The second GSL Code S season of the year kicked off with two former champions advancing from their RO32 group. Classic was mostly untroubled as he defeated Elazer and ByuN to advance as the first place player from Group A of the RO32, looking once more like a title contender in the early going. On the other hand, ByuNwiped tears from his eyes after he won a hard-fought deciding match against Elazer, relieved to have reached a potential turning point in a lengthy slump.
Poland's Elazer was able to take a map off both Classic and ByuN, but was unable to pull through in the deciding games. In particular, he had no answer for ByuN's late-game play, and he saw his army whittled down by Ghosts and Ravens. Leenock came into the group after a surprisingly strong showing in the previous season of Code S, but he was unable to reproduce his good form.
GSL Code S continues on Saturday, Apr 21 4:00am GMT (GMT+00:00) with Group B of the RO32, featuring Scarlett, Patience, Losira, and Gumiho.
ByuN making out of this group is actually quite surprising. I watch his match vs Elazer and compared to other Terrans, he made a lot of mistakes that we don't see a lot from the best Terran players. Have yet to watch his match against Classic, but I'm guessing it's very one-sided.
Pretty expected results but I dont think many would of predicted the manner in which ByuN won his games vs Elazer. Classic continues to look terrifying against all but the best Zergs and Protoss'.
Yeah Byun really made it this time on the back of his TvZ, which he said in the postgame interview was his best matchup, like 90% on ladder. I dunno how far he'll get though versus protoss, because like the TL preview said, he doesn't seem to go macro against protoss and tried here to do timing attacks, which were better than his foray in the super tournament, but didn't help him that much. It does say a lot when the no.1 ladder player (again, he said he hit no.1 on ladder during the week between the super tournament and GSL season 2) can't find a way to crack protoss via the long game. He probably will need a zerg/terran heavy ro.16 group for him to advance to the knockout rounds, with his current TvP. Hopefully he gets it though, because as a fan its always great to see such raw emotion coming with wins.
On April 19 2018 15:06 Orlok wrote: Yeah Byun really made it this time on the back of his TvZ, which he said in the postgame interview was his best matchup, like 90% on ladder. I dunno how far he'll get though versus protoss, because like the TL preview said, he doesn't seem to go macro against protoss and tried here to do timing attacks, which were better than his foray in the super tournament, but didn't help him that much. It does say a lot when the no.1 ladder player (again, he said he hit no.1 on ladder during the week between the super tournament and GSL season 2) can't find a way to crack protoss via the long game. He probably will need a zerg/terran heavy ro.16 group for him to advance to the knockout rounds, with his current TvP. Hopefully he gets it though, because as a fan its always great to see such raw emotion coming with wins.
Sounds as if protoss wants to go late game vs Terran. PvT is in a bad state in that it's all about early game regardless of if you are protoss or terran. Aggressive style works in PvT (think Zest, Classic, herO). Macro style doesn't work as well (think Stats). Same the other way around; macro style doesn't work well in TvP (InnoVation). Aggressive style works better (Maru).
I'd argue that when both players play aggressively, Protoss has an edge due to having more early game options; but when both play macro games (extremely rare, and I can only think of Stats vs Maru at IEM and herO vs InnVation at GSL ST2 G3, G4), Terran has an edge when the Terran player stablizes on mass ranged liberators and ravens.
Actually Maru and Stats were the one who did not impress that much in the beginning of Season 1. Then we know what happened and it always does. May be we should give some time for Byun to enter in better condition. Great players very often know how to win games without showing extraordinary skill in some moments. Mvp did it many times. Now I think that Classic is the one that must face bigger pressure and fulfil the expectations because he is the one who i supposed to picк the trophy. I really hope for that but for this two months period balance could slighly change and of course he should deal with top zerg players if he really wants to fulfil his ambitions.
On April 19 2018 15:06 Orlok wrote: Yeah Byun really made it this time on the back of his TvZ, which he said in the postgame interview was his best matchup, like 90% on ladder. I dunno how far he'll get though versus protoss, because like the TL preview said, he doesn't seem to go macro against protoss and tried here to do timing attacks, which were better than his foray in the super tournament, but didn't help him that much. It does say a lot when the no.1 ladder player (again, he said he hit no.1 on ladder during the week between the super tournament and GSL season 2) can't find a way to crack protoss via the long game. He probably will need a zerg/terran heavy ro.16 group for him to advance to the knockout rounds, with his current TvP. Hopefully he gets it though, because as a fan its always great to see such raw emotion coming with wins.
Sounds as if protoss wants to go late game vs Terran. PvT is in a bad state in that it's all about early game regardless of if you are protoss or terran. Aggressive style works in PvT (think Zest, Classic, herO). Macro style doesn't work as well (think Stats). Same the other way around; macro style doesn't work well in TvP (InnoVation). Aggressive style works better (Maru).
I'd argue that when both players play aggressively, Protoss has an edge due to having more early game options; but when both play macro games (extremely rare, and I can only think of Stats vs Maru at IEM and herO vs InnVation at GSL ST2 G3, G4), Terran has an edge when the Terran player stablizes on mass ranged liberators and ravens.
Problem is, there's a huge chunk of time between midgame Colossus/Storm showing up and super-lategame critical mass of Ravens, and that's where Protoss shits all over Terran. Aside from that one time with Maru vs Stats at Katowice (where Stats happily sat on his own side of the map giving Maru all the time in the world), I haven't seen a single pro PvT game where Terran manages to reach a critical mass of Ravens.
Zergs are the ones concerned about Ravens, Protoss not so much.
On April 19 2018 15:06 Orlok wrote: Yeah Byun really made it this time on the back of his TvZ, which he said in the postgame interview was his best matchup, like 90% on ladder. I dunno how far he'll get though versus protoss, because like the TL preview said, he doesn't seem to go macro against protoss and tried here to do timing attacks, which were better than his foray in the super tournament, but didn't help him that much. It does say a lot when the no.1 ladder player (again, he said he hit no.1 on ladder during the week between the super tournament and GSL season 2) can't find a way to crack protoss via the long game. He probably will need a zerg/terran heavy ro.16 group for him to advance to the knockout rounds, with his current TvP. Hopefully he gets it though, because as a fan its always great to see such raw emotion coming with wins.
Sounds as if protoss wants to go late game vs Terran. PvT is in a bad state in that it's all about early game regardless of if you are protoss or terran. Aggressive style works in PvT (think Zest, Classic, herO). Macro style doesn't work as well (think Stats). Same the other way around; macro style doesn't work well in TvP (InnoVation). Aggressive style works better (Maru).
I'd argue that when both players play aggressively, Protoss has an edge due to having more early game options; but when both play macro games (extremely rare, and I can only think of Stats vs Maru at IEM and herO vs InnVation at GSL ST2 G3, G4), Terran has an edge when the Terran player stablizes on mass ranged liberators and ravens.
Problem is, there's a huge chunk of time between midgame Colossus/Storm showing up and super-lategame critical mass of Ravens, and that's where Protoss shits all over Terran. Aside from that one time with Maru vs Stats at Katowice (where Stats happily sat on his own side of the map giving Maru all the time in the world), I haven't seen a single pro PvT game where Terran manages to reach a critical mass of Ravens.
Zergs are the ones concerned about Ravens, Protoss not so much.
Colossi suck period. I agree when storm just finishes, Protoss is strong and can basically defend any Terran's army of comparable size. I'm not sure how many Protosses do storm timing push though and I imagine storm is not enough to win the game by itself vs a turtling Terran, but definitely allows Protoss to expand and transition safely to late game while potentially containing Terran on 3 bases.
But after Terran ramps up ranged liberator production, storm's advantage is cancelled out. At this point before Protoss builds up enough Tempests, Terrans have an edge and usually go for a push and often times decide the game here (InnoVation does it every time if he manages to reach this point).
I don't see a reason for Terran not to be able to go for mass ravens afterwards, other than that it is extremely rare that such a situation is reached because 1) almost everyone going for early game aggressions, 2) there are several timings from each side where one race has an edge and goes for the finish and most of the time decide the game right there, 3) there are zero late game (raven-ghost type of late game) terrans in the foreign scene, so only korean PvT can possibly reach this supreme late game stage.
On April 19 2018 15:06 Orlok wrote: Yeah Byun really made it this time on the back of his TvZ, which he said in the postgame interview was his best matchup, like 90% on ladder. I dunno how far he'll get though versus protoss, because like the TL preview said, he doesn't seem to go macro against protoss and tried here to do timing attacks, which were better than his foray in the super tournament, but didn't help him that much. It does say a lot when the no.1 ladder player (again, he said he hit no.1 on ladder during the week between the super tournament and GSL season 2) can't find a way to crack protoss via the long game. He probably will need a zerg/terran heavy ro.16 group for him to advance to the knockout rounds, with his current TvP. Hopefully he gets it though, because as a fan its always great to see such raw emotion coming with wins.
To be fair in GSL ST all terrans got obliterated by protosses, it was delightful to watch.
Both Byun and Elazer didn't look particularly great in lategame, especially Elazer. Balance aside (don't think this series is really relevant), god damn I hate watching TvZ lategame atm. It's now at the point where I enjoy it less than the Carrier vs spore forest garbage.
On April 19 2018 15:52 Veluvian wrote: Actually Maru and Stats were the one who did not impress that much in the beginning of Season 1. Then we know what happened and it always does. May be we should give some time for Byun to enter in better condition. Great players very often know how to win games without showing extraordinary skill in some moments. Mvp did it many times. Now I think that Classic is the one that must face bigger pressure and fulfil the expectations because he is the one who i supposed to picк the trophy. I really hope for that but for this two months period balance could slighly change and of course he should deal with top zerg players if he really wants to fulfil his ambitions.
Byun striked me as a player who will not win withouth showing extraordinary skill. When he won Blizzcon/GSL it was because of his skill being higher than his opponents (some people call it abusing reapers). Stats is someone who always wins without doing something impressive. And often it seems to me his opponents just collapses/makes stupid mistakes (ofc that's also part of Stats' skill).
On April 19 2018 15:52 Veluvian wrote: Actually Maru and Stats were the one who did not impress that much in the beginning of Season 1. Then we know what happened and it always does. May be we should give some time for Byun to enter in better condition. Great players very often know how to win games without showing extraordinary skill in some moments. Mvp did it many times. Now I think that Classic is the one that must face bigger pressure and fulfil the expectations because he is the one who i supposed to picк the trophy. I really hope for that but for this two months period balance could slighly change and of course he should deal with top zerg players if he really wants to fulfil his ambitions.
Byun striked me as a player who will not win withouth showing extraordinary skill. When he won Blizzcon/GSL it was because of his skill being higher than his opponents (some people call it abusing reapers). Stats is someone who always wins without doing something impressive. And often it seems to me his opponents just collapses/makes stupid mistakes (ofc that's also part of Stats' skill).
ByuN thrives on flashy micro. I wouldn't necessarily call that higher skill. Each player can have different strengths like better game sense, good preparation, or strong macro. Some of those traits are less noticeable than others, but all are important. His micro still seems pretty on point, but it seems like it's the other aspects of his game that have fallen off a bit.
Watching the Elazer Byun games, I really started to wonder why lategame zergs aren't making a lot more vipers to counter the ravens. Parasitic bomb is super good.
On April 19 2018 15:52 Veluvian wrote: Actually Maru and Stats were the one who did not impress that much in the beginning of Season 1. Then we know what happened and it always does. May be we should give some time for Byun to enter in better condition. Great players very often know how to win games without showing extraordinary skill in some moments. Mvp did it many times. Now I think that Classic is the one that must face bigger pressure and fulfil the expectations because he is the one who i supposed to picк the trophy. I really hope for that but for this two months period balance could slighly change and of course he should deal with top zerg players if he really wants to fulfil his ambitions.
Byun striked me as a player who will not win withouth showing extraordinary skill. When he won Blizzcon/GSL it was because of his skill being higher than his opponents (some people call it abusing reapers). Stats is someone who always wins without doing something impressive. And often it seems to me his opponents just collapses/makes stupid mistakes (ofc that's also part of Stats' skill).
ByuN thrives on flashy micro. I wouldn't necessarily call that higher skill. Each player can have different strengths like better game sense, good preparation, or strong macro. Some of those traits are less noticeable than others, but all are important. His micro still seems pretty on point, but it seems like it's the other aspects of his game that have fallen off a bit.
No, I did mean overall skill - that also includes flashy micro. When Byun won Blizzcon, he had the highest overall skill (by far) I would say (because that patch suited him and he was on fire). On the contrary he doesn't thrive on clutching out an evenly matched opponent. He is not bad, but also no $o$, I would say below average. Would match with his statement, in an interview that he can't/couldn't deliver offline as well. My point is, it is very difficult for Byun to win a championship now, because what he needs is to be overwhelmingly better than his opponent. 50/50 (or even a worse skill level) Won't cut it for him (He can win against anyone, but also lose against anyone).
On April 19 2018 15:52 Veluvian wrote: Actually Maru and Stats were the one who did not impress that much in the beginning of Season 1. Then we know what happened and it always does. May be we should give some time for Byun to enter in better condition. Great players very often know how to win games without showing extraordinary skill in some moments. Mvp did it many times. Now I think that Classic is the one that must face bigger pressure and fulfil the expectations because he is the one who i supposed to picк the trophy. I really hope for that but for this two months period balance could slighly change and of course he should deal with top zerg players if he really wants to fulfil his ambitions.
Byun striked me as a player who will not win withouth showing extraordinary skill. When he won Blizzcon/GSL it was because of his skill being higher than his opponents (some people call it abusing reapers). Stats is someone who always wins without doing something impressive. And often it seems to me his opponents just collapses/makes stupid mistakes (ofc that's also part of Stats' skill).
ByuN thrives on flashy micro. I wouldn't necessarily call that higher skill. Each player can have different strengths like better game sense, good preparation, or strong macro. Some of those traits are less noticeable than others, but all are important. His micro still seems pretty on point, but it seems like it's the other aspects of his game that have fallen off a bit.
No, I did mean overall skill - that also includes flashy micro. When Byun won Blizzcon, he had the highest overall skill (by far) I would say (because that patch suited him and he was on fire).
Debatable. I'd put both Dark and Zest above ByuN around the time he won blizzcon.
Maybe even TY as well to be honest. TY's entire game was perfected (from earlygame cheese to the super lategame). ByuN's lategame wasn't even good when he won blizzcon, he had to win with reapers and fast tank pushes iirc. Both Showtime and Dark crushed him when the games went late.
On April 19 2018 15:52 Veluvian wrote: Actually Maru and Stats were the one who did not impress that much in the beginning of Season 1. Then we know what happened and it always does. May be we should give some time for Byun to enter in better condition. Great players very often know how to win games without showing extraordinary skill in some moments. Mvp did it many times. Now I think that Classic is the one that must face bigger pressure and fulfil the expectations because he is the one who i supposed to picк the trophy. I really hope for that but for this two months period balance could slighly change and of course he should deal with top zerg players if he really wants to fulfil his ambitions.
Byun striked me as a player who will not win withouth showing extraordinary skill. When he won Blizzcon/GSL it was because of his skill being higher than his opponents (some people call it abusing reapers). Stats is someone who always wins without doing something impressive. And often it seems to me his opponents just collapses/makes stupid mistakes (ofc that's also part of Stats' skill).
ByuN thrives on flashy micro. I wouldn't necessarily call that higher skill. Each player can have different strengths like better game sense, good preparation, or strong macro. Some of those traits are less noticeable than others, but all are important. His micro still seems pretty on point, but it seems like it's the other aspects of his game that have fallen off a bit.
No, I did mean overall skill - that also includes flashy micro. When Byun won Blizzcon, he had the highest overall skill (by far) I would say (because that patch suited him and he was on fire).
Debatable. I'd put both Dark and Zest above ByuN around the time he won blizzcon.
Maybe even TY as well to be honest. TY's entire game was perfected (from earlygame cheese to the super lategame). ByuN's lategame wasn't even good when he won blizzcon, he had to win with reapers and fast tank pushes iirc. Both Showtime and Dark crushed him when the games went late.
I disagree; I think whoever has the extra bit of special ends up winning. Byun had something special... the something special allowed him to beat sOs in that GSL finals and propelled him to Blizzcon. Rating any other top player at the time vs sOs, I really doubt any of them had the extra spice needed.
If you look at the last 5 Blizzcon winners v runner-up, you see the difference comes down to spice (the players' games more than the players.)
sOs v. Jaedong: Jaedong had power, sOs had mindgame spice. Life v. MMA: MMA had micro, Life had gamesense spice. sOs v. Life: spicier spice won. Byun v Dark: Dark had force, Byun had reaper spice Rogue v soO: soO had macro, Rogue had composition spice
EPT
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/Waxangel/GSL/2018/GSL_Code_S_Banner_v2.jpg)
ByuN wiped tears from his eyes after he won a hard-fought deciding match against Elazer, relieved to have reached a potential turning point in a lengthy slump.
