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Active: 2115 users

Do NOT blinding cloud Hellbats! - Page 3

Forum Index > SC2 General
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babysimba
Profile Joined November 2010
10466 Posts
April 02 2013 06:32 GMT
#41
Maybe someone would like to do some extra tests with a mixed unit composition. Now we know hellbats can kill lings more efficient if they are at the frontline under blinding cloud, but what happens if they are stucked behind marines, marauders?

It is difficult to constantly place them in the front row, maybe that will further differentiate the best from the better players. Also it might add another tactical aspect where backstabbing with lings become much more efficient.
Deleted User 137586
Profile Joined January 2011
7859 Posts
April 02 2013 06:42 GMT
#42
Nice find, and as others have said. Makes me rather think about move-command micro to increase hellbat damage.
Cry 'havoc' and let slip the dogs of war
Jacmert
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
Canada1709 Posts
April 02 2013 06:42 GMT
#43
On April 02 2013 14:29 ChristianS wrote:
From the other side of things, then, might it be beneficial to move-command hellbats until lings have a surround?
Edit: Woah, ninja'd.

Yes, I had this exact thought, too.
Plat Support Main #believe
dynwar7
Profile Joined May 2011
1983 Posts
April 02 2013 06:56 GMT
#44
very interesting this is lol
Regarding the imbalance, hilarious to see Zergs defending themselves....
Grobyc
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Canada18410 Posts
April 02 2013 06:58 GMT
#45
On April 02 2013 14:59 darkscream wrote:
the title of this thread is way misleading

the only reason it works like this is because its amove, if you micro'd the hellbats not to fire until the lings were close and clumped, it would be the same thing

What's so misleading about it? It says not to blinding cloud hellbats and the explanation/video show why; seems pretty straightforward to me.

Yeah Terran can mitigate it (to a pretty large degree probably) but it's an increase in required unit control for him and you save energy on your vipers so it seems like a informative piece of information to share.
If you watch Godzilla backwards it's about a benevolent lizard who helps rebuild a city and then moonwalks into the ocean.
ALPINA
Profile Joined May 2010
3791 Posts
April 02 2013 06:59 GMT
#46
On April 02 2013 15:42 Ghanburighan wrote:
Nice find, and as others have said. Makes me rather think about move-command micro to increase hellbat damage.


Not really viable, because:

1. Speedlings =/= slowlings. Trying to "micro" will probably lead to even less damage done.
2. Speedling on creep will come so fast that you won't even be able to blink.

You should never underestimate the predictability of stupidity
darkscream
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Canada2310 Posts
April 02 2013 07:03 GMT
#47
On April 02 2013 15:58 Grobyc wrote:
What's so misleading about it?


it's a-move vs a-move. which doesn't/shouldn't ever happen.

The terran could force this without blinding cloud by not firing with the hellbats until the correct time.

The zerg could still use blindling cloud and actually split his units up instead of blobbing them.

The title of the post is DO NOT USE BLINDING CLOUD AGAINST HELLBATS. It's misleading because it should actually be "do not a-move lings into hellbats in a blinding cloud"..
Aerisky
Profile Blog Joined May 2012
United States12129 Posts
April 02 2013 07:07 GMT
#48
Does this mean you should put hellbats on hold position or somehow get them to delay their attack until lings are closer?
Jim while Johnny had had had had had had had; had had had had the better effect on the teacher.
opterown *
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
Australia54784 Posts
April 02 2013 07:11 GMT
#49
On April 02 2013 16:03 darkscream wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 02 2013 15:58 Grobyc wrote:
What's so misleading about it?


it's a-move vs a-move. which doesn't/shouldn't ever happen.

The terran could force this without blinding cloud by not firing with the hellbats until the correct time.

The zerg could still use blindling cloud and actually split his units up instead of blobbing them.

The title of the post is DO NOT USE BLINDING CLOUD AGAINST HELLBATS. It's misleading because it should actually be "do not a-move lings into hellbats in a blinding cloud"..

i think you'll find a-move vs. a-move happens quite a lot!
ModeratorRetired LR Bonjwa
TL+ Member
ChristianS
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States3304 Posts
April 02 2013 07:13 GMT
#50
On April 02 2013 16:07 Aerisky wrote:
Does this mean you should put hellbats on hold position or somehow get them to delay their attack until lings are closer?

Hold position wouldn't delay anything. Hold positioned units still attack as soon as something comes into range (except workers and such). Move command, though!
"Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity." -Robert J. Hanlon
thezanursic
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
5499 Posts
April 02 2013 07:21 GMT
#51
On April 02 2013 14:01 Xylocaine wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 02 2013 13:53 Arceus wrote:
[image loading]

the farther the wave is, the less it's hit by attack radius
im not sure about damage calculation but the same might apply


Haha looks like we did the same mad Paint paintings at the same time.
[image loading]

Makes perfect sense!
http://i45.tinypic.com/9j2cdc.jpg Let it be so!
Ketch
Profile Joined October 2010
Netherlands7285 Posts
April 02 2013 07:29 GMT
#52
Why is this test with vipers and slow lings? If I have vipers out, I'd probably have ling speed as well. What is the result of the test with speedlings?
nucleo
Profile Joined February 2011
292 Posts
April 02 2013 07:31 GMT
#53
Nice find! makes since tho as this is what will also happen irl if we had to go to war against the zerg (:
Xxazn4lyfe51xX
Profile Joined October 2010
United States976 Posts
April 02 2013 07:36 GMT
#54
It makes perfect sense. Think BW lurkers and why stop spamming lurkers was so useful. If you wait so that the splash will hit more units, of course more will die faster.
MHT
Profile Joined August 2010
Sweden1026 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-04-02 07:46:22
April 02 2013 07:37 GMT
#55
Sweet I can micro hellbats now! Should also be the same thing with hellions right?
Grobyc
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Canada18410 Posts
April 02 2013 07:46 GMT
#56
On April 02 2013 16:03 darkscream wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 02 2013 15:58 Grobyc wrote:
What's so misleading about it?


it's a-move vs a-move. which doesn't/shouldn't ever happen.

The terran could force this without blinding cloud by not firing with the hellbats until the correct time.

The zerg could still use blindling cloud and actually split his units up instead of blobbing them.

The title of the post is DO NOT USE BLINDING CLOUD AGAINST HELLBATS. It's misleading because it should actually be "do not a-move lings into hellbats in a blinding cloud"..

Title says don't blinding cloud vs hellbats which is indeed more effective in the majority of situations, likely vs other zerg units as well as the splash damage hits them more as well. Yeah it leaves some information out, details go in the OP. It's honestly not as misleading as you make it seem. I could easily point out half a dozen current threads that have less detailed titles. Meh.
If you watch Godzilla backwards it's about a benevolent lizard who helps rebuild a city and then moonwalks into the ocean.
meijin
Profile Joined October 2010
United States141 Posts
April 02 2013 07:58 GMT
#57
when are you actually going to blinding cloud 2 hellbats vs 14 lings? i'd like to see this with 10+ of them vs 50+ lings or something. the power of blinding cloud is that units in the middle of the death ball do nothing.
wwJd)El_Mojjo
Profile Blog Joined September 2009
Sweden173 Posts
April 02 2013 08:07 GMT
#58
I tested a lot of different late game scenarios with this idea and it doesn't seem to matter when you have normal circumstances (lings with speed etc). I didn't get the move command into attack command with hellbats to work either.

Still a nice find, but at least in my experience it won't affect normal game play.
Gc.El_Mojjo
Markwerf
Profile Joined March 2010
Netherlands3728 Posts
April 02 2013 08:08 GMT
#59
This is just a specific case where waiting to fire the first shot with the hellbats is better which blinding cloud causes to happen.
I doubt this is really the case with much bigger numbers or if the zerg micro's a bit more.

It would be interesting to see if this also happens with roaches. Even more so if it might be beneficial to move command your hellbats slightly into the enemy before attacking to get better surface area.
ZenithM
Profile Joined February 2011
France15952 Posts
April 02 2013 08:08 GMT
#60
And as a nice Terran gentleman, I can give this piece of pro-advice to my good Zerg fellows:
DO NOT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES CAST BLINDING CLOUD ON MARINES OR MARAUDERS!
It actually makes them stronger, because it's like they're eating vegetables, and it's actually good for their body. Kind of the same deal with Fungal Growth, by the way.

Don't thank me guys.
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