EPTMaru out, Patience & INnoVation advance in Code S - Page 2
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dysenterymd
1250 Posts
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Miralem Ibrahim
40 Posts
 not again please | ||
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Xain0n
Italy3963 Posts
Moreover, the Protoss menace that seems to be so real in your minds has produced only Super Tournament victories in 2018-2019. PvT, as well, is a less onesided matchup than you think and Zerg cannot choke forever in Korea, it's not like a Protoss victory is certain; in any of case, why would it be a disaster like your words would suggest? | ||
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yht9657
1810 Posts
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Athenau
571 Posts
On April 30 2019 08:19 Xain0n wrote: Hm guys, I would just like to point out Terran won seven Code S in LoTV, six consecutively; Protoss won it twice, the last of which well over two years ago. Moreover, the Protoss menace that seems to be so real in your minds has produced only Super Tournament victories in 2018-2019. PvT, as well, is a less onesided matchup than you think and Zerg cannot choke forever in Korea, it's not like a Protoss victory is certain; in any of case, why would it be a disaster like your words would suggest? I can't speak for anyone else, but I don't care whether a protoss takes it or not. I do care if we have another terrible Ro8 like the super tournament with nothing but PvP's. | ||
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Miralem Ibrahim
40 Posts
Hm guys, I would just like to point out Terran won seven Code S in LoTV, six consecutively; Protoss won twice, the last of which well over two years ago. I can give some explanation This 7 Code S are 4 for Maru. 1 For Byun in 2016 a lot of patch were made since that period that was quite an other version of the game same for Innovation in 2017. We are today in 2019. And Gumiho won against soO and every one can win against soO in the final except the other kong. With the politic of blizzard today all the consideration about balance must be reviewed because they make a patch at least every year We are talking about the state of the game currently in 2019. (And in my opinion TvP is realy hard since 2018 Maru won a lot of TvP just with cheeses proxy plays or two base timing attack but in pure macrogame he didn't beat to much good protoss player no? I m not sure) But in Korea Maru was just to strong in preparation format but in super tournament protosses won those both edition. Same for this year. This 2018 for me TvP looks like pretty hard for terran at every level and this year it's even worth and blizzard didn't change many thinks for that. | ||
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deacon.frost
Czech Republic12129 Posts
On April 30 2019 08:35 Athenau wrote: I can't speak for anyone else, but I don't care whether a protoss takes it or not. I do care if we have another terrible Ro8 like the super tournament with nothing but PvP's. That's what certain people don't understand, it's not about who won, but how the RO8 looks(or RO16). If Terran wins but it's a single Terran, a Zerg and 6 Protoss players(e.g.), then it's not an OK state(while being this Code S we need to how this happened as the group selection can shift it at some moments). | ||
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Incognoto
France10239 Posts
 I am so sorry | ||
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Xain0n
Italy3963 Posts
On April 30 2019 09:45 deacon.frost wrote: That's what certain people don't understand, it's not about who won, but how the RO8 looks(or RO16). If Terran wins but it's a single Terran, a Zerg and 6 Protoss players(e.g.), then it's not an OK state(while being this Code S we need to how this happened as the group selection can shift it at some moments). Asking for one even ro8 composition is legit but premature; in that worst case scenario you described, swapping Maru with Patience would only make 5P 2T 1Z so if that was the only thing you are worried of, Maru dropping out would be almost irrelevant. | ||
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pvsnp
7676 Posts
On April 30 2019 09:45 deacon.frost wrote: That's what certain people don't understand, it's not about who won, but how the RO8 looks(or RO16). If Terran wins but it's a single Terran, a Zerg and 6 Protoss players(e.g.), then it's not an OK state(while being this Code S we need to how this happened as the group selection can shift it at some moments). It is very difficult to get a man to understand something when his winrates depend on him not understanding it. | ||
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batatm
Israel116 Posts
i actually skipped about half of the games in the super tournament because i was fed up with the match up. as a retired (random) player who only watch i don't care too much for balance, but i will pass on games in the gsl as well if it will be a similar situation. | ||
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pdd
Australia9933 Posts
He expanded behind it and it just looked like no matter what he would do significant economic damage. (Maybe Maru played it wrong). Sure he may be behind in tech and army if it fails, but the economic damage would have kept him safe enough to rebuild an army no? | ||
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Carminedust
487 Posts
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DomeGetta
480 Posts
On April 30 2019 08:19 Xain0n wrote: Hm guys, I would just like to point out Terran won seven Code S in LoTV, six consecutively; Protoss won it twice, the last of which well over two years ago. Moreover, the Protoss menace that seems to be so real in your minds has produced only Super Tournament victories in 2018-2019. PvT, as well, is a less onesided matchup than you think and Zerg cannot choke forever in Korea, it's not like a Protoss victory is certain; in any of case, why would it be a disaster like your words would suggest? Yeah if at any time Terran was taking an overwhelming number of the ro32/ro16/ro8 we would have been hearing about it. Maru has won every code S since the msc patch but the field of nearly every code S / ST / IEM has been skewed toward toss. Not as overwhelmingly as we see now but this is a normal thing to have happen when the game is not in a balanced state. Outliers can muddy the water for a time but eventually it will be exploited. The guy who literally everyone wants in their ro16 group stomped current best player in the world and inno who is clearly in good form as of late. Matchup needs review and big changes..not simple compartmentized buffs or nerfs. Im good with waiting for it to become more apparent even if that means end of s2 gsl. | ||
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Solar424
United States4001 Posts
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pvsnp
7676 Posts
On April 30 2019 11:28 Carminedust wrote: well then looks like the magic number of consecutive gsl finals is 4 before the starcraft gods get tired of you and smite you in the round of 32 4 is death, don't you know? | ||
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Anc13nt
1557 Posts
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xelnaga_empire
627 Posts
On April 30 2019 06:11 pvsnp wrote: Also calling a Protoss nerf before the Ro16. It's pretty clear that the upgrade nerf had little to no effect. Who would've thought? As long as Maru is winning the balance team seems reluctant to step in, but they did take a hand the last time he bombed out early (IEM). Especially now with this coming after the Super Tournament making history, and not in a good way. Also they've been silent for well over a month, so I'd expect another community update regardless. Yup, I agree. | ||
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xelnaga_empire
627 Posts
On April 30 2019 11:29 DomeGetta wrote: Yeah if at any time Terran was taking an overwhelming number of the ro32/ro16/ro8 we would have been hearing about it. Maru has won every code S since the msc patch but the field of nearly every code S / ST / IEM has been skewed toward toss. Not as overwhelmingly as we see now but this is a normal thing to have happen when the game is not in a balanced state. Outliers can muddy the water for a time but eventually it will be exploited. The guy who literally everyone wants in their ro16 group stomped current best player in the world and inno who is clearly in good form as of late. Matchup needs review and big changes..not simple compartmentized buffs or nerfs. Im good with waiting for it to become more apparent even if that means end of s2 gsl. Terran struggled against Protoss in the qualifiers for this GSL. Protoss had a 79.5% win rate against Terran in the qualifiers for this GSL. | ||
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skdsk
138 Posts
Also i would like to point out its definetally holdable strategy, but you need a dedicated wall of engbay + depots and 1/2bunkers + siege tanks and maybe fast banshee or lib, neither maru or inno seems to practiced against this type of cheeze much and whos to blame them? toss can do 15 different 2 base cheezes. Its no wonder both maru and inno was laughing in there games vs patience. | ||
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