EPTCommunity Feedback Update - March 30 - Page 2
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Solar424
United States4001 Posts
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Shield
Bulgaria4824 Posts
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada18030 Posts
since LotV's release Terran air has been nerfed quite a bit and Terran ground has been buffed a lot. Good trend to see. at my level ( NA Diamond ) there is still too much airplay for my taste. this issue is not fun-breaking.. its not like i'm quitting next week and never, ever playing again.. .i'd just prefer more ground based play, more often. Please, buff the Thor's anti air as much as reasonably possible. Please weaken any and all air units as much as possible in all 3 races. | ||
Nakajin
Canada8991 Posts
On March 31 2017 05:51 jpg06051992 wrote: The Thor has also been a huge balance problem in that it shifts away from being an OP a move unit and totally useless because it get's hard countered by cracklings, remove the unit from the game and replace it with the Goliath, and be...done....with....it....You can really only polish a turd so much, even if the turd is glimmering and covered in chrome, it's still a turd. I love the fact that replacing a sc2 unit by a BW unit that had nothing (it just a mech unit that shoot up and down and has zero original idea behind it, oppose to lets day the lurker) is suppose the make the game better. Like that the fact that there is a unit with the skin and the name of the goliat will all of the sudden make it an awesome balance unit. | ||
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washikie
United States752 Posts
I like the Thor change tenitivly I would warn that if you buff Thor splash more i and a lot of other terran's would probably just use it with bio to shred mutas rather than bothering with mech. Mech as a long term plan and not a 3 base Allin just has a lot of issues right now. Swarmhosts from Zerg are often crippling, fast mutas are often crippling( although Thor might fix this) early roaches can be crippling depending on how greedy the opening is. Late game is often crippling deppending on the map since you ca t secure enough bases and your army is not effecient enough to wear down a Zerg on more basses than you. For Protoss I don't like the idea of buffing the tempest when skytoss is already prity strong it has to much impact on other matches, void ray changes sure, although it will make certain allins harder to hold in plz if you go stargate open. | ||
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NutriaKaiN
88 Posts
On March 31 2017 05:55 Solar424 wrote: 6 months of Adept into DT into Archon in every PvZ and Blizzard is just now realizing there's a stale meta? Just make the Warp Prism 100/100 or even 100/50 so that there's some sort of gas investment. Every other harass option in the game costs some amount of gas, but arguably the most effective one doesn't. Makes no sense. or maybe buff the other options.. when the balance numbers are fine now.. why a **** nerf? it makes 0 sense. | ||
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Solar424
United States4001 Posts
On March 31 2017 06:27 NutriaKaiN wrote: or maybe buff the other options.. when the balance numbers are fine now.. why a **** nerf? it makes 0 sense. Warp prism play has been problematic in all matchups for a long time, and changing the cost to requiring gas has been something people have proposed for a while. Since the warp prism gives Adepts, DT's, and Archons added power in the early game, nerfing it would be a benefit. Obviously there would be buffs in other places, but Adept play is just uninteresting to watch and unfun to play against. | ||
Liquid`Snute
Norway839 Posts
Adding in an upgrade requirement for timing attacks will hurt build diversity. Having a default warp-in time slightly slower than the power pylon warp-in time as default for the prism wouldn't be so bad, but if it becomes as bad as a proxy pylon without anything next to it, that won't be healthy. From a Z standpoint it wouldn't be so bad to nerf the pickup range (primary concern), prism's shields (secondary concern), or move-speed (lesser concern). 1. Slight reduction to pick-up range - enough to micro immortals, but strengthening queens against the archon drop) and 2. Changing the shield/hp ratio of warp prism. Right now it's 100 shields and 80 hp, it would be far more suitable to have 60-80 shields and 100-120hp so that target-firing of prism will be rewarded more than it is today. Archons already have a near-full healing capability, no reason to have the prism effectively work the same way. | ||
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Silky
United States260 Posts
On March 31 2017 06:56 Liquid`Snute wrote: quite a lot to talk about here but just my cents for the prism: i'm not a big fan of the slow warp-in without upgrade as a suggestion. It only nerfs DT drop and limits build diversity, depending on how expensive the upgrade is. Nerfing TC 7/8-gates would be welcome, but I think it's better to nerf the adept itself rather than adding in a prism research upgrade. Adding in an upgrade requirement for timing attacks will hurt build diversity. Having a default warp-in time slightly slower than the power pylon warp-in time as default for the prism wouldn't be so bad, but if it becomes as bad as a proxy pylon without anything next to it, that won't be healthy. From a Z standpoint it wouldn't be so bad to nerf the pickup range (primary concern), prism's shields (secondary concern), or move-speed (lesser concern). 1. Slight reduction to pick-up range - enough to micro immortals, but strengthening queens against the archon drop) and 2. Changing the shield/hp ratio of warp prism. Right now it's 100 shields and 80 hp, it would be far more suitable to have 60-80 shields and 100-120hp so that target-firing of prism will be rewarded more than it is today. Archons already have a near-full healing capability, no reason to have the prism effectively work the same way. I think these ideas are the right call | ||
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SNSeigifried
United States1640 Posts
Glad to see you both agree that the current prism suggestion is the wrong way to go. Also snute's suggesting i think are a welcoming change if they were to be tested. | ||
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Aunvilgodess
954 Posts
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Tyrhanius
France947 Posts
On March 31 2017 05:12 Olli wrote: Pretty terrible as far as Protoss is concerned. PvZ variety is perfectly fine, and it's not going to improve if they take away potential Protoss openings without giving anything in return. No idea what they were thinking there. Meanwhile in PvT, there's exactly one somewhat reliable playstyle in phoenix/adept, everything else dies to tank pushes. How about addressing that first? With these propositions Terran will be the big winner of the patch : Better thor vs mutas with both bio and mech. Also thor could become a really good counter to phoenix adept, he can't be lifted by phoenix, deal + light on AOE, has 400 HP and 1 armor, so it needs 45 shots of adept to die, it's repairable, and has a good 66 DPS (same than sieged liberator) before the patch... The oracle into void to defend liberator/tanks push could be also weaker when void charge is on cooldown. And the WP nerf won't just affect PvZ but aslo PvT. Terran has won 4 tournaments on the last 5, they are not really on trouble. | ||
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Meepman
Canada610 Posts
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FrkFrJss
Canada1208 Posts
However, any nerf to the warp prism whether it be health/speed/pickup range (health was already nerfed, by the way), is a nerf in PvT, where Terran really doesn't need any more help there against Protoss. | ||
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Lexender
Mexico2665 Posts
On March 31 2017 07:39 FrkFrJss wrote: Like some of the others on here, I think you have to be very careful where you nerf Protoss. I agree that against zerg, the warp prism + adept is hard to deal with. However, any nerf to the warp prism whether it be health/speed/pickup range (health was already nerfed, by the way), is a nerf in PvT, where Terran really doesn't need any more help there against Protoss. On March 31 2017 07:28 Tyrhanius wrote: With these propositions Terran will be the big winner of the patch : Better thor vs mutas with both bio and mech. Also thor could become a really good counter to phoenix adept, he can't be lifted by phoenix, deal + light on AOE, has 400 HP and 1 armor, so it needs 45 shots of adept to die, it's repairable, and has a good 66 DPS (same than sieged liberator) before the patch... The oracle into void to defend liberator/tanks push could be also weaker when void charge is on cooldown. And the WP nerf won't just affect PvZ but aslo PvT. Terran has won 4 tournaments on the last 5, they are not really on trouble. Stop looking at it from balance view. If something needs to be nerfed for terran or buffed for toss after the changes thats ok, as long as the changes makes sense. Not making changes and letting meta get stale for months just because some winrates its not the way to go. | ||
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pvsnp
7676 Posts
Thor I never see Thors, and mech really needs AA so definitely a good change. Buffing Cyclone AA is an alternative option. Raven Yeah Autoturrets have had way too high DPS for way too long. Ravens are supposed to be support units not harassing ones. A turret nerf and compensating buff to other abilities would help redefine them as defensive units. PvP Skytoss is stupid in PvP as well as everywhere else, who knew? Nerfing Void Rays/Carriers will only lead to good things. In contrast, Tempests have needed some love since 3.8, so buffing them makes a lot of sense. Shifting the current Skytoss meta is a long overdue fix. PvZ soO did not die for nothing at least. Either Adepts or Warp Prisms being nerfed would go a long way towards helping Zergs. Reducing pickup range and slow warp ins are both options for WP; shades are massively obnoxious with regard to splitting units to defend and losing your army half at a time so nerfing them is a wonderful idea. Alternatively, I would propose either a health reduction or a Glaives nerf. Even something like increasing the research time for Glaives would help a lot. Anything to reshape the current mass Adept meta that is terrible to both play and watch. Conclusion: Blizzard did something completely right! A M A Z I N G! | ||
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bela.mervado
Hungary418 Posts
shade=adept's shield, killing shade cancels shade and depletes adept shield, but does not kill the unit? | ||
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Edowyth
United States183 Posts
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Tyrhanius
France947 Posts
On March 31 2017 08:12 Lexender wrote: Stop looking at it from balance view. If something needs to be nerfed for terran or buffed for toss after the changes thats ok, as long as the changes makes sense. Not making changes and letting meta get stale for months just because some winrates its not the way to go. Nobody has said they shouldn't do anything, but we begin to be used the way they proceed. The change won't be lived until 2-3 months, and then we have to wait for 2-3months to get the " corrective patch" because it's too strong, and usually it takes 2-3 patchs to correct something, so well it will take around 1 year from the change to the moment it will be balanced... Better try to warn them about the consequences before the patch, rather than waiting 9months-12months. | ||
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JackONeill
861 Posts
We haven’t been seeing as much Mech play as we would like Did they fire DK? WHO WROTE THAT? Giving more AA strength to the thor is good, but it won't change the fact that SHs are the reason we don't see mech play. An AA buff would help mech in TvP a lot though. Raven nerf is good. But "burst damage" turret is still bad for the game, because it's free damage. It'd be best of the turret to be remplaced by a 50 energy defensive matrix. Nerfing the void ray's damage and putting more into the alignement is terrible : stop making units rely on abilities. Nerfing the warp prism can only be made by nerfing the stupid pickuprange. Good ideas overall, but things are moving way too slow to keep people interested. | ||
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