EPTSeason 3 Ladder Map Update - Page 2
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Mozdk
Denmark6989 Posts
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TheFish7
United States2824 Posts
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Soke
United States790 Posts
On July 24 2014 05:18 Mozdk wrote: Deadwing was a given. What exactly is wrong with Foxtrot? There was never vertical spawns to begin with, but horizontal spawns were completely different layouts of your base and your expansions, plus another few imbalances. Thank you Blizzard, the changes were much needed. | ||
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leopardb
Germany92 Posts
On July 24 2014 05:23 Soke wrote: There was never vertical spawns to begin with, but horizontal spawns were completely different layouts of your base and your expansions, plus another few imbalances. Thank you Blizzard, the changes were much needed. Well that's exactly what was nice in foxtrot labs either you would spawn with a delayed third because of rocks or a dangerous natural for the same reason (rocks) and you knew there was a high chance the situation would be the opposite for your opponent. That made for quite a different way to play, but i must have missed something :/ if Blizzard changed it, it must have been really imba... | ||
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Drake
Germany6146 Posts
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Drake
Germany6146 Posts
On July 24 2014 05:18 Mozdk wrote: Deadwing was a given. What exactly is wrong with Foxtrot? On July 24 2014 05:22 TheFish7 wrote: Don't understand the foxtrot change. As i heared in a few casts and said by a few pros this maps seems AMAZING on cross but near to broken on some spawns in some matchups. i cant give much detail cause my skill is so bad xD but there was so many pros saying its even worse then deadwing that it has to be something | ||
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vult
United States9400 Posts
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leopardb
Germany92 Posts
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Survivor61316
United States470 Posts
On July 24 2014 05:14 Faust852 wrote: Doesn't work the same tho. All your tank will focus the same pack of baneling with quick shift rights clic on them. WM have a way sorter radius and there is no way to really focus manually each of them. + Tank are good to hold the Z army a couple of second so you have more time to split, while you have absolutly no holders with biomine. If you dont stagger your tanks at all they will just fire on the same banelings and before they can shoot again the ling/bling will close on the army. The same goes for mines, you have to stagger them so that you can keep auto targeting as the banes come through. I'm not sure what you mean by tanks being good at holding the zerg army for a couple seconds; if by that you mean that it keeps the lings back for a couple seconds as they kill the tanks before going after the bio again, then mines do the same thing because Zergs generally send seers with their army the kill the mines while they pass through. If you mean that the damage and splash of tanks means that Zergs have to be ready to fully commit to the attack before launching it, then again, mines do the same thing because of their tremendous splash damage and damage output. Couple of that with the mass of tanks you need to be able to trade cost effectively on creep, the longer siege time, the longer build time, super fast mutas who can be wreaking havoc in your base and still be back for the fight if you take too long to engage (ie slowly leapfrogging tanks), then mines are clearly a superior choice to add to the army composition than tanks in virtually any given situation. | ||
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boxerfred
Germany8360 Posts
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Genome852
United States979 Posts
On July 24 2014 05:39 Survivor61316 wrote: + Show Spoiler + If you dont stagger your tanks at all they will just fire on the same banelings and before they can shoot again the ling/bling will close on the army. The same goes for mines, you have to stagger them so that you can keep auto targeting as the banes come through. I'm not sure what you mean by tanks being good at holding the zerg army for a couple seconds; if by that you mean that it keeps the lings back for a couple seconds as they kill the tanks before going after the bio again, then mines do the same thing because Zergs generally send seers with their army the kill the mines while they pass through. If you mean that the damage and splash of tanks means that Zergs have to be ready to fully commit to the attack before launching it, then again, mines do the same thing because of their tremendous splash damage and damage output. Couple of that with the mass of tanks you need to be able to trade cost effectively on creep, the longer siege time, the longer build time, super fast mutas who can be wreaking havoc in your base and still be back for the fight if you take too long to engage (ie slowly leapfrogging tanks), then mines are clearly a superior choice to add to the army composition than tanks in virtually any given situation. He was just saying that you can reliably focus fire banes with tanks, which is true. You cannot reliably aim widow mines due to short range and lockon timer resetting every time you give them a new order. The most you can do in most cases is burrow / unburrow micro to prevent them from getting tripped by 1 or 2 sacrificial lings. | ||
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Survivor61316
United States470 Posts
On July 24 2014 05:44 Genome852 wrote: He was just saying that you can reliably focus fire banes with tanks, which is true. You cannot reliably aim widow mines due to short range and lockon timer resetting every time you give them a new order. The most you can do in most cases is burrow / unburrow micro to prevent them from getting tripped by 1 or 2 sacrificial lings. Yeah its definitely way easier with tanks, no doubt. But mines are still a way better unit so it doesn't really make sense to play marine tank regardless of that. | ||
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Pontius Pirate
United States1557 Posts
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[PkF] Wire
France24192 Posts
It's good though because it shows Blizzard is more and more enclined to answering community and pro scene feedback. I take it as a really positive sign. | ||
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SpikeStarcraft
Germany2095 Posts
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Sajaki
Canada1135 Posts
On July 24 2014 08:11 SpikeStarcraft wrote: Doesnt seem to be in effect on EU yet. I just had a game with horizontal spawns on deathwing. They're getting clumped with the widowmine/thor/timewarp patch. | ||
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JessicaSc2
Poland123 Posts
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Faust852
Luxembourg4004 Posts
On July 24 2014 05:39 Survivor61316 wrote: If you dont stagger your tanks at all they will just fire on the same banelings and before they can shoot again the ling/bling will close on the army. The same goes for mines, you have to stagger them so that you can keep auto targeting as the banes come through. I'm not sure what you mean by tanks being good at holding the zerg army for a couple seconds; if by that you mean that it keeps the lings back for a couple seconds as they kill the tanks before going after the bio again, then mines do the same thing because Zergs generally send seers with their army the kill the mines while they pass through. If you mean that the damage and splash of tanks means that Zergs have to be ready to fully commit to the attack before launching it, then again, mines do the same thing because of their tremendous splash damage and damage output. Couple of that with the mass of tanks you need to be able to trade cost effectively on creep, the longer siege time, the longer build time, super fast mutas who can be wreaking havoc in your base and still be back for the fight if you take too long to engage (ie slowly leapfrogging tanks), then mines are clearly a superior choice to add to the army composition than tanks in virtually any given situation. Tanks don't do overkill, so if you shiftclic 4/5 banelings, they will probably all be dead. | ||
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[PkF] Wire
France24192 Posts
On July 24 2014 09:57 JessicaSc2 wrote: who needs variety anyway... Please Jessica, I know it must be painful to be told "your map as it stood was not suited for competitive play", like it must be painful for the mother of a mentally crippled child to be told the truth by a physician, but balance and gameplay issues on horizontal spawns were blatant. Variety is welcome but must not come at the price of a fair competitive environment. | ||
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JessicaSc2
Poland123 Posts
On July 24 2014 10:44 [PkF] Wire wrote: Please Jessica, I know it must be painful to be told "your map as it stood was not suited for competitive play", like it must be painful for the mother of a mentally crippled child to be told the truth by a physician, but balance and gameplay issues on horizontal spawns were blatant. Variety is welcome but must not come at the price of a fair competitive environment. So blatant that no one noticed them until the map got on ladder? Please. The only map that has been reasonably decent for terran now has been thoroughly nerfed because some zergs cannot adapt. Sigh. | ||
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