. Starcraft is not mentioned. The fact is that over the past decade Starcraft has lost it's brand value as an esport. No one cares anymore.

Don't get me wrong, I love starcraft. But when you look at the growth of other esports this past decade and then take a look at starcraft, well, I don't see how you can call it anything but a failure.

These are good points but I really think there is a limitation for RTS games as major esports competing with other genres. I would love for Frost Giant to prove this trend wrong.
therealtucker
Profile Joined October 2020
United States1 Post
October 30 2020 18:21 GMT
#10
Now, read this article about investing in Esports. Activision Blizzard is the first name listed, for Overwatch and Call of Duty. Starcraft is not mentioned. The fact is that over the past decade Starcraft has lost it's brand value as an esport. No one cares anymore
.

I don't know if starcraft being smaller than OW and CoD means that 'no one cares' or that it's a failure of an esport. Is rugby a failure of a sport because soccer, football, and tons of other sports are more popular? Is it a failure because there are certain sponsors that would for sure put their money towards the NBA or NFL first? I'm not saying that things couldn't be better, but to argue that SC2 is a failure doesn't seem correct.
ilax30
Profile Joined November 2019
720 Posts
Last Edited: 2020-10-30 19:18:06
October 30 2020 19:17 GMT
#11
On October 29 2020 01:24 Monochromatic wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 28 2020 22:27 True_Spike wrote:
In terms of monetary value, SC2 esport surpassed BW a long time ago. In terms of an active player base it's orders of magnitude better. in terms of number of tournaments and their relative size it's the same.

I love BW to bits, but don't let that cloud your judgement.


Here's the thing: I can go to the store right now and buy a box of cheezits with an Overwatch character on the front telling me to watch OWL. A major US fast food chain (buffalo wild wings) is an official sponsor of LCS. These are mainstream brands and these esports have mainstream recognition. Brood War had an even higher level of mainstream recognition in Korea prior to Starcraft 2.

Now, read this article about investing in Esports. Activision Blizzard is the first name listed, for Overwatch and Call of Duty. Starcraft is not mentioned. The fact is that over the past decade Starcraft has lost it's brand value as an esport. No one cares anymore.

Don't get me wrong, I love starcraft. But when you look at the growth of other esports this past decade and then take a look at starcraft, well, I don't see how you can call it anything but a failure.


Judging by your anecdote it looks like you think OW succeeded with their esport scene? If anything OWL has taught has how NOT to get your game e-sports ready, what a disaster that is
AdrianHealeyy
Profile Joined June 2015
114 Posts
October 31 2020 22:53 GMT
#12
I mean, more and more research shows that the majority of gamers - a recent survey in Belgium among youngsters for example - that only about 13% prefer single player and the vast majority (over 60%) want to game 'together with friends'.

Single player RTS just has a player potential of 1/5th of coop stuff like fortnite, LoL and Overwatch.
Odoakar
Profile Joined May 2010
Croatia1835 Posts
November 01 2020 17:05 GMT
#13
Unfortunately, the good old RTS games are dead. Players nowadays find them too hard and too anxiety inducing to play solo. it' much easier to play with 4 other guys where the weight of losing and winning is not squarely on yourself.

BW will be the last RTS game with a decent pro scene. I expect SC2 scene to die off in a year or two. BW will probably continue as long as Kespa wants it.
WombaT
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Northern Ireland25036 Posts
November 02 2020 02:38 GMT
#14
On November 02 2020 02:05 Odoakar wrote:
Unfortunately, the good old RTS games are dead. Players nowadays find them too hard and too anxiety inducing to play solo. it' much easier to play with 4 other guys where the weight of losing and winning is not squarely on yourself.

BW will be the last RTS game with a decent pro scene. I expect SC2 scene to die off in a year or two. BW will probably continue as long as Kespa wants it.

Why are they dead?

The Soulslike genre is basically predicted on hard games from people who want a challenge and became rather large.

Just takes one good game to capture a pretty sizeable niche market really.

'You'll always be the cuddly marsupial of my heart, despite the inherent flaws of your ancestry' - Squat
chuDr3t4
Profile Joined April 2010
Russian Federation484 Posts
November 02 2020 06:39 GMT
#15
On November 02 2020 02:05 Odoakar wrote:
Unfortunately, the good old RTS games are dead. Players nowadays find them too hard and too anxiety inducing to play solo. it' much easier to play with 4 other guys where the weight of losing and winning is not squarely on yourself.

BW will be the last RTS game with a decent pro scene. I expect SC2 scene to die off in a year or two. BW will probably continue as long as Kespa wants it.

Are you aware that Kespa is long dead?
I live in Russia. I wear the fufaika, valenoks and the shapka-ushanka with the red star. I drink vodka straight from the samovar, and my riding bear plays on the balalaika.
BLinD-RawR
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
ALLEYCAT BLUES50114 Posts
November 02 2020 09:53 GMT
#16
On November 02 2020 02:05 Odoakar wrote:
Unfortunately, the good old RTS games are dead. Players nowadays find them too hard and too anxiety inducing to play solo. it' much easier to play with 4 other guys where the weight of losing and winning is not squarely on yourself.

BW will be the last RTS game with a decent pro scene. I expect SC2 scene to die off in a year or two. BW will probably continue as long as Kespa wants it.


Kespa, in my BW?

shieeeeet we haven't had that in ages.
Brood War EICWoo Jung Ho, never forget.| Twitter: @BLinDRawR
TL+ Member
Ziggy
Profile Blog Joined June 2013
South Korea2105 Posts
November 02 2020 09:54 GMT
#17
damn this is good i cant tell if hes baiting or not
WriterDefeating a sandwich only makes it tastier. @imjustziggy
CadenZie
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Korea (South)545 Posts
November 02 2020 11:31 GMT
#18
long live kespa
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