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United States23455 Posts
On August 26 2012 18:27 rj rl wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2012 18:11 GhandiEAGLE wrote:
This rollercoaster ride can only end with Kespa giving in, ESF holds all of the cards right now. For the sake of esports, clean this up Kespa all cards? Kespa still can do OSL\PL with its own players and dominate the korean scene, also it seems they dont give much fuck about international one.
Yes they do. If they didn't, they wouldn't have an English broadcast.
KeSPA has said they want to get into the international scene.
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On August 26 2012 18:26 Teddyman wrote:I don't think posters in this thread realize what a busy schedule the KeSPA teams have. To clarify, I have compiled the leagues each player in the 3 sponsored teams that were eliminated from PL today take part in. + Show Spoiler +
KT Rolster:
Acacia: -
Action: -
Barracks: -
Crazy-Hydra: -
Flash: OSL
Hoejja: -
Mind: -
Motive: -
PerfectMan: -
Stats: -
Wooki: -
Penguin: -
MyungSik: -
Hitman: -
Woongjin Stars:
Aria: -
Bisang: -
Flying: OSL
fokins: -
free: -
Light: -
Rudy: -
Shout: -
Sos: -
Sin: -
Soulkey: -
Woon: -
Zero: -
STX Soul:
Bogus: -
Calm: -
Classic: -
Dear: -
hyvaa: -
Last: OSL
Mini: -
Modesty: -
Shuttle: -
Size: -
Trap: WCG
Yourosia: -
So you are saying that in fact KESPA are holding its players back without a real purpose, other than maybe shoving GOM off ?
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Pretty sure Koreans are pissed at Kespa too and losing the entire Ro16 stage and the whole GSL v Kespa storyline would do so much damage towards the OSL's transition.
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On August 26 2012 18:09 NoobSkills wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2012 16:00 Sandermatt wrote:On August 26 2012 15:52 6NR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:39 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:37 BLinD-RawR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:31 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:24 BLinD-RawR wrote:
today's sunday, as much as I would love to ague with people in this thread there won't be any updates today. The osl starts in 2 days, I'd be surprised if there wasn't a meeting over the weekend. but nothing will be announced today, probably tomorrow. You're probably right, I'm just hoping for a resolution to this  I've been scanning the usual channels for updates. None so far, though I'll be here to update as soon as its out. If someone has any updates or anything just post it right away so we can update op. How Kespa will play this depends on how powerful they think they are, in terms of summoning larger clout among sponsors in korea and having wider margin potential of talent in the long run. If they think they are not ready yet, then I expect some concessions. But I won't be surprised if they damn GOM and ESF altogether. They are not as weak as they seem. I think this really boils down to the bottom line - money. If GOM were any powerful, they'd be killing Kespa too. Well, GOM has not yet tried to kill any other league. Not the NASl, IPL, MLG, Dreamhack, HomestoryCup, Gathering, Ironsquid, IEM or the ASUS ROG. If we speak about not beeing powerful enough, they also didn't hurt the small korean online tournaments like the ESV. You're right GOM has a very nice way of working well with others. Even still GOM had no control over the individual players, so they effectively couldn't themselves prevent the players from going to those events, and so couldn't kill any event. I also think one of the two GOM or KESPA should in fact be gone if we want the best games. If we want the players paid well while playing those great games then KESPA is the obvious choice. If we want the players to have a longer leash (which isn't necessarily a good thing) then GOM has to win. Either way one will probably have to go and all these side leagues may become forfeit or at least decreased with the number of Korean talent attending them, that is if you want the best/most creative games.
Well, if Kespa wins I doubt professional SC2 has a future. If the OSL becomes the place of highest quality play and these players are restricted to korea, then the foreign interest in SC2 will start to fade. BW had only a small foreign scene. GOM lets the foreign scene and the korean scene connect. Their players join foreign tournaments, foreign players play in the GSL. GOM might not have direct control over their players, but they have direct control over their scheduling. They arranged their scheduling so that the players can join foreign tournaments. They even asked Hero to compete in the WCS, knowing that he would drop out to join the MLG.
I am not always on GOM's side, with things like the Naniwa incident, but for sure I prefer them over Kespa, that will split the foreign and korean scene.
Edit: And in this case I do not even have to side with GOM, just with the ESF.
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On August 26 2012 18:32 Mondieu wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2012 18:26 Teddyman wrote:I don't think posters in this thread realize what a busy schedule the KeSPA teams have. To clarify, I have compiled the leagues each player in the 3 sponsored teams that were eliminated from PL today take part in. + Show Spoiler +
KT Rolster:
Acacia: -
Action: -
Barracks: -
Crazy-Hydra: -
Flash: OSL
Hoejja: -
Mind: -
Motive: -
PerfectMan: -
Stats: -
Wooki: -
Penguin: -
MyungSik: -
Hitman: -
Woongjin Stars:
Aria: -
Bisang: -
Flying: OSL
fokins: -
free: -
Light: -
Rudy: -
Shout: -
Sos: -
Sin: -
Soulkey: -
Woon: -
Zero: -
STX Soul:
Bogus: -
Calm: -
Classic: -
Dear: -
hyvaa: -
Last: OSL
Mini: -
Modesty: -
Shuttle: -
Size: -
Trap: WCG
Yourosia: -
So you are saying that in fact KESPA are holding its players back without a real purpose, other than maybe shoving GOM off ?
Yes. I also love your country and its people.
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On August 26 2012 18:09 NoobSkills wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2012 16:00 Sandermatt wrote:On August 26 2012 15:52 6NR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:39 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:37 BLinD-RawR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:31 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:24 BLinD-RawR wrote:
today's sunday, as much as I would love to ague with people in this thread there won't be any updates today. The osl starts in 2 days, I'd be surprised if there wasn't a meeting over the weekend. but nothing will be announced today, probably tomorrow. You're probably right, I'm just hoping for a resolution to this I've been scanning the usual channels for updates. None so far, though I'll be here to update as soon as its out. If someone has any updates or anything just post it right away so we can update op. How Kespa will play this depends on how powerful they think they are, in terms of summoning larger clout among sponsors in korea and having wider margin potential of talent in the long run. If they think they are not ready yet, then I expect some concessions. But I won't be surprised if they damn GOM and ESF altogether. They are not as weak as they seem. I think this really boils down to the bottom line - money. If GOM were any powerful, they'd be killing Kespa too. Well, GOM has not yet tried to kill any other league. Not the NASl, IPL, MLG, Dreamhack, HomestoryCup, Gathering, Ironsquid, IEM or the ASUS ROG. If we speak about not beeing powerful enough, they also didn't hurt the small korean online tournaments like the ESV. You're right GOM has a very nice way of working well with others. Even still GOM had no control over the individual players, so they effectively couldn't themselves prevent the players from going to those events, and so couldn't kill any event. I also think one of the two GOM or KESPA should in fact be gone if we want the best games. If we want the players paid well while playing those great games then KESPA is the obvious choice. If we want the players to have a longer leash (which isn't necessarily a good thing) then GOM has to win. Either way one will probably have to go and all these side leagues may become forfeit or at least decreased with the number of Korean talent attending them, that is if you want the best/most creative games.
Actually, if you want the average players to be paid well, KeSPA needs to die. GOM players are in a union, KeSPA players aren't.
On August 26 2012 18:30 Fionn wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2012 18:27 rj rl wrote:On August 26 2012 18:11 GhandiEAGLE wrote:
This rollercoaster ride can only end with Kespa giving in, ESF holds all of the cards right now. For the sake of esports, clean this up Kespa all cards? Kespa still can do OSL\PL with its own players and dominate the korean scene, also it seems they dont give much fuck about international one. Yes they do. If they didn't, they wouldn't have an English broadcast. KeSPA has said they want to get into the international scene.
Personally, I wouldn't hold too much weight on what they say on that. Because of the type of sponsors they have, the international scene is always going to be an after thought compare to the Korean one. This is in contrast to the GOM sponsors, which are much more international based in their operations.
Personally, I dream of a KeSPA player revolt and joining the ESF, where then the ESF becomes a player union for all teams, making leverage on both KeSPA, GOM, and Blizzard. It's a wild dream, I know.
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On August 26 2012 18:33 Sandermatt wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2012 18:09 NoobSkills wrote:On August 26 2012 16:00 Sandermatt wrote:On August 26 2012 15:52 6NR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:39 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:37 BLinD-RawR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:31 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:24 BLinD-RawR wrote:
today's sunday, as much as I would love to ague with people in this thread there won't be any updates today. The osl starts in 2 days, I'd be surprised if there wasn't a meeting over the weekend. but nothing will be announced today, probably tomorrow. You're probably right, I'm just hoping for a resolution to this I've been scanning the usual channels for updates. None so far, though I'll be here to update as soon as its out. If someone has any updates or anything just post it right away so we can update op. How Kespa will play this depends on how powerful they think they are, in terms of summoning larger clout among sponsors in korea and having wider margin potential of talent in the long run. If they think they are not ready yet, then I expect some concessions. But I won't be surprised if they damn GOM and ESF altogether. They are not as weak as they seem. I think this really boils down to the bottom line - money. If GOM were any powerful, they'd be killing Kespa too. Well, GOM has not yet tried to kill any other league. Not the NASl, IPL, MLG, Dreamhack, HomestoryCup, Gathering, Ironsquid, IEM or the ASUS ROG. If we speak about not beeing powerful enough, they also didn't hurt the small korean online tournaments like the ESV. You're right GOM has a very nice way of working well with others. Even still GOM had no control over the individual players, so they effectively couldn't themselves prevent the players from going to those events, and so couldn't kill any event. I also think one of the two GOM or KESPA should in fact be gone if we want the best games. If we want the players paid well while playing those great games then KESPA is the obvious choice. If we want the players to have a longer leash (which isn't necessarily a good thing) then GOM has to win. Either way one will probably have to go and all these side leagues may become forfeit or at least decreased with the number of Korean talent attending them, that is if you want the best/most creative games. Well, if Kespa wins I doubt professional SC2 has a future. If the OSL becomes the place of highest quality play and these players are restricted to korea, then the foreign interest in SC2 will start to fade. BW had only a small foreign scene. GOM lets the foreign scene and the korean scene connect. Their players join foreign tournaments, foreign players play in the GSL. GOM might not have direct control over their players, but they have direct control over their scheduling. They arranged their scheduling so that the players can join foreign tournaments. They even asked Hero to compete in the WCS, knowing that he would drop out to join the MLG. I am not always on GOM's side, with things like the Naniwa incident, but for sure I prefer them over Kespa, that will split the foreign and korean scene. Edit: And in this case I do not even have to side with GOM, just with the ESF.
Professional SCBW lasted 10+ years despite not having a foreign scene.
Also I think that KESPA could open their eyes to foreign involvement because of the money, what they're trying to do now, is control the market in Korea (which they probably will).
On August 26 2012 18:41 achan1058 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2012 18:09 NoobSkills wrote:On August 26 2012 16:00 Sandermatt wrote:On August 26 2012 15:52 6NR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:39 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:37 BLinD-RawR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:31 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:24 BLinD-RawR wrote:
today's sunday, as much as I would love to ague with people in this thread there won't be any updates today. The osl starts in 2 days, I'd be surprised if there wasn't a meeting over the weekend. but nothing will be announced today, probably tomorrow. You're probably right, I'm just hoping for a resolution to this I've been scanning the usual channels for updates. None so far, though I'll be here to update as soon as its out. If someone has any updates or anything just post it right away so we can update op. How Kespa will play this depends on how powerful they think they are, in terms of summoning larger clout among sponsors in korea and having wider margin potential of talent in the long run. If they think they are not ready yet, then I expect some concessions. But I won't be surprised if they damn GOM and ESF altogether. They are not as weak as they seem. I think this really boils down to the bottom line - money. If GOM were any powerful, they'd be killing Kespa too. Well, GOM has not yet tried to kill any other league. Not the NASl, IPL, MLG, Dreamhack, HomestoryCup, Gathering, Ironsquid, IEM or the ASUS ROG. If we speak about not beeing powerful enough, they also didn't hurt the small korean online tournaments like the ESV. You're right GOM has a very nice way of working well with others. Even still GOM had no control over the individual players, so they effectively couldn't themselves prevent the players from going to those events, and so couldn't kill any event. I also think one of the two GOM or KESPA should in fact be gone if we want the best games. If we want the players paid well while playing those great games then KESPA is the obvious choice. If we want the players to have a longer leash (which isn't necessarily a good thing) then GOM has to win. Either way one will probably have to go and all these side leagues may become forfeit or at least decreased with the number of Korean talent attending them, that is if you want the best/most creative games. Actually, if you want the average players to be paid well, KeSPA needs to die. GOM players are in a union, KeSPA players aren't.
Don't fool yourself some of the top players for ESf don't get paid squat (a few of them) and most don't make much even after that. Also if you want average players to get paid, they can join the average life with the rest of the world and get a job that doesn't involve being the best. Also ESF has nothing to do with player salaries for as far as I recall, and when the salary list for BW pros came out a while back some of the scrubs weren't doing too shabby for doing absolutely nothing in any league.
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On August 26 2012 18:41 achan1058 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2012 18:09 NoobSkills wrote:On August 26 2012 16:00 Sandermatt wrote:On August 26 2012 15:52 6NR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:39 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:37 BLinD-RawR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:31 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:24 BLinD-RawR wrote:
today's sunday, as much as I would love to ague with people in this thread there won't be any updates today. The osl starts in 2 days, I'd be surprised if there wasn't a meeting over the weekend. but nothing will be announced today, probably tomorrow. You're probably right, I'm just hoping for a resolution to this I've been scanning the usual channels for updates. None so far, though I'll be here to update as soon as its out. If someone has any updates or anything just post it right away so we can update op. How Kespa will play this depends on how powerful they think they are, in terms of summoning larger clout among sponsors in korea and having wider margin potential of talent in the long run. If they think they are not ready yet, then I expect some concessions. But I won't be surprised if they damn GOM and ESF altogether. They are not as weak as they seem. I think this really boils down to the bottom line - money. If GOM were any powerful, they'd be killing Kespa too. Well, GOM has not yet tried to kill any other league. Not the NASl, IPL, MLG, Dreamhack, HomestoryCup, Gathering, Ironsquid, IEM or the ASUS ROG. If we speak about not beeing powerful enough, they also didn't hurt the small korean online tournaments like the ESV. You're right GOM has a very nice way of working well with others. Even still GOM had no control over the individual players, so they effectively couldn't themselves prevent the players from going to those events, and so couldn't kill any event. I also think one of the two GOM or KESPA should in fact be gone if we want the best games. If we want the players paid well while playing those great games then KESPA is the obvious choice. If we want the players to have a longer leash (which isn't necessarily a good thing) then GOM has to win. Either way one will probably have to go and all these side leagues may become forfeit or at least decreased with the number of Korean talent attending them, that is if you want the best/most creative games. Actually, if you want the average players to be paid well, KeSPA needs to die. GOM players are in a union, KeSPA players aren't.
Even the good non-KeSPA players are not being paid well. What make you think that when KeSPA dies (if it ever does) there will be a surge of the money pouring into the scene?
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On August 26 2012 18:35 Teddyman wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2012 18:32 Mondieu wrote:On August 26 2012 18:26 Teddyman wrote:I don't think posters in this thread realize what a busy schedule the KeSPA teams have. To clarify, I have compiled the leagues each player in the 3 sponsored teams that were eliminated from PL today take part in. + Show Spoiler +
KT Rolster:
Acacia: -
Action: -
Barracks: -
Crazy-Hydra: -
Flash: OSL
Hoejja: -
Mind: -
Motive: -
PerfectMan: -
Stats: -
Wooki: -
Penguin: -
MyungSik: -
Hitman: -
Woongjin Stars:
Aria: -
Bisang: -
Flying: OSL
fokins: -
free: -
Light: -
Rudy: -
Shout: -
Sos: -
Sin: -
Soulkey: -
Woon: -
Zero: -
STX Soul:
Bogus: -
Calm: -
Classic: -
Dear: -
hyvaa: -
Last: OSL
Mini: -
Modesty: -
Shuttle: -
Size: -
Trap: WCG
Yourosia: -
So you are saying that in fact KESPA are holding its players back without a real purpose, other than maybe shoving GOM off ? Yes. I also love your country and its people.
lol XD
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On August 26 2012 18:45 chisuri wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2012 18:41 achan1058 wrote:On August 26 2012 18:09 NoobSkills wrote:On August 26 2012 16:00 Sandermatt wrote:On August 26 2012 15:52 6NR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:39 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:37 BLinD-RawR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:31 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:24 BLinD-RawR wrote:
today's sunday, as much as I would love to ague with people in this thread there won't be any updates today. The osl starts in 2 days, I'd be surprised if there wasn't a meeting over the weekend. but nothing will be announced today, probably tomorrow. You're probably right, I'm just hoping for a resolution to this I've been scanning the usual channels for updates. None so far, though I'll be here to update as soon as its out. If someone has any updates or anything just post it right away so we can update op. How Kespa will play this depends on how powerful they think they are, in terms of summoning larger clout among sponsors in korea and having wider margin potential of talent in the long run. If they think they are not ready yet, then I expect some concessions. But I won't be surprised if they damn GOM and ESF altogether. They are not as weak as they seem. I think this really boils down to the bottom line - money. If GOM were any powerful, they'd be killing Kespa too. Well, GOM has not yet tried to kill any other league. Not the NASl, IPL, MLG, Dreamhack, HomestoryCup, Gathering, Ironsquid, IEM or the ASUS ROG. If we speak about not beeing powerful enough, they also didn't hurt the small korean online tournaments like the ESV. You're right GOM has a very nice way of working well with others. Even still GOM had no control over the individual players, so they effectively couldn't themselves prevent the players from going to those events, and so couldn't kill any event. I also think one of the two GOM or KESPA should in fact be gone if we want the best games. If we want the players paid well while playing those great games then KESPA is the obvious choice. If we want the players to have a longer leash (which isn't necessarily a good thing) then GOM has to win. Either way one will probably have to go and all these side leagues may become forfeit or at least decreased with the number of Korean talent attending them, that is if you want the best/most creative games. Actually, if you want the average players to be paid well, KeSPA needs to die. GOM players are in a union, KeSPA players aren't. Even the good non-KeSPA players are not being paid well. What make you think that when KeSPA dies (if it ever does) there will be a surge of the money pouring into the scene?
I guess I shouldn't say "pay well", but "not being treated like dirt".
On August 26 2012 18:44 NoobSkills wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2012 18:33 Sandermatt wrote:On August 26 2012 18:09 NoobSkills wrote:On August 26 2012 16:00 Sandermatt wrote:On August 26 2012 15:52 6NR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:39 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:37 BLinD-RawR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:31 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:24 BLinD-RawR wrote:
today's sunday, as much as I would love to ague with people in this thread there won't be any updates today. The osl starts in 2 days, I'd be surprised if there wasn't a meeting over the weekend. but nothing will be announced today, probably tomorrow. You're probably right, I'm just hoping for a resolution to this I've been scanning the usual channels for updates. None so far, though I'll be here to update as soon as its out. If someone has any updates or anything just post it right away so we can update op. How Kespa will play this depends on how powerful they think they are, in terms of summoning larger clout among sponsors in korea and having wider margin potential of talent in the long run. If they think they are not ready yet, then I expect some concessions. But I won't be surprised if they damn GOM and ESF altogether. They are not as weak as they seem. I think this really boils down to the bottom line - money. If GOM were any powerful, they'd be killing Kespa too. Well, GOM has not yet tried to kill any other league. Not the NASl, IPL, MLG, Dreamhack, HomestoryCup, Gathering, Ironsquid, IEM or the ASUS ROG. If we speak about not beeing powerful enough, they also didn't hurt the small korean online tournaments like the ESV. You're right GOM has a very nice way of working well with others. Even still GOM had no control over the individual players, so they effectively couldn't themselves prevent the players from going to those events, and so couldn't kill any event. I also think one of the two GOM or KESPA should in fact be gone if we want the best games. If we want the players paid well while playing those great games then KESPA is the obvious choice. If we want the players to have a longer leash (which isn't necessarily a good thing) then GOM has to win. Either way one will probably have to go and all these side leagues may become forfeit or at least decreased with the number of Korean talent attending them, that is if you want the best/most creative games. Well, if Kespa wins I doubt professional SC2 has a future. If the OSL becomes the place of highest quality play and these players are restricted to korea, then the foreign interest in SC2 will start to fade. BW had only a small foreign scene. GOM lets the foreign scene and the korean scene connect. Their players join foreign tournaments, foreign players play in the GSL. GOM might not have direct control over their players, but they have direct control over their scheduling. They arranged their scheduling so that the players can join foreign tournaments. They even asked Hero to compete in the WCS, knowing that he would drop out to join the MLG. I am not always on GOM's side, with things like the Naniwa incident, but for sure I prefer them over Kespa, that will split the foreign and korean scene. Edit: And in this case I do not even have to side with GOM, just with the ESF. Professional SCBW lasted 10+ years despite not having a foreign scene. Also I think that KESPA could open their eyes to foreign involvement because of the money, what they're trying to do now, is control the market in Korea (which they probably will). Show nested quote +On August 26 2012 18:41 achan1058 wrote:On August 26 2012 18:09 NoobSkills wrote:On August 26 2012 16:00 Sandermatt wrote:On August 26 2012 15:52 6NR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:39 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:37 BLinD-RawR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:31 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:24 BLinD-RawR wrote:
today's sunday, as much as I would love to ague with people in this thread there won't be any updates today. The osl starts in 2 days, I'd be surprised if there wasn't a meeting over the weekend. but nothing will be announced today, probably tomorrow. You're probably right, I'm just hoping for a resolution to this I've been scanning the usual channels for updates. None so far, though I'll be here to update as soon as its out. If someone has any updates or anything just post it right away so we can update op. How Kespa will play this depends on how powerful they think they are, in terms of summoning larger clout among sponsors in korea and having wider margin potential of talent in the long run. If they think they are not ready yet, then I expect some concessions. But I won't be surprised if they damn GOM and ESF altogether. They are not as weak as they seem. I think this really boils down to the bottom line - money. If GOM were any powerful, they'd be killing Kespa too. Well, GOM has not yet tried to kill any other league. Not the NASl, IPL, MLG, Dreamhack, HomestoryCup, Gathering, Ironsquid, IEM or the ASUS ROG. If we speak about not beeing powerful enough, they also didn't hurt the small korean online tournaments like the ESV. You're right GOM has a very nice way of working well with others. Even still GOM had no control over the individual players, so they effectively couldn't themselves prevent the players from going to those events, and so couldn't kill any event. I also think one of the two GOM or KESPA should in fact be gone if we want the best games. If we want the players paid well while playing those great games then KESPA is the obvious choice. If we want the players to have a longer leash (which isn't necessarily a good thing) then GOM has to win. Either way one will probably have to go and all these side leagues may become forfeit or at least decreased with the number of Korean talent attending them, that is if you want the best/most creative games. Actually, if you want the average players to be paid well, KeSPA needs to die. GOM players are in a union, KeSPA players aren't. Don't fool yourself some of the top players for ESf don't get paid squat (a few of them) and most don't make much even after that. Also if you want average players to get paid, they can join the average life with the rest of the world and get a job that doesn't involve being the best. Also ESF has nothing to do with player salaries for as far as I recall, and when the salary list for BW pros came out a while back some of the scrubs weren't doing too shabby for doing absolutely nothing in any league.
Thank you for clarifying. I finally understood that article from FXOBoSs regarding on Stork's comment, then.
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On August 26 2012 18:44 NoobSkills wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2012 18:33 Sandermatt wrote:On August 26 2012 18:09 NoobSkills wrote:On August 26 2012 16:00 Sandermatt wrote:On August 26 2012 15:52 6NR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:39 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:37 BLinD-RawR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:31 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:24 BLinD-RawR wrote:
today's sunday, as much as I would love to ague with people in this thread there won't be any updates today. The osl starts in 2 days, I'd be surprised if there wasn't a meeting over the weekend. but nothing will be announced today, probably tomorrow. You're probably right, I'm just hoping for a resolution to this I've been scanning the usual channels for updates. None so far, though I'll be here to update as soon as its out. If someone has any updates or anything just post it right away so we can update op. How Kespa will play this depends on how powerful they think they are, in terms of summoning larger clout among sponsors in korea and having wider margin potential of talent in the long run. If they think they are not ready yet, then I expect some concessions. But I won't be surprised if they damn GOM and ESF altogether. They are not as weak as they seem. I think this really boils down to the bottom line - money. If GOM were any powerful, they'd be killing Kespa too. Well, GOM has not yet tried to kill any other league. Not the NASl, IPL, MLG, Dreamhack, HomestoryCup, Gathering, Ironsquid, IEM or the ASUS ROG. If we speak about not beeing powerful enough, they also didn't hurt the small korean online tournaments like the ESV. You're right GOM has a very nice way of working well with others. Even still GOM had no control over the individual players, so they effectively couldn't themselves prevent the players from going to those events, and so couldn't kill any event. I also think one of the two GOM or KESPA should in fact be gone if we want the best games. If we want the players paid well while playing those great games then KESPA is the obvious choice. If we want the players to have a longer leash (which isn't necessarily a good thing) then GOM has to win. Either way one will probably have to go and all these side leagues may become forfeit or at least decreased with the number of Korean talent attending them, that is if you want the best/most creative games. Well, if Kespa wins I doubt professional SC2 has a future. If the OSL becomes the place of highest quality play and these players are restricted to korea, then the foreign interest in SC2 will start to fade. BW had only a small foreign scene. GOM lets the foreign scene and the korean scene connect. Their players join foreign tournaments, foreign players play in the GSL. GOM might not have direct control over their players, but they have direct control over their scheduling. They arranged their scheduling so that the players can join foreign tournaments. They even asked Hero to compete in the WCS, knowing that he would drop out to join the MLG. I am not always on GOM's side, with things like the Naniwa incident, but for sure I prefer them over Kespa, that will split the foreign and korean scene. Edit: And in this case I do not even have to side with GOM, just with the ESF. Professional SCBW lasted 10+ years despite not having a foreign scene. Also I think that KESPA could open their eyes to foreign involvement because of the money, what they're trying to do now, is control the market in Korea (which they probably will).
The difference to BW is that the fanbase for BW is in korea. The fanbase for SC2 is international. If they stick to korea, they are dependant on the BW fans swithcing over to SC2, a game that many BW fans do not like.
If they want the international audience, they will need foreign players and the esf players.
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On August 26 2012 18:45 chisuri wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2012 18:41 achan1058 wrote:On August 26 2012 18:09 NoobSkills wrote:On August 26 2012 16:00 Sandermatt wrote:On August 26 2012 15:52 6NR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:39 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:37 BLinD-RawR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:31 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:24 BLinD-RawR wrote:
today's sunday, as much as I would love to ague with people in this thread there won't be any updates today. The osl starts in 2 days, I'd be surprised if there wasn't a meeting over the weekend. but nothing will be announced today, probably tomorrow. You're probably right, I'm just hoping for a resolution to this I've been scanning the usual channels for updates. None so far, though I'll be here to update as soon as its out. If someone has any updates or anything just post it right away so we can update op. How Kespa will play this depends on how powerful they think they are, in terms of summoning larger clout among sponsors in korea and having wider margin potential of talent in the long run. If they think they are not ready yet, then I expect some concessions. But I won't be surprised if they damn GOM and ESF altogether. They are not as weak as they seem. I think this really boils down to the bottom line - money. If GOM were any powerful, they'd be killing Kespa too. Well, GOM has not yet tried to kill any other league. Not the NASl, IPL, MLG, Dreamhack, HomestoryCup, Gathering, Ironsquid, IEM or the ASUS ROG. If we speak about not beeing powerful enough, they also didn't hurt the small korean online tournaments like the ESV. You're right GOM has a very nice way of working well with others. Even still GOM had no control over the individual players, so they effectively couldn't themselves prevent the players from going to those events, and so couldn't kill any event. I also think one of the two GOM or KESPA should in fact be gone if we want the best games. If we want the players paid well while playing those great games then KESPA is the obvious choice. If we want the players to have a longer leash (which isn't necessarily a good thing) then GOM has to win. Either way one will probably have to go and all these side leagues may become forfeit or at least decreased with the number of Korean talent attending them, that is if you want the best/most creative games. Actually, if you want the average players to be paid well, KeSPA needs to die. GOM players are in a union, KeSPA players aren't. Even the good non-KeSPA players are not being paid well. What make you think that when KeSPA dies (if it ever does) there will be a surge of the money pouring into the scene?
The good non-Kespa players make a lot trough price money. Also the foreign teams pay much better than the korean esf teams. Additionally non.Kespa players can also make money trough streaming, something Kespa players can't.
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On August 26 2012 18:47 achan1058 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2012 18:45 chisuri wrote:On August 26 2012 18:41 achan1058 wrote:On August 26 2012 18:09 NoobSkills wrote:On August 26 2012 16:00 Sandermatt wrote:On August 26 2012 15:52 6NR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:39 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:37 BLinD-RawR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:31 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:24 BLinD-RawR wrote:
today's sunday, as much as I would love to ague with people in this thread there won't be any updates today. The osl starts in 2 days, I'd be surprised if there wasn't a meeting over the weekend. but nothing will be announced today, probably tomorrow. You're probably right, I'm just hoping for a resolution to this I've been scanning the usual channels for updates. None so far, though I'll be here to update as soon as its out. If someone has any updates or anything just post it right away so we can update op. How Kespa will play this depends on how powerful they think they are, in terms of summoning larger clout among sponsors in korea and having wider margin potential of talent in the long run. If they think they are not ready yet, then I expect some concessions. But I won't be surprised if they damn GOM and ESF altogether. They are not as weak as they seem. I think this really boils down to the bottom line - money. If GOM were any powerful, they'd be killing Kespa too. Well, GOM has not yet tried to kill any other league. Not the NASl, IPL, MLG, Dreamhack, HomestoryCup, Gathering, Ironsquid, IEM or the ASUS ROG. If we speak about not beeing powerful enough, they also didn't hurt the small korean online tournaments like the ESV. You're right GOM has a very nice way of working well with others. Even still GOM had no control over the individual players, so they effectively couldn't themselves prevent the players from going to those events, and so couldn't kill any event. I also think one of the two GOM or KESPA should in fact be gone if we want the best games. If we want the players paid well while playing those great games then KESPA is the obvious choice. If we want the players to have a longer leash (which isn't necessarily a good thing) then GOM has to win. Either way one will probably have to go and all these side leagues may become forfeit or at least decreased with the number of Korean talent attending them, that is if you want the best/most creative games. Actually, if you want the average players to be paid well, KeSPA needs to die. GOM players are in a union, KeSPA players aren't. Even the good non-KeSPA players are not being paid well. What make you think that when KeSPA dies (if it ever does) there will be a surge of the money pouring into the scene? I guess I shouldn't say "pay well", but "not being treated like dirt". Show nested quote +On August 26 2012 18:44 NoobSkills wrote:On August 26 2012 18:33 Sandermatt wrote:On August 26 2012 18:09 NoobSkills wrote:On August 26 2012 16:00 Sandermatt wrote:On August 26 2012 15:52 6NR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:39 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:37 BLinD-RawR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:31 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:24 BLinD-RawR wrote:
today's sunday, as much as I would love to ague with people in this thread there won't be any updates today. The osl starts in 2 days, I'd be surprised if there wasn't a meeting over the weekend. but nothing will be announced today, probably tomorrow. You're probably right, I'm just hoping for a resolution to this I've been scanning the usual channels for updates. None so far, though I'll be here to update as soon as its out. If someone has any updates or anything just post it right away so we can update op. How Kespa will play this depends on how powerful they think they are, in terms of summoning larger clout among sponsors in korea and having wider margin potential of talent in the long run. If they think they are not ready yet, then I expect some concessions. But I won't be surprised if they damn GOM and ESF altogether. They are not as weak as they seem. I think this really boils down to the bottom line - money. If GOM were any powerful, they'd be killing Kespa too. Well, GOM has not yet tried to kill any other league. Not the NASl, IPL, MLG, Dreamhack, HomestoryCup, Gathering, Ironsquid, IEM or the ASUS ROG. If we speak about not beeing powerful enough, they also didn't hurt the small korean online tournaments like the ESV. You're right GOM has a very nice way of working well with others. Even still GOM had no control over the individual players, so they effectively couldn't themselves prevent the players from going to those events, and so couldn't kill any event. I also think one of the two GOM or KESPA should in fact be gone if we want the best games. If we want the players paid well while playing those great games then KESPA is the obvious choice. If we want the players to have a longer leash (which isn't necessarily a good thing) then GOM has to win. Either way one will probably have to go and all these side leagues may become forfeit or at least decreased with the number of Korean talent attending them, that is if you want the best/most creative games. Well, if Kespa wins I doubt professional SC2 has a future. If the OSL becomes the place of highest quality play and these players are restricted to korea, then the foreign interest in SC2 will start to fade. BW had only a small foreign scene. GOM lets the foreign scene and the korean scene connect. Their players join foreign tournaments, foreign players play in the GSL. GOM might not have direct control over their players, but they have direct control over their scheduling. They arranged their scheduling so that the players can join foreign tournaments. They even asked Hero to compete in the WCS, knowing that he would drop out to join the MLG. I am not always on GOM's side, with things like the Naniwa incident, but for sure I prefer them over Kespa, that will split the foreign and korean scene. Edit: And in this case I do not even have to side with GOM, just with the ESF. Professional SCBW lasted 10+ years despite not having a foreign scene. Also I think that KESPA could open their eyes to foreign involvement because of the money, what they're trying to do now, is control the market in Korea (which they probably will). On August 26 2012 18:41 achan1058 wrote:On August 26 2012 18:09 NoobSkills wrote:On August 26 2012 16:00 Sandermatt wrote:On August 26 2012 15:52 6NR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:39 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:37 BLinD-RawR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:31 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:24 BLinD-RawR wrote:
today's sunday, as much as I would love to ague with people in this thread there won't be any updates today. The osl starts in 2 days, I'd be surprised if there wasn't a meeting over the weekend. but nothing will be announced today, probably tomorrow. You're probably right, I'm just hoping for a resolution to this I've been scanning the usual channels for updates. None so far, though I'll be here to update as soon as its out. If someone has any updates or anything just post it right away so we can update op. How Kespa will play this depends on how powerful they think they are, in terms of summoning larger clout among sponsors in korea and having wider margin potential of talent in the long run. If they think they are not ready yet, then I expect some concessions. But I won't be surprised if they damn GOM and ESF altogether. They are not as weak as they seem. I think this really boils down to the bottom line - money. If GOM were any powerful, they'd be killing Kespa too. Well, GOM has not yet tried to kill any other league. Not the NASl, IPL, MLG, Dreamhack, HomestoryCup, Gathering, Ironsquid, IEM or the ASUS ROG. If we speak about not beeing powerful enough, they also didn't hurt the small korean online tournaments like the ESV. You're right GOM has a very nice way of working well with others. Even still GOM had no control over the individual players, so they effectively couldn't themselves prevent the players from going to those events, and so couldn't kill any event. I also think one of the two GOM or KESPA should in fact be gone if we want the best games. If we want the players paid well while playing those great games then KESPA is the obvious choice. If we want the players to have a longer leash (which isn't necessarily a good thing) then GOM has to win. Either way one will probably have to go and all these side leagues may become forfeit or at least decreased with the number of Korean talent attending them, that is if you want the best/most creative games. Actually, if you want the average players to be paid well, KeSPA needs to die. GOM players are in a union, KeSPA players aren't. Don't fool yourself some of the top players for ESf don't get paid squat (a few of them) and most don't make much even after that. Also if you want average players to get paid, they can join the average life with the rest of the world and get a job that doesn't involve being the best. Also ESF has nothing to do with player salaries for as far as I recall, and when the salary list for BW pros came out a while back some of the scrubs weren't doing too shabby for doing absolutely nothing in any league. Thank you for clarifying. I finally understood that article from FXOBoSs regarding on Stork's comment, then.
Yea, KESPA has taken care of their own monetarily, but for that they pay in almost slave like standards in a way. It isn't like they can't leave, but it is an intense 24/7 job which holds them to high standards. ESF and GOM give them plenty of slack, but that slack in certain ways deters from the game and even with that slack, the freedom they do have, they have no money to show for their "career" path.
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On August 26 2012 18:48 Sandermatt wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2012 18:44 NoobSkills wrote:On August 26 2012 18:33 Sandermatt wrote:On August 26 2012 18:09 NoobSkills wrote:On August 26 2012 16:00 Sandermatt wrote:On August 26 2012 15:52 6NR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:39 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:37 BLinD-RawR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:31 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:24 BLinD-RawR wrote:
today's sunday, as much as I would love to ague with people in this thread there won't be any updates today. The osl starts in 2 days, I'd be surprised if there wasn't a meeting over the weekend. but nothing will be announced today, probably tomorrow. You're probably right, I'm just hoping for a resolution to this I've been scanning the usual channels for updates. None so far, though I'll be here to update as soon as its out. If someone has any updates or anything just post it right away so we can update op. How Kespa will play this depends on how powerful they think they are, in terms of summoning larger clout among sponsors in korea and having wider margin potential of talent in the long run. If they think they are not ready yet, then I expect some concessions. But I won't be surprised if they damn GOM and ESF altogether. They are not as weak as they seem. I think this really boils down to the bottom line - money. If GOM were any powerful, they'd be killing Kespa too. Well, GOM has not yet tried to kill any other league. Not the NASl, IPL, MLG, Dreamhack, HomestoryCup, Gathering, Ironsquid, IEM or the ASUS ROG. If we speak about not beeing powerful enough, they also didn't hurt the small korean online tournaments like the ESV. You're right GOM has a very nice way of working well with others. Even still GOM had no control over the individual players, so they effectively couldn't themselves prevent the players from going to those events, and so couldn't kill any event. I also think one of the two GOM or KESPA should in fact be gone if we want the best games. If we want the players paid well while playing those great games then KESPA is the obvious choice. If we want the players to have a longer leash (which isn't necessarily a good thing) then GOM has to win. Either way one will probably have to go and all these side leagues may become forfeit or at least decreased with the number of Korean talent attending them, that is if you want the best/most creative games. Well, if Kespa wins I doubt professional SC2 has a future. If the OSL becomes the place of highest quality play and these players are restricted to korea, then the foreign interest in SC2 will start to fade. BW had only a small foreign scene. GOM lets the foreign scene and the korean scene connect. Their players join foreign tournaments, foreign players play in the GSL. GOM might not have direct control over their players, but they have direct control over their scheduling. They arranged their scheduling so that the players can join foreign tournaments. They even asked Hero to compete in the WCS, knowing that he would drop out to join the MLG. I am not always on GOM's side, with things like the Naniwa incident, but for sure I prefer them over Kespa, that will split the foreign and korean scene. Edit: And in this case I do not even have to side with GOM, just with the ESF. Professional SCBW lasted 10+ years despite not having a foreign scene. Also I think that KESPA could open their eyes to foreign involvement because of the money, what they're trying to do now, is control the market in Korea (which they probably will). The difference to BW is that the fanbase for BW is in korea. The fanbase for SC2 is international. If they stick to korea, they are dependant on the BW fans swithcing over to SC2, a game that many BW fans do not like. If they want the international audience, they will need foreign players and the esf players.
Completely agree with this. Kespa is defenitely on the losing end here.
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9071 Posts
jeopardizing a running tournament with a set sponsorship is really throwing the nukes by ESF. how is KeSPA all in the wrong I cant understand.
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On August 26 2012 18:51 Sandermatt wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2012 18:45 chisuri wrote:On August 26 2012 18:41 achan1058 wrote:On August 26 2012 18:09 NoobSkills wrote:On August 26 2012 16:00 Sandermatt wrote:On August 26 2012 15:52 6NR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:39 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:37 BLinD-RawR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:31 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:24 BLinD-RawR wrote:
today's sunday, as much as I would love to ague with people in this thread there won't be any updates today. The osl starts in 2 days, I'd be surprised if there wasn't a meeting over the weekend. but nothing will be announced today, probably tomorrow. You're probably right, I'm just hoping for a resolution to this I've been scanning the usual channels for updates. None so far, though I'll be here to update as soon as its out. If someone has any updates or anything just post it right away so we can update op. How Kespa will play this depends on how powerful they think they are, in terms of summoning larger clout among sponsors in korea and having wider margin potential of talent in the long run. If they think they are not ready yet, then I expect some concessions. But I won't be surprised if they damn GOM and ESF altogether. They are not as weak as they seem. I think this really boils down to the bottom line - money. If GOM were any powerful, they'd be killing Kespa too. Well, GOM has not yet tried to kill any other league. Not the NASl, IPL, MLG, Dreamhack, HomestoryCup, Gathering, Ironsquid, IEM or the ASUS ROG. If we speak about not beeing powerful enough, they also didn't hurt the small korean online tournaments like the ESV. You're right GOM has a very nice way of working well with others. Even still GOM had no control over the individual players, so they effectively couldn't themselves prevent the players from going to those events, and so couldn't kill any event. I also think one of the two GOM or KESPA should in fact be gone if we want the best games. If we want the players paid well while playing those great games then KESPA is the obvious choice. If we want the players to have a longer leash (which isn't necessarily a good thing) then GOM has to win. Either way one will probably have to go and all these side leagues may become forfeit or at least decreased with the number of Korean talent attending them, that is if you want the best/most creative games. Actually, if you want the average players to be paid well, KeSPA needs to die. GOM players are in a union, KeSPA players aren't. Even the good non-KeSPA players are not being paid well. What make you think that when KeSPA dies (if it ever does) there will be a surge of the money pouring into the scene? The good non-Kespa players make a lot trough price money. Also the foreign teams pay much better than the korean esf teams. Additionally non.Kespa players can also make money trough streaming, something Kespa players can't.
If the business model of non-KeSPA teams is good then they don't have to do anything. KeSPA will die because it won't able to compete with superior organizations.
If the foreign teams are good, the players can join them, but so far they still choose to stay in KeSPA teams. I wonder why?
And streaming is bad for your results. That's why KeSPA players are superior, they follow a better practice regime. Streaming will distract you and allow opponents to study you. Again, if KeSPA's not allowing players to stream such a bad thing then they can leave. But they don't and won't do so. Ever wonder why?
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On August 26 2012 18:51 Sandermatt wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2012 18:45 chisuri wrote:On August 26 2012 18:41 achan1058 wrote:On August 26 2012 18:09 NoobSkills wrote:On August 26 2012 16:00 Sandermatt wrote:On August 26 2012 15:52 6NR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:39 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:37 BLinD-RawR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:31 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:24 BLinD-RawR wrote:
today's sunday, as much as I would love to ague with people in this thread there won't be any updates today. The osl starts in 2 days, I'd be surprised if there wasn't a meeting over the weekend. but nothing will be announced today, probably tomorrow. You're probably right, I'm just hoping for a resolution to this I've been scanning the usual channels for updates. None so far, though I'll be here to update as soon as its out. If someone has any updates or anything just post it right away so we can update op. How Kespa will play this depends on how powerful they think they are, in terms of summoning larger clout among sponsors in korea and having wider margin potential of talent in the long run. If they think they are not ready yet, then I expect some concessions. But I won't be surprised if they damn GOM and ESF altogether. They are not as weak as they seem. I think this really boils down to the bottom line - money. If GOM were any powerful, they'd be killing Kespa too. Well, GOM has not yet tried to kill any other league. Not the NASl, IPL, MLG, Dreamhack, HomestoryCup, Gathering, Ironsquid, IEM or the ASUS ROG. If we speak about not beeing powerful enough, they also didn't hurt the small korean online tournaments like the ESV. You're right GOM has a very nice way of working well with others. Even still GOM had no control over the individual players, so they effectively couldn't themselves prevent the players from going to those events, and so couldn't kill any event. I also think one of the two GOM or KESPA should in fact be gone if we want the best games. If we want the players paid well while playing those great games then KESPA is the obvious choice. If we want the players to have a longer leash (which isn't necessarily a good thing) then GOM has to win. Either way one will probably have to go and all these side leagues may become forfeit or at least decreased with the number of Korean talent attending them, that is if you want the best/most creative games. Actually, if you want the average players to be paid well, KeSPA needs to die. GOM players are in a union, KeSPA players aren't. Even the good non-KeSPA players are not being paid well. What make you think that when KeSPA dies (if it ever does) there will be a surge of the money pouring into the scene? The good non-Kespa players make a lot trough price money. Also the foreign teams pay much better than the korean esf teams. Additionally non.Kespa players can also make money trough streaming, something Kespa players can't.
Prize money goes to the winners. Did you have an off season? Your mother sick? Your bills unpaid? Shit happens and then you'd rather have that safe paycheck. Additionally non.Kespa players can't really stream anymore. Look to the right this is their time to be awake. Also if you didn't know the pay from streaming is squat EXCEPT again for the very best. KESPA players can't because they don't want to happen what has been happening. Games losing value because they spotted by next weeks opponent while the guy is playing ladder, no tips, not hints, no clues.
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On August 26 2012 18:26 Teddyman wrote:I don't think posters in this thread realize what a busy schedule the KeSPA teams have. To clarify, I have compiled the leagues each player in the 3 sponsored teams that were eliminated from PL today take part in. + Show Spoiler +
KT Rolster:
Acacia: -
Action: -
Barracks: -
Crazy-Hydra: -
Flash: OSL
Hoejja: -
Mind: -
Motive: -
PerfectMan: -
Stats: -
Wooki: -
Penguin: -
MyungSik: -
Hitman: -
Woongjin Stars:
Aria: -
Bisang: -
Flying: OSL
fokins: -
free: -
Light: -
Rudy: -
Shout: -
Sos: -
Sin: -
Soulkey: -
Woon: -
Zero: -
STX Soul:
Bogus: -
Calm: -
Classic: -
Dear: -
hyvaa: -
Last: OSL
Mini: -
Modesty: -
Shuttle: -
Size: -
Trap: WCG
Yourosia: -
Lol this is probably the best post in the thread.
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On August 26 2012 18:57 quannguyen wrote:Show nested quote +On August 26 2012 18:48 Sandermatt wrote:On August 26 2012 18:44 NoobSkills wrote:On August 26 2012 18:33 Sandermatt wrote:On August 26 2012 18:09 NoobSkills wrote:On August 26 2012 16:00 Sandermatt wrote:On August 26 2012 15:52 6NR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:39 bo1b wrote:On August 26 2012 15:37 BLinD-RawR wrote:On August 26 2012 15:31 bo1b wrote:
[quote]
The osl starts in 2 days, I'd be surprised if there wasn't a meeting over the weekend. but nothing will be announced today, probably tomorrow. You're probably right, I'm just hoping for a resolution to this I've been scanning the usual channels for updates. None so far, though I'll be here to update as soon as its out. If someone has any updates or anything just post it right away so we can update op. How Kespa will play this depends on how powerful they think they are, in terms of summoning larger clout among sponsors in korea and having wider margin potential of talent in the long run. If they think they are not ready yet, then I expect some concessions. But I won't be surprised if they damn GOM and ESF altogether. They are not as weak as they seem. I think this really boils down to the bottom line - money. If GOM were any powerful, they'd be killing Kespa too. Well, GOM has not yet tried to kill any other league. Not the NASl, IPL, MLG, Dreamhack, HomestoryCup, Gathering, Ironsquid, IEM or the ASUS ROG. If we speak about not beeing powerful enough, they also didn't hurt the small korean online tournaments like the ESV. You're right GOM has a very nice way of working well with others. Even still GOM had no control over the individual players, so they effectively couldn't themselves prevent the players from going to those events, and so couldn't kill any event. I also think one of the two GOM or KESPA should in fact be gone if we want the best games. If we want the players paid well while playing those great games then KESPA is the obvious choice. If we want the players to have a longer leash (which isn't necessarily a good thing) then GOM has to win. Either way one will probably have to go and all these side leagues may become forfeit or at least decreased with the number of Korean talent attending them, that is if you want the best/most creative games. Well, if Kespa wins I doubt professional SC2 has a future. If the OSL becomes the place of highest quality play and these players are restricted to korea, then the foreign interest in SC2 will start to fade. BW had only a small foreign scene. GOM lets the foreign scene and the korean scene connect. Their players join foreign tournaments, foreign players play in the GSL. GOM might not have direct control over their players, but they have direct control over their scheduling. They arranged their scheduling so that the players can join foreign tournaments. They even asked Hero to compete in the WCS, knowing that he would drop out to join the MLG. I am not always on GOM's side, with things like the Naniwa incident, but for sure I prefer them over Kespa, that will split the foreign and korean scene. Edit: And in this case I do not even have to side with GOM, just with the ESF. Professional SCBW lasted 10+ years despite not having a foreign scene. Also I think that KESPA could open their eyes to foreign involvement because of the money, what they're trying to do now, is control the market in Korea (which they probably will). The difference to BW is that the fanbase for BW is in korea. The fanbase for SC2 is international. If they stick to korea, they are dependant on the BW fans swithcing over to SC2, a game that many BW fans do not like. If they want the international audience, they will need foreign players and the esf players. Completely agree with this. Kespa is defenitely on the losing end here.
Then let it stick to its old way of practice and die off that. You will be happy then, right? Why does ESF have to interfere with how KeSPA makes decisions? Trying to save the organization?
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EPT
