On June 28 2012 13:31 rysecake wrote: ^ we've already answered this. The NAME of the tournament itself gives the prestige. Starcraft pros have wet dreams over winning a starleague. It could have a prize pool of zero for all they care, winning this title is like winning the world cup.
Thank you guys for answering. <3
Sure BroodWar players have wet dreams about winning OSL but do StarCraft 2 players have wet dreams about the OSL? It's kind of a different world, no?
On June 28 2012 07:51 neoghaleon55 wrote: Does anyone know the prize pool of an OSL on average, or how much 1st place gets? I've been looking at old OSL like the 2011 Jin Air OSL, but no prizes were reported.
Please tell me that the winner of this ridiculously grueling tournament gets at least something for their efforts....
it's a similar prize pool to gsl, winner gets 40k and so on i think
Thanks GSL is 50,000K
Longer tourney with less money though I heard it used to be the most prestigious.... .... not sure how much it's worth these days.
used to be?
It IS the most prestigious tournament
Well what exactly makes it more prestigious then?
I guess to explain my view, the most prestigious league should have
1. Big Names and Sponsors 2. The biggest prize pool 3. The current top players
Being a longer tournament that lasts half a year may leave the current top players out. Remember just in the last GSL, all the Zergs died off by the round of 16. Yet in the last few weeks Zergs have been dominating tournaments world wide. The point is the meta-game will shift faster than the tournament itself.
This fact coupled with the substantially smaller prize pool makes it hard to argue that OSL is MOST Prestigious.
I have no doubt that it is a top tier premier league, but I'm holding reservations on calling it "the BEST" for now.
Also, It's pretty hard to compare global viewership without counting the VODS. Remember that GSL is now a global show instead of just Korean Mainstream, thus to discredit VOD-views, which most foreigners watch instead of live, may underestimate the overall viewership.
I think what neoghaleon tries to argue is that "the GSL is what shaping the highest level of play in Korean SC2 (and to a certain extent, the world) scene since the beginning and makes SC2 as we know today. So as an SC2 tournament, GSL should be considered more prestigious than OSL because it is the tournament that established the scene and OSL still has not prove it's prestige in SC2 scene yet. Couple with the bigger prize even makes GSL more prestigious". This is kinda understanble, especially if he did not follow BW.
I don't have any thoughtful comment whether OSL or GSL is more prestigious in SC2 scene but I would say they both hold their own values. GSL is what making the highest level of today's games possible, but at the same time OSL is still the most prestigious "Starcraft" league to date. It depends on the quality of games, especially from KesPA's players, that would make OSL the most prestigious league in the truest sense (highest level of play and longest running league).
EDIT: And the discussion had proceeded so much before I hit "post reply" button
On June 28 2012 13:31 rysecake wrote: ^ we've already answered this. The NAME of the tournament itself gives the prestige. Starcraft pros have wet dreams over winning a starleague. It could have a prize pool of zero for all they care, winning this title is like winning the world cup.
Thank you guys for answering. <3
Sure BroodWar players have wet dreams about winning OSL but do StarCraft 2 players have wet dreams about the OSL? It's kind of a different world, no?
the majority of the sc2 players are bw players.
mvp, mc, nestea, forgg, drg, jinro, squirtle, symbol, etc.etc.etc. i could go on forever
even those outside of bw (wc3 plyers) know how much an osl is worth prestige wise. That's why you see so many unknown names here (some of them from bw, some of them from who knows where)
On June 28 2012 07:51 neoghaleon55 wrote: Does anyone know the prize pool of an OSL on average, or how much 1st place gets? I've been looking at old OSL like the 2011 Jin Air OSL, but no prizes were reported.
Please tell me that the winner of this ridiculously grueling tournament gets at least something for their efforts....
the winner of this ridiculously grueling tournament gets the title of best player in the world. This is THE most prestigious starcraft tournament there is. No one does the osl for the money. You're only here for the glory.
Is it possible to argue that OSL is more prestigious than the GSL? Especially when GSL has been the biggest premier StarCraft 2 league since the game's release, GSL has a bigger prize pool and overall prize output per year right now. Not to mention the whole OSL in Star2 hasn't even started yet.
I find it hard to swallow that an upcoming league, though popular during BW days, is more prestigious than a well established one.
Any titles won under GSL will mean absolutely nothing simply because it was once a monthly tournament. MVP could have 6 titles, but all of those would have happened in such a short span of time that his longevity was never tested. Players were tested not only for their skill, but their perseverance too. Imagine balancing two Starleagues and being your team's ace player for Proleague. If you manage to make it far into both every league, there's a possibility of having a different match up back to back.
Winning an OSL means walking into a hall where legends once tread. I'm sorry to say this, but in those halls MVP is a pre-Light era Woongjin Terran. The legitimacy that winning an OSL grants is immense, because the level of competition has always been the very best. I find your last comment confusing, because there is no league more well-established than the OSL. It is a league with more than 10 years of history and buckets full of television viewers. OSL was perhaps the very birth of what people now call "eSports" and the birth of mainstream gaming. I'd damn well say that it's the most prestigious league.
On June 28 2012 13:36 Veldril wrote: I think what neoghaleon tries to argue is that "the GSL is what shaping the highest level of play in Korean SC2 (and to a certain extent, the world) scene since the beginning and makes SC2 as we know today. So as an SC2 tournament, GSL should be considered more prestigious than OSL because it is the tournament that established the scene and OSL still has not prove it's prestige in SC2 scene yet. Couple with the bigger prize even makes GSL more prestigious". This is kinda understanble, especially if he did not follow BW.
I don't have any thoughtful comment whether OSL or GSL is more prestigious in SC2 scene but I would say they both hold their own values. GSL is what making the highest level of today's games possible, but at the same time OSL is still the most prestigious "Starcraft" league to date. It depends on the quality of games, especially from KesPA's players, that would make OSL the most prestigious league in the truest sense.
Thanks for understanding me. I'm not trying to be confrontational, just offering a different viewpoint.
the reason gsl has held the highest level of competition up to this point was because osl and msl were still doing sc1 at the time, making gsl the only high level sc2 league in korea. had osl and msl dropped sc1 2 years ago at the start of sc2, gsl wouldn't even be here today. gsl gained fame simply through being at the right place at the right time.
Being a longer tournament that lasts half a year may leave the current top players out. Remember just in the last GSL, all the Zergs died off by the round of 16. Yet in the last few weeks Zergs have been dominating tournaments world wide. The point is the meta-game will shift faster than the tournament itself.
I would also like to comment on this matter
The length of the OSL is seen as one of its strengths, not one of its weaknesses. The fact that it is so long means that momentary shifts do not have as big of an impact. If one group of players discovers something that gives them a momentary advantage, the rest have time to react and respond to it (part of this is helped by the fact that series are not played all on one day - they'll play one game in four different series on one day, then do it again on another day). A player who comes out on top of OSL is one who has been able to sustain top performance for a significant amount of time.
god... noobs not knowing what OSL is or what it means to the players is facepalm status right there. The only reason OSL can afford to not have a huge prize pool and still attract the best of the best to compete in their tournament is due to the reputation and prestige of the event. Also, as it has been mentioned many times (both on the forums and by the commentators), most of the sc2 pros were bw pros. Players like MVP, MC, Nestea, and others played with the goal to do well in the OSL. They got dominated by most of the A and S class players and so this time around (now that they are better) they can own it up and grab that long elusive OSL title.
On June 28 2012 13:41 rysecake wrote: the reason gsl has held the highest level of competition up to this point was because osl and msl were still doing sc1 at the time, making gsl the only high level sc2 league in korea. had osl and msl dropped sc1 2 years ago at the start of sc2, gsl wouldn't even be here today. gsl gained fame simply through being at the right place at the right time.
That's highly debatable. GSL was the first Korean Star League to market itself primarily to a global audience. OSL and MSL were being broadcasted with the Korean audience in mind, only. If I recall, Pro-League still has no English commentators...
It's difficult to globalize the sport the way KeSPA has been doing it for years. Point is, I do not think you give GOMTV enough credit.
On June 28 2012 13:41 rysecake wrote: the reason gsl has held the highest level of competition up to this point was because osl and msl were still doing sc1 at the time, making gsl the only high level sc2 league in korea. had osl and msl dropped sc1 2 years ago at the start of sc2, gsl wouldn't even be here today. gsl gained fame simply through being at the right place at the right time.
That's highly debatable. GSL was the first Korean Star League to market itself primarily to a global audience. OSL and MSL were being broadcasted with the Korean audience in mind, only. If I recall, Pro-League still has no English commentators...
It's difficult to globalize the sport the way KeSPA has been doing it for years. Point is, I do not think you give GOMTV enough credit.
i give them plenty of credit for doign their job and opening sc2 to the globe. but the point still stands that if they tried opening their tournament at the same time osl or msl did, they wouldn't have gotten to where they were today simply because they would be trying to fight a decade long starleague with a brand new one
On June 28 2012 13:31 rysecake wrote: ^ we've already answered this. The NAME of the tournament itself gives the prestige. Starcraft pros have wet dreams over winning a starleague. It could have a prize pool of zero for all they care, winning this title is like winning the world cup.
Thank you guys for answering. <3
Sure BroodWar players have wet dreams about winning OSL but do StarCraft 2 players have wet dreams about the OSL? It's kind of a different world, no?
I doubt starcraft 2 players have wet dreams about winning.
On June 28 2012 13:36 Veldril wrote: I think what neoghaleon tries to argue is that "the GSL is what shaping the highest level of play in Korean SC2 (and to a certain extent, the world) scene since the beginning and makes SC2 as we know today. So as an SC2 tournament, GSL should be considered more prestigious than OSL because it is the tournament that established the scene and OSL still has not prove it's prestige in SC2 scene yet. Couple with the bigger prize even makes GSL more prestigious". This is kinda understanble, especially if he did not follow BW.
I don't have any thoughtful comment whether OSL or GSL is more prestigious in SC2 scene but I would say they both hold their own values. GSL is what making the highest level of today's games possible, but at the same time OSL is still the most prestigious "Starcraft" league to date. It depends on the quality of games, especially from KesPA's players, that would make OSL the most prestigious league in the truest sense.
Thanks for understanding me. I'm not trying to be confrontational, just offering a different viewpoint.
sometimes a viewpoint that doesn't read his own articles.
but anyways, you do have to give gsl credit as they branched out to foreigners with the original gomtv classics and hired tasteless in the first place, then stepped it way up with sc2. OGN probably doesn't actually have any concrete plans for this OSL for foreigners, as torch and moletrap commentate their LoL.
On June 28 2012 07:51 neoghaleon55 wrote: Does anyone know the prize pool of an OSL on average, or how much 1st place gets? I've been looking at old OSL like the 2011 Jin Air OSL, but no prizes were reported.
Please tell me that the winner of this ridiculously grueling tournament gets at least something for their efforts....
it's a similar prize pool to gsl, winner gets 40k and so on i think
Thanks GSL is 50,000K
Longer tourney with less money though I heard it used to be the most prestigious.... .... not sure how much it's worth these days.
used to be?
It IS the most prestigious tournament
Well what exactly makes it more prestigious then?
I guess to explain my view, the most prestigious league should have
1. Big Names and Sponsors 2. The biggest prize pool 3. The current top players
Being a longer tournament that lasts half a year may leave the current top players out. Remember just in the last GSL, all the Zergs died off by the round of 16. Yet in the last few weeks Zergs have been dominating tournaments world wide. The point is the meta-game will shift faster than the tournament itself.
This fact coupled with the substantially smaller prize pool makes it hard to argue that OSL is MOST Prestigious.
I have no doubt that it is a top tier premier league, but I'm holding reservations on calling it "the BEST" for now.
Also, It's pretty hard to compare global viewership without counting the VODS. Remember that GSL is now a global show instead of just Korean Mainstream, thus to discredit VOD-views, which most foreigners watch instead of live, may underestimate the overall viewership.
On June 28 2012 07:51 neoghaleon55 wrote: Does anyone know the prize pool of an OSL on average, or how much 1st place gets? I've been looking at old OSL like the 2011 Jin Air OSL, but no prizes were reported.
Please tell me that the winner of this ridiculously grueling tournament gets at least something for their efforts....
it's a similar prize pool to gsl, winner gets 40k and so on i think
Thanks GSL is 50,000K
Longer tourney with less money though I heard it used to be the most prestigious.... .... not sure how much it's worth these days.
used to be?
It IS the most prestigious tournament
Well what exactly makes it more prestigious then?
I guess to explain my view, the most prestigious league should have
1. Big Names and Sponsors 2. The biggest prize pool 3. The current top players
Being a longer tournament that lasts half a year may leave the current top players out. Remember just in the last GSL, all the Zergs died off by the round of 16. Yet in the last few weeks Zergs have been dominating tournaments world wide. The point is the meta-game will shift faster than the tournament itself.
This fact coupled with the substantially smaller prize pool makes it hard to argue that OSL is MOST Prestigious.
I have no doubt that it is a top tier premier league, but I'm holding reservations on calling it "the BEST" for now.
Also, It's pretty hard to compare global viewership without counting the VODS. Remember that GSL is now a global show instead of just Korean Mainstream, thus to discredit VOD-views, which most foreigners watch instead of live, may underestimate the overall viewership.
On June 28 2012 07:51 neoghaleon55 wrote: Does anyone know the prize pool of an OSL on average, or how much 1st place gets? I've been looking at old OSL like the 2011 Jin Air OSL, but no prizes were reported.
Please tell me that the winner of this ridiculously grueling tournament gets at least something for their efforts....
it's a similar prize pool to gsl, winner gets 40k and so on i think
Thanks GSL is 50,000K
Longer tourney with less money though I heard it used to be the most prestigious.... .... not sure how much it's worth these days.
used to be?
It IS the most prestigious tournament
Well what exactly makes it more prestigious then?
I guess to explain my view, the most prestigious league should have
1. Big Names and Sponsors 2. The biggest prize pool 3. The current top players
Being a longer tournament that lasts half a year may leave the current top players out. Remember just in the last GSL, all the Zergs died off by the round of 16. Yet in the last few weeks Zergs have been dominating tournaments world wide. The point is the meta-game will shift faster than the tournament itself.
This fact coupled with the substantially smaller prize pool makes it hard to argue that OSL is MOST Prestigious.
I have no doubt that it is a top tier premier league, but I'm holding reservations on calling it "the BEST" for now.
Also, It's pretty hard to compare global viewership without counting the VODS. Remember that GSL is now a global show instead of just Korean Mainstream, thus to discredit VOD-views, which most foreigners watch instead of live, may underestimate the overall viewership.
EPT
