EPT
On the other hand they will probably nerf the raven fast enough since the only ZvT won will be those of Dark and Solar in Ro32.
Community Update - April 19 - Page 4
| Forum Index > SC2 General |
|
DieuCure
France3713 Posts
On the other hand they will probably nerf the raven fast enough since the only ZvT won will be those of Dark and Solar in Ro32. | ||
|
Boggyb
2855 Posts
On April 20 2018 07:58 DieuCure wrote: It's good that they admit that the TV is in a horrible posture. And that they took into account the "just play like Maru" meme. On the other hand they will probably nerf the raven fast enough since the only ZvT won will be those of Dark and Solar in Ro32. If PatchZerglett loses to the GumiGod and fails to get out of the group, they'll probably delete ghosts and ravens then force Afreeka to replay the group. | ||
|
pvsnp
7676 Posts
On April 20 2018 06:57 Tyrhanius wrote: Best quality you can find is stats from tournaments, there are no secret stats or things blizzard knows better than players, else they would have skipped the broodlords infestors area, mass SH, mass reapers, mass blink, and now mass raven, but no it takes age before they finally realize it should be fixed. You need to actually read the stats from tournaments and realize that TvZ is slightly Zerg favored–exactly like Blizzard said: On April 20 2018 07:15 Athenau wrote: Here are the TvZ winrates you conveniently omitted: Aligulac for the last two complete periods: http://aligulac.com/periods/211/?sort=&race=ptzrs&nats=all 46.29% http://aligulac.com/periods/212/?sort=&race=ptzrs&nats=all 46.78% Last GSL including qualifiers: http://aligulac.com/results/events/77372-GSL-2018/ 47.39% This GSL including qualifiers: http://aligulac.com/results/events/80696-GSL-2018-Season-2/ 47.52% GSL Super Tournament: http://aligulac.com/results/events/80577-GSL-2018-Super-Tournament-/#1/ 48.68% Also, LOL at 80% for "this code S". Yeah, those 5 games are super representative. What's next, claiming Terran has a 100% winrate when they win the first game of a set? | ||
|
Solar424
United States4001 Posts
On April 20 2018 08:05 Boggyb wrote: If PatchZerglett loses to the GumiGod and fails to get out of the group, they'll probably delete ghosts and ravens then force Afreeka to replay the group. Off topic, but would it physically pain you to say anything positive about a non-Korean player? It feels like 95% of your posts on here are just shitting on foreigners, saying their accomplishments don't count and that only Koreans should be allowed to play SC2. | ||
|
Lexender
Mexico2657 Posts
On April 20 2018 05:54 MrWayne wrote: Thank you, I didn't know that HotS Marauders get +2 from every attack upgrade, that obviously makes them way better than the LotV ones. Btw this guy on reddit is either outdated or just wrong in regardes of attack upgrades for LotV Marauders, they only get 2x +1 , so they as good vs buildings as the old Marauder. Don't forget guardian shield, since it counts for every attack it makes the marauder attack have -4 instead of -2. | ||
Orlok
Korea (South)227 Posts
I just don't like playing against Protoss, because it does feel rather hopeless unless Im just straight up better than the opponent. Nothing I do can cripple the protoss fast enough or effectively enough to let me transition to a stronger mid-late game, and because of it it just feels that the Protoss has to make a mistake for me to win. I'd love it if there was something in the Terran build to force the Protoss to be a little less confident. Something that will make the Protoss think twice about building oracles to harass whilst taking a third base, something that is a viable counter towards them so its not just a question of Ok, I'll harass and never let the Terran take a 3rd or move out while I get a totally free third base that only dies if the Terran suicides the army on it! | ||
|
Charoisaur
Germany16074 Posts
 Nerf Raven to the ground -> + 15 viking HP -> perfect balance it's that easy! | ||
|
DubiousC2
129 Posts
I wonder why they took more than a month to post a community update that, while very detailed, has no actual gameplay application. It lacks any real suggestion as to what needs to be done, and they haven't even insinuated when they plan on dealing with the problems they stated. | ||
|
Obamarauder
697 Posts
On April 20 2018 08:50 Lexender wrote: Don't forget guardian shield, since it counts for every attack it makes the marauder attack have -4 instead of -2. If you consider that protoss is almost always +1 upgrade ahead, its actually -6 compared to Hots marauder. Let that sink in, 6 damage difference PER marauader PER shot. The problem is further amplified by the fact that chargelots are more effective which makes colossus sniping much harder. | ||
|
xTJx
Brazil419 Posts
| ||
|
Charoisaur
Germany16074 Posts
On April 20 2018 11:00 xTJx wrote: Nothing about the cannon shield battery immortal, guess it will be adressed once a zerg loses another GSL finals to cheese. I have no idea what "Cannon shield battery immortal" (lol) is but it's certainly not a thing at pro level | ||
|
pvsnp
7676 Posts
On April 20 2018 11:03 Charoisaur wrote: I have no idea what "Cannon shield battery immortal" (lol) is but it's certainly not a thing at pro level I think he's referring to printf's favorite build, which is mostly just an NA ladder thing. | ||
|
xelnaga_empire
627 Posts
Hey! Hard to pinpoint one thing, there's several build orders for Protoss which are all viable, and have very different possibilities - Twilight = Aggressive Blink, Defensive blink (3 base), Nothing to do with blink but a fake out and tech, DT. Robo = Collosus 2 base, Collosus 3 base, Immortal, Warp prism aggression, Disruptor Drops. Stargate = Oracle 1x into phoenix, 2x oracle, 3x oracle + They are all good openings, and can lead to very quick and efficient victories, anyone of them can change too based on what they're seeing, if a Protoss sees the Terran is going 3 cc (probe scout initially into the adept across the map) Lets say he was going robo initially into 3 base was his plan in mind, he can then very quickly transition into a warp prism opening and put on pressure. I feel there's a huge amount of lenience in Protoss builds that allow them to go from being "hardcountered" to doing the hard countering, now that example was very basic. But if you see a terran that goes 5 rax before his 3rd cc, there's no real getting out of what he's gonna do, if you see his addons, you can also tell what army comp you're gonna face, If you see 1/1/1 from a terran with an oracle for instance, you see the addons or lack of, and you can tell what's coming, and everything that comes out of a 1/1/1 has the a very similar response and won't really slow down a toss. If you see 3 cc, you can change, if you see 3 rax then 3rd cc, you have your 3rd up already and respond appropriately. Protoss will always get the 3rd up faster than the terran, they can scout better than a terran (Oracle or observers) and they get upgrades faster than a terran, they also have much better late game so the Terran is working with less readable. The shield battery is a very quick "Ah, so the terran is going to be pushing at X:xx minute mark, i'll throw up 3 shield batteries for the attack since my economy is better." All in all, when you play as a Terran vs Protoss, you pick a build at the start of the game, the issue comes in that once you've made your choice, that's it, can do the hard countering, or be hard countered, but as long as a Protoss scouts, he should never realistically be hard countered. It's a game of Rock, Paper, Scissors where they can change their answer. Extremely frustrating and very unforgiving for a terran. Link to this comment by Demuslim: www.reddit.com | ||
|
xelnaga_empire
627 Posts
They could pick a Terran unit and buff the shield damage to it. Adding only shield damage helps Terran in TvsP but keeps TvsZ the same, | ||
|
BronzeKnee
United States5220 Posts
On April 20 2018 04:18 Nakajin wrote: It might be a terrible idea, but why not come back to the old widow mine to fix TvP? It is a terrible idea. Would you suggest bringing back the MSC when Terran starts dominating with Mine drops? | ||
|
ZigguratOfUr
Iraq16955 Posts
On April 20 2018 11:10 pvsnp wrote: I think he's referring to printf's favorite build, which is mostly just an NA ladder thing. His disciple TurkeyDano did bring it to NationWars. But yeah the build isn't great if your opponent knows what's up and just proxy hatches or nyduses in response. | ||
|
EvanC
Canada130 Posts
| ||
|
ZigguratOfUr
Iraq16955 Posts
On April 20 2018 12:28 EvanC wrote: I think a good but not too major nerf for the Raven would be to make the Anti-Armor Missile cost 100 energy The problem with that is that it nerfs them early on where it isn't a problem and the anti-armor debuff is being used "as intended", and late game while ravens are a bit worse they still each have two missiles to spam all over the place. | ||
|
aish
20 Posts
Like people actually think PvZ or PvT needs to be "fixed" when the balance and gameplay has been the best it's ever been in starcraft's history this year. The only poor gameplay mechanic still in the game is mass raven; that's really it. | ||
|
xelnaga_empire
627 Posts
On April 20 2018 13:33 aish wrote: I feel like the balance team just keeps sounding like reddit or team liquid forum warriors. Like people actually think PvZ or PvT needs to be "fixed" when the balance and gameplay has been the best it's ever been in starcraft's history this year. The only poor gameplay mechanic still in the game is mass raven; that's really it. PvsT balance is poor right now. That is the conclusion the Blizzard balance team has come to and they are correct. For more information on why PvsT balance is poor, I just posted the analysis by Demuslim above. If you can't find the analysis by Demuslim on why PvsT balance is poor, you can also read it here: www.reddit.com | ||
| ||
