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Russian Federation4295 Posts
Anyone remember Command & Conquer 3 and Red Alert 3? If yes, you may know that there was very compact and good interface, including smaller health bars. With this photoshop-concept I want to discuss with your some problems of SC2 interface, that many of you don't care about, but these problems are still in the game. Here you can see C&C3-based UI-concept (Drone with shields is just concept-example, screenshot was taken from HOTS press screenshots)
1. Very big health bars and unclear smooth indication of lost "health-blocks".
Gladly Blizzard introduced damaged-only HP-bars mode, but that did not solve the problem. Look at all RTS and MOBA games - StarCraft 1, Red Alert 1-2-3, C&C3, C&C4, Generals, Supreme Commander, Dawn of War 1 & 2, Dota, LOL, etc - every game with similar camera height has thinny health bars, that don't take half of battle-field space, cluttering everything into messy picture of health-bars parade instead of unit models.
Why Blizzard not used SC1 health-bars? They were under unit and were small and thinny.
![[image loading]](http://www.my-bestgames.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/starcraft-brood-war-screenshotsstarcraft--brood-war-screenshots-v0j6eyd6.jpg)
2. Widescreen advantage against square-screen players
C&C sidebar from the beginning was the solution to widescreen vs squarescreen players, because everyone had more similar amount of view, and difference was smaller.
3. No more unused space
In SC2 and in many other RTS games with standard bottom UI there are always unused places. For streamers it may be good, but for players, I think, that unused black space can be used for battlefield, or turned into transparent background for UI elements, like selected units.
4. Right-click to remove from selection. This feature is impossible to show on screenshot. If you played C&C3 and RA3, you were able to right-click on selected unit icon and remove it from selection. That was quicker and more comfortable, than Shift-click in StarCraft 1-2. If there can be an UI mod, this feature should be in it.
5. Resources closer to unit descriptions/costs. To minimize unneeded eye "jumping" through screen, C&C3/RA3 resource placement (under minimap) was very good. But if you prefer resources in the corner, then 2nd variant under screenshot is for you. In other word, put the most important thing of the game (resources) closer the the second most important thing in the game (minimap).
6. Colorful resource indication. Instead white minerals / vespene / supply counts, why not make it fit resource color? In unit descriptions, as I remember, costs were colored with blue/green color, which represented minerals and vespene.
Probably removable if resource icons can be a good idea too.
7. Toggle'able between left and right. Everyone remember WarCraft 2 interface? It was on left side, so anyoe who prefers interface on the left side, can like this feature too.
8. Unnecessary buttons removed, and you may remove more. No other RTS have unit group buttons, even StarCraft 1. All players usually keeping in mind their unit groups, and some pro-players turned off these buttons in SC2.
Also social / menu / minimap terrain / players window / transfer resources were removed too. Why not remember hotkey for each? Also some buttons you never use, such as Menu button or minimap terrain.
Keep in mind that the goal is to remake C&C3 interface and create alternative compact UI. There is no purpose to create something better or follow your preferences regarding SC interface, just different and alternative interface with some features.
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interesting ideas, i guess. i don't see any particular major advantages or disadvantages though. it's just an interesting different concept. nothing really bad or wrong about it, but if two ideas are equal you generally stick with the one people are accustomed to and comfortable with.
random thoughts:
-right click deselect would definitely cause overlap/problems with right click move (which is essential)
-i don't agree that there is less "unused space" because basically all you did was move the UI to the right instead of the bottom
-your unit selection card looks like it has a much smaller capacity than the current one and would require clicking through more tabs for mass unit selections in late game
-no one has a square screen anymore so who cares about that?
-if you can already turn off buttons, they aren't a design problem at all
i commend you for forward thinking and offering something different, but i would not personally be interested in switching to this
(i like the health bars though)
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I agree that SC2 interface isn't the best. In the best world we'd have a Supreme Commander kind of UI were you could resize, move, delete, duplicate and choose transparency of all individual elements, and even do it in-game if necessary.
Also even If blizzard do not consider customable UI or even sidebar UI for "competitiveness and fairness" at least having an option for a TOP SCREEN UI should be implemented. In order to keep the minimap in my sphere of interest, I have to keep it near the center of my field of view (thus forgetting resources...) and on some screens like laptops it's nearly impossible or can bring neck pain. And I can't think this feature should take more than a day-man of work.
My biggest chagne I'd ask is this one : 5. Resources closer to unit descriptions/costs. To minimize unneeded eye "jumping" through screen, C&C3/RA3 resource placement (under minimap) was very good. But if you prefer resources in the corner, then 2nd variant under screenshot is for you.
AKA: Put the most important thing of the game (resources) closer the the second most important thing in the game (minimap).
Seriously SCII interface comes from an era (SC1 and BW) where things had to be huge to be distinguishable because of low screen resolution at the time and had to take lot of screen space to reduce the amount of game to render because CPU+GPU were very limited in power. Nowadays those limitations do not exist anymore. Please Blizzard improve your UI like you did with some other usability features.
Thank Existor for bringing up this important, yet it seems taboo subject on the table.
EDIT : On April 05 2014 15:26 Waise wrote:
-no one has a square screen anymore so who cares about that?
That's just plain wrong, yes majority of people have 16x9, but even I have a 16x10 and I'm not alone : http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey
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Well, I'm pretty sure every pro finds portraits and the command box totally useless (I know I do...) but it's sort of weird having patches of vision on a screen. In addition, Blizzard would never remove those things, as it would go against their casual appeal technique. It'd also be silly to remove the control groups though, as I'm pretty sure many <Master league players like them. Hell, I even keep them visible (not clickable).
But I wouldn't mind being able to change a setting that shrinks each unit's green selection frame, so that you can fit (see) more of them without having to go through pages...
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Honestly, I like it a lot. On HD screen (16x9) it does make a lot more sense to put all UI stuff on the side rather than bottom/top. Also, combining the resource counts with the minimap is something I wondered why wasn't done since the beginning in SC2. At the time when BW's UI was designed this way, these types of games were not competitive (not at a similar level at least). But when people spend 12+ hours playing such game professionally, you can save them the straining of the eye muscles that they get from constantly viewing top-right--bottom-left. It just doesn't make sense and keeping it just because that's how it was done before is a silly reason. I like the HP bars too.
The thing I didn't like, but it's super easy to fix, is the chat font size - looks way too big in this screenshot at least. I liked that it's also to the side though. Well done!
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I hope blizzard say that modding UI is fine and further encourage it. Current UI and whole menus are bad. Although menus have huge problem with engine, not just UI.
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Russian Federation4295 Posts
right click deselect would definitely cause overlap/problems with right click move (which is essential)
Right-click on the interface can can differently. So I don't understand what the problems can be there
your unit selection card looks like it has a much smaller capacity than the current one and would require clicking through more tabs for mass unit selections in late game
It is fully same as in SC2 bottombar. Instead 3x8 here you can see 8x3. Just vertical arrangement.
you can save them the straining of the eye muscles that they get from constantly viewing top-right--bottom-left
This. Almost this.
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I don't think I would move to this, but I see you did a pretty good job with this. If blizzard allowed customizing your UI, and even let you mod it, I would take some of your ideas.
I find it harder to look at the right instad of the bottom, but I suppose you need to get used to it. I don't like the minimap at the top right, I think in the bottom left is kinda perfect. Also it would be good if the resources were at the bottom, since it's closer to the create unit buttons.
Those HP bars are really neat. I like them a lot.
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Russian Federation4295 Posts
Seems that here most of players never played Command & Conquer games 
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It's funny, when I used to play Age of Empires or C&C I always prefered having the UI on the side.
But now after so many hours of Starcraft, the idea of a sidebar feels so strange.
The concept of it is pretty interesting though, I'd like to see more alternatives to the current UI (even though I understand Blizzard's reluctance to allow custom interfaces for players).
The healthbars seem quite nice, I actually think they might improve the viewing experience of the game if made available for observers.
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On April 05 2014 17:32 Existor wrote:Seems that here most of players never played Command & Conquer games
I played until "hour zero". c&c 4 was pretty bad and I dont like tiberium wars (c&c 5?). the UI of tiberium wars was the best of this game.
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On April 05 2014 18:00 MilLorD wrote:
The healthbars seem quite nice, I actually think they might improve the viewing experience of the game if made available for observers.
That actually a good point, observer UI are so much better than in-game UI and I feel lo could be taken from eg. gameheart.
Lists like Total Units/Building, Production Queue, alert when upgrades near finish or cancelled and even zoom out camera. All those nifty toys that could be very good to have in-game.
And from all the challenge that playing SCII gives, I find fiddling vs lack of good UI most frustrating. Better UI doesn't make the game easier, just easier to handle, and make skill matter more in fights vs opponents that fight vs UI. And those that could argue that it "increase skill ceiling" and thus make the game better, well they still have BW with no multiple selection of buildings, 12 unit selection limit and no saturation numbers. 
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the present sc2 interface is bad , they should have options like
mini map on left or right
increasing the size of the minimap
increasing the size of the resource panel
changing the location of the resource panel
health bars of protoss should be symmetric. The present protoss health bar is asymmetrical the life bar takes more space than the shield bar. I cannot tell when there is 1 shield left because the lifebar overlaps the shield bar.
Your Idea of health bars are perfect. It just needs an option to select whether one wants such health bars above the unit or below the unit.
I wonder why a company as big as blizzard didn't put some of the basic features in game ?
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Dustin Browder doesn't even think about it when he formerly worked for C and C before.LOLOL.
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pretty cool putting the minimap next to the resources!
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Allow players to make and use universal ui skins from scratch I say!
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Russian Federation4295 Posts
On April 05 2014 20:59 vaL4r wrote:
Allow players to make and use universal ui skins from scratch I say!
And movable Ui parts can be a good idea too, but that can come only with sc3 probbaly
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Honestly if I had the UI on the side like that, I would go insane. I really did not like C&C interface all that much.
Unfortunately, as soon as you start allowing customizable UIs to this extent, eventually there will be a "best" one, or one that gives a clear advantage for whatever reason. This is why competitive games should enforce a standard UI, imo as it keeps the playing field as even as possible in this facet of the game. It's bad enough I hear stuff like "Oh, he only won because he plays <race>" I don't want to start hearing "Oh, he only one because he uses this <UI element>" -_-
The whole widescreen vs squarescreen argument is frankly ridiculous in 2014.
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Changing the UI of this game is probably the last nail in the coffin.
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why is supply yellow ? I can understand blue / green for mineral / gas but this ..
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EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/UMG5mWB.jpg)
