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I got onto vVv back in September of 2011, was just a mid master zerg player, but won a tournament that got me into the academy. Back then, the team was consisting of the older squad with Titan, MurdeR, and Glon. I was excited, really excited. They were copying coL academy by letting us know that one of us would be lucky enough to get payed trip to the next MLG (Whoever won the academy tournament - Academy consisted of 6 players).
Anyways, a couple of the academy members missed a mumble meeting or two, got kicked off. Some of us didn't change our twitter ID's to have vVv in it, another reason you got bitched at / kicked off, or you just didn't post in the forums enough. Silly things got you kicked out of vVv, so it took a lot of effort for anyone on the squad. By this time, it was just me, an old friend Starkad, and a zerg who's ID is slipping my mind (crbox maybe?).
Anyways, we were excited to see who would win the MLG trip and what not, so we prepared for the event.
We then got this delightful message:
Hey guys,
I have some bad news: MLG Providence competitor passes have sold out. Unfortunately this means we can't send anyone to MLG Providence from the academy this season.
Instead, we are going to hold the tournament as usual. The top player to finish this season will be sent to the next MLG event in 2012. We will also keep this player on the academy next season (so that they can train and prepare with other academy members the entire time between now and then).
Let me know if you have any questions.
Ok, not so bad right? Well, next season I planned on going to MLG Columbus, but ended up paying for it all out of my pocket as vVv declined sending me or anyone from the academy out there (Which they promised right above me).
But nope, I still had faith in vVv. Grandmaster was my goal from the academy so I worked my ass off to get it (about 1.5 ladder games per season) until I finally got GM with zerg with help from mostly Titan. I was excited, I improved with the help of titan, had a couple good practice partners and what not, and they finally moved me up to the sponsored team.
I was really excited, as sponsored players got gear and got to go to MLG's on vVv's dime and what not, seemed like it would be fun, and I really wanted to go to the next MLG (And as a broke college student, I can only afford to pay for so many extra expenses...)
Anyways, all the sponsored players were supposed to get gear, so I asked Sugarbear for a headset. Here's the response!
Hey ToXSiK,
I heard back from Jerry, and we can send you a headset. We need the following from you:
- Unboxing video (if possible) for when you open the headset for the first time
- Written review once you've been using it for ~two weeks
- Promoting these things on your facebook, twitter, and stream.
Do you think that's all possible?
To which I replied
Yes, all of this will be possible.
Yep, still haven't received anything. In fact, the only thing vVv has ever given me is a t-shirt (Which they were handing out to ANYONE at MLG Columbus, the event that remember I had to pay in full for... The one where they were going to send an academy member to)
I didn't want to make such a big deal about all this, but this is why I eventually left vVv, and it seems people are curious here on why vVv finally shut down. Rocker left because jerry (LordJerith - owner of vVv) came into a team meeting one day and told us he was cutting all player funding from the sc2 squad except for Glon and RuFF because they had done decent at MLG (Like top 50 on the open bracket or something?). Well, I was disappointed, but I still stayed on vVv for about three months to see if things would eventually work out.
Slowly all of our good players left, Rocker left because the team was just going downhill, daisuki left because he got a personal sponsor, Titan and Murder quit, so just me and glon and ruff were really left. At this point I was approached by BlighT (LOL) which I declined and then went with oGaming where they've been super great to me.
Anyways, just thought you guys might be interested in my point of view on the situation, vVv really is not a team, it's just a bunch of gamers that pretend they are a team. They expect 100% from you and give you nothing in return, even if they promise it. I just can't believe it took them this long to die.
You live and you learn? I guess.
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What is vVv trying to do nowadays? Half a year ago they shut down their fighting division, and comments on fighting forums weren't too pretty neither.
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On January 30 2013 04:36 exfrozensteel wrote:Hey, I'm vVv Astraëa, firstly GW2 player for vVv then Community Gamer for vVv, then SC2 player for vVv, just member no sponsor thing, now MMO player. Still, when you joined vVv you accepted to respect the 5pillars ( http://www.vvv-gaming.com/forum/topic/39135-five-pillars-of-vvv-gaming/ ) that you are actually breaking. You probably don't give a dam, but as a vVv member I do. This is not helping you, this is not helping us. Yes they didn't proceed as you accorded, so what? Take it for what it is and live with it. Since the Starcraft 2 division was closed, we have in deed had a few things going on in our heads. But this is an intern problem, not a public problem. I do acknowledge that you are not directly the one who threw out the word and that vVv themselves endangered the pillars by going on reddit saying they were closing the division... it was a bit like searching for the stick that will beat them... But the mature thing to do would've been to get over it. If I had the same feelings and thoughts as you, I wouldn't be complaining the slightest about not being a member of vVv anymore. I would embrace my freedom, and start something else, something new, and most important, something bigger just to show them where they were wrong. But here's the thing, you can't... Why? I don't know and don't really care, thing is you just showed yourself trustful by going public instead of discussing with the concerned people (pillar N°4 for the recall). So obviously by joining vVv gaming and accepting to respect the five pillars, you lied. Please note this, no one ever told you they would pay you, and after all why would they? you don't bring them money so... that's that, plus I'd like to bring something back to your minds, you and the aspire team, when you applied to vVv it wasn't as a sponsorship application but as a member of the community. Does Millenium Serveur (french WoW pserver) pay me for being active on their forums and stuff? I don't think so... No one forced you into doing what you did, if you didn't want to it's your problem, if you thought you would have something in return, you blinded yourself for nothing, because unless you can prove that they did a statement saying: I will do [this] for you if you do [this], you are the only one to blame for your situation. Some of you may dislike Lordjerrith, Understandable, and note that it is his objective. He know that the only way to be listened to in this world is by being hated, or being made fun of. Just like that, how much of you have never watch a video of a guy raging on youtube? ok harder, How much of you have never watched a video of a guy hurting himself and talked about it to someone else? It is the same way that this works. He insults people to bring their attention to them by interposed people, and that is where this is strong, because when you are insulted, it is your self esteem that is heart, so you want to hear everything the other guy has to say to be able to counter attack so you just listen to the losers bracket in which you were talked about, and try to find something, only thing is you only find truth and that makes you hate him even more... You think that when he says to you that he has x years of experience in x domain and you don't it's annoying? Seriously man... just hang up then... This man here has brought ideas that nowadays seem to be common sense... And guess what, he also has ideas to develop esports that will be in place in the future... For the direction of vVv, if you think RobzGod and Doomhammer are misleading vVv, tell them directly, don't wait for it to implode, if you felt abandoned, you should have talked with them instead of building hate and losing faith in them over time. NuBrGNi left by his own. Okay, I do appreciate this guy, and do admit that what they asked from him was to much considering his life style, but still, he didn't say no. And they didn't say in that skype conversation that they would pay his travel. If the direction asked him for solid evidence that they should put money in him, well bro go check out the team liquid SC2 events calender and choose weekly tournaments to do, even if you shall stop streaming to do so, or if you have to stop helping team mates, no big deal, they should know what are the priorities. But now please don't come complain... I think this is going too far for what the vVv SC2 Division was, after all we didn't have a roster and as I just said, it was a Division, not a team. People are just happy because it allows them to poop on vVv once again, please note that even if the head of vVv is "full of shit" as would say NuBrGNi, the vVv community isn't, and we don't need this to tarnish I image, some of us have ambitions and we'd like to not be stuck at some point because thank to people that dislike the head of the association decided that the members were as bad... I'm sorry for the loss of the division, plus for myself it is the 3rd time I change status in vVv for diverse reasons, but it will not stop me from playing Starcraft, so why should it stop you? after all with or without them, it obviously makes no change since they didn't bring you anything from your says. Maybe you just needed this to appear as a scandal for you all to feel better, but seriously... You'll soon realize this is accomplishing nothing. Sincere regards and respect, Peter "Astraëa" Steel.
The management lied, publicly, and you blame the players for speaking out in public? I'm sure no one here is blaming your community, they're blaming the management.
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You think that when he says to you that he has x years of experience in x domain and you don't it's annoying? Seriously man... just hang up then... This man here has brought ideas that nowadays seem to be common sense... And guess what, he also has ideas to develop esports that will be in place in the future...
I'm a nonamer on the esports scale and I have more managerial and esports organizational experience than Jerith. He is NOBODY. Get off his D and explore the world, you might figure that vVv is an insignificant, annoying rock in the community's shoe. The man brought no ideas, he got them elsewhere. He also has horrible business sense, as vVv is still at rock bottom and unknown to most people (I only know of vVv because I've been heaviliy involved in esports in the past and I regard them as one of those joke orgas that failed hard to adapt to the PC reality when switching from consoles). You just wouldn't know any better because it's clear that you haven't experienced any different.
If I had the same feelings and thoughts as you, I wouldn't be complaining the slightest about not being a member of vVv anymore. I would embrace my freedom, and start something else, something new, and most important, something bigger just to show them where they were wrong. But here's the thing, you can't... Why? I don't know and don't really care, thing is you just showed yourself trustful by going public instead of discussing with the concerned people (pillar N°4 for the recall).
Nobody is complaining that they can't be a member anymore (like seriously ... you must be kidding, nobody cares about what team tag they wear, as long as they get support and exposure, which vVv has none of). Obviously they will keep playing, so why do you say "here's the thing, you can't"... Nobody here said they were quitting the game, learn to read ffs. They will keep going as just Aspire, but the post, as you clearly don't seem to understand, is to warn other potential victims about vVv's malpractices.
And insulting community pillars like scoots, wheat, sundance or others won't get you anywhere. Especially when these people have accomplished a million times more things than Jerith and his crew ever will.
Oh and the vVv community might not be shit (although LJ is shit), but it's certainly a bunch of casuals with clearly no understanding of esports outside of vVv. It's like if you lived on an island your whole life and just aren't aware of the world around you, so I can't even blame you for being so ignorant about the larger picture here.
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VVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV
toxsik, Titan and nooborghini all my home boys.
always heard bad things aobut vVv management :\
User was banned for this post.
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On January 30 2013 04:48 EtherealDeath wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2013 04:07 t e a C h e r wrote:On January 30 2013 03:54 CanadianSC wrote:
you're really complaining that his named account is low? As his room mate I can tell you that he uses 2 smurfs and then has the main. Main is for tournaments, 1 smurf for trying new builds/timings, 1 to try to ez that ladder. GL, and good on Torte de Lini for offering up a place. Hope nubrgini takes it. If he was a GM player, he would have his main/named account in GM right? Come on dude make sense... Why he smurfin if he aint even high mater? I doubt his smurfs have high master points. Glon was very often top 20 gm on NA this past year on his smurf. Yet I bet you've never seen vVvGlon in GM, hell I don't think I even have and I keep track of that shit pretty closely.
Umm vVvgLon account is in gm...
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Unfortunate. I never knew much about vVv aside from playing some of their players on ladder, but it sure looks like a lot of good people had their time and hard work go into improving the team. It's sad it had to end this way.
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On January 30 2013 05:02 zuhairZ wrote:
VVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV
toxsik, Titan and nooborghini all my home boys.
always heard bad things aobut vVv management :\
Wow zoohairz, was your other account banned THAT long ago that they've not caught this one? Damn how time flies ~. But yea, don't think anyone in sc2 will be missing vVv.
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vVv is notorious for mistreating their players. It really sucks this has to happen
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On January 30 2013 05:03 t e a C h e r wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2013 04:48 EtherealDeath wrote:On January 30 2013 04:07 t e a C h e r wrote:On January 30 2013 03:54 CanadianSC wrote:
you're really complaining that his named account is low? As his room mate I can tell you that he uses 2 smurfs and then has the main. Main is for tournaments, 1 smurf for trying new builds/timings, 1 to try to ez that ladder. GL, and good on Torte de Lini for offering up a place. Hope nubrgini takes it. If he was a GM player, he would have his main/named account in GM right? Come on dude make sense... Why he smurfin if he aint even high mater? I doubt his smurfs have high master points. Glon was very often top 20 gm on NA this past year on his smurf. Yet I bet you've never seen vVvGlon in GM, hell I don't think I even have and I keep track of that shit pretty closely. Umm vVvgLon account is in gm...
Ok turns out from sc2ranks history that his main account ended in GM twice in 2012 out of 5 seasons, once in top 16 gm. Whereas his smurf was in GM every season after the first, after he got it (3 times). And in fact his smurf has been renamed to GosuGlon and is the one currently in GM. So I guess he does play both sort of, but mainly his smurf.
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On January 30 2013 04:46 pb.fcnz wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2013 04:36 exfrozensteel wrote:
firstly GW2 player for vVv then Community Gamer for vVv, then SC2 player for vVv, just member no sponsor thing, now MMO player. And this is why vVv can't be considered a serious legitimate eSports organization but nothing else than a community site/clan. You might not understand where I'm coming from with this but no serious team would have "community teams" or switch players from a game to the other (I mean, if you were a legend in say, GW2 then switching to SC2, that'd be one thing, they could promote it and bring GW2 fans to follow the SC2 by streaming your progress but I doubt you follow a pro practice regimen of playing 6-10 hours of intense SC2 laddering) but if you were such a legend, we'd all know your name, so as far as I know you're just some gamer like anyone here, so why a "pro team" would have you on their line up in the first place is puzzling and also evidence that vVv is not a serious team. As far as your statement and defending vVv, well I wouldn't really expect an outsider to eSports to understand right off the bat, but pro SC2 players dedicate what is pretty much a "full-time job" type of time commitment into their practice, so for them to be promised incentives in exchange for creating content and bringing visibility to the vVv brand and then for the organization to reneg on their promises is shady, immoral and downright disgusting. This is why pro teams nowadays have contracts, they protect both the organization and the players. But vVv has never been in the business of protecting their players, nor have they ever had a clue how to run an organization. Why has vVv, with all the console community support it had/has with casuals, not become as big and powerful as an EG, coL or Liquid? If Jerith is such a genius businessman, why is vVv regarded as a joke by most competitive teams and esports "personalities"? FPS community thinks vVv is horrid and plays shit games with controllers that only appeal to casual pre-teens. RTS community thinks vVv is shady as hell and abused the trust of up and coming players. FGC community would like to stab Jerith a few times... Not to mention Jerith constantly contradicts himself.... rants against multigenre gamers but the only people on vVv to ever get exposure were the noob clowns they had in WCG Ultimate Gamer (people who couldnt even dominate their native games, yet play anything else)... And don't even get me started on vVv having "professional" guitar hero and dj hero players....
I do know all this and that is also a fact, vVv gaming is not a pro gaming team. It is a multi-gaming community with players within the community looking to go higher.
I do have a hard planned schedule, but don't feel ready to try tournaments. Thing is I am a diverse player, so one week it'll be LoL, the other it'll be SC2 and the other WoW. Thing is, I try to keep an equal level in the three of them in case these things happen when your division is shut down. Plus, the fact that the Aspire members decided to leave suddenly made them close the entire SC2 division, therefor they are to blame for my last change.
I see you talk about contracts (happy you do), as mentioned, these players didn't have one. Therefor vVv did have no legal engagement. As said previously, I do as good as I can to help the WoW server I play on develop itself even though it does take me time. But since I have no contract with them, it is just pure passion.
i think the notion of passion is something that is being neglected more and more in the esports domain, a lot of players start to forget that playing games once was for fun and not to win or make money. I believe that reminding those principals too kids at school as much as possible could solve that, still I doubt any school would do this for the esports community, no school (or at least french one) accepted an esports scholarship thinking that video games are bad for health and stuff like that that the medias brought to their heads...
As a matter of a fact, there are some things that do happen to turn bad. So to the "Why?" I answer "because". You said that the people that vVv sent out were clowns, who tells you they had anything better... That might have been what made the head of vVv need proof of NuBrGNi's level to decide if they would give him money, because until then the only people to who they did give money turned out to be clowns... vVv hasn't had the good elements because they weren't offering the big pay checks, the few players they got fucked them up, so in return they got suspicious about the people they engaged. That could easily explain the place they got stuck in.
But let's take this as a new start for us. We don't have any players on the games that old players dishonored our name on, and our leader isn't Lordjerrith anymore but a young nice guy going under the name of DoomHammer. The community seems to have grown from the mistakes of the past and shall probably respond as such.
Hope I have answered your questions,
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On January 30 2013 05:12 exfrozensteel wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2013 04:46 pb.fcnz wrote:On January 30 2013 04:36 exfrozensteel wrote:
firstly GW2 player for vVv then Community Gamer for vVv, then SC2 player for vVv, just member no sponsor thing, now MMO player. And this is why vVv can't be considered a serious legitimate eSports organization but nothing else than a community site/clan. You might not understand where I'm coming from with this but no serious team would have "community teams" or switch players from a game to the other (I mean, if you were a legend in say, GW2 then switching to SC2, that'd be one thing, they could promote it and bring GW2 fans to follow the SC2 by streaming your progress but I doubt you follow a pro practice regimen of playing 6-10 hours of intense SC2 laddering) but if you were such a legend, we'd all know your name, so as far as I know you're just some gamer like anyone here, so why a "pro team" would have you on their line up in the first place is puzzling and also evidence that vVv is not a serious team. As far as your statement and defending vVv, well I wouldn't really expect an outsider to eSports to understand right off the bat, but pro SC2 players dedicate what is pretty much a "full-time job" type of time commitment into their practice, so for them to be promised incentives in exchange for creating content and bringing visibility to the vVv brand and then for the organization to reneg on their promises is shady, immoral and downright disgusting. This is why pro teams nowadays have contracts, they protect both the organization and the players. But vVv has never been in the business of protecting their players, nor have they ever had a clue how to run an organization. Why has vVv, with all the console community support it had/has with casuals, not become as big and powerful as an EG, coL or Liquid? If Jerith is such a genius businessman, why is vVv regarded as a joke by most competitive teams and esports "personalities"? FPS community thinks vVv is horrid and plays shit games with controllers that only appeal to casual pre-teens. RTS community thinks vVv is shady as hell and abused the trust of up and coming players. FGC community would like to stab Jerith a few times... Not to mention Jerith constantly contradicts himself.... rants against multigenre gamers but the only people on vVv to ever get exposure were the noob clowns they had in WCG Ultimate Gamer (people who couldnt even dominate their native games, yet play anything else)... And don't even get me started on vVv having "professional" guitar hero and dj hero players.... I do know all this and that is also a fact, vVv gaming is not a pro gaming team. It is a multi-gaming community with players within the community looking to go higher. I do have a hard planned schedule, but don't feel ready to try tournaments. Thing is I am a diverse player, so one week it'll be LoL, the other it'll be SC2 and the other WoW. Thing is, I try to keep an equal level in the three of them in case these things happen when your division is shut down. Plus, the fact that the Aspire members decided to leave suddenly made them close the entire SC2 division, therefor they are to blame for my last change. I see you talk about contracts (happy you do), as mentioned, these players didn't have one. Therefor vVv did have no legal engagement. As said previously, I do as good as I can to help the WoW server I play on develop itself even though it does take me time. But since I have no contract with them, it is just pure passion. i think the notion of passion is something that is being neglected more and more in the esports domain, a lot of players start to forget that playing games once was for fun and not to win or make money. I believe that reminding those principals too kids at school as much as possible could solve that, still I doubt any school would do this for the esports community, no school (or at least french one) accepted an esports scholarship thinking that video games are bad for health and stuff like that that the medias brought to their heads... As a matter of a fact, there are some things that do happen to turn bad. So to the "Why?" I answer "because". You said that the people that vVv sent out were clowns, who tells you they had anything better... That might have been what made the head of vVv need proof of NuBrGNi's level to decide if they would give him money, because until then the only people to who they did give money turned out to be clowns... vVv hasn't had the good elements because they weren't offering the big pay checks, the few players they got fucked them up, so in return they got suspicious about the people they engaged. That could easily explain the place they got stuck in. But let's take this as a new start for us. We don't have any players on the games that old players dishonored our name on, and our leader isn't Lordjerrith anymore but a young nice guy going under the name of DoomHammer. The community seems to have grown from the mistakes of the past and shall probably respond as such. Hope I have answered your questions, Peter "Astraëa" Steel
Can you please clarify as to how the SC2 'sponsored team', and the academy 'dishonoured' vVv? From the numerous player statements, it seems that the vVv management did not live up to what they promised, not the other way round.
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Okay I guess I'll have to do a general answer again...
If you have a problem with Lordjerrith, please know that he is only the owner of vVv and no longer at the head of the community.
As I just said, we have a new path in front of us and will advance on other games than Starcraft. you may think vVv is a joke, we all have our bad days...
Some of you may think I'm a C Sucker because I am defending a community (I insist on "COMMUNITY" not team) that was once ruled by a jerk with no sense, and that once had shit players that tarnished their image, to that I reply that I am defending the players of a community that have potential and motivation for their passion. Even though our principals were not respected until now, the players we have now do respect them and they won't change. That is the reason why better than leaving vVv we prefer to restore the image of the community so that one day it'll be called a team.
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On January 30 2013 05:21 mikkmagro wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2013 05:12 exfrozensteel wrote:On January 30 2013 04:46 pb.fcnz wrote:On January 30 2013 04:36 exfrozensteel wrote:
firstly GW2 player for vVv then Community Gamer for vVv, then SC2 player for vVv, just member no sponsor thing, now MMO player. And this is why vVv can't be considered a serious legitimate eSports organization but nothing else than a community site/clan. You might not understand where I'm coming from with this but no serious team would have "community teams" or switch players from a game to the other (I mean, if you were a legend in say, GW2 then switching to SC2, that'd be one thing, they could promote it and bring GW2 fans to follow the SC2 by streaming your progress but I doubt you follow a pro practice regimen of playing 6-10 hours of intense SC2 laddering) but if you were such a legend, we'd all know your name, so as far as I know you're just some gamer like anyone here, so why a "pro team" would have you on their line up in the first place is puzzling and also evidence that vVv is not a serious team. As far as your statement and defending vVv, well I wouldn't really expect an outsider to eSports to understand right off the bat, but pro SC2 players dedicate what is pretty much a "full-time job" type of time commitment into their practice, so for them to be promised incentives in exchange for creating content and bringing visibility to the vVv brand and then for the organization to reneg on their promises is shady, immoral and downright disgusting. This is why pro teams nowadays have contracts, they protect both the organization and the players. But vVv has never been in the business of protecting their players, nor have they ever had a clue how to run an organization. Why has vVv, with all the console community support it had/has with casuals, not become as big and powerful as an EG, coL or Liquid? If Jerith is such a genius businessman, why is vVv regarded as a joke by most competitive teams and esports "personalities"? FPS community thinks vVv is horrid and plays shit games with controllers that only appeal to casual pre-teens. RTS community thinks vVv is shady as hell and abused the trust of up and coming players. FGC community would like to stab Jerith a few times... Not to mention Jerith constantly contradicts himself.... rants against multigenre gamers but the only people on vVv to ever get exposure were the noob clowns they had in WCG Ultimate Gamer (people who couldnt even dominate their native games, yet play anything else)... And don't even get me started on vVv having "professional" guitar hero and dj hero players.... I do know all this and that is also a fact, vVv gaming is not a pro gaming team. It is a multi-gaming community with players within the community looking to go higher. I do have a hard planned schedule, but don't feel ready to try tournaments. Thing is I am a diverse player, so one week it'll be LoL, the other it'll be SC2 and the other WoW. Thing is, I try to keep an equal level in the three of them in case these things happen when your division is shut down. Plus, the fact that the Aspire members decided to leave suddenly made them close the entire SC2 division, therefor they are to blame for my last change. I see you talk about contracts (happy you do), as mentioned, these players didn't have one. Therefor vVv did have no legal engagement. As said previously, I do as good as I can to help the WoW server I play on develop itself even though it does take me time. But since I have no contract with them, it is just pure passion. i think the notion of passion is something that is being neglected more and more in the esports domain, a lot of players start to forget that playing games once was for fun and not to win or make money. I believe that reminding those principals too kids at school as much as possible could solve that, still I doubt any school would do this for the esports community, no school (or at least french one) accepted an esports scholarship thinking that video games are bad for health and stuff like that that the medias brought to their heads... As a matter of a fact, there are some things that do happen to turn bad. So to the "Why?" I answer "because". You said that the people that vVv sent out were clowns, who tells you they had anything better... That might have been what made the head of vVv need proof of NuBrGNi's level to decide if they would give him money, because until then the only people to who they did give money turned out to be clowns... vVv hasn't had the good elements because they weren't offering the big pay checks, the few players they got fucked them up, so in return they got suspicious about the people they engaged. That could easily explain the place they got stuck in. But let's take this as a new start for us. We don't have any players on the games that old players dishonored our name on, and our leader isn't Lordjerrith anymore but a young nice guy going under the name of DoomHammer. The community seems to have grown from the mistakes of the past and shall probably respond as such. Hope I have answered your questions, Peter "Astraëa" Steel Can you please clarify as to how the SC2 'sponsored team', and the academy 'dishonoured' vVv? From the numerous player statements, it seems that the vVv management did not live up to what they promised, not the other way round.
Where did you see promises? I didn't see any...
These players are tarnishing the image of vVv by trying to create a scandal around our community to make themselves interesting... plus they are going against the principals of the team they seemed to like by not respecting the fourth pillar of vVv gaming which reveals of common sense.
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On January 30 2013 05:24 exfrozensteel wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2013 05:21 mikkmagro wrote:On January 30 2013 05:12 exfrozensteel wrote:On January 30 2013 04:46 pb.fcnz wrote:On January 30 2013 04:36 exfrozensteel wrote:
firstly GW2 player for vVv then Community Gamer for vVv, then SC2 player for vVv, just member no sponsor thing, now MMO player. And this is why vVv can't be considered a serious legitimate eSports organization but nothing else than a community site/clan. You might not understand where I'm coming from with this but no serious team would have "community teams" or switch players from a game to the other (I mean, if you were a legend in say, GW2 then switching to SC2, that'd be one thing, they could promote it and bring GW2 fans to follow the SC2 by streaming your progress but I doubt you follow a pro practice regimen of playing 6-10 hours of intense SC2 laddering) but if you were such a legend, we'd all know your name, so as far as I know you're just some gamer like anyone here, so why a "pro team" would have you on their line up in the first place is puzzling and also evidence that vVv is not a serious team. As far as your statement and defending vVv, well I wouldn't really expect an outsider to eSports to understand right off the bat, but pro SC2 players dedicate what is pretty much a "full-time job" type of time commitment into their practice, so for them to be promised incentives in exchange for creating content and bringing visibility to the vVv brand and then for the organization to reneg on their promises is shady, immoral and downright disgusting. This is why pro teams nowadays have contracts, they protect both the organization and the players. But vVv has never been in the business of protecting their players, nor have they ever had a clue how to run an organization. Why has vVv, with all the console community support it had/has with casuals, not become as big and powerful as an EG, coL or Liquid? If Jerith is such a genius businessman, why is vVv regarded as a joke by most competitive teams and esports "personalities"? FPS community thinks vVv is horrid and plays shit games with controllers that only appeal to casual pre-teens. RTS community thinks vVv is shady as hell and abused the trust of up and coming players. FGC community would like to stab Jerith a few times... Not to mention Jerith constantly contradicts himself.... rants against multigenre gamers but the only people on vVv to ever get exposure were the noob clowns they had in WCG Ultimate Gamer (people who couldnt even dominate their native games, yet play anything else)... And don't even get me started on vVv having "professional" guitar hero and dj hero players.... I do know all this and that is also a fact, vVv gaming is not a pro gaming team. It is a multi-gaming community with players within the community looking to go higher. I do have a hard planned schedule, but don't feel ready to try tournaments. Thing is I am a diverse player, so one week it'll be LoL, the other it'll be SC2 and the other WoW. Thing is, I try to keep an equal level in the three of them in case these things happen when your division is shut down. Plus, the fact that the Aspire members decided to leave suddenly made them close the entire SC2 division, therefor they are to blame for my last change. I see you talk about contracts (happy you do), as mentioned, these players didn't have one. Therefor vVv did have no legal engagement. As said previously, I do as good as I can to help the WoW server I play on develop itself even though it does take me time. But since I have no contract with them, it is just pure passion. i think the notion of passion is something that is being neglected more and more in the esports domain, a lot of players start to forget that playing games once was for fun and not to win or make money. I believe that reminding those principals too kids at school as much as possible could solve that, still I doubt any school would do this for the esports community, no school (or at least french one) accepted an esports scholarship thinking that video games are bad for health and stuff like that that the medias brought to their heads... As a matter of a fact, there are some things that do happen to turn bad. So to the "Why?" I answer "because". You said that the people that vVv sent out were clowns, who tells you they had anything better... That might have been what made the head of vVv need proof of NuBrGNi's level to decide if they would give him money, because until then the only people to who they did give money turned out to be clowns... vVv hasn't had the good elements because they weren't offering the big pay checks, the few players they got fucked them up, so in return they got suspicious about the people they engaged. That could easily explain the place they got stuck in. But let's take this as a new start for us. We don't have any players on the games that old players dishonored our name on, and our leader isn't Lordjerrith anymore but a young nice guy going under the name of DoomHammer. The community seems to have grown from the mistakes of the past and shall probably respond as such. Hope I have answered your questions, Peter "Astraëa" Steel Can you please clarify as to how the SC2 'sponsored team', and the academy 'dishonoured' vVv? From the numerous player statements, it seems that the vVv management did not live up to what they promised, not the other way round. Where did you see promises? I didn't see any... These players are tarnishing the image of vVv by trying to create a scandal around our community to make themselves interesting... plus they are going against the principals of the team they seemed to like by not respecting the fourth pillar of vVv gaming which reveals of common sense.
???? Did you willfully not read the posts of some of the former players (not referring to the Aspire players)???
And why would you bother to not say things publicly when you're clearly getting a PR shaft up the anus and no longer part of the community/team?
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On January 30 2013 05:12 exfrozensteel wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2013 04:46 pb.fcnz wrote:On January 30 2013 04:36 exfrozensteel wrote:
firstly GW2 player for vVv then Community Gamer for vVv, then SC2 player for vVv, just member no sponsor thing, now MMO player. And this is why vVv can't be considered a serious legitimate eSports organization but nothing else than a community site/clan. You might not understand where I'm coming from with this but no serious team would have "community teams" or switch players from a game to the other (I mean, if you were a legend in say, GW2 then switching to SC2, that'd be one thing, they could promote it and bring GW2 fans to follow the SC2 by streaming your progress but I doubt you follow a pro practice regimen of playing 6-10 hours of intense SC2 laddering) but if you were such a legend, we'd all know your name, so as far as I know you're just some gamer like anyone here, so why a "pro team" would have you on their line up in the first place is puzzling and also evidence that vVv is not a serious team. As far as your statement and defending vVv, well I wouldn't really expect an outsider to eSports to understand right off the bat, but pro SC2 players dedicate what is pretty much a "full-time job" type of time commitment into their practice, so for them to be promised incentives in exchange for creating content and bringing visibility to the vVv brand and then for the organization to reneg on their promises is shady, immoral and downright disgusting. This is why pro teams nowadays have contracts, they protect both the organization and the players. But vVv has never been in the business of protecting their players, nor have they ever had a clue how to run an organization. Why has vVv, with all the console community support it had/has with casuals, not become as big and powerful as an EG, coL or Liquid? If Jerith is such a genius businessman, why is vVv regarded as a joke by most competitive teams and esports "personalities"? FPS community thinks vVv is horrid and plays shit games with controllers that only appeal to casual pre-teens. RTS community thinks vVv is shady as hell and abused the trust of up and coming players. FGC community would like to stab Jerith a few times... Not to mention Jerith constantly contradicts himself.... rants against multigenre gamers but the only people on vVv to ever get exposure were the noob clowns they had in WCG Ultimate Gamer (people who couldnt even dominate their native games, yet play anything else)... And don't even get me started on vVv having "professional" guitar hero and dj hero players.... Thing is I am a diverse player, so one week it'll be LoL, the other it'll be SC2 and the other WoW. Thing is, I try to keep an equal level in the three of them in case these things happen when your division is shut down.
Proving my point. Not a single progamer does that. No one. Nada. Some switch (like completely switch, stop a game totally and play another one full-time). To get you to "tournament status" in SC2 would require well over a year of 6-10 hours of laddering if you have no competitive background in BW, maybe 6-8 months if you were a solid BW player.
You are a casual gamer dude. And that's totally fine, but you can't relate to the players on Aspire. You're probably a terrible player at all 3 games when gauged on a competitive scale. If you focused on a single game, you'd probably end up decent in it, depending on the skill cap of your game of choice and the time invested in it.
I spent almost 10 years playing CS 1.6 and still wasn't at the top. True competitive platforms like BW/SC2, CS1.6, Q3 and a few others require years of intense practice to get anywhere at a competitive level. These guys from Aspire aren't trying to be casuals and that's not why vVv took them onboard. The goal was to be competitive. This is why what vVv did is just flat-out bad.
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On January 30 2013 05:24 exfrozensteel wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2013 05:21 mikkmagro wrote:On January 30 2013 05:12 exfrozensteel wrote:On January 30 2013 04:46 pb.fcnz wrote:On January 30 2013 04:36 exfrozensteel wrote:
firstly GW2 player for vVv then Community Gamer for vVv, then SC2 player for vVv, just member no sponsor thing, now MMO player. And this is why vVv can't be considered a serious legitimate eSports organization but nothing else than a community site/clan. You might not understand where I'm coming from with this but no serious team would have "community teams" or switch players from a game to the other (I mean, if you were a legend in say, GW2 then switching to SC2, that'd be one thing, they could promote it and bring GW2 fans to follow the SC2 by streaming your progress but I doubt you follow a pro practice regimen of playing 6-10 hours of intense SC2 laddering) but if you were such a legend, we'd all know your name, so as far as I know you're just some gamer like anyone here, so why a "pro team" would have you on their line up in the first place is puzzling and also evidence that vVv is not a serious team. As far as your statement and defending vVv, well I wouldn't really expect an outsider to eSports to understand right off the bat, but pro SC2 players dedicate what is pretty much a "full-time job" type of time commitment into their practice, so for them to be promised incentives in exchange for creating content and bringing visibility to the vVv brand and then for the organization to reneg on their promises is shady, immoral and downright disgusting. This is why pro teams nowadays have contracts, they protect both the organization and the players. But vVv has never been in the business of protecting their players, nor have they ever had a clue how to run an organization. Why has vVv, with all the console community support it had/has with casuals, not become as big and powerful as an EG, coL or Liquid? If Jerith is such a genius businessman, why is vVv regarded as a joke by most competitive teams and esports "personalities"? FPS community thinks vVv is horrid and plays shit games with controllers that only appeal to casual pre-teens. RTS community thinks vVv is shady as hell and abused the trust of up and coming players. FGC community would like to stab Jerith a few times... Not to mention Jerith constantly contradicts himself.... rants against multigenre gamers but the only people on vVv to ever get exposure were the noob clowns they had in WCG Ultimate Gamer (people who couldnt even dominate their native games, yet play anything else)... And don't even get me started on vVv having "professional" guitar hero and dj hero players.... I do know all this and that is also a fact, vVv gaming is not a pro gaming team. It is a multi-gaming community with players within the community looking to go higher. I do have a hard planned schedule, but don't feel ready to try tournaments. Thing is I am a diverse player, so one week it'll be LoL, the other it'll be SC2 and the other WoW. Thing is, I try to keep an equal level in the three of them in case these things happen when your division is shut down. Plus, the fact that the Aspire members decided to leave suddenly made them close the entire SC2 division, therefor they are to blame for my last change. I see you talk about contracts (happy you do), as mentioned, these players didn't have one. Therefor vVv did have no legal engagement. As said previously, I do as good as I can to help the WoW server I play on develop itself even though it does take me time. But since I have no contract with them, it is just pure passion. i think the notion of passion is something that is being neglected more and more in the esports domain, a lot of players start to forget that playing games once was for fun and not to win or make money. I believe that reminding those principals too kids at school as much as possible could solve that, still I doubt any school would do this for the esports community, no school (or at least french one) accepted an esports scholarship thinking that video games are bad for health and stuff like that that the medias brought to their heads... As a matter of a fact, there are some things that do happen to turn bad. So to the "Why?" I answer "because". You said that the people that vVv sent out were clowns, who tells you they had anything better... That might have been what made the head of vVv need proof of NuBrGNi's level to decide if they would give him money, because until then the only people to who they did give money turned out to be clowns... vVv hasn't had the good elements because they weren't offering the big pay checks, the few players they got fucked them up, so in return they got suspicious about the people they engaged. That could easily explain the place they got stuck in. But let's take this as a new start for us. We don't have any players on the games that old players dishonored our name on, and our leader isn't Lordjerrith anymore but a young nice guy going under the name of DoomHammer. The community seems to have grown from the mistakes of the past and shall probably respond as such. Hope I have answered your questions, Peter "Astraëa" Steel Can you please clarify as to how the SC2 'sponsored team', and the academy 'dishonoured' vVv? From the numerous player statements, it seems that the vVv management did not live up to what they promised, not the other way round. Where did you see promises? I didn't see any... These players are tarnishing the image of vVv by trying to create a scandal around our community to make themselves interesting... plus they are going against the principals of the team they seemed to like by not respecting the fourth pillar of vVv gaming which reveals of common sense.
It sounds like vVv broke their own pillars by enticing players with offers and then failing to deliver.
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On January 30 2013 05:27 EtherealDeath wrote:
???? Did you willfully not read the posts of some of the former players (not referring to the Aspire players)???
And why would you bother to not say things publicly when you're clearly getting a PR shaft up the anus and no longer part of the community/team?
Did you not read what I said earlier? there are no evident promises that have been made and those who are stated aren't provided with proof !
And they may not be members of the community any more, it doesn't take away there common sense... other wise they deserved to get screwed even if it isn't the case
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On January 30 2013 05:03 t e a C h e r wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2013 04:48 EtherealDeath wrote:On January 30 2013 04:07 t e a C h e r wrote:On January 30 2013 03:54 CanadianSC wrote:
you're really complaining that his named account is low? As his room mate I can tell you that he uses 2 smurfs and then has the main. Main is for tournaments, 1 smurf for trying new builds/timings, 1 to try to ez that ladder. GL, and good on Torte de Lini for offering up a place. Hope nubrgini takes it. If he was a GM player, he would have his main/named account in GM right? Come on dude make sense... Why he smurfin if he aint even high mater? I doubt his smurfs have high master points. Glon was very often top 20 gm on NA this past year on his smurf. Yet I bet you've never seen vVvGlon in GM, hell I don't think I even have and I keep track of that shit pretty closely. Umm vVvgLon account is in gm...
If you see Nub's match history its like 99% customs with high masters/gm. You dont need to ladder to be good at the game.
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We've traditionally never covered both for a sponsored players first event with us.
Does this not break anyone else's brain? What the fuck? Isn't the ENTIRE POINT of signing a contract for sponsorship that they cover these things? If they told me this I would instantly drop from the team.
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EPT
