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On March 10 2013 22:21 Nausea wrote:Show nested quote +On March 10 2013 22:15 paralleluniverse wrote:On February 28 2013 00:52 Denda Reloaded wrote:![[image loading]](http://fc01.deviantart.net/fs71/f/2013/058/8/6/bildschirmfoto_2013_02_27_um_16_51_16_by_dendareloaded-d5we0l9.png) @Existor maybe something to support your theory + Show Spoiler +Oh Arcturus, this isn't #vengeance, this is justice #lol Oh god. Now that we know the leaked ending is real, we have absolute proof that Blizzard writers are amateurs. As you've pointed out, the ending cinematic contains some of the the cheesiest dialogue ever written. It's just awful. High school students could do better. Would not surprise me if Christ Metzen is laughing with his friends about the fact that he still is getting paid.
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United Kingdom20274 Posts
On February 20 2013 03:52 Plexa wrote:+ Show Spoiler +Campaign ending on Korhal makes the 'leaked' ending more plausible .... oh god 
Welp
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What is happening with Protoss in the meantime?
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Kerrigan was completely consious in brood war; she wasn't wholly herself though (morality was stripped away making it easy to embrace her darker nature. Also, not only were mengsk's fleet and the protoss and ued badly damaged, but most of kerrigan's forces weren't even on char. they were out plundering. And in any case, she still showed more virtues than she ever did in brood war.
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I feel really ashamed that my first post has to be like this. I am acting out of grief, don't judge me.
Go fuck yourself Metzen.
User was banned for this post.
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United States1654 Posts
I went ahead and spoiled myself with the cutscenes since I wasn't planning on buying Heart of the Swarm after the butchering of Starcraft's story in Wings of Liberty, and I am glad I made that decision. The dialogue is cringe-worthy, and I have no doubt in my mind now that Blizzard no longer has any competent writers. The stories of Wings of Liberty, Diablo 3, and now Heart of the Swarm have been ruined by writing directed toward prepubescent teens.
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+ Show Spoiler +Wow that was uninteresting. Waited 2 years essentially to say that Kerrigan regained control and killed Mengsk. Almost nothing on the overarching storyline w/ hybrids and XelNaga was advanced.
Legacy of the Void has potential with all the story it has to fill, have no confidence that it will be done well though.
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Geeze, what a bunch of whiners here. I'm playing the campaign itself now, without having spoiled myself with the story and it's really great so far. I find Kerrigan particulary amusing at times. Sure, if you just go off by the cutscenes then perhaps but there's a lot of ingame stuff goin as well which puts more context to the cutscenes. It's way better then WoL (so far)
Also...raptorlings...are...AMAAAAZING
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Maybe I am the only one, but I thought the ending was pretty good. They changed the ending a little bit from what it was, but it was essentially the same. Yes, the story is a bit cheesy and corny, but that's Blizzard, any recent projects from them have been like that. I don't mind the cheesiness of it, to be honest.
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Aotearoa39261 Posts
Having just finished the campaign (on brutal)... + Show Spoiler +HotS is so much easier compared to WoL. Last level is a joke. Story is hit and miss. I thought Blizz may have done something really cool after the first few missions.. then things got dumb. They should have killed Jim or at least Nova. Lots of cute tie ins to what you did in WoL Narud = Duran completely and utterly confirmed lol but he dies. Stukov coming back wasn't as terrible as I thought it would be. Zeratul felt extremely out of place. The story itself is pretty shitty, its basically going to be the WC3 story again - all the races banding against a demigod to kill him. Yawn. Give me a real twist please Blizzard.
I'd give it a 5/10. And for the record, I would have given WoL a 7 - at least I could see some potential in future story lines and the missions were interesting on the first play through. Almost every HotS mission was a recycled WoL mission - barring the fact that there are boss fights now lol....
On March 12 2013 07:49 Salv wrote: Maybe I am the only one, but I thought the ending was pretty good. They changed the ending a little bit from what it was, but it was essentially the same. Yes, the story is a bit cheesy and corny, but that's Blizzard, any recent projects from them have been like that. I don't mind the cheesiness of it, to be honest. + Show Spoiler +I felt that the ending was really weak. There was next to no hype around killing Mengsk, the whole game was GARHH IM ANGRY AT MENSK LETS KILL HIM RWARRR. The missions leading up to it were pathetically weak storywise. The summary is: herp derp we're going to crush through Korhal with the entire might of the Zerg. Yup you can't stop us. As I watched the ending cutscene I was just overwhelmed with a feeling of 'meh'. Unlike WoL, which at least had a semi-epic climax.
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On March 12 2013 08:14 Plexa wrote:+ Show Spoiler +I felt that the ending was really weak. There was next to no hype around killing Mengsk, the whole game was GARHH IM ANGRY AT MENSK LETS KILL HIM RWARRR. The missions leading up to it were pathetically weak storywise. The summary is: herp derp we're going to crush through Korhal with the entire might of the Zerg. Yup you can't stop us. As I watched the ending cutscene I was just overwhelmed with a feeling of 'meh'. Unlike WoL, which at least had a semi-epic climax.
+ Show Spoiler +I disagree. I felt that this expansion was meant to set the stage for Legacy of the Void - most media in between a beginning and an end have this same style to them, you want to further the story but you need to leave enough things unfinished and left hanging for the final game to wrap up.
I felt like they did a good job advancing the story between Jim and Sarah, they had a bit of fan service in the beginning by having them begin to hook up, Sarah kissing him etc, only to separate them and have them reunite. It was a bit predictable, but I didn't mind it so much. I liked the contrast between Sarah being somewhat ruthless as the Queen of Blades, but still maintaining some of her human compassion - I thought that was well done.
Mengsk was a bit underwhelming, the last few missions are quite easy, I agree with you that Wings of Liberty was more difficult, but I like that they changed the ending. I think a poor ending would have been if they just had Jim come back, confess he was wrong to say he was done with Sarah, and then they kiss as the credits roll. I give them some credit for taking a less predictable route and have Kerrigan prepare the swarm for the battle with the Xel'Naga fella at the cost of what she personally wants (Jim).
Maybe your expectations were a lot higher than mine, but I actually enjoyed the story. I thought the feral zerg bit was neat, I thought Stukov was well done - in fact the only bit I thought was poorly done was the Duran/Narud bit - he's supposed to be a very powerful mysterious entity and they pretty much just kill him off with further explanation to him - that's a wasted character in my opinion. I'd give the story an 8/10 - I would have given WOL a 7/10.
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+ Show Spoiler +I felt like they did a good job advancing the story between Jim and Sarah, they had a bit of fan service in the beginning by having them begin to hook up, Sarah kissing him etc, only to separate them and have them reunite.
That's exactly why I want to grind my face in granite. Jezus thats the kind of relational/emotional complexity I was involved in when I was in the 4th grade.
I have read every single Harry Potter book. I enjoyed them when I was young and stuck with them. But even I recognized how immature and underdeveloped they were as I grew up. My enjoyment didn't blind me from seeing that. Does that mean they were bad books? No, but I knew I was dealing with unsophisticated material.
In contrast BW gave us some relief from binaries and nuance in the motivations of characters. This on the other hand....especially with cutscenes using setups to trigger cheap emotional responses a la Hollywood and terrible lines to boot?
Common, Jim already did everything he could to get Kerrigan back and didn't give up his humanity to do so but she ended up ripping apart his world (BW). He vowed not to trust her. Okay fine, he has amnesia in SC2. Blizz sets it up that Kerrigan can return the favor, what does she do? + Show Spoiler +She unlike Jim turns her back on her humanity and turns to the zerg to save Jim (although in this case she is depicted as transcending and becoming the "good" queen). Jim is very visibly upset and he shoots some rounds into the wall. But what does he do again? He comes and saves her at the end. That's what I'm to buy in? I'm supposed to cheer that? That's your 8/10?
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+ Show Spoiler +That was pathetically poor writing. The optimistic side of me was hoping that due to the leaked ending, they would go a different, non-terrible direction. I won't be buying this, and I'm glad I waited to see the ending instead of pre-ordering
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+ Show Spoiler +On March 12 2013 09:06 wangstra wrote:+ Show Spoiler +I felt like they did a good job advancing the story between Jim and Sarah, they had a bit of fan service in the beginning by having them begin to hook up, Sarah kissing him etc, only to separate them and have them reunite. That's exactly why I want to grind my face in granite. Jezus thats the kind of relational/emotional complexity I was involved in when I was in the 4th grade. I have read every single Harry Potter book. I enjoyed them when I was young and stuck with them. But even I recognized how immature and underdeveloped they were as I grew up. My enjoyment didn't blind me from seeing that. Does that mean they were bad books? No, but I knew I was dealing with unsophisticated material. In contrast BW gave us some relief from binaries and nuance in the motivations of characters. This on the other hand....especially with cutscenes using setups to trigger cheap emotional responses a la Hollywood and terrible lines to boot? Common, Jim already did everything he could to get Kerrigan back and didn't give up his humanity to do so but she ended up ripping apart his world (BW). He vowed not to trust her. Okay fine, he has amnesia in SC2. Blizz sets it up that Kerrigan can return the favor, what does she do? + Show Spoiler +She again turns to "evil" to save Jim. Jim is very visibly upsets and he shoots some rounds into the wall. But what does he do again? He comes and saves her at the end. That's what I'm to buy in? I'm supposed to cheer that? That's your 8/10? + Show Spoiler +She didn't become evil. She just reinfested herself, she's the "good" queen of blades now, because her mind is cleared of blind hate after she was saved by Jim, and further cemented her alliance to the Jim and Zeratul after she killed mengsk.
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On March 12 2013 09:26 aeroblaster wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On March 12 2013 09:06 wangstra wrote:+ Show Spoiler +I felt like they did a good job advancing the story between Jim and Sarah, they had a bit of fan service in the beginning by having them begin to hook up, Sarah kissing him etc, only to separate them and have them reunite. That's exactly why I want to grind my face in granite. Jezus thats the kind of relational/emotional complexity I was involved in when I was in the 4th grade. I have read every single Harry Potter book. I enjoyed them when I was young and stuck with them. But even I recognized how immature and underdeveloped they were as I grew up. My enjoyment didn't blind me from seeing that. Does that mean they were bad books? No, but I knew I was dealing with unsophisticated material. In contrast BW gave us some relief from binaries and nuance in the motivations of characters. This on the other hand....especially with cutscenes using setups to trigger cheap emotional responses a la Hollywood and terrible lines to boot? Common, Jim already did everything he could to get Kerrigan back and didn't give up his humanity to do so but she ended up ripping apart his world (BW). He vowed not to trust her. Okay fine, he has amnesia in SC2. Blizz sets it up that Kerrigan can return the favor, what does she do? + Show Spoiler +She again turns to "evil" to save Jim. Jim is very visibly upsets and he shoots some rounds into the wall. But what does he do again? He comes and saves her at the end. That's what I'm to buy in? I'm supposed to cheer that? That's your 8/10? + Show Spoiler +She didn't become evil. She just reinfested herself, she's the "good" queen of blades now, because her mind is cleared of blind hate after she was saved by Jim, and further cemented her alliance to the Jim and Zeratul after she killed mengsk.
Sorry I just edited that after thinking about it and updated it. Zerg aren't really "evil" per se. I was alluding to the contrast between what happened with BW zerg.
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On March 12 2013 09:06 wangstra wrote:+ Show Spoiler +I felt like they did a good job advancing the story between Jim and Sarah, they had a bit of fan service in the beginning by having them begin to hook up, Sarah kissing him etc, only to separate them and have them reunite. That's exactly why I want to grind my face in granite. Jezus thats the kind of relational/emotional complexity I was involved in when I was in the 4th grade. I have read every single Harry Potter book. I enjoyed them when I was young and stuck with them. But even I recognized how immature and underdeveloped they were as I grew up. My enjoyment didn't blind me from seeing that. Does that mean they were bad books? No, but I knew I was dealing with unsophisticated material. In contrast BW gave us some relief from binaries and nuance in the motivations of characters. This on the other hand....especially with cutscenes using setups to trigger cheap emotional responses a la Hollywood and terrible lines to boot? Common, Jim already did everything he could to get Kerrigan back and didn't give up his humanity to do so but she ended up ripping apart his world (BW). He vowed not to trust her. Okay fine, he has amnesia in SC2. Blizz sets it up that Kerrigan can return the favor, what does she do? + Show Spoiler +She unlike Jim turns her back on her humanity and turns to the zerg to save Jim (although in this case she is depicted as transcending and becoming the "good" queen). Jim is very visibly upset and he shoots some rounds into the wall. But what does he do again? He comes and saves her at the end. That's what I'm to buy in? I'm supposed to cheer that? That's your 8/10?
+ Show Spoiler +Then what do you want Raynor to do? Shoot Kerrigan in the face? Let Mengsk kill her? Then watch the whole universe burnt by the hybrid?
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The most disappointing thing for me is the lack of protoss influence in the storyline in both WoL and HoTS. Sure, you do fight protoss but do they have any significant role in the main storyline? NO. The only exception is Zeratul, but he doesn't appear much either. WoL is "TvZ" and HoTS is "ZvT", I'm pretty fed up already.
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On March 12 2013 09:06 wangstra wrote:+ Show Spoiler +I felt like they did a good job advancing the story between Jim and Sarah, they had a bit of fan service in the beginning by having them begin to hook up, Sarah kissing him etc, only to separate them and have them reunite. That's exactly why I want to grind my face in granite. Jezus thats the kind of relational/emotional complexity I was involved in when I was in the 4th grade. I have read every single Harry Potter book. I enjoyed them when I was young and stuck with them. But even I recognized how immature and underdeveloped they were as I grew up. My enjoyment didn't blind me from seeing that. Does that mean they were bad books? No, but I knew I was dealing with unsophisticated material. In contrast BW gave us some relief from binaries and nuance in the motivations of characters. This on the other hand....especially with cutscenes using setups to trigger cheap emotional responses a la Hollywood and terrible lines to boot? Common, Jim already did everything he could to get Kerrigan back and didn't give up his humanity to do so but she ended up ripping apart his world (BW). He vowed not to trust her. Okay fine, he has amnesia in SC2. Blizz sets it up that Kerrigan can return the favor, what does she do? + Show Spoiler +She unlike Jim turns her back on her humanity and turns to the zerg to save Jim (although in this case she is depicted as transcending and becoming the "good" queen). Jim is very visibly upset and he shoots some rounds into the wall. But what does he do again? He comes and saves her at the end. That's what I'm to buy in? I'm supposed to cheer that? That's your 8/10?
+ Show Spoiler +I don't know what kind of story people wanted. Is this a better story: Jim rescues Kerrigan and turns her back into a human, but he doesn't want anything to do with her. Both Kerrigan and Jim spend zero time together on the Hyperion and Kerrigan goes to seek more power so she can kill Mengsk. Kerrigan becomes reinfested and Jim doesn't care. Kerrigan kills Mengsk, Jim is happy Mengsk is dead, but doesn't really care. Kerrigan prepares the swarm for the Xel'Naga God.
Of course there was going to be a love story between the two of them, I would have been upset if there wasn't. What kind of love story would have been better? I think love stories are almost always going to be cheesy and corny, it's more or less inherent to that type of story.
Brood War was a different scenario because it dealt with material that I feel was rather easy to craft. I think creating a love/redemption story in Starcraft II is far more difficult than creating a betrayal/revenge story - so I don't really compare the two in that way.
Yes, that was my 8/10, I enjoyed it.
I ask anyone who is upset with the story/ending - what do YOU think would have been better? Give an example.
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Let's be fair here. Starcraft, Brood War, Starcraft 2 and Heart of the Swarm were never particularly well written in the first place. However I'm pleased enough with what I've seen. I can't imagine what planet you must be on if you thought Kerrigan's comedy "I saw this coming a mile away" face-heel-turn in BW was particularly good writing.
One thing I will say about Heart of the Swarm - they've changed the story at least twice. There are clear discontinuities in the writing, + Show Spoiler +particularly around that protoss, the "prophecy" and the Primal Zerg . However, what is there is engaging enough that I've played it for most of today due to being sick.
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