Destiny on where he thinks SC2 is heading. - Page 8

On October 17 2012 15:09 larse wrote:
Actually, people disagreed with Destiny's argument.

Most people for the last 2 years have been saying that there are not enough hardcore features and too many casual features. People have been asking for clan, in-game tournament, more stats, more prominent ladder 1v1, and have been criticizing the "dumb-down" of arcade and rearrangement of the order of 1v1, 2v2, 3v3, and 4v4 in the ladder screen.

Now you are blaming Blizzard of not paying attention to casuals. Of course they don't. People didn't ask for casual features but all they have asked are hardcore features. Now you just changed?

Even though I agree that casuals should be the focus rather than the hardcore, SC2's failture is the resulted from people's and the community's own fault that is the constant demand of more hardcore features and the constant blame of SC2's dumb-down features.

On October 17 2012 15:08 HaruRH wrote:


But skills from sc2 do translate to LoL/dota. Examples are plentiful, eg: iceiceice (dominated sc2 SEA ladder, now dominates dota 2), fruitdealer (went to LoL), etc

LoL,and dota managed to siphon players from sc2 to them, but sc2 isnt able to attract players from LoL and dota to them.

On October 17 2012 14:16 jalstar wrote:
Ok 1, I thought Destiny wasn't posting on reddit any more, 2, most of the things in this article are correct, but I want to focus on something else.

Are 1v1 games/sports intrinsically less interesting than team games/sports? (because humans are social animals)

I don't think Dota/LoL are competitors to SC2 any more than football is a competitor to tennis.

On October 17 2012 15:21 Fionn wrote:
Call me when a new RTS game that draws big e-sports viewership comes around. LoL/Dota2 and SC2 are different games. Different pay models. Of course there are people who are into both, but it's much easier for a 12-year-old kid to get into LoL, a game he can play with his friends for free on whatever kind of computer he has, than get into Starcraft 2, usually played 1v1, costs $60, and needs a good computer to run properly.

Valve and Riot do a better job of promoting their games, but it's not like Blizzard isn't doing anything. WCS has been awesome. They've put on some great tournaments around the globe, given a lot of money out, and we'll have to see if their grand finals can match up to The International and LoL S2 World Championship.

It's not like everything is going perfectly for LoL and Dota2. LoL had massive numbers for their finals, but they had to postpone their quarterfinals and semifinals due to problems in the arena. Dota2 had a flawless The International, but the buzz has died down and it seems like every single team that played in that tournament has disbanded, traded away players, or is dead. It's not like they're constantly drawing in view numbers like The International for their tournaments currently. To me, it's the Super Bowl Effect.

I loved The International due to it's high production, hype, and everything surrounding it. It drew huge numbers and was a mighty success. Just like how the Super Bowl in America is watched by ten times the amount of people who usually watch a weekly football game on Monday night.

I think SC2 is fine. It drew 100,000 viewers during WCS Europe and constantly gets 50,000+ during bigger tournaments. Heart of the Swarm hype isn't as big anymore because there is still thousands of Wings of Liberty tournaments going on. When a MLG, GSL, IPL, DH whatever finally switches over to HotS and we see the best players from Korea and across the world play it, the hype will be back.

On October 17 2012 15:22 Dephy wrote:
Also, the amount of stuff they planning to add in Hots is joke. I mean all they are planning to do is add 2-3 units per race, and balance some wol stuff. For fucks sakes, this is more like DLC than actual expand.
Blizzard you dont remember how much stuf tft changed from roc in wc3? Basicly all damage/armor system have been revamped, new items, new units, new heroes. Basically game changed 120% degrees.
And now with sc2 we will do same stuff, same openings, no change whatsoever. Its not even whine about balance. Its whine about there being no new content in hots.
Also why the fuck are there units that suck cock? remeber in wc3 if you made tier 3 units they owned the shit out of everything: Gryphon riders, taurens, frost wyrms, all these tier 3 units where bad ass. When you got then in your army you knew they gonna do awesome stuff.
Now in sc2 BC, Carrier is basicly joke units, thor is joke to, ultralisk is abit better, but tier 1 units like marauder still owns them hardcore, while tier 2 unit imortall, makes ultras not valible at all(in pvz).

On October 17 2012 15:21 Fionn wrote:
Call me when a new RTS game that draws big e-sports viewership comes around. LoL/Dota2 and SC2 are different games. Different pay models. Of course there are people who are into both, but it's much easier for a 12-year-old kid to get into LoL, a game he can play with his friends for free on whatever kind of computer he has, than get into Starcraft 2, usually played 1v1, costs $60, and needs a good computer to run properly.

Valve and Riot do a better job of promoting their games, but it's not like Blizzard isn't doing anything. WCS has been awesome. They've put on some great tournaments around the globe, given a lot of money out, and we'll have to see if their grand finals can match up to The International and LoL S2 World Championship.

It's not like everything is going perfectly for LoL and Dota2. LoL had massive numbers for their finals, but they had to postpone their quarterfinals and semifinals due to problems in the arena. Dota2 had a flawless The International, but the buzz has died down and it seems like every single team that played in that tournament has disbanded, traded away players, or is dead. It's not like they're constantly drawing in view numbers like The International for their tournaments currently. To me, it's the Super Bowl Effect.

I loved The International due to it's high production, hype, and everything surrounding it. It drew huge numbers and was a mighty success. Just like how the Super Bowl in America is watched by ten times the amount of people who usually watch a weekly football game on Monday night.

I think SC2 is fine. It drew 100,000 viewers during WCS Europe and constantly gets 50,000+ during bigger tournaments. Heart of the Swarm hype isn't as big anymore because there is still thousands of Wings of Liberty tournaments going on. When a MLG, GSL, IPL, DH whatever finally switches over to HotS and we see the best players from Korea and across the world play it, the hype will be back.

On October 17 2012 15:08 HaruRH wrote:


But skills from sc2 do translate to LoL/dota. Examples are plentiful, eg: iceiceice (dominated sc2 SEA ladder, now dominates dota 2), fruitdealer (went to LoL), etc

LoL,and dota managed to siphon players from sc2 to them, but sc2 isnt able to attract players from LoL and dota to them.

On October 17 2012 15:19 ChApFoU wrote:
[in response to the OP]

Or maybe we should just accept once and for all that Broodwar was a "once in a lifetime" game that will hardly be surpassed. Sure LoL is sucessful in terms of players and viewership, but would we be passionate about a 5v5, 60apm required game ?

On October 17 2012 15:33 algorithm0r wrote:
Destiny spreading some of the real shit again. Good on you Destiny - at least someone tells it like it is.

TT1 and the rest of ROOT good on you guys too - except when are you gonna let Destiny back in the club?

On October 17 2012 15:32 jmbthirteen wrote:

and Antonio Gates and Tony Gonzalez were both basketball players in college who now play in the NFL.

Also a lot of the sc2 players who went to LoL, fell on in sc2 like Fruitdealer and Rainbow.

And there is still a ton of money in sc2. Guess which game has given out more money than any other? SC2.
http://www.esportsearnings.com/games

In its 2 years of existence its paid out a million dollars more than the holy grail that is BW.

LoL has paid out 3.4 mil. 2 million was just paid out this past weekend in ONE tournament. All paid by Riot too. Dota has also paid out 3.4 mil, 3.2 mil is from the TWO Internationals. Such a large percentage of both games money has come from a total of 3 tournaments. Thats not healthy.

Arguably the second biggest Dota 2 tournament (outside of China) is happening this weekend, StarLadder 3. Quantic and EG aren't even sending their teams which qualified because its not even worth it. How often does that happen for EG in sc2? They send people everywhere all the time. Yet they won't send their Dota team to one of the biggest tournaments because its not worth it.

I love Dota 2, i find it to be a fantastic game. But its not near the size of SC2 right now. They have a LOOOONG way to go still.

Complaints that $100,000 prize pools haven't raised are ridiculous as well. Its a one hundred fucking grand! Thats a lot of money. MLG tournaments pay out more in sc2 than they do LoL. DH Valencia actually paid out more in sc2 than it did in LoL, Dota 2 and CS GO combined.