• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 00:55
CEST 06:55
KST 13:55
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall9HomeStory Cup 27 - Info & Preview18Classic wins Code S Season 2 (2025)16Code S RO4 & Finals Preview: herO, Rogue, Classic, GuMiho0TL Team Map Contest #5: Presented by Monster Energy6
Community News
[BSL20] Non-Korean Championship 4x BSL + 4x China2Flash Announces Hiatus From ASL63Weekly Cups (June 23-29): Reynor in world title form?13FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $8000 live event22Esports World Cup 2025 - Final Player Roster16
StarCraft 2
General
Program: SC2 / XSplit / OBS Scene Switcher The SCII GOAT: A statistical Evaluation Statistics for vetoed/disliked maps Weekly Cups (June 23-29): Reynor in world title form? PiG Sty Festival #5: Playoffs Preview + Groups Recap
Tourneys
RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $8000 live event Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament WardiTV Mondays Korean Starcraft League Week 77
Strategy
How did i lose this ZvP, whats the proper response Simple Questions Simple Answers
Custom Maps
[UMS] Zillion Zerglings
External Content
Mutation # 481 Fear and Lava Mutation # 480 Moths to the Flame Mutation # 479 Worn Out Welcome Mutation # 478 Instant Karma
Brood War
General
SC uni coach streams logging into betting site Player “Jedi” cheat on CSL Flash Announces Hiatus From ASL BW General Discussion Practice Partners (Official)
Tourneys
CSL Xiamen International Invitational [BSL20] Non-Korean Championship 4x BSL + 4x China The Casual Games of the Week Thread [BSL20] Grand Finals - Sunday 20:00 CET
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers I am doing this better than progamers do.
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread What do you want from future RTS games? Beyond All Reason
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Summer Games Done Quick 2025! Trading/Investing Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine
Fan Clubs
SKT1 Classic Fan Club! Maru Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion 2024 - 2025 Football Thread NBA General Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 NHL Playoffs 2024
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Blogs
Culture Clash in Video Games…
TrAiDoS
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
Blog #2
tankgirl
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Trip to the Zoo
micronesia
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 671 users

Dustin Browder WCS TL Interview - Page 23

Forum Index > SC2 General
605 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 21 22 23 24 25 31 Next All
rumodbrotheraturface
Profile Joined November 2012
3 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-20 20:15:06
November 20 2012 20:04 GMT
#441
I did not watch the entire interview however i looked at their ideas and i find none to be terrible to start redisigning the flaws in this game i find dustin browders view quite skewed in the first 3-5 minutes of the interview when he says mvp is only 3-5% better then other people i disagree completely i think not jet lag ect leading to upsets i think this game is extremely more luck dependent then broodwar due to how you control stuff also as it being imbalanced imo in certain matchups (tvz) its almost as if he enjoys this luck factor which as a spectator isnt that bad but a designing point of view i think their mindset is extremely flawed also when you take a econmic risk in this game its generally rewarded WAY more then BW due to having extra mule for CC extra chrono on probes for extra nexus and extra injects for a hatch WHY add so much capabilitys to the main buildings so that unscouted you get extremely ahead quicker which leads to needing MORE precise scouting= leading to more luck due to not 100% perfect scouting which is somewhat players fault but at certain parts in the game its literally impossible to scout and see anything if opponents are not even good just compatent its simple flaws like this that lead the game to become way more luck imo and thats why you see worse players winning due to incorrect blind builds which i think are magnified more in sc2 then BW which leads way worse players having the possibility of winning


(dont mean to say this is the only flaw in the game just showing a example of one of the many failed ideas that blizzard implemented into sc2 and wont even bring up changing just furthering proof that they have no clue how to actuelly balance a game they literally just add units and say this looks cool or this ability seems nice then not listen to the people with way more gametime played)

dustin browder himself said for the first 10-15 minutes he can play at a pro level? WTF someone with this clouded of a mind should not be in the position he is today not saying its all his fault but clearly he does a poor job

User was warned for this post
sitromit
Profile Joined June 2011
7051 Posts
November 20 2012 20:07 GMT
#442
If there wasn't such a unit like the Mothership that can win a game with a single cast of a single spell, then stealing it wouldn't become a problem. I don't understand why they want to get rid of Neural.
Flummie
Profile Joined August 2010
Netherlands417 Posts
November 20 2012 20:09 GMT
#443
haha right
ผมพยายามหาคำตอบอยู่ตลอดเวลา
Doc Daneeka
Profile Joined March 2010
United States577 Posts
November 20 2012 20:13 GMT
#444
On November 21 2012 04:54 HolydaKing wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 21 2012 04:49 Doc Daneeka wrote:
so many of these ideas rub me the wrong way. why remove tools? it just strikes me as a really dumb shortsighted idea to just pull things out of the game like neural and essentially the mothership instead of continuing to work with their balance and tweak their mechanics. i'm afraid they're gonna end up boxing the game into a corner.

i'm sure if they remove neural they'll add something to replace it.


maybe, and i'll reserve judgement on that for when they actually attempt to replace/remove it.... but just given what we have to work with now (as in, not trying to speculate what they might replace it with) it sounds like a bad idea to me.

about the mothership, here's an idea: if you don't want a unit used in competitive play, don't put it in multiplayer. also HotS is being balanced with the mothership core as a major part of it, and they're making stargate play more appealing, so they're basically asking for the mothership proper to be used. it'll be within reach far far more often that it was in the earlier stages of WoL. it sounds like he hasn't thought this out very well. i'm also personally convinced the mothership has the potential to be, in the long run (as in years down the road - we DO want this game to have a long lifespan, correct?) a very viable part of late and super late game play and part of what will drastically differentiate the experience of playing protoss from the other two races, but if and only if blizzard goes forward with the expectation that the unit will be used.

unfortunately for this game, it's all about keeping the tournament scene alive RIGHT NOW, and so the bottom line is balancing win rates. that just is what it is but i think it's hurting the game in the long run, particularly when i hear them say stuff like this.
payed off security
dreadlordx
Profile Joined January 2012
United States80 Posts
November 20 2012 20:16 GMT
#445
I watched the entire interview, or should I call it a discussion about ZVP.... I mean if you are terran this interview is almost worthless, except to say that we are so diverse and if we don't show in big numbers in tournaments it must be jet lag. And the changes he did mention for terrans are seeker missle wont need research "but that won't change anything" and 250mm cannon might be changed. In a 32min interview, it was 30 mins of P and Z discussion and then 2 minutes to say terrans are getting shit basically. If Dustin thinks terrans are even close to excited for HOTS or happy with the current state of WoL then I give up. Terran is not more diverse, how so? Right now our builds are focused on tier 1 and 1.5, maybe some tier 2 peppered in there. Raven = worthless, BC = worthless, Ghost = worthless vs Z and not great vs feedback, banshee = worthless past 8 min, Thor = worthless except maybe against mutas in tvz mech. How is it possible that this how he sees it. Clearly he hasn't built any of the units i described and had one feedback take a massive of amount of health off a thor. I could go on and on, I will just say if you are terran dont watch this interview or buy hots. HOTS for terran is basically the same units as WOL but more shit to deal with from the other races. Worthless these people are.
Play on Playa!!!!
paradiset16
Profile Joined August 2012
United States9 Posts
November 20 2012 20:17 GMT
#446
All I heard in this interview is that Zerg op Zerg op Zerg op and that's bull crap the zerg isn't op I feel its under powered because of what other races can do and if other races weren't so dumb. And clump units together and make them fungal able of the mother ship neural situation not send their mother ship to the front of their army the mother ship has more range then neural and goes automatically and neural has a delay so all this crap about changing the infestor is bull crap for the first time scence the beta we have a unit that sustains equality between the game and Zerg players shouldn't be punished for finding out this unit that is what we need and have to use to win cause if you look at most games we do not use infestors we auto lose against death ball bio tank and the most bull shit composition mass air for Protoss with mother ship and storms is stead of looking at the Zerg and blaming the Zerg you should be look at Zerg players and loving them because unlike the other races the found a unit that is the best in their race and use it so instead of changeling them other races shouldn't be dumb asses and have their unit be fungalable because you should know Zerg is going infestors and if they aren't usually it's baneling lung muta so please stop just saying Zerg op Zerg op this needs to be changed no it doesn't need to be changed you need to change and play better

User was warned for this post
awwwww~~~zerg so underpowered
nuogaiyen
Profile Joined May 2012
United States42 Posts
November 20 2012 20:27 GMT
#447
Terran getting a shit deal, but about half the discussion is about the infestor, I hope they make the change that psionic units are not affected by fungal, or at least if they are they could move, dealing with a large number of infestor is insanely stupid. Keep the neural I dont care, not a toss. Infestor broodlord needs an answer and it should come soon.
nuogaiyen
Profile Joined May 2012
United States42 Posts
November 20 2012 20:29 GMT
#448
Only reason zerg doesn't want an infestor nerf is because that's all they do. Mm yeah
kyllinghest
Profile Joined December 2011
Norway1607 Posts
November 20 2012 20:33 GMT
#449
On November 21 2012 05:17 paradiset16 wrote:
All I heard in this interview is that Zerg op Zerg op Zerg op and that's bull crap the zerg isn't op I feel its under powered because of what other races can do and if other races weren't so dumb. And clump units together and make them fungal able of the mother ship neural situation not send their mother ship to the front of their army the mother ship has more range then neural and goes automatically and neural has a delay so all this crap about changing the infestor is bull crap for the first time scence the beta we have a unit that sustains equality between the game and Zerg players shouldn't be punished for finding out this unit that is what we need and have to use to win cause if you look at most games we do not use infestors we auto lose against death ball bio tank and the most bull shit composition mass air for Protoss with mother ship and storms is stead of looking at the Zerg and blaming the Zerg you should be look at Zerg players and loving them because unlike the other races the found a unit that is the best in their race and use it so instead of changeling them other races shouldn't be dumb asses and have their unit be fungalable because you should know Zerg is going infestors and if they aren't usually it's baneling lung muta so please stop just saying Zerg op Zerg op this needs to be changed no it doesn't need to be changed you need to change and play better

If all the other races are so dumb, maybe you could enlighten us about how we can fight the infestor better? I think you would be surprised if you tried playing terran and protoss for a game or 20 each.

On a different note I think some puctuation would do your text good!
"NO" -Has
c0sm0naut
Profile Joined April 2011
United States1229 Posts
November 20 2012 20:35 GMT
#450
yes please paradise, tell us what the koreans practicing for 8 hours per day missed. i'm sure your insight as a zerg player will be more valuable than these professional players who can play at GM level as random..
rumodbrotheraturface
Profile Joined November 2012
3 Posts
November 20 2012 20:41 GMT
#451
On November 21 2012 05:17 paradiset16 wrote:
All I heard in this interview is that Zerg op Zerg op Zerg op and that's bull crap the zerg isn't op I feel its under powered because of what other races can do and if other races weren't so dumb. And clump units together and make them fungal able of the mother ship neural situation not send their mother ship to the front of their army the mother ship has more range then neural and goes automatically and neural has a delay so all this crap about changing the infestor is bull crap for the first time scence the beta we have a unit that sustains equality between the game and Zerg players shouldn't be punished for finding out this unit that is what we need and have to use to win cause if you look at most games we do not use infestors we auto lose against death ball bio tank and the most bull shit composition mass air for Protoss with mother ship and storms is stead of looking at the Zerg and blaming the Zerg you should be look at Zerg players and loving them because unlike the other races the found a unit that is the best in their race and use it so instead of changeling them other races shouldn't be dumb asses and have their unit be fungalable because you should know Zerg is going infestors and if they aren't usually it's baneling lung muta so please stop just saying Zerg op Zerg op this needs to be changed no it doesn't need to be changed you need to change and play better



So when all your infestors get emped because there in a big clump when new patch hits can we say lol your bad split infestors noob? wtf zerg INTIRE RACE OF PLAYERS SUCK OMG instead of saying how great you and other zergs are open your mind to the REAL game if you cant see whats going on then you should be forced to play TVZ until your eyes bleed
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
November 20 2012 20:42 GMT
#452
paradiset16, if you could also pick up a copy of Elements of Style before responding, that would be great. Just focus on the section about complete sentences and we should be in the clear.

I also want to hear how other races are dumb. Explain to me how you know more than Grubby, I want to hear this.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
OkStyX
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
Canada1199 Posts
November 20 2012 20:42 GMT
#453
On November 20 2012 16:30 lichter wrote:
Oh, for the medivac they should give them a 150/150 researchable ability that allows medivacs to drop all its load simultaneously. Give this ability a cool down (so that medivac micro isn't too easy) and a different hotkey so that moving drops and individual drops are still the default.

So zerg has to react even faster cause 8 marines fall out instantly stim killed 5-6 drones multi prong drops would be even more deadly 1 at a time is manageable for both sides .
Team Overklocked Gaming! That man is the noblest creature may be inferred from the fact that no other creature has contested this claim. - G.C. Lichtenberg
Doc Daneeka
Profile Joined March 2010
United States577 Posts
November 20 2012 20:48 GMT
#454
i dunno why it's necessary to buff medivacs just because drop play isn't as fashionable or meta as it was awhile ago. they're already pretty nuts. i mean maybe, but it's not the first thing i'd think of when brainstorming ways to change the game for sure.
payed off security
ZAiNs
Profile Joined July 2010
United Kingdom6525 Posts
November 20 2012 20:49 GMT
#455
Excellent interview. Everything DB said made sense.
Godwrath
Profile Joined August 2012
Spain10121 Posts
November 20 2012 20:54 GMT
#456
On November 21 2012 00:42 Acritter wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 21 2012 00:10 Figgy wrote:
On November 20 2012 16:36 Flonomenalz wrote:
On November 20 2012 16:30 lichter wrote:
Oh, for the medivac they should give them a 150/150 researchable ability that allows medivacs to drop all its load simultaneously. Give this ability a cool down (so that medivac micro isn't too easy) and a different hotkey so that moving drops and individual drops are still the default.

That would be ridiculous.

Double medi drop late game with 3/3 marines/marauders vs Z or P. Research said ability. Insta drop a base, snipe nexus/hatch/tech/ then leave.

Repeat as needed.

Part of what allows drop defense to be possible is the delay in units coming out.



Hahahaha mutas chasing down 2 medivacs that just left the base from harass. Both of them instantly drop 16 stimmed marines to insta kill the flock <3

That would be the most broken change EVERRRRRRRRRRRRR

Hmm... maybe it WOULD be acceptable if it cost energy. Like, 150 energy. There was another ability that allowed you to instantly put a ton of units into the enemy base that cost 150 energy... what was it again?

+ Show Spoiler +
RIP Arbiter, but you get my point. Energy cost can make it balanced, because it means you can't do it constantly, and it lowers the Medivac's ability to heal.


Nope. Maybe making it unloading 2 units per "drop" instead of 1 would be interesting, but not needed.
garlicface
Profile Joined April 2010
Canada4196 Posts
November 20 2012 20:56 GMT
#457
On November 21 2012 04:41 Mczeppo wrote:
Hey i thought about fungal growth a little bit and came to the conclusion that a counter spell would be a fun way to deal with it. Something like dispel (i.e. dispelling roots, exploding wisp, etc) in Warcraft. Of course many people here may not like warcraft but it created these exciting back and forth situations.

This would also incorporate more depth and skill into the game. Players would need to position the dispelling unit before the fight correctly. This makes hit and run tactics more viable. Imagine ghost emp to dispel fungal. The ghost would have another use instead of only sniping and emp'ing the infestor directly. It makes for a slightly less extreme balance solution as units would get damaged but would't die instantly all the time while infestors would stay alive all together (zerg is not damaged directly. They'd only lose energy).

Give the high templar something similar and we have a reason to build these casters more (ghosts, HT's, ...). HT's also fulfill the role to provide aoe damage vs zerg.

I don't know if this idea is terrible but it still could be adjusted easily. Make it an upgrade. Make it gas heavy. I dont know. HT's and Ghost already are expensive. You could also give a spell like this to a new protoss unit in Hots...

In my opinion it could be a good solution to these fail/win situations.

50 energy AoE Dispel ability on the Medivac could be cool. B)
#TeamBuLba
President Dead
Profile Joined November 2012
97 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-20 20:57:27
November 20 2012 20:57 GMT
#458
Right?
Hey, I'm a police officer. Just do what I tell ya.
chatuka
Profile Joined July 2011
1351 Posts
November 20 2012 20:57 GMT
#459
give more strength to weaker units.. give terran players more options to fight zerg. Protoss need the void ray and Fenix relevant again.

it's pretty common sense that zerg has a lot of usable pieces and other races don't have the variety of units that zerg has.
vgijamven
Profile Joined December 2011
Sweden95 Posts
November 20 2012 20:58 GMT
#460
He says fungal shouldn't be a slow, but what if it's a really good slow, like 60-80% slow? I think it could be viable.
"If it it's important, you'll find a way. If it's not, you'll find an excuse." -Daniel Decker
Prev 1 21 22 23 24 25 31 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 6h 5m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Nina 273
ProTech63
Ketroc 32
StarCraft: Brood War
Leta 471
Shine 105
Mind 40
Snow 33
Bale 3
Dota 2
monkeys_forever1278
Counter-Strike
Stewie2K1341
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King182
Other Games
summit1g8860
ViBE220
Maynarde47
SortOf8
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick35237
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 18 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH298
• Hupsaiya 61
• practicex 22
• Kozan
• Migwel
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• sooper7s
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
StarCraft: Brood War
• Azhi_Dahaki40
• Diggity6
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
League of Legends
• Lourlo1274
• Rush1035
• HappyZerGling77
Upcoming Events
Wardi Open
6h 5m
Replay Cast
19h 5m
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 5h
WardiTV European League
1d 11h
MaNa vs sebesdes
Mixu vs Fjant
ByuN vs HeRoMaRinE
ShoWTimE vs goblin
Gerald vs Babymarine
Krystianer vs YoungYakov
PiGosaur Monday
1d 19h
The PondCast
2 days
WardiTV European League
2 days
Jumy vs NightPhoenix
Percival vs Nicoract
ArT vs HiGhDrA
MaxPax vs Harstem
Scarlett vs Shameless
SKillous vs uThermal
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
RSL Revival
3 days
ByuN vs SHIN
Clem vs Reynor
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
3 days
RSL Revival
4 days
Classic vs Cure
FEL
4 days
RSL Revival
5 days
FEL
5 days
FEL
5 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
6 days
RSL Revival
6 days
FEL
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

BSL Season 20
HSC XXVII
Heroes 10 EU

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
BSL 2v2 Season 3
Acropolis #3
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 2
CSL 17: 2025 SUMMER
Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
Championship of Russia 2025
RSL Revival: Season 1
Murky Cup #2
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters
CCT Season 2 Global Finals
IEM Melbourne 2025

Upcoming

2025 ACS Season 2: Qualifier
CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSL Xiamen Invitational
2025 ACS Season 2
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
K-Championship
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
SEL Season 2 Championship
FEL Cracov 2025
Esports World Cup 2025
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.