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On July 23 2013 15:10 Sissors wrote:
While obviously this isn't handy, maybe the people here could explain when exactly they should hold those WCS rounds?
Last weekend, DH valencia, next one IEM Shangai, after that ASUS ROG. Add that the facilities also need to be free, I don't think those studios are exclusively kept all year long for SC2, and it really is alot easier to complain about it than to find an alternative. But the SC2 community has always been great at complaining.
If WCS EU had to be played that weekend it would be fine with time zones (not ideal) but putting three on the same weekend makes it hard for people to watch all of it and then NA will have to run vs Ti3 is just stupid. It just doesn't seem like blizzard is doing much right to try and help sc2 grow.
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There was point of time where I felt WoW was magnum opus of gaming. I feel ashamed for ever liking Blizzard. I am really sad by this. I was never a SC guy but since I started following TB it looks like a big shame what Blizzard is doing to it.
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On July 23 2013 11:39 scintilliaSD wrote:
Even for people who aren't necessarily Dota 2 fans, The International 3 is a huge event that will draw in huge crowds from all over eSports. I know Rioters and League people who are attending, Starcraft people who are attending, even fighting game people who are attending. Last year's International proved that Valve knows how to put on a show, and all the storylines from that International have been maintained. The skill difference between the regions is smaller than ever, and literally any of the sixteen teams invited have a chance of taking it.
From an eSports perspective, Valve has done something amazing for the community. By crowdsourcing the tournament via the International Compendium on Dota 2, they've raised over $4 million in revenue for the event alone, $1 million of which is going to increase the already substantial prize pool to $2.6 million, the biggest in eSports history. The $4 million from Compendium sales alone might be pushing the barrier for paying for the entire event itself. Wouldn't it be cool to see something as well-produced as the International and be told, "Yes, this was all done by you, the community. All of it was paid by your passion for our game." It is a complete 180 from the way Blizzard and Riot have handled things by trying to take more of the tournament development into the company's hands.
Valve's dedication to the eSports community has been top-notch. The in-game pennant system and in-game ticket system give viewers the ability to support the tournaments they choose while also providing tangible benefit for the viewer who purchases them. Their observing client is second-to-none when it comes to the features that the game gives the viewer. You can even link your Twitch account to your Steam account with the hopes of winning items, in the case you can't actually watch the game from in-client. It's clear that Valve knows what they're doing when it comes to how to make their customers happy.
Dota 2 tournaments are flooded with constant cup after cup after cup, and it's very common to see teams play two Bo3s a day, multiple days a week. It's almost becoming a problem when it comes to Dota 2 viewership. The International is the crowning achievement for all Dota 2 teams, and it makes itself stand out from everything else in a big way. Sorry, Blizzard, but this is an easy choice for me.
Thanks for the insight.
People should not be too surprised by another WCS debacle.
It was clear the day the WCS thing was announced that Blizzard slammed it together at the last minute with little planning.
This latest event is just another symptom of Blizzard's haste.
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Wow.
This isn't the 'occasional fuck-up' or 'gross incompetence' that Blizzard regularly displays.
Beyond doubt this was done deliberately and Blizzard simply thinks they can punch far above their weight.
It seems viewer experience is a acceptable sacrifice when it comes to competing with Valve.
Honestly I never liked mobas but if twitch won't die on that day I'd rather give dota a chance than fall into Blizzards machinations.
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On July 23 2013 10:48 figq wrote:
This might be the biggest Blizzard fail ever. Probably bigger than no LAN in SC2 or the Diablo 3 fails. It's just mind-blowingly bad on so many levels.
On the other hand... I guess... who cares. Season 2 WCS regional finals - not that important altogether, compared to TI3, even if you don't play or watch Dota 2 at all. Hell, even non-esports people will tune in for TI3, it's arguably the biggest esports event of the year. So, thanks Blizz, you make the choice what to watch very easy.
You know what's the worst about it though - it shows blizz folks don't watch The International. Which means they are deprived of a sense of esports that anyone today should have. It's just sad.
p.s. Twitch better prepare. Prepare their servers/bandwidth etc hard, because they are gonna be up for the rape of their lives.
Its not Blizzard's fucking job to watch the International, its their job to run the WCS on schedule which is why this is timed like this.
I seriously don't understand why this is such a big deal you can watch one or the other or have 2 streams open and watch both during the downtime and don't even play the "I watch every single game of every tournament" card that is the biggest lie that I've ever heard.
"Sense of E-Sports" what does that even mean? I am not patriotic because I watch online gaming tournaments, I watch them because I like watching pro players in the gaems that I play compete at them. And if you think that non-Esports people are going to actually watch and pay attention to TI3 you are kidding yourself, maybe it will get their attention with its large views but believe me that "sense of E-sports" is felt by very few people who actually watch competitive gaming.
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On July 23 2013 15:42 KnadRa wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2013 10:48 figq wrote:
This might be the biggest Blizzard fail ever. Probably bigger than no LAN in SC2 or the Diablo 3 fails. It's just mind-blowingly bad on so many levels.
On the other hand... I guess... who cares. Season 2 WCS regional finals - not that important altogether, compared to TI3, even if you don't play or watch Dota 2 at all. Hell, even non-esports people will tune in for TI3, it's arguably the biggest esports event of the year. So, thanks Blizz, you make the choice what to watch very easy.
You know what's the worst about it though - it shows blizz folks don't watch The International. Which means they are deprived of a sense of esports that anyone today should have. It's just sad.
p.s. Twitch better prepare. Prepare their servers/bandwidth etc hard, because they are gonna be up for the rape of their lives. Its not Blizzard's fucking job to watch the International, its their job to run the WCS on schedule which is why this is timed like this. I seriously don't understand why this is such a big deal you can watch one or the other or have 2 streams open and watch both during the downtime and don't even play the "I watch every single game of every tournament" card that is the biggest lie that I've ever heard. "Sense of E-Sports" what does that even mean? I am not patriotic because I watch online gaming tournaments, I watch them because I like watching pro players in the gaems that I play compete at them. And if you think that non-Esports people are going to actually watch and pay attention to TI3 you are kidding yourself, maybe it will get their attention with its large views but believe me that "sense of E-sports" is felt by very few people who actually watch competitive gaming.
Agreed, for people who claim that, the only fix seems to be if blizzard just stops broadcasting anything but ro16.
With only ro16 to broadcast there would be tons of room to make perfect schedules that would make everyone happy and would make esports so much better, right.
Totalbiscuit would not be so fatigued too from watching all dat starcraft, and could perhaps find some energy to run few more shoutcrafts.
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Its not Blizzard's fucking job to watch the International, its their job to run the WCS on schedule which is why this is timed like this.
I seriously don't understand why this is such a big deal you can watch one or the other or have 2 streams open and watch both during the downtime and don't even play the "I watch every single game of every tournament" card that is the biggest lie that I've ever heard.
"Sense of E-Sports" what does that even mean? I am not patriotic because I watch online gaming tournaments, I watch them because I like watching pro players in the gaems that I play compete at them. And if you think that non-Esports people are going to actually watch and pay attention to TI3 you are kidding yourself, maybe it will get their attention with its large views but believe me that "sense of E-sports" is felt by very few people who actually watch competitive gaming.
Well, WCS and TI2 will be both stramed and with recent lack of quality Twitch might go under. In that case, DotA 2 people will go inclient and what SC2 people would do?
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You think Blizz worry that much about it overlapping? Get real, they only worry about their WoW numbers dropping. This hasn't been the case for SC2 in the past, and neither it will be now or in the near future.
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dota dota dota
league of legends
riot pls
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I dream of Valve entering RTS market with flying colors.
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Mmm ti3 on youtube, the video quality has been amazing on youtube live events
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On July 23 2013 15:46 rename wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2013 15:42 KnadRa wrote:On July 23 2013 10:48 figq wrote:
This might be the biggest Blizzard fail ever. Probably bigger than no LAN in SC2 or the Diablo 3 fails. It's just mind-blowingly bad on so many levels.
On the other hand... I guess... who cares. Season 2 WCS regional finals - not that important altogether, compared to TI3, even if you don't play or watch Dota 2 at all. Hell, even non-esports people will tune in for TI3, it's arguably the biggest esports event of the year. So, thanks Blizz, you make the choice what to watch very easy.
You know what's the worst about it though - it shows blizz folks don't watch The International. Which means they are deprived of a sense of esports that anyone today should have. It's just sad.
p.s. Twitch better prepare. Prepare their servers/bandwidth etc hard, because they are gonna be up for the rape of their lives. Its not Blizzard's fucking job to watch the International, its their job to run the WCS on schedule which is why this is timed like this. I seriously don't understand why this is such a big deal you can watch one or the other or have 2 streams open and watch both during the downtime and don't even play the "I watch every single game of every tournament" card that is the biggest lie that I've ever heard. "Sense of E-Sports" what does that even mean? I am not patriotic because I watch online gaming tournaments, I watch them because I like watching pro players in the gaems that I play compete at them. And if you think that non-Esports people are going to actually watch and pay attention to TI3 you are kidding yourself, maybe it will get their attention with its large views but believe me that "sense of E-sports" is felt by very few people who actually watch competitive gaming. Agreed, for people who claim that, the only fix seems to be if blizzard just stops broadcasting anything but ro16. With only ro16 to broadcast there would be tons of room to make perfect schedules that would make everyone happy and would make esports so much better, right. Totalbiscuit would not be so fatigued too from watching all dat starcraft, and could perhaps find some energy to run few more shoutcrafts.
That one sentence in my post is what this whole issue is about in the first place and people arguing against Blizzard about it have the most baseless argument that I've ever seen. Also thanks for supporting my rant about Blizzard hate, I thought I would get shot down immediately on TL.
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On July 23 2013 15:55 NightOfTheDead wrote:
I dream of Valve entering RTS market with flying colors.
If they fix their selection boxes in DotA2, I'll be especially excited.
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Normally I think the community has a tendency to overreact.
But this is just a disaster.
This makes me want to march down to the Blizzard Corporate office at Irvine to demand a job. I don't know who is working in Blizzard's e-sports department but it takes talent to fuck something up this bad.
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On July 23 2013 15:46 Skagzill wrote:Show nested quote +Its not Blizzard's fucking job to watch the International, its their job to run the WCS on schedule which is why this is timed like this.
I seriously don't understand why this is such a big deal you can watch one or the other or have 2 streams open and watch both during the downtime and don't even play the "I watch every single game of every tournament" card that is the biggest lie that I've ever heard.
"Sense of E-Sports" what does that even mean? I am not patriotic because I watch online gaming tournaments, I watch them because I like watching pro players in the gaems that I play compete at them. And if you think that non-Esports people are going to actually watch and pay attention to TI3 you are kidding yourself, maybe it will get their attention with its large views but believe me that "sense of E-sports" is felt by very few people who actually watch competitive gaming. Well, WCS and TI2 will be both stramed and with recent lack of quality Twitch might go under. In that case, DotA 2 people will go inclient and what SC2 people would do?
Wait a few days because WCS Regional finals aren't that important in the long run and are meaningless in the SC2 scene compared to TI3 in the Dota 2 scene.
Also lets not forget that this hasn't even happened yet and Twitch going down is just baseless speculation at this point since Twitch is really inconsistent about how many people it can hold.
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It's more just Blizzard showing how amateur they are by forcing the schedule conflict like this. Considering TI3 is a once a year thing and that its date has been known WELL in advance, this just feels like a crazy SO forcing you to choose sides. Their handling of this sends all the wrong messages about how well played any faith in them would be.
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On July 23 2013 16:08 Taku wrote:
It's more just Blizzard showing how amateur they are by forcing the schedule conflict like this. Considering TI3 is a once a year thing and that its date has been known WELL in advance, this just feels like a crazy SO forcing you to choose sides. Their handling of this sends all the wrong messages about how well played any faith in them would be.
So who should they have screwed over instead? DH, IEM or ROG? Complaining it collides with something is easy, everyone can do it, as clearly demonstrated by this topic. Making a schedule where everyone is happy is alot harder.
Until today I never heard about this event (believing this topic I should pretty much end my own misery, considering I am 'deprived of a sense of e-sports everyone should have'. Well good to know.
I see it is a US based event. With some luck that means the overlap with WCS EU is minimal. What remains is WCS AM. So the RO16 onwards of the smallest region for one season collides with a major event. Is that handy? Of course not? Could that have been planned better? Pretty sure yes. But the majority of the posters here make you believe the mayas were right after all and the end of the world as we know it is coming, all because of two tournaments colliding.
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On July 23 2013 16:04 Vindicare605 wrote:
Normally I think the community has a tendency to overreact.
But this is just a disaster.
This makes me want to march down to the Blizzard Corporate office at Irvine to demand a job. I don't know who is working in Blizzard's e-sports department but it takes talent to fuck something up this bad.
Kim Phan apparently
I love how they say it's beyond their control and "unworkable complexity" lawl.
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On July 23 2013 16:20 Sissors wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2013 16:08 Taku wrote:
It's more just Blizzard showing how amateur they are by forcing the schedule conflict like this. Considering TI3 is a once a year thing and that its date has been known WELL in advance, this just feels like a crazy SO forcing you to choose sides. Their handling of this sends all the wrong messages about how well played any faith in them would be. So who should they have screwed over instead? DH, IEM or ROG? Complaining it collides with something is easy, everyone can do it, as clearly demonstrated by this topic. Making a schedule where everyone is happy is alot harder. Until today I never heard about this event (believing this topic I should pretty much end my own misery, considering I am 'deprived of a sense of e-sports everyone should have'. Well good to know. I see it is a US based event. With some luck that means the overlap with WCS EU is minimal. What remains is WCS AM. So the RO16 onwards of the smallest region for one season collides with a major event. Is that handy? Of course not? Could that have been planned better? Pretty sure yes. But the majority of the posters here make you believe the mayas were right after all and the end of the world as we know it is coming, all because of two tournaments colliding.
That's the thing though, it isn't just a US-based event. It's like the world cup of dota, this is a gathering of the best of the best from all around the world. Aside from the expected Chinese presence, EU is always big, NA teams are very competitive now, and even Korean teams are trying to find their way in right now. Viewership alone is huge all across the board not to mention a prize pool that SC2 can't touch. I'm not sure whether you comprehend the scale of this event, but if even Blizzard can't see it then they're toast within a few years should they stay this out of touch with reality. TI3 and dota2 in general have some of the smartest and brightest minds in valve and various community heads running the show such as the GD Studio and BTS, and Blizzard want to throw their now-substandard product up against that? Not to mention riot running around like a steamroller taking whatever they can get.
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On July 23 2013 16:20 Sissors wrote:Show nested quote +On July 23 2013 16:08 Taku wrote:
It's more just Blizzard showing how amateur they are by forcing the schedule conflict like this. Considering TI3 is a once a year thing and that its date has been known WELL in advance, this just feels like a crazy SO forcing you to choose sides. Their handling of this sends all the wrong messages about how well played any faith in them would be. So who should they have screwed over instead? DH, IEM or ROG? Complaining it collides with something is easy, everyone can do it, as clearly demonstrated by this topic. Making a schedule where everyone is happy is alot harder. Until today I never heard about this event (believing this topic I should pretty much end my own misery, considering I am 'deprived of a sense of e-sports everyone should have'. Well good to know. I see it is a US based event. With some luck that means the overlap with WCS EU is minimal. What remains is WCS AM. So the RO16 onwards of the smallest region for one season collides with a major event. Is that handy? Of course not? Could that have been planned better? Pretty sure yes. But the majority of the posters here make you believe the mayas were right after all and the end of the world as we know it is coming, all because of two tournaments colliding.
Well actually 16-18 august weekend seems to have absolutely nothing going on so i actually have no idea why they did not have EU/AM finals at that week.
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EPT
