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Bashing of any sort will result in temp bans. |
On October 19 2012 11:20 ragz_gt wrote:Show nested quote +On October 19 2012 11:16 GolemMadness wrote:On October 19 2012 11:07 ragz_gt wrote:On October 19 2012 11:04 GolemMadness wrote:On October 19 2012 11:02 ragz_gt wrote:On October 19 2012 10:58 LuckoftheIrish wrote:On October 19 2012 10:53 ragz_gt wrote:On October 19 2012 10:48 Dfgj wrote:On October 19 2012 10:47 ragz_gt wrote:
I'm pretty sure MMA is not a drug addict, and did not break any law that we know of (though we will find about Alicia's date with court TV I'm sure) so the analogy is nowhere near perfect. It has nothing to do with legality, it has to do with the issue of negative influence. The issue of negative influence is called run a damn house. Slayers is not the parents of its members (because those throw children under bus when going gets tough everyday, and Slayers is definitely not doing that), they are more like teacher of a class room. When one of the kid behaves badly, guess what you do not do? You do not kick other kids out. You solve the issue with the kid who have a problem. That's their job and responsibility running a team. Slayers definitely looks like incapable of doing that. You need to pay attention and read the damn documents. This isn't a situation of one player misbehaving. You need to realize that. There's a lot more going on here than that. I agree it's not one player misbehaving. But do you know what everyone misbehaving means? It means they suck at running a team. It's not everyone misbehaving. That's not said anywhere. Don't post accusations if you didn't bother to read the OP. Read the conversation. I'm saying Slayers either literally breeding evil monsters in their team house or they are incapable of solving issues that occurs when young people live together in a highly competitive highly pressured environment. And I'm leaning against latter (because former is utterly ridiculous). That's like saying that you've had a few girlfriends who've broken up with you before, therefore you're entirely incapable of having a good relationship with women. The issues were mostly J leading MMA to believe that Jessica was embezzling money from the team, which caused problems with other members of the team as well, and Alicia mostly just being a brat. What exactly was Jessica supposed to do differently there? What Slayers is doing is not breaking up with a few girlfriends though. If they fired their problematic members then it would be the case. What they are doing is basically swearing to never go out with a woman again and setting fire to the bar.
Jessica, after firing the problematic members, looked at her remaining players and decided their roster wasn't strong enough to continue. Not exactly setting fire to anything. Given that the team was founded by Boxer, who's now the head coach of a competing team, it seems a pretty logical time to shut up shop.
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reading all these things... jessica comes off to me as an extremely scary person. Also, ive watched korean dramas before, and its like the same kind of dramatization that happens in those korean shows.
why is jessica doing this? what purpose does she have? sure she may have been wronged, but this is like... jessica vs e-sports. holy crappers.
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On October 19 2012 11:35 Lokian wrote:
reading all these things... jessica comes off to me as an extremely scary person. Also, ive watched korean dramas before, and its like the same kind of dramatization that happens in those korean shows.
why is jessica doing this? what purpose does she have? sure she may have been wronged, but this is like... jessica vs e-sports. holy crappers.
Well people shit on you. You need to shit them back.
Now that she had no affiliations with the players anymore, all hell breaks loose.
But if shit goes down, the public will be behind her in Korea so she will be gaining publicity.
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On October 19 2012 10:08 HackBenjamin wrote:Show nested quote +On October 19 2012 09:57 geokilla wrote:
Yup... Jessica is blowing things out of proportion and going to take everyone down with her... Starcraft esports in Korea and the world won't recover well from this in my opinion. It's only going to get worse. I think her acting career will be affected as well. Wow geokilla Im so glad to see your super insightful post. Team Liquid definitely needs more fortune tellers. How is she blowing it out of proportion? Flesh out your post with some effort instead of useless shit posting.
I mentioned it before somewhere in this 130+ pages thread. Didn't go into detail but basically, we're just hearing from one side of the story right now, and that's Jessica's side. The players, aside from Alicia, hasn't exactly spoken up last I checked, and I'm not going to read every single post in this thread. I'm reading mainly the OP and skimming through the posts in this thread.
There is definitely some sort of huge problem within SlayerS as many mentioned before if so many people are losing trust in Jessica in such a short amount of time. Well what I believe is a short amount of time. I don't know the Korean culture well, but I won't be surprised if SlayerS was like a huge family during the 2(?) years that they were a team. Now that everything is going ape shit, Jessica is going to take everyone down with her and ex SlayerS players will be viewed in a negative way, as some already do because of Jessica's comments and stuff. If I was the manager or an esports team, as of right now, I definitely don't want any ex SlayerS players on my team until we find out more about the truth of what's happening, and what actually happened. It's a case of he said she said as I mentioned many times, and unfortunately we may never find the truth and things are only going to get worse.
Look at Taeja, the genius Terran. Did Jessica really have to point him out and say that he doesn't practice as hard as MMA? Let's say that Taeja didn't practice as hard in the SlayerS house. Well it might have changed when he joined TL. That jump in skill and becoming one of the best Terrans in the world at the moment doesn't just happen overnight. I'm no programmer and I admit I'm in Platinum league, but one does not simply improve because they think "Oh this build might work, let's try it out". From what I've learned watching players, tournaments, and casts, and following programmers, it takes a lot of practice to think of the build, refine it, and make sure it works the way you wanted it to.
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On October 19 2012 11:39 geokilla wrote:Show nested quote +On October 19 2012 10:08 HackBenjamin wrote:On October 19 2012 09:57 geokilla wrote:
Yup... Jessica is blowing things out of proportion and going to take everyone down with her... Starcraft esports in Korea and the world won't recover well from this in my opinion. It's only going to get worse. I think her acting career will be affected as well. Wow geokilla Im so glad to see your super insightful post. Team Liquid definitely needs more fortune tellers. How is she blowing it out of proportion? Flesh out your post with some effort instead of useless shit posting. I mentioned it before somewhere in this 130+ pages thread. Didn't go into detail but basically, we're just hearing from one side of the story right now, and that's Jessica's side. The players, aside from Alicia, hasn't exactly spoken up last I checked, and I'm not going to read every single post in this thread. I'm reading mainly the OP and skimming through the posts in this thread. There is definitely some sort of huge problem within SlayerS as many mentioned before if so many people are losing trust in Jessica in such a short amount of time. Well what I believe is a short amount of time. I don't know the Korean culture well, but I won't be surprised if SlayerS was like a huge family during the 2(?) years that they were a team. Now that everything is going ape shit, Jessica is going to take everyone down with her and ex SlayerS players will be viewed in a negative way, as some already do because of Jessica's comments and stuff. If I was the manager or an esports team, as of right now, I definitely don't want any ex SlayerS players on my team until we find out more about the truth of what's happening, and what actually happened. It's a case of he said she said as I mentioned many times, and unfortunately we may never find the truth and things are only going to get worse. Look at Taeja, the genius Terran. Did Jessica really have to point him out and say that he doesn't practice as hard as MMA? Let's say that Taeja didn't practice as hard in the SlayerS house. Well it might have changed when he joined TL. That jump in skill and becoming one of the best Terrans in the world at the moment doesn't just happen overnight. I'm no programmer and I admit I'm in Platinum league, but one does not simply improve because they think "Oh this build might work, let's try it out". From what I've learned watching players, tournaments, and casts, and following programmers, it takes a lot of practice to think of the build, refine it, and make sure it works the way you wanted it to.
I dont like the fact that you say that "Jessica is going to take everyone down with her" when it seemed that people always blamed her (isn't she just defending herself?). People always blamed her for shit and now its become a self fulfilling prophesy. Whenever there was some Slayers drama thread, Id read the OP and maybe if i was feeling brave Id read down the rest of the page. I'd always see some number of posts automatically saying its her fault or something when I never got that impression from the OP by itself.
Now people see her as some drama queen (I doubt her TV career helped her with that one) and will automatically blame her and look to their past opinions (well founded or not) to say "see, shes always starting trouble." People love to simplify problems and blame just one thing. So far from what we've heard, I'm more sympathetic towards Jessica (obviously since weve only really heard from her). Coach Won's response seemed vague and I'm not very satisfied with it. I'd like to hear from Manager J and MMA. Those 2 seem to be, along with Jessica, at the center of the internal break down.
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Boxer has an autobiography called "Crazy As Me"
He should write a sequel about when he met Jessica called "But Not As Crazy As Her"
(Edit: And btw, if you haven't read the biography, go fucking read it right now!)
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On October 19 2012 11:57 mikedebo wrote:
Boxer has an autobiography called "Crazy As Me"
He should write a sequel about when he met Jessica called "But Not As Crazy As Her"
(Edit: And btw, if you haven't read the biography, go fucking read it right now!)
Imagine the kids! :O
Unless SlayerS counts as the "kids." Damn, the crazy is contagious.
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On October 19 2012 11:57 mikedebo wrote:
Boxer has an autobiography called "Crazy As Me"
He should write a sequel about when he met Jessica called "But Not As Crazy As Her"
(Edit: And btw, if you haven't read the biography, go fucking read it right now!)
That autobiography was legendary. Remember reading it like ~5 years ago
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Seeker
Where dat snitch at?37023 Posts
On October 19 2012 11:57 mikedebo wrote:
Boxer has an autobiography called "Crazy As Me"
He should write a sequel about when he met Jessica called "But Not As Crazy As Her"
(Edit: And btw, if you haven't read the biography, go fucking read it right now!)
I laughed. Really well played XD.
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On October 19 2012 11:57 mikedebo wrote:
Boxer has an autobiography called "Crazy As Me"
He should write a sequel about when he met Jessica called "But Not As Crazy As Her"
(Edit: And btw, if you haven't read the biography, go fucking read it right now!)
Nice one 
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On October 19 2012 11:47 Supamang wrote:Show nested quote +On October 19 2012 11:39 geokilla wrote:On October 19 2012 10:08 HackBenjamin wrote:On October 19 2012 09:57 geokilla wrote:
Yup... Jessica is blowing things out of proportion and going to take everyone down with her... Starcraft esports in Korea and the world won't recover well from this in my opinion. It's only going to get worse. I think her acting career will be affected as well. Wow geokilla Im so glad to see your super insightful post. Team Liquid definitely needs more fortune tellers. How is she blowing it out of proportion? Flesh out your post with some effort instead of useless shit posting. I mentioned it before somewhere in this 130+ pages thread. Didn't go into detail but basically, we're just hearing from one side of the story right now, and that's Jessica's side. The players, aside from Alicia, hasn't exactly spoken up last I checked, and I'm not going to read every single post in this thread. I'm reading mainly the OP and skimming through the posts in this thread. There is definitely some sort of huge problem within SlayerS as many mentioned before if so many people are losing trust in Jessica in such a short amount of time. Well what I believe is a short amount of time. I don't know the Korean culture well, but I won't be surprised if SlayerS was like a huge family during the 2(?) years that they were a team. Now that everything is going ape shit, Jessica is going to take everyone down with her and ex SlayerS players will be viewed in a negative way, as some already do because of Jessica's comments and stuff. If I was the manager or an esports team, as of right now, I definitely don't want any ex SlayerS players on my team until we find out more about the truth of what's happening, and what actually happened. It's a case of he said she said as I mentioned many times, and unfortunately we may never find the truth and things are only going to get worse. Look at Taeja, the genius Terran. Did Jessica really have to point him out and say that he doesn't practice as hard as MMA? Let's say that Taeja didn't practice as hard in the SlayerS house. Well it might have changed when he joined TL. That jump in skill and becoming one of the best Terrans in the world at the moment doesn't just happen overnight. I'm no programmer and I admit I'm in Platinum league, but one does not simply improve because they think "Oh this build might work, let's try it out". From what I've learned watching players, tournaments, and casts, and following programmers, it takes a lot of practice to think of the build, refine it, and make sure it works the way you wanted it to. I dont like the fact that you say that "Jessica is going to take everyone down with her" when it seemed that people always blamed her (isn't she just defending herself?). People always blamed her for shit and now its become a self fulfilling prophesy. Whenever there was some Slayers drama thread, Id read the OP and maybe if i was feeling brave Id read down the rest of the page. I'd always see some number of posts automatically saying its her fault or something when I never got that impression from the OP by itself. Now people see her as some drama queen (I doubt her TV career helped her with that one) and will automatically blame her and look to their past opinions (well founded or not) to say "see, shes always starting trouble." People love to simplify problems and blame just one thing. So far from what we've heard, I'm more sympathetic towards Jessica (obviously since weve only really heard from her). Coach Won's response seemed vague and I'm not very satisfied with it. I'd like to hear from Manager J and MMA. Those 2 seem to be, along with Jessica, at the center of the internal break down.
well, from what i gathered everyone started getting dissatisfied with jessica because she was very dramatic with fans throughout the years (suing ppl, getting into fights on the internet, etc). We were all talking about it on TL too. It was a matter of time before the time bomb exploded.
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On October 19 2012 11:10 Taku wrote:Show nested quote +On October 19 2012 11:07 ragz_gt wrote:On October 19 2012 11:04 GolemMadness wrote:On October 19 2012 11:02 ragz_gt wrote:On October 19 2012 10:58 LuckoftheIrish wrote:On October 19 2012 10:53 ragz_gt wrote:On October 19 2012 10:48 Dfgj wrote:On October 19 2012 10:47 ragz_gt wrote:
I'm pretty sure MMA is not a drug addict, and did not break any law that we know of (though we will find about Alicia's date with court TV I'm sure) so the analogy is nowhere near perfect. It has nothing to do with legality, it has to do with the issue of negative influence. The issue of negative influence is called run a damn house. Slayers is not the parents of its members (because those throw children under bus when going gets tough everyday, and Slayers is definitely not doing that), they are more like teacher of a class room. When one of the kid behaves badly, guess what you do not do? You do not kick other kids out. You solve the issue with the kid who have a problem. That's their job and responsibility running a team. Slayers definitely looks like incapable of doing that. You need to pay attention and read the damn documents. This isn't a situation of one player misbehaving. You need to realize that. There's a lot more going on here than that. I agree it's not one player misbehaving. But do you know what everyone misbehaving means? It means they suck at running a team. It's not everyone misbehaving. That's not said anywhere. Don't post accusations if you didn't bother to read the OP. Read the conversation. I'm saying Slayers either literally breeding evil monsters in their team house or they are incapable of solving issues that occurs when young people live together in a highly competitive highly pressured environment. And I'm leaning against latter (because former is utterly ridiculous). If you dump a ton of money on a teenager and cater to almost every one of their whims, of course they're going to turn into brats. If Boxer/Jessica are guilty of anything, I'd say it's if being naive. That and victims of their bratty players who took advantage of them.
By "dump a ton of money on a teenager", did you mean, "pay them $0"? Because they were all paid $0 by their team. They did get food, housing, and (usually) transportation covered. Along with that, in their contracts, SlayerS was actually supposed to get a portion of all their players' tournament winnings. Supposedly, they never actually took any. I believe they were also prevented from streaming pretty early on which cut off one of their only abilities to make some income. If MMA would have signed with a foreign team at his peak, he'd have at least 10s of thousands of dollars more than he currently has and potentially 100s of thousands if he could hit a sweet deal with a team like EG.
Instead, the players made tournament winnings and nothing else even when the team had an approximately half million dollar Intel deal. They put in 40+ hours a week for more than a year to be some of the most elite people in their profession and only in a few cases are they walking away with more than minimum wage. Many of the less successful players are walking away with less than $1000 total. Does that sound like they've been spoiled?
MMA called it a slave contract for a reason. Boxer may not have had all the food/housing support when he started, but he wasn't contractually bound to a team he didn't want to play for that was paying him $0. And nobody was charging $90,000 to get Boxer out of a contract that paid him $0.
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On October 19 2012 12:20 RenSC2 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 19 2012 11:10 Taku wrote:On October 19 2012 11:07 ragz_gt wrote:On October 19 2012 11:04 GolemMadness wrote:On October 19 2012 11:02 ragz_gt wrote:On October 19 2012 10:58 LuckoftheIrish wrote:On October 19 2012 10:53 ragz_gt wrote:On October 19 2012 10:48 Dfgj wrote:On October 19 2012 10:47 ragz_gt wrote:
I'm pretty sure MMA is not a drug addict, and did not break any law that we know of (though we will find about Alicia's date with court TV I'm sure) so the analogy is nowhere near perfect. It has nothing to do with legality, it has to do with the issue of negative influence. The issue of negative influence is called run a damn house. Slayers is not the parents of its members (because those throw children under bus when going gets tough everyday, and Slayers is definitely not doing that), they are more like teacher of a class room. When one of the kid behaves badly, guess what you do not do? You do not kick other kids out. You solve the issue with the kid who have a problem. That's their job and responsibility running a team. Slayers definitely looks like incapable of doing that. You need to pay attention and read the damn documents. This isn't a situation of one player misbehaving. You need to realize that. There's a lot more going on here than that. I agree it's not one player misbehaving. But do you know what everyone misbehaving means? It means they suck at running a team. It's not everyone misbehaving. That's not said anywhere. Don't post accusations if you didn't bother to read the OP. Read the conversation. I'm saying Slayers either literally breeding evil monsters in their team house or they are incapable of solving issues that occurs when young people live together in a highly competitive highly pressured environment. And I'm leaning against latter (because former is utterly ridiculous). If you dump a ton of money on a teenager and cater to almost every one of their whims, of course they're going to turn into brats. If Boxer/Jessica are guilty of anything, I'd say it's if being naive. That and victims of their bratty players who took advantage of them. By "dump a ton of money on a teenager", did you mean, "pay them $0"? Because they were all paid $0 by their team. They did get food, housing, and (usually) transportation covered. Along with that, in their contracts, SlayerS was actually supposed to get a portion of all their players' tournament winnings. Supposedly, they never actually took any. I believe they were also prevented from streaming pretty early on which cut off one of their only abilities to make some income. If MMA would have signed with a foreign team at his peak, he'd have at least 10s of thousands of dollars more than he currently has and potentially 100s of thousands if he could hit a sweet deal with a team like EG. Instead, the players made tournament winnings and nothing else even when the team had an approximately half million dollar Intel deal. They put in 40+ hours a week for more than a year to be some of the most elite people in their profession and only in a few cases are they walking away with more than minimum wage. Many of the less successful players are walking away with less than $1000 total. Does that sound like they've been spoiled? MMA called it a slave contract for a reason. Boxer may not have had all the food/housing support when he started, but he wasn't contractually bound to a team he didn't want to play for that was paying him $0. And nobody was charging $90,000 to get Boxer out of a contract that paid him $0.
Just out of Curosity, Do you know how much it costs to feed 10-15 Growing men a month?. Do you know how much it costs to rent a apartment big enough (in a nice area of seoul too) for 10-15 men? Do you know how much gas+transit fees are in Seoul?
Nevermind Electric bills, heating and water bills (hot water is expensive in Korea IIRC). Having a maid to cook the food.
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On October 19 2012 11:47 Supamang wrote:Show nested quote +On October 19 2012 11:39 geokilla wrote:On October 19 2012 10:08 HackBenjamin wrote:On October 19 2012 09:57 geokilla wrote:
Yup... Jessica is blowing things out of proportion and going to take everyone down with her... Starcraft esports in Korea and the world won't recover well from this in my opinion. It's only going to get worse. I think her acting career will be affected as well. Wow geokilla Im so glad to see your super insightful post. Team Liquid definitely needs more fortune tellers. How is she blowing it out of proportion? Flesh out your post with some effort instead of useless shit posting. I mentioned it before somewhere in this 130+ pages thread. Didn't go into detail but basically, we're just hearing from one side of the story right now, and that's Jessica's side. The players, aside from Alicia, hasn't exactly spoken up last I checked, and I'm not going to read every single post in this thread. I'm reading mainly the OP and skimming through the posts in this thread. There is definitely some sort of huge problem within SlayerS as many mentioned before if so many people are losing trust in Jessica in such a short amount of time. Well what I believe is a short amount of time. I don't know the Korean culture well, but I won't be surprised if SlayerS was like a huge family during the 2(?) years that they were a team. Now that everything is going ape shit, Jessica is going to take everyone down with her and ex SlayerS players will be viewed in a negative way, as some already do because of Jessica's comments and stuff. If I was the manager or an esports team, as of right now, I definitely don't want any ex SlayerS players on my team until we find out more about the truth of what's happening, and what actually happened. It's a case of he said she said as I mentioned many times, and unfortunately we may never find the truth and things are only going to get worse. Look at Taeja, the genius Terran. Did Jessica really have to point him out and say that he doesn't practice as hard as MMA? Let's say that Taeja didn't practice as hard in the SlayerS house. Well it might have changed when he joined TL. That jump in skill and becoming one of the best Terrans in the world at the moment doesn't just happen overnight. I'm no programmer and I admit I'm in Platinum league, but one does not simply improve because they think "Oh this build might work, let's try it out". From what I've learned watching players, tournaments, and casts, and following programmers, it takes a lot of practice to think of the build, refine it, and make sure it works the way you wanted it to. I dont like the fact that you say that "Jessica is going to take everyone down with her" when it seemed that people always blamed her (isn't she just defending herself?). People always blamed her for shit and now its become a self fulfilling prophesy. Whenever there was some Slayers drama thread, Id read the OP and maybe if i was feeling brave Id read down the rest of the page. I'd always see some number of posts automatically saying its her fault or something when I never got that impression from the OP by itself. Now people see her as some drama queen (I doubt her TV career helped her with that one) and will automatically blame her and look to their past opinions (well founded or not) to say "see, shes always starting trouble." People love to simplify problems and blame just one thing. So far from what we've heard, I'm more sympathetic towards Jessica (obviously since weve only really heard from her). Coach Won's response seemed vague and I'm not very satisfied with it. I'd like to hear from Manager J and MMA. Those 2 seem to be, along with Jessica, at the center of the internal break down.
I'm just saying it based on what I read in the OP and stuff. I don't even remember her going through the trouble of suing fans and everything till you mentioned it just now.
Anyways, let's just sit back for a bit, and wait for more information come to light.
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On October 19 2012 12:35 masterbreti wrote:Show nested quote +On October 19 2012 12:20 RenSC2 wrote:On October 19 2012 11:10 Taku wrote:On October 19 2012 11:07 ragz_gt wrote:On October 19 2012 11:04 GolemMadness wrote:On October 19 2012 11:02 ragz_gt wrote:On October 19 2012 10:58 LuckoftheIrish wrote:On October 19 2012 10:53 ragz_gt wrote:On October 19 2012 10:48 Dfgj wrote:On October 19 2012 10:47 ragz_gt wrote:
I'm pretty sure MMA is not a drug addict, and did not break any law that we know of (though we will find about Alicia's date with court TV I'm sure) so the analogy is nowhere near perfect. It has nothing to do with legality, it has to do with the issue of negative influence. The issue of negative influence is called run a damn house. Slayers is not the parents of its members (because those throw children under bus when going gets tough everyday, and Slayers is definitely not doing that), they are more like teacher of a class room. When one of the kid behaves badly, guess what you do not do? You do not kick other kids out. You solve the issue with the kid who have a problem. That's their job and responsibility running a team. Slayers definitely looks like incapable of doing that. You need to pay attention and read the damn documents. This isn't a situation of one player misbehaving. You need to realize that. There's a lot more going on here than that. I agree it's not one player misbehaving. But do you know what everyone misbehaving means? It means they suck at running a team. It's not everyone misbehaving. That's not said anywhere. Don't post accusations if you didn't bother to read the OP. Read the conversation. I'm saying Slayers either literally breeding evil monsters in their team house or they are incapable of solving issues that occurs when young people live together in a highly competitive highly pressured environment. And I'm leaning against latter (because former is utterly ridiculous). If you dump a ton of money on a teenager and cater to almost every one of their whims, of course they're going to turn into brats. If Boxer/Jessica are guilty of anything, I'd say it's if being naive. That and victims of their bratty players who took advantage of them. By "dump a ton of money on a teenager", did you mean, "pay them $0"? Because they were all paid $0 by their team. They did get food, housing, and (usually) transportation covered. Along with that, in their contracts, SlayerS was actually supposed to get a portion of all their players' tournament winnings. Supposedly, they never actually took any. I believe they were also prevented from streaming pretty early on which cut off one of their only abilities to make some income. If MMA would have signed with a foreign team at his peak, he'd have at least 10s of thousands of dollars more than he currently has and potentially 100s of thousands if he could hit a sweet deal with a team like EG. Instead, the players made tournament winnings and nothing else even when the team had an approximately half million dollar Intel deal. They put in 40+ hours a week for more than a year to be some of the most elite people in their profession and only in a few cases are they walking away with more than minimum wage. Many of the less successful players are walking away with less than $1000 total. Does that sound like they've been spoiled? MMA called it a slave contract for a reason. Boxer may not have had all the food/housing support when he started, but he wasn't contractually bound to a team he didn't want to play for that was paying him $0. And nobody was charging $90,000 to get Boxer out of a contract that paid him $0. Just out of Curosity, Do you know how much it costs to feed 10-15 Growing men a month?. Do you know how much it costs to rent a apartment big enough (in a nice area of seoul too) for 10-15 men? Do you know how much gas+transit fees are in Seoul? Nevermind Electric bills, heating and water bills (hot water is expensive in Korea IIRC). Having a maid to cook the food.
I would guess half a million dollars when you add in transportation costs. Either that or some money went missing. I'm guessing by your location that you'd be able to give better answers than I on the costs of living in Korea.
The point was that these players weren't exactly spoiled as a lot of people seem to be saying. SlayerS paid them nothing and a few of them could have made a lot more if they weren't bound by a $0 contract.
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On October 19 2012 12:08 SeeKeR wrote:Show nested quote +On October 19 2012 11:57 mikedebo wrote:
Boxer has an autobiography called "Crazy As Me"
He should write a sequel about when he met Jessica called "But Not As Crazy As Her"
(Edit: And btw, if you haven't read the biography, go fucking read it right now!) I laughed. Really well played XD.
To quote tasteless: "I didn't ask for these powers"
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On October 19 2012 10:58 Xiphos wrote:Show nested quote +On October 19 2012 09:52 Gorlin wrote:On October 19 2012 09:38 Xyik wrote:
SlayerS players sound like a bunch of spoiled brats. Honestly, be thankful you had the support of a great team and could make a living off of playing a video game. Sometimes people just forget how lucky they are ... It absolutely baffles me that people like you make such stupid fucking conjectures like that with only one source at your disposal who is well known to bend the truth. I've liked Jessica well enough, and definitely disagree with the idiots who post shit like "what do you expect from a drama actress, that bitch is crazy", but it cannot be denied that, one, a lot of trouble is centered on her, and two, there have been many instances where she manipulates the truth to some degree. How could you possibly think, that by some ridiculous chance, all the SlayerS players just happened to be considerably more immature and stupid than the players on other teams? That's just inane. Do some fucking research, read the other sources, and fucking think before making personal attacks on people with based solely off a single, not entirely trustworthy source. On October 19 2012 09:11 Xiphos wrote:On October 19 2012 09:04 DyEnasTy wrote:
Well, if Jessica and Boxer are truthful, I sincerely hope Liquid and EG dont pick up any of their trash. That will be the last day I root for either team if one of the problem players are picked up. MMA yelled at BoxeR because he think that he is being treated as slave. And then BoxeR looked at it and thought to himself "This guy have no idea what is he talking about. He don't know the days where you have to live in a crampy apartment with 5 other guys while living off of instant noodles and would split a mere 100 dollar price pool just to be alive. What have I made, what did this industry have come into? Oh well, there is always SKT to go back to." Which I applaud him, SKT would never complain about anything. Bisu would watch his replays in conjunction to practicing. I can't even imagine Oov having attitude with BoxeR even though Oov have had more accomplishment under his belt. Same to you kid. Looking at your posts, it's extremely clear how little respect you have for the non-Kespa teams, and it's entirely obvious how you are perceiving this incident to reinforce your idea that the infallible former Brood War teams would never have these problems, and how Boxer has finally seen the light and gone back to his "true" home. Fuck you and stop being so shallow. I think someone is simply rattled because of their team getting disbanded. Just accept that BW teams' infrastructure is much better enforced.
Cute. I am admittedly rattled, but it's remarkable how even so, I'm not addressing the situation like a stupid little punk on the internet.
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On October 19 2012 11:39 geokilla wrote:Show nested quote +On October 19 2012 10:08 HackBenjamin wrote:On October 19 2012 09:57 geokilla wrote:
Yup... Jessica is blowing things out of proportion and going to take everyone down with her... Starcraft esports in Korea and the world won't recover well from this in my opinion. It's only going to get worse. I think her acting career will be affected as well. Wow geokilla Im so glad to see your super insightful post. Team Liquid definitely needs more fortune tellers. How is she blowing it out of proportion? Flesh out your post with some effort instead of useless shit posting. I mentioned it before somewhere in this 130+ pages thread. Didn't go into detail but basically, we're just hearing from one side of the story right now, and that's Jessica's side. The players, aside from Alicia, hasn't exactly spoken up last I checked, and I'm not going to read every single post in this thread. I'm reading mainly the OP and skimming through the posts in this thread. There is definitely some sort of huge problem within SlayerS as many mentioned before if so many people are losing trust in Jessica in such a short amount of time. Well what I believe is a short amount of time. I don't know the Korean culture well, but I won't be surprised if SlayerS was like a huge family during the 2(?) years that they were a team. Now that everything is going ape shit, Jessica is going to take everyone down with her and ex SlayerS players will be viewed in a negative way, as some already do because of Jessica's comments and stuff. If I was the manager or an esports team, as of right now, I definitely don't want any ex SlayerS players on my team until we find out more about the truth of what's happening, and what actually happened. It's a case of he said she said as I mentioned many times, and unfortunately we may never find the truth and things are only going to get worse. Look at Taeja, the genius Terran. Did Jessica really have to point him out and say that he doesn't practice as hard as MMA? Let's say that Taeja didn't practice as hard in the SlayerS house. Well it might have changed when he joined TL. That jump in skill and becoming one of the best Terrans in the world at the moment doesn't just happen overnight. I'm no programmer and I admit I'm in Platinum league, but one does not simply improve because they think "Oh this build might work, let's try it out". From what I've learned watching players, tournaments, and casts, and following programmers, it takes a lot of practice to think of the build, refine it, and make sure it works the way you wanted it to.
Jessica mentioned Taeja, but in a decent light. She said that he left the team in the correct terms according to his contract. Taeja didn't break any conditions when he joined teamliquid.
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On October 19 2012 12:46 RenSC2 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 19 2012 12:35 masterbreti wrote:On October 19 2012 12:20 RenSC2 wrote:On October 19 2012 11:10 Taku wrote:On October 19 2012 11:07 ragz_gt wrote:On October 19 2012 11:04 GolemMadness wrote:On October 19 2012 11:02 ragz_gt wrote:On October 19 2012 10:58 LuckoftheIrish wrote:On October 19 2012 10:53 ragz_gt wrote:On October 19 2012 10:48 Dfgj wrote:
[quote]
It has nothing to do with legality, it has to do with the issue of negative influence.
The issue of negative influence is called run a damn house. Slayers is not the parents of its members (because those throw children under bus when going gets tough everyday, and Slayers is definitely not doing that), they are more like teacher of a class room. When one of the kid behaves badly, guess what you do not do? You do not kick other kids out. You solve the issue with the kid who have a problem. That's their job and responsibility running a team. Slayers definitely looks like incapable of doing that. You need to pay attention and read the damn documents. This isn't a situation of one player misbehaving. You need to realize that. There's a lot more going on here than that. I agree it's not one player misbehaving. But do you know what everyone misbehaving means? It means they suck at running a team. It's not everyone misbehaving. That's not said anywhere. Don't post accusations if you didn't bother to read the OP. Read the conversation. I'm saying Slayers either literally breeding evil monsters in their team house or they are incapable of solving issues that occurs when young people live together in a highly competitive highly pressured environment. And I'm leaning against latter (because former is utterly ridiculous). If you dump a ton of money on a teenager and cater to almost every one of their whims, of course they're going to turn into brats. If Boxer/Jessica are guilty of anything, I'd say it's if being naive. That and victims of their bratty players who took advantage of them. By "dump a ton of money on a teenager", did you mean, "pay them $0"? Because they were all paid $0 by their team. They did get food, housing, and (usually) transportation covered. Along with that, in their contracts, SlayerS was actually supposed to get a portion of all their players' tournament winnings. Supposedly, they never actually took any. I believe they were also prevented from streaming pretty early on which cut off one of their only abilities to make some income. If MMA would have signed with a foreign team at his peak, he'd have at least 10s of thousands of dollars more than he currently has and potentially 100s of thousands if he could hit a sweet deal with a team like EG. Instead, the players made tournament winnings and nothing else even when the team had an approximately half million dollar Intel deal. They put in 40+ hours a week for more than a year to be some of the most elite people in their profession and only in a few cases are they walking away with more than minimum wage. Many of the less successful players are walking away with less than $1000 total. Does that sound like they've been spoiled? MMA called it a slave contract for a reason. Boxer may not have had all the food/housing support when he started, but he wasn't contractually bound to a team he didn't want to play for that was paying him $0. And nobody was charging $90,000 to get Boxer out of a contract that paid him $0. Just out of Curosity, Do you know how much it costs to feed 10-15 Growing men a month?. Do you know how much it costs to rent a apartment big enough (in a nice area of seoul too) for 10-15 men? Do you know how much gas+transit fees are in Seoul? Nevermind Electric bills, heating and water bills (hot water is expensive in Korea IIRC). Having a maid to cook the food. I would guess half a million dollars when you add in transportation costs. Either that or some money went missing. I'm guessing by your location that you'd be able to give better answers than I on the costs of living in Korea. The point was that these players weren't exactly spoiled as a lot of people seem to be saying. SlayerS paid them nothing and a few of them could have made a lot more if they weren't bound by a $0 contract.
Well first you have to look at buying a Van for the players, and seeing the SlayerS van itself, it would cost them a pretty penny, maybe 20-30,000 if you buy used or on a huge sale. Then renting a apartment, in a rich area where they were. It would be maybe 8-10k a month (not sure 100% on this, but I've seen smaller apartments go for around that price, in lesser areas of seoul too) and a maybe 5k security deposit
food is maybe 100-200 a week, depepnding on where you go shopping and what they want to eat.
Having to pay a maid to come and cook and clean for them would be around 300 a week (never had to hire a maid, so again, not sure on this, might be or less)
Not you are looking at Hydro, water, heating, electric, and other such costs for 10 men. So maybe 2-3k a month.
So lets tally the first months costs, nevermind stuff like uniforms, computers, or any of that stuff.
9000+5000+30000+1200+1000+3000= 49 200 dollars for the first month
Now assmuing nothing changes and they don't need new uniforms or new computers or anything apart from rent and their regular bills.
9000+1200+1000+3000= 14 200 a month
now SlayerS was formed in December 2010, so lets caculate the costs from Janurary 2011 until November 2012 (when the team is disbanding.
14200x21= 298 200 in base costs. Now lets add the first months startup costs of 49200 and we get 349 000 roughly.
Now this is just base costs, This doesn't inculde things like going out to eat, transit for players to international events (which costs a lot of money). having to buy new uniforms, or registration fees for tournaments. Or anything of that sort. Assuming nothing ever breaks or nothin new ever needs to be bought ever. For the team house alone and to cover the players expenses. It would be about 350k. Remember, this doesn't cover Boxer or Jessica's apartment or their own personal costs. This is just for the players. Mind you also I am lowballing everything here, and likely it is much more expensive.
Running a team and a teamhouse isn't cheap. The players in korea all know this and most of them don't complain, I know while I was in the prime house, none of the players ever complained about the team.
I thinkthe Manager who came in around november/december 2011 and left around Janurary of this year really made things worse. All the sponsors basically dropped SlayerS because of this guy and finally he was removed from the team. After that money was tight for SlayerS and so they had to cur corners, which made the Already unhappy MMA angry, he started to spread rumors (the same that manager J told) and the environment turned ugly from then on.
If manager J hadn't come along and screw around with SlayerS, we would have a different result here. and SlayerS would likely still be the most wealthy team around. But this manager really fucked with the atmosphere and made everyone turn against each other.
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