EPTStarCraft II Balance Update -- November 28, 2017 - Page 12
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hiroshOne
Poland425 Posts
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ZigguratOfUr
Iraq16955 Posts
On December 06 2017 14:50 hiroshOne wrote: Reverting Marauders changes would mean that Ultralisks are back to being useless cows that die like pigeons from stimmed bio. I think that current state of ths unit vs bio is kinda OK. Bio still can kill Ultras but it's not so ez as it was in HOTS which is understandable concidering Ultra is top tier for Zerg and Bio is not same thing for T. So indirect nerf to Ultras, when they just nerfed Infestors to the ground would be an overkill. Now, I understand that it would help a lot in PvT but it would wreck TvZ. I think nerfing ChronoBoost is the way to go. It would make Protoss timings less imba and first of all it would nerf its ridiculous economy. It would normalize 2 forge play too. Now even Special is saying that Protoss can have 3/3 in time when Terran has his 1/1. Its pretty much OP Why would it wreck TvZ? Bio isn't even being played much in TvZ currently, so it's hard to imagine that a marauder buff would flip the match-up on its head. | ||
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JackONeill
861 Posts
The first thing blizz has to do is recognize that they gutted the mine without giving bio any compensation, and that such a nerf to the mine makes it unusable. The mine change needs to be reverted, changed or a least reconsidered (for instance i suggested making it weaker, but cheaper, faster to produce, and only 1 population). Second thing is taking a look at the reaper. 3 rax reapers has been a cancer, everyone can and usually will agree about that, however the reaper is now back to its original state, where you can only build 1 or 2 in the early game, then you can unbind the R key for your baracks. Maybe giving the reaper some kind of utility later in the game through an upgrade would be nice. For instance, removing the reaper grenade but having a tech lab upgrade requiring the ghost academy that gives the reaper some AoE utility to cope for the mine nerf? Or give the reaper detection to help bio players use mules to sustain their production? I would love for blizzard to consider giving bio playstyle somewhat of a coherent and well rounded roster of units so that you can play full bio, with the ghost as a late game unit, and the reaper not being useless past the 4 minute mark. | ||
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jpg06051992
United States580 Posts
On December 06 2017 15:19 JackONeill wrote: Reverting marauders when ghosts were buffed is a wrong move. If you make the ghost easier to use with bio AND buff the marauder, bio will be overwhelming. The first thing blizz has to do is recognize that they gutted the mine without giving bio any compensation, and that such a nerf to the mine makes it unusable. The mine change needs to be reverted, changed or a least reconsidered (for instance i suggested making it weaker, but cheaper, faster to produce, and only 1 population). Second thing is taking a look at the reaper. 3 rax reapers has been a cancer, everyone can and usually will agree about that, however the reaper is now back to its original state, where you can only build 1 or 2 in the early game, then you can unbind the R key for your baracks. Maybe giving the reaper some kind of utility later in the game through an upgrade would be nice. For instance, removing the reaper grenade but having a tech lab upgrade requiring the ghost academy that gives the reaper some AoE utility to cope for the mine nerf? Or give the reaper detection to help bio players use mules to sustain their production? I would love for blizzard to consider giving bio playstyle somewhat of a coherent and well rounded roster of units so that you can play full bio, with the ghost as a late game unit, and the reaper not being useless past the 4 minute mark. Seeing the Reaper not built past 4 minutes is a disappointment, it's a good high skill cap/micro unit that really shows the difference between top tier players and low tier, I would be fine giving it some pro bio changes, but idk, even with some type of AoE utility, what purpose is it going to serve a Terran in the late game when a Zerg is fielding Brood Lords, Ultralisks and cracklings? | ||
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hiroshOne
Poland425 Posts
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MrWayne
219 Posts
On December 06 2017 14:50 hiroshOne wrote: Reverting Marauders changes would mean that Ultralisks are back to being useless cows that die like pigeons from stimmed bio. I think that current state of ths unit vs bio is kinda OK. Bio still can kill Ultras but it's not so ez as it was in HOTS which is understandable concidering Ultra is top tier for Zerg and Bio is not same thing for T. So indirect nerf to Ultras, when they just nerfed Infestors to the ground would be an overkill. Now, I understand that it would help a lot in PvT but it would wreck TvZ. I think nerfing ChronoBoost is the way to go. It would make Protoss timings less imba and first of all it would nerf its ridiculous economy. It would normalize 2 forge play too. Now even Special is saying that Protoss can have 3/3 in time when Terran has his 1/1. Its pretty much OP As some others and i mentioned, if they revert the Marauder they should also revert the Ultra to 8 armor. I did some math. I compared the current marine/marauder bio ball vs Ultras with the buffed marauder bio ball vs 8 armor ultra, I also assumed the terran player to produce his bio out of 8 Barracks and always stimming his bio. when producing out of 4 tech labs and 4 Reactors the new bio ball would have 97% of the current bio balls dps vs ultras. when producing out of 5 tach labs and 3 Reactors the new bio ball would have 105% ot the current bio balls dps vs ultras. Also the attack animation of the buffed marauder will be shorter and therefore better to micro. that's not too shabby i think. But to be fair, the Ultra isn't really a problem in TvZ and i think the more important reason for the Marauder change is the strength of chargelot/Stalker/sentry the problems in BiovZ are LBH and the lack of good Bio openings. Edit: + a Marauder change would not affect Mech | ||
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JackONeill
861 Posts
On December 06 2017 15:37 jpg06051992 wrote: Seeing the Reaper not built past 4 minutes is a disappointment, it's a good high skill cap/micro unit that really shows the difference between top tier players and low tier, I would be fine giving it some pro bio changes, but idk, even with some type of AoE utility, what purpose is it going to serve a Terran in the late game when a Zerg is fielding Brood Lords, Ultralisks and cracklings? I don't know really, just throwing ideas. For instance if they were able to land spider mines? I don't know i just think it's bad design to have a unit that only has early game utility, and nothing past that. There's actually no other unit like that in the game. The only one may be the roach, but they can be turned into ravagers and get some mid-late game purpose. The reaper is truly the only unit in the game that can't built past the early game. | ||
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