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Active: 1844 users

Pro Terran Replay Analysis from TLR.WeFly

Forum Index > SC2 General
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FrayzZeUsher
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States225 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-26 18:55:54
May 26 2012 00:27 GMT
#1
[image loading]

Hello, I decided to share my knowledge and wisdom of Terran strategy, this well be a video series of replays I play and other pros. I will give my analysis of what I am thinking from a Terran's POV. I would consider my strategy and decision making as one of the best around. This is similiar to the concept behind Day9 Dailies, except exclusively for Terran players and more to-the-point explanation of strategy.

About me:+ Show Spoiler +

I played chess throughout my youth, and achieved a 2200+ ELO at the age of 15 (Near Grandmaster Status) I then started playing Poker online with great success to make money. I now play SC2 at a High Master/Low GM level.

I am sponsored by http://tlr-esports.co.uk/





TvT Strategy:
Vs SlayerSRyung - Shakuras Plateau - 1 Rax FE into Mech
Vs Smug - Tal Darim Altar - Reactor Hellion Rush

TvP Strategy:
Vs EGiNcontroL - Antiga Shipyard - Failed 1-1-2 Allin

General Strategy/Advice:
Optimal Settings for Playing SC2


If you guys like this, I will do more.
Josh_rakoons
Profile Joined December 2011
United Kingdom1158 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-26 00:31:47
May 26 2012 00:29 GMT
#2
Pro? No offense, but i've never heard of you.

I don't think you can legitimately call yourself pro if you don't make any money from the game.
FrayzZeUsher
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States225 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-26 00:32:19
May 26 2012 00:31 GMT
#3
On May 26 2012 09:29 Josh_rakoons wrote:
Pro? No offense, but i've never heard of you.


My analytical skills are pro. I am semi-pro in actuality though :p
Josh_rakoons
Profile Joined December 2011
United Kingdom1158 Posts
May 26 2012 00:32 GMT
#4
On May 26 2012 09:31 FrayzZeUsher wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 26 2012 09:29 Josh_rakoons wrote:
Pro? No offense, but i've never heard of you.


My analytical skills are pro.

Who said, your mother?
Josh_rakoons
Profile Joined December 2011
United Kingdom1158 Posts
May 26 2012 00:53 GMT
#5
I don't have a problem with you advertising your show at all, but the fact you claim yourself to be "pro" is a miss statement, no matter how good you are or think you are.
FrayzZeUsher
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States225 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-26 01:04:14
May 26 2012 00:59 GMT
#6
On May 26 2012 09:53 Josh_rakoons wrote:
I don't have a problem with you advertising your show at all, but the fact you claim yourself to be "pro" is a miss statement, no matter how good you are or think you are.


I kind of meant it as a general term for the terran games I will look at. Not all the replays i will look at will involve me, I would say 30% games of me playing and 70% of korean/euro pros.
pallad
Profile Joined September 2010
Poland1958 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-26 01:10:53
May 26 2012 01:03 GMT
#7
I just watched game vs SlayerSRyung and first of all , you are not a pro Analysis
Secound thing.. its looks like you watched this re many times before and you just KNOW What he is doing. Its not Analysis , its Analysis cheating for me
This kind of Analysis gives no feedback to player... because when you play game , you dont know for sure what opponent wil do , you dont show this as oportunity.. " maby he drop there.." you tell " he gonna drop there for sure etc" this dont work in "real" game.

Pro = making money form someting
Pro players are full time pro and make money form gamming , its not the same as semi pro , who make money time to time.
Same is for Analysis like Artosis , Apollo , Day9 they are pro , because they are making money from that
SC 2 -LingsLover- EU -- Jaedong , NesTea , Nerchio , DRG , Moon , Oz , Tarson , Scarlett -- Dota 2 Pallad EU- NaVi - LGD
FrayzZeUsher
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States225 Posts
May 26 2012 01:09 GMT
#8
On May 26 2012 10:03 pallad wrote:
I just watched game vs SlayerSRyung and first of all , you are not a pro Analysis
Secound thing.. its looks like you watched this re many times before and you just KNOW What he is doing. Its not Analysis , its Analysis cheating for me


I haven't watched it in a month so I had more of a 'fresh perspective', I made some standard predictions, i don't think I was being suspiciously psychic at all...
Ogna
Profile Joined November 2008
United States106 Posts
May 26 2012 01:37 GMT
#9
why would you post a video of you bming ryung?
Spades
Profile Joined September 2010
United States249 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-26 01:39:24
May 26 2012 01:39 GMT
#10
Free analysis and learning materials, watch it or don't, no need to act entitled and complain
FsKsc2
Profile Joined May 2012
Canada27 Posts
May 26 2012 01:42 GMT
#11
Thanks for the videos! I'll watch them

pro or not doesn't matter much to me high master low gm is a high level player no?!
FrayzZeUsher
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States225 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-26 01:47:19
May 26 2012 01:47 GMT
#12
On May 26 2012 10:42 FsK wrote:
Thanks for the videos! I'll watch them

pro or not doesn't matter much to me high master low gm is a high level player no?!


Thank you, enjoy.

I just noticed that my mic picks up 's' sounds really loud for some reason, will try and fix that.
Simbaaaa
Profile Joined March 2011
23 Posts
May 26 2012 01:52 GMT
#13
I don't see why you would blatantly lie about 2200 elo being 'close to grandmaster' when in reality it isn't even close, like, its the difference from diamond to Grandmaster in sc2
FrayzZeUsher
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States225 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-26 03:49:02
May 26 2012 03:41 GMT
#14
On May 26 2012 10:52 Simbaaaa wrote:
I don't see why you would blatantly lie about 2200 elo being 'close to grandmaster' when in reality it isn't even close, like, its the difference from diamond to Grandmaster in sc2


Inconsequential errors do not need to be corrected, even if your comparison was accurate.

Talk about the actual content, it's good information.
Chrobbus
Profile Joined February 2010
Iceland195 Posts
May 26 2012 04:10 GMT
#15
Hello, I like when people are giving to the community and as such I respect your contribution.

But a friendly advice; when you are trying to establishing yourself within a specific community, you need to be extremely aware of your behavior & manners. Not only do you bad manner Ruyng in a foolish pointless manner, but you also try to squeeze in and support the idea of yourself as a "really good player" by setting up a scenario in which one factor is completely impossible - that of the hidden battle cruisers. If you are going to say that you are a really good player, you should have something far more valuable to back that up. In the context of that game, you describing how extremely good you are (and I'm sure you felt proud after beating Ruyng) is truly representative of arrogance, and that is never a good notion to be attached to when trying to establish a fan base.

Anyway, good luck in your endeavors.
theBALLS
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
Singapore2935 Posts
May 26 2012 04:17 GMT
#16
On May 26 2012 13:10 Chrobbus wrote:
Hello, I like when people are giving to the community and as such I respect your contribution.

But a friendly advice; when you are trying to establishing yourself within a specific community, you need to be extremely aware of your behavior & manners. Not only do you bad manner Ruyng in a foolish pointless manner, but you also try to squeeze in and support the idea of yourself as a "really good player" by setting up a scenario in which one factor is completely impossible - that of the hidden battle cruisers. If you are going to say that you are a really good player, you should have something far more valuable to back that up. In the context of that game, you describing how extremely good you are (and I'm sure you felt proud after beating Ruyng) is truly representative of arrogance, and that is never a good notion to be attached to when trying to establish a fan base.

Anyway, good luck in your endeavors.

I would have liked to say this buy I'd be adding unnecessary snide comments.

Please kid, arrogance gets you no where.
If you lose the stick, you'll always have theBALLS.
PrAeToR.FeNiX
Profile Joined February 2010
Canada361 Posts
May 26 2012 05:41 GMT
#17
^arroguance is not wisdom
En taro Adun!
Daniel C
Profile Joined October 2010
Hong Kong1606 Posts
May 26 2012 06:09 GMT
#18
On May 26 2012 12:41 FrayzZeUsher wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 26 2012 10:52 Simbaaaa wrote:
I don't see why you would blatantly lie about 2200 elo being 'close to grandmaster' when in reality it isn't even close, like, its the difference from diamond to Grandmaster in sc2


Inconsequential errors do not need to be corrected, even if your comparison was accurate.

Talk about the actual content, it's good information.

Actually it says alot about your credibility. What now should we make of your claim of "High Master/Low GM level" at SC2?
In theory, theory and practice are the same. In practice, they are not.
Inz`
Profile Joined July 2010
Scotland120 Posts
May 26 2012 06:34 GMT
#19
If you plan on doing more of this content there's a few things that will hold you back.

I won't mention the other comments that people have left but your entire cast was just depressing, I honestly felt quite sad after maybe 10 minutes of watching because of how you sound, in audio broadcasts the only connection we have to you is how you translate your thoughts, attempt to be more up beat and positive and people will listen.

If you're going to put yourself out there you don't lead off with "Pro Terran Replay Analysis". First impression is everything when it comes to spending time watching and learning. There are so many resources out there for people to learn and you very well could be the best but your name wont get out there because of the way you conduct yourself. Some people love it but the vast majority of people dislike it.

You're obviously of a high skill level and able to compete with some top players but this is a whole new world you're going into were you're starting from the lowest point, take the criticism in this thread seriously but don't listen to straight up nay sayers.

Goodluck, Have fun. I hope everything works out for you.
FT.aCt)Sony
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
United States1048 Posts
May 26 2012 06:48 GMT
#20
On May 26 2012 10:52 Simbaaaa wrote:
I don't see why you would blatantly lie about 2200 elo being 'close to grandmaster' when in reality it isn't even close, like, its the difference from diamond to Grandmaster in sc2


Considering 2400 is classified as grandmasters in the chess world and 2600 up is world class. 2200 is equivilate to national masters.

Might help if you do research before you decide to make yourself look like a complete tool.

Despite all of that, this was regarding "analysis" not any history of chess he may have.
Daniel C
Profile Joined October 2010
Hong Kong1606 Posts
May 26 2012 07:01 GMT
#21
On May 26 2012 15:48 FT.aCt)Sony wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 26 2012 10:52 Simbaaaa wrote:
I don't see why you would blatantly lie about 2200 elo being 'close to grandmaster' when in reality it isn't even close, like, its the difference from diamond to Grandmaster in sc2


Considering 2400 is classified as grandmasters in the chess world and 2600 up is world class. 2200 is equivilate to national masters.

Might help if you do research before you decide to make yourself look like a complete tool.

Despite all of that, this was regarding "analysis" not any history of chess he may have.


2200 wouldn't even get you to FM, let alone IM or GM (GM is >2500).

Might help if you do research before you decide to make yourself look like a complete tool.
In theory, theory and practice are the same. In practice, they are not.
FT.aCt)Sony
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
United States1048 Posts
May 26 2012 07:48 GMT
#22
On May 26 2012 16:01 Daniel C wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 26 2012 15:48 FT.aCt)Sony wrote:
On May 26 2012 10:52 Simbaaaa wrote:
I don't see why you would blatantly lie about 2200 elo being 'close to grandmaster' when in reality it isn't even close, like, its the difference from diamond to Grandmaster in sc2


Considering 2400 is classified as grandmasters in the chess world and 2600 up is world class. 2200 is equivilate to national masters.

Might help if you do research before you decide to make yourself look like a complete tool.

Despite all of that, this was regarding "analysis" not any history of chess he may have.


2200 wouldn't even get you to FM, let alone IM or GM (GM is >2500).

Might help if you do research before you decide to make yourself look like a complete tool.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chess_rating_system

If you look at the elo rating you will see where I got my information/research. Gg? Thought so. Now like I said this topic was about his analysis not his chess history. Don't know why another random individual wants to flaunt flawed knowledge and not discuss the direct topic.
ScrubbleS
Profile Joined December 2010
United States74 Posts
May 26 2012 07:53 GMT
#23
You're not pro. Iv'e seen you play. You remember me from starcraftcentral.net. such false advertiseee
LTK Scrubbles.1563
Daniel C
Profile Joined October 2010
Hong Kong1606 Posts
May 26 2012 07:57 GMT
#24
On May 26 2012 16:48 FT.aCt)Sony wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 26 2012 16:01 Daniel C wrote:
On May 26 2012 15:48 FT.aCt)Sony wrote:
On May 26 2012 10:52 Simbaaaa wrote:
I don't see why you would blatantly lie about 2200 elo being 'close to grandmaster' when in reality it isn't even close, like, its the difference from diamond to Grandmaster in sc2


Considering 2400 is classified as grandmasters in the chess world and 2600 up is world class. 2200 is equivilate to national masters.

Might help if you do research before you decide to make yourself look like a complete tool.

Despite all of that, this was regarding "analysis" not any history of chess he may have.


2200 wouldn't even get you to FM, let alone IM or GM (GM is >2500).

Might help if you do research before you decide to make yourself look like a complete tool.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chess_rating_system

If you look at the elo rating you will see where I got my information/research. Gg? Thought so. Now like I said this topic was about his analysis not his chess history. Don't know why another random individual wants to flaunt flawed knowledge and not discuss the direct topic.


http://www.fide.com/component/handbook/?id=58&view=article
From the FIDE handbook itself:

1.5 Requirements for award of the title, having achieved norm
1.52 To have achieved at some time or other a rating as follows:
GM ≥2500

I hold no grudge against you nor the OP, I only wish to correct flawed knowledge when flaunted as fact.
In theory, theory and practice are the same. In practice, they are not.
Fenneth
Profile Blog Joined April 2007
Australia354 Posts
May 26 2012 08:32 GMT
#25
On May 26 2012 16:48 FT.aCt)Sony wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 26 2012 16:01 Daniel C wrote:
On May 26 2012 15:48 FT.aCt)Sony wrote:
On May 26 2012 10:52 Simbaaaa wrote:
I don't see why you would blatantly lie about 2200 elo being 'close to grandmaster' when in reality it isn't even close, like, its the difference from diamond to Grandmaster in sc2


Considering 2400 is classified as grandmasters in the chess world and 2600 up is world class. 2200 is equivilate to national masters.

Might help if you do research before you decide to make yourself look like a complete tool.

Despite all of that, this was regarding "analysis" not any history of chess he may have.


2200 wouldn't even get you to FM, let alone IM or GM (GM is >2500).

Might help if you do research before you decide to make yourself look like a complete tool.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chess_rating_system

If you look at the elo rating you will see where I got my information/research. Gg? Thought so. Now like I said this topic was about his analysis not his chess history. Don't know why another random individual wants to flaunt flawed knowledge and not discuss the direct topic.


You're wrong.

FIDE master = 2300 rating
International master = 2400 rating + IM norms
Grandmaster = 2500 rating + GM norms

Saying a 2200 rated player is "close to grandmaster" is very wrong, as wrong as saying any random 2500 player is "close to being the best in the world". 300 rating points in chess is a world of difference.

Saying 2400 and above = grandmaster is very wrong. 2500+ is *required* and players can get well above 2500 without becoming a GM if they don't get the required norms.

If you don't want people pointing out your falsehoods, don't make them in the first place, and don't try to defend them once you've been called out.
Embir
Profile Joined January 2011
Poland567 Posts
May 26 2012 09:05 GMT
#26
Jesus, people on TL can be obnoxious sometimes - i dont know are you a bunch of angry nerd-kids?

Guy posted a coaching videos, he is good player and suddenly only one or two posts are actually about content provided by him - the rest are nagging posts about trivial things like: "You arent good player", "You BM Korean!!!", "You arent close to GM", and most of all "You called yourself pro - how dare you!?"

It is funny how bitchy nerds can be.

TO OP - care only about to the point posts, ignore the angry, bitchy kids.
Gamegene
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United States8308 Posts
May 26 2012 09:29 GMT
#27
zzz. god you people make me so angry.

someone's contributing something on his own free time and will. honestly the negativity and hostility towards people who want to involved with the community just discourages more people from wanting to contribute if all they see is a bunch of whining and zero actual feedback.

please just keep your mouth shut if you're going to attempt call someone out and delegitimize their contributions. it doesn't make anyone feel better or help improve content.

Throw on your favorite jacket and you're good to roll. Stroll through the trees and let your miseries go.
rfoster
Profile Joined December 2010
United States1005 Posts
May 26 2012 09:31 GMT
#28
I really liked the second video that was a really quirky build.

As much as I dont care, you really shouldnt bm on the videos you put out because a lot of other people will dislike your videos because of that.
SupLilSon
Profile Joined October 2011
Malaysia4123 Posts
May 26 2012 09:34 GMT
#29
On May 26 2012 18:29 Gamegene wrote:
zzz. god you people make me so angry.

someone's contributing something on his own free time and will. honestly the negativity and hostility towards people who want to involved with the community just discourages more people from wanting to contribute if all they see is a bunch of whining and zero actual feedback.

please just keep your mouth shut if you're going to attempt call someone out and delegitimize their contributions. it doesn't make anyone feel better or help improve content.



Even if this guy isn't pro, I'm sure he's a hell of a lot better than the people deriding him. Even if someone isn't pro, you might still be able to learn from them. Anyone better than you can likely teach you something you didn't already know. I mean, Day9 hasn't competed in a single SC2 tournament, yet people will tout his word as truth but if a high master player wants to give advice, he's bound to have 20 bronzies harping on him because he's not Stephano. There's so much great content on TL, just check out what you want and ignore what you dont.
Yoshi Kirishima
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States10366 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-26 10:03:18
May 26 2012 09:54 GMT
#30
On May 26 2012 17:32 Fenneth wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 26 2012 16:48 FT.aCt)Sony wrote:
On May 26 2012 16:01 Daniel C wrote:
On May 26 2012 15:48 FT.aCt)Sony wrote:
On May 26 2012 10:52 Simbaaaa wrote:
I don't see why you would blatantly lie about 2200 elo being 'close to grandmaster' when in reality it isn't even close, like, its the difference from diamond to Grandmaster in sc2


Considering 2400 is classified as grandmasters in the chess world and 2600 up is world class. 2200 is equivilate to national masters.

Might help if you do research before you decide to make yourself look like a complete tool.

Despite all of that, this was regarding "analysis" not any history of chess he may have.


2200 wouldn't even get you to FM, let alone IM or GM (GM is >2500).

Might help if you do research before you decide to make yourself look like a complete tool.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chess_rating_system

If you look at the elo rating you will see where I got my information/research. Gg? Thought so. Now like I said this topic was about his analysis not his chess history. Don't know why another random individual wants to flaunt flawed knowledge and not discuss the direct topic.


You're wrong.

FIDE master = 2300 rating
International master = 2400 rating + IM norms
Grandmaster = 2500 rating + GM norms

Saying a 2200 rated player is "close to grandmaster" is very wrong, as wrong as saying any random 2500 player is "close to being the best in the world". 300 rating points in chess is a world of difference.

Saying 2400 and above = grandmaster is very wrong. 2500+ is *required* and players can get well above 2500 without becoming a GM if they don't get the required norms.

If you don't want people pointing out your falsehoods, don't make them in the first place, and don't try to defend them once you've been called out.


He got his information from wiki. He got called out, but with no source. He defended himself with a source: Wiki. Apparently though, FIDE's site says something different.

There's nothing wrong with him defending himself, with a source to back him up, especially if the one doing the "calling out" didn't even provide a piece of evidence to support his argument. If you're suggesting that people who correct others are always right, and that you should never argue back... things just won't work very well. Or maybe you are suggesting that people should know more about chess ratings, which would be pretty elitist.
Mid-master streaming MECH ONLY + commentary www.twitch.tv/yoshikirishima +++ "If all-in fails, all-in again."
Pawss
Profile Joined October 2010
United States12 Posts
May 26 2012 10:04 GMT
#31
Correct if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure that the SlayerSRyung video isn't the real Ryung...

http://sc2ranks.com/la/432534/SlayerSRyu

But on topic, for future reference, never showcase yourself as BM or arrogant in your replays/analysis and be sure to be more articulate in your videos. I don't think people wouldn't be so hostile against you if you were well mannered and humble. Hopefully this doesn't scare you away from making more videos, but you have much to improve on. Manner, analysis, articulation, etc.
orz
MetalSlug
Profile Joined February 2010
Germany443 Posts
May 26 2012 10:09 GMT
#32
The TL community really is on a power trip right now... Calling out everyone for the most ridiculous shit.
Why cant you guys just watch/not watch his VODs and shut the hell up ?
Its really getting out of hand right now to the point that i dont like reading TL anymore
MKP | Maru | Nada | Boxer | Supernova | Keen
Yoshi Kirishima
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States10366 Posts
May 26 2012 10:17 GMT
#33
Just checked out the first video (skimmed around).

The audio quality is decent. More importantly though, I like your voice.

I'm not sure how useful it is for a mid-masters player like me, (especially because, even if a player is better, the way a high masters play may not necessarily be "closer" to what a code S player would do than say, a diamond player), though I did pick up bits of info that were useful, but for anyone in diamond or lower, this should be well worth your time. Compared to other videos/shows though? IDK.
Mid-master streaming MECH ONLY + commentary www.twitch.tv/yoshikirishima +++ "If all-in fails, all-in again."
cythaze
Profile Joined June 2011
830 Posts
May 26 2012 10:23 GMT
#34
The thing is that that is not about dedicating your free time, but rather promoting yourself with false pretences. That just doesn´t look that good. So if i go on youtube, thinking this is a pro player, defeating Slayers Ryung with his imba mech build, predicting the shit out of his opponent i might look into his coaching and so on, when in reality he is high master, played against someone who most likely isn´t even ryung and prepared the analysis to look good.
frontline-
Profile Joined March 2012
Bulgaria281 Posts
May 26 2012 10:29 GMT
#35
Well that sure wasn't Ryung , sorry.
Doodsmack
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7224 Posts
May 26 2012 18:04 GMT
#36
While I usually speak out against unnecessary negativity on the forums I think something has to be said about this guy potentially misleading his viewers and customers, considering that he charges $20 per hour for coaching and advertises said coaching beneath his videos. He 1) wasn't "near-Grandmaster" in chess, 2) didn't play the real Ryung, 3) isn't a pro Terran despite what the thread title clearly implies (and what his coaching site claims), and 4) can't reasonably be believed to have strategy and decision making that's "one of the best around". I hope people in the market for coaching are discerning enough to find a better deal.
FrayzZeUsher
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States225 Posts
May 26 2012 18:54 GMT
#37


I made a new video playing iNcontrol by playing 1-1-2 all in. the BO is in the video description
Kuja
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
United States1759 Posts
May 26 2012 18:57 GMT
#38
On May 26 2012 09:32 Josh_rakoons wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 26 2012 09:31 FrayzZeUsher wrote:
On May 26 2012 09:29 Josh_rakoons wrote:
Pro? No offense, but i've never heard of you.


My analytical skills are pro.

Who said, your mother?

Nearly fell out of my chair haha, be nice!
“Who's to say that my light is better than your darkness? Who's to say death is better than your darkness? Who am I to say?”
Yoshi Kirishima
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States10366 Posts
May 26 2012 19:18 GMT
#39
I just saw the new video vs Incontrol.

I liked it quite a lot. You mention important things (the kind of things i hope to learn when watching a video) such as what exactly you need to do, what you need to watch out for, what you need to do in X situation if Y. I prefer this a lot over Day9's videos because, although they can be entertaining and educational, they usually take too long to make it worth it. Also, he seems to focus on providing broad, general concepts, and then showing how you can apply those to a game, resulting in a couple things you should or should not do. However, this takes too long, and at this point I'm really just looking for the very specific things, like shown in this video.

I hadn't considered hiding the rax like that neither... that will come in handy!

Thanks for making these, I hope you continue to make more.
Mid-master streaming MECH ONLY + commentary www.twitch.tv/yoshikirishima +++ "If all-in fails, all-in again."
Smug
Profile Joined June 2011
England12 Posts
May 26 2012 19:20 GMT
#40
Regarding the "analysis" of my game. He said that I appear to 1 rax fe on shakuras and taldarim "most of the time".

He's just covering how all in he goes most games... I 1 rax fe most games, in every match up.
FrayzZeUsher
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States225 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-26 19:23:22
May 26 2012 19:22 GMT
#41
On May 27 2012 04:20 Smug wrote:
Regarding the "analysis" of my game. He said that I appear to 1 rax fe on shakuras and taldarim "most of the time".

He's just covering how all in he goes most games... I 1 rax fe most games, in every match up.


You got an analysis of your mistakes in that game, and I get exposure.

Everryyyone's a winner.

I just saw the new video vs Incontrol.

I liked it quite a lot. You mention important things (the kind of things i hope to learn when watching a video) such as what exactly you need to do, what you need to watch out for, what you need to do in X situation if Y. I prefer this a lot over Day9's videos because, although they can be entertaining and educational, they usually take too long to make it worth it. Also, he seems to focus on providing broad, general concepts, and then showing how you can apply those to a game, resulting in a couple things you should or should not do. However, this takes too long, and at this point I'm really just looking for the very specific things, like shown in this video.

I hadn't considered hiding the rax like that neither... that will come in handy!

Thanks for making these, I hope you continue to make more.


Thank you
GeeKBigOllie
Profile Joined January 2012
Wales55 Posts
May 26 2012 19:29 GMT
#42
This guy loves to all-in he just covers it up by saying his builds are "hard-counters" to macro builds, and hes definitely not "pro" level.
Smug
Profile Joined June 2011
England12 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-26 19:29:30
May 26 2012 19:29 GMT
#43
On May 27 2012 04:22 FrayzZeUsher wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 27 2012 04:20 Smug wrote:
Regarding the "analysis" of my game. He said that I appear to 1 rax fe on shakuras and taldarim "most of the time".

He's just covering how all in he goes most games... I 1 rax fe most games, in every match up.


You got an analysis of your mistakes in that game, and I get exposure.

Everryyyone's a winner.



I don't really agree with that, my mistake was simply a stupid move due to nerves rather than a mistake to analyse and correct. You are a cheesy player - which would be fine if you accepted it rather than trying to justify your one base plays as calculated.
FrayzZeUsher
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States225 Posts
May 26 2012 19:31 GMT
#44
I do what wins, I find the cheapest thing to do and do it until it stops working for me. I'm not denying that!! i'm a cheesy brute, but it wins.
Smug
Profile Joined June 2011
England12 Posts
May 26 2012 19:35 GMT
#45
On May 27 2012 04:31 FrayzZeUsher wrote:
I do what wins, I find the cheapest thing to do and do it until it stops working for me. I'm not denying that!! i'm a cheesy brute, but it wins.


That kind of mentality is fine <3
GeeKBigOllie
Profile Joined January 2012
Wales55 Posts
May 26 2012 19:35 GMT
#46
On May 27 2012 04:31 FrayzZeUsher wrote:
I do what wins, I find the cheapest thing to do and do it until it stops working for me. I'm not denying that!! i'm a cheesy brute, but it wins.


How can you have high level analysis, if you all in and play cheesy every game. That doesnt give you "pro analysis" like you claim to have.
FrayzZeUsher
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States225 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-26 19:45:47
May 26 2012 19:41 GMT
#47
On May 27 2012 04:35 GeeKBigOllie wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 27 2012 04:31 FrayzZeUsher wrote:
I do what wins, I find the cheapest thing to do and do it until it stops working for me. I'm not denying that!! i'm a cheesy brute, but it wins.


How can you have high level analysis, if you all in and play cheesy every game. That doesnt give you "pro analysis" like you claim to have.


I don't have strong mechanics, so what? the appeal of replay analysis videos is discussion of decision making and not demonstrating how effective my apm is. You really think you would learn much from hearing koreans trying to explain what they are doing in broken and shy english relative to someone like day9 or me?
Yoshi Kirishima
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States10366 Posts
May 26 2012 19:46 GMT
#48
Just saw the one vs SlayerSRyu

Got a question about your build:

Since you get a 2nd factory before the first starport, is this build weak (is it considered auto-lose) to 1 base tank pushes? Usually I get the starport before the 2nd factory so that I can get vikings out faster, and get my raven earlier. Maybe it is only weak to 1 base tank pushes on maps without natural ramps, or maybe the hellion drop will do enough damage if he pushes out to allow you to sac a lot of SCVs to defend? Or maybe you adapt somehow?

Also, if he goes cloak banshee, your viking is only starting at 7:30. Similar to the last question, does the hellion harass keep you in the game or maybe even forces the banshee to go home? Because even if you do scan his main to see what he's doing at 6:30, maybe he proxied his starport, or your scan missed it, or such, and wouldn't expect cloaked banshees.


Thanks in advance!
Mid-master streaming MECH ONLY + commentary www.twitch.tv/yoshikirishima +++ "If all-in fails, all-in again."
Yoshi Kirishima
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States10366 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-26 19:57:02
May 26 2012 19:53 GMT
#49
On May 27 2012 04:29 Smug wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 27 2012 04:22 FrayzZeUsher wrote:
On May 27 2012 04:20 Smug wrote:
Regarding the "analysis" of my game. He said that I appear to 1 rax fe on shakuras and taldarim "most of the time".

He's just covering how all in he goes most games... I 1 rax fe most games, in every match up.


You got an analysis of your mistakes in that game, and I get exposure.

Everryyyone's a winner.



I don't really agree with that, my mistake was simply a stupid move due to nerves rather than a mistake to analyse and correct. You are a cheesy player - which would be fine if you accepted it rather than trying to justify your one base plays as calculated.



Even if you messed up and know why you messed up, it is something to point out to the viewer so they understand that it's not what the opponent (you) should have done, so in a way it is still analysis.

Also, he didn't even use those words, of justifying his base plays as calculated... Or maybe it was in one of the videos?

Even so, his all-ins are not cheeses. A cheese is something that, when scouted, is basically auto-lose. However, with superior micro, you can always win with an all-in build. Think of MVP doing a 1/1/1 marine tank banshee all-in versus a mid-masters NA protoss player. The latter would probably lose, even though he knows what's coming.

Hence, an all-in is a "calculated" build. A cheese is something relying more on luck, though you could even call that calculated -- when you perform a cheese, you should know how you can win, and how you may lose. In that way, you know the risks; the build is calculated.


On May 27 2012 04:35 GeeKBigOllie wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 27 2012 04:31 FrayzZeUsher wrote:
I do what wins, I find the cheapest thing to do and do it until it stops working for me. I'm not denying that!! i'm a cheesy brute, but it wins.


How can you have high level analysis, if you all in and play cheesy every game. That doesnt give you "pro analysis" like you claim to have.


First, "every" is not true.

Second, what is a "professional level of analysis" is subjective.

Third, you can analyze a game without being good at it. The skills needed to play SC2 well and analyze SC2 well may be complimentary, but they are most definitely not directly related.

So, if you don't think this is high enough analysis (or the analysis is not done well enough, that is, explained to a professionally-polished extent), that's fine. But to support your opinion in the way you did, is quite unreasonable.
Mid-master streaming MECH ONLY + commentary www.twitch.tv/yoshikirishima +++ "If all-in fails, all-in again."
Djin)ftw(
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Germany3357 Posts
May 26 2012 19:55 GMT
#50
is that seriously Ryung playing? Like, seriously?
"jk CLG best mindgames using the baron to counterthrow" - boesthius
Yoshi Kirishima
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States10366 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-26 19:58:50
May 26 2012 19:58 GMT
#51
On May 27 2012 04:55 Djin)ftw( wrote:
is that seriously Ryung playing? Like, seriously?


Nope, probably not. Of what I know, ryung (as well as alicia, MMA, ganzi, etc.) use Cella's account to ladder on NA. And plus, this one is named SlayerSRyu. SlayerSRyung fits under the 12 character limit, so I don't see a reason why he would shorten it to "Ryu"
Mid-master streaming MECH ONLY + commentary www.twitch.tv/yoshikirishima +++ "If all-in fails, all-in again."
GeeKBigOllie
Profile Joined January 2012
Wales55 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-26 20:07:06
May 26 2012 20:06 GMT
#52
Ive seen this guy play quite a lot and ive played against him a couple of times, and spoke to lots of people who have played him, and he cheeses a lot of the time. Maybe "every game" was a bit over the top, but he does all in very frequently.
Yoshi Kirishima
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States10366 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-26 20:10:02
May 26 2012 20:09 GMT
#53
On May 27 2012 05:06 GeeKBigOllie wrote:
Ive seen this guy play quite a lot and ive played against him a couple of times, and spoke to lots of people who have played him, and he cheeses a lot of the time. Maybe "every game" was a bit over the top, but he does all in very frequently.


Thanks for clarifying -- I assumed you meant "every" to be used as an exaggeration (certainly no one would all-in EVERY game... right? xD I understood you just meant to portray that he all-ins a lot), but my points still stand that a player's ability to play may be different from how well he can analyze a game.

But then you could say there are just 2 interpretations of "pro analysis". One is that it is a professional player analyzing a game (in this case, you would be right, it's not quite professional then, though it is relatively high level on the ladder). The other is that the analyzing itself is professional -- whatever that means, whether it is that the analysis is at a high quality and/or the analysis is done well.
Mid-master streaming MECH ONLY + commentary www.twitch.tv/yoshikirishima +++ "If all-in fails, all-in again."
biology]major
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States2253 Posts
May 26 2012 20:28 GMT
#54
So let me get this straight,

A high masters player who rarely plays past 1 base claims to be "semi pro".
Posts a video vs ryung (not even the real ryung) and bms him.
Randomly claims to have high analytical skills with nothing to base it on. I would'nt give a crap if you were more humble about the way you approached this, but... all I see is delusion and arrogance
Question.?
Gardel
Profile Joined April 2011
Mexico220 Posts
May 26 2012 20:33 GMT
#55
I understand the people that say " ey, he is making a contribution to the community" but really I hate false advertising, the only reason I opened this thread was because it said " pro Terran Analysis". Did it, to find out you where an all-inner, I have no problem about that but that means you have no understanding of the lategame and much less pro analysis.
"And in the end, it's not the years in your life that count. It's the life in your years." Abraham Lincoln.
GeeKBigOllie
Profile Joined January 2012
Wales55 Posts
May 26 2012 20:50 GMT
#56
After all the thing i said about him being a cheesy/all innish player, i did enjoy the analysis of the game against incontrol, as a protoss player it gave me more insight into a terran's mindest and timings when doing 1-1-1.
Zerker
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada201 Posts
May 26 2012 21:10 GMT
#57
This one time, a team called vT gaming was going give me a free t-shirt but that never fell through. feelbadman.jpg i was never pro either.
Chelch
Profile Joined February 2011
United Kingdom159 Posts
May 26 2012 21:20 GMT
#58
Why were you scared of the cannons against Incontrol if you had a PDD?
Daitro
Profile Joined April 2012
England31 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-26 21:33:16
May 26 2012 21:26 GMT
#59
After watching the iNcontroL VOD I can safely say your statement 'my strategy and decision making is one of the best around' is really fucking wrong.
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
May 26 2012 21:39 GMT
#60
On May 27 2012 06:26 Eshez wrote:
After watching the iNcontroL VOD I can safely say your statement 'my strategy and decision making is one of the best around' is really fucking wrong.


Deciding to all in because you know your not good enough to beat a player is decision making. Good decision making? That is questionable. Taking a game off of a professional player is impressive, even with an all in. Flipping a coin and hoping it works is not professional skill level, though. It is not impressive enough to make me want to listen to the "all-iner" that is for sure.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Yoshi Kirishima
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States10366 Posts
May 26 2012 21:54 GMT
#61
On May 27 2012 06:20 Chelch wrote:
Why were you scared of the cannons against Incontrol if you had a PDD?


I think it was a bad decision to move back. IIRC he says he was simply unfamiliar with the situation, so he ended up making a bad move (going back home). Then again, if he had moved back but saved his CC, the game could have played out longer (especially since Terran can lift off his main base while protoss can't -- since the protoss doesn't have colossus tech neither, the terran could easily contain the protoss in his main). Also I think he said there was only 1 sentry, but he didn't realize, or something.
Mid-master streaming MECH ONLY + commentary www.twitch.tv/yoshikirishima +++ "If all-in fails, all-in again."
FrayzZeUsher
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States225 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-26 22:35:14
May 26 2012 22:27 GMT
#62
On May 27 2012 04:46 Yoshi Kirishima wrote:
Just saw the one vs SlayerSRyu

Got a question about your build:

Since you get a 2nd factory before the first starport, is this build weak (is it considered auto-lose) to 1 base tank pushes? Usually I get the starport before the 2nd factory so that I can get vikings out faster, and get my raven earlier. Maybe it is only weak to 1 base tank pushes on maps without natural ramps, or maybe the hellion drop will do enough damage if he pushes out to allow you to sac a lot of SCVs to defend? Or maybe you adapt somehow?

Also, if he goes cloak banshee, your viking is only starting at 7:30. Similar to the last question, does the hellion harass keep you in the game or maybe even forces the banshee to go home? Because even if you do scan his main to see what he's doing at 6:30, maybe he proxied his starport, or your scan missed it, or such, and wouldn't expect cloaked banshees.


Thanks in advance!


Hmmm, well you see, for that very reason this build will only be above 50% win ratio if you do it on large maps such as shakruas, antiga, TDA, cloud, and others. You can defend a tank push by scanning @5:30 as i mentioned, and instead of going BFH first, you get squeeze out 1 tank and siege tech asap, and build 2 bunkers with a viking. Obviously if you just go for BFH and no tanks you will autolose. As long as you squeeze siege tech + a tank and have 2 bunkers, you will crush the push.

Regarding proxy cloak.. by scanning @5:30 and seeing the tech inside his base you can deduce if he is making proxy factory+ if you see only the rax with a reactor on reactor, this is extremely suspicious and it then comes down to your game sense (whether that be proxy thors, or cloak) either way you need atleast 2 bunkers at natural and engi bay @6:00.

I hope this helps.
Yoshi Kirishima
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States10366 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-27 07:23:34
May 27 2012 07:23 GMT
#63
On May 27 2012 07:27 FrayzZeUsher wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 27 2012 04:46 Yoshi Kirishima wrote:
Just saw the one vs SlayerSRyu

Got a question about your build:

Since you get a 2nd factory before the first starport, is this build weak (is it considered auto-lose) to 1 base tank pushes? Usually I get the starport before the 2nd factory so that I can get vikings out faster, and get my raven earlier. Maybe it is only weak to 1 base tank pushes on maps without natural ramps, or maybe the hellion drop will do enough damage if he pushes out to allow you to sac a lot of SCVs to defend? Or maybe you adapt somehow?

Also, if he goes cloak banshee, your viking is only starting at 7:30. Similar to the last question, does the hellion harass keep you in the game or maybe even forces the banshee to go home? Because even if you do scan his main to see what he's doing at 6:30, maybe he proxied his starport, or your scan missed it, or such, and wouldn't expect cloaked banshees.


Thanks in advance!


Hmmm, well you see, for that very reason this build will only be above 50% win ratio if you do it on large maps such as shakruas, antiga, TDA, cloud, and others. You can defend a tank push by scanning @5:30 as i mentioned, and instead of going BFH first, you get squeeze out 1 tank and siege tech asap, and build 2 bunkers with a viking. Obviously if you just go for BFH and no tanks you will autolose. As long as you squeeze siege tech + a tank and have 2 bunkers, you will crush the push.

Regarding proxy cloak.. by scanning @5:30 and seeing the tech inside his base you can deduce if he is making proxy factory+ if you see only the rax with a reactor on reactor, this is extremely suspicious and it then comes down to your game sense (whether that be proxy thors, or cloak) either way you need atleast 2 bunkers at natural and engi bay @6:00.

I hope this helps.


Ok, thanks a lot!
Mid-master streaming MECH ONLY + commentary www.twitch.tv/yoshikirishima +++ "If all-in fails, all-in again."
FrayzZeUsher
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States225 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-27 18:41:31
May 27 2012 18:38 GMT
#64
On May 27 2012 06:39 Plansix wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 27 2012 06:26 Eshez wrote:
After watching the iNcontroL VOD I can safely say your statement 'my strategy and decision making is one of the best around' is really fucking wrong.


Deciding to all in because you know your not good enough to beat a player is decision making. Good decision making? That is questionable. Taking a game off of a professional player is impressive, even with an all in. Flipping a coin and hoping it works is not professional skill level, though. It is not impressive enough to make me want to listen to the "all-iner" that is for sure.


Instead of thinking about luck, think about probability. If I play high stakes games of poker online with the concept that their is some 'lady luck' that may or may not be watching over me, of course i'm going to get stressed. it's just a fundamental of mathematics that you have to manipulate in order to be successful. Get comfortable with 'luck', you'll have to work with it in any area of life.

And about BM. I tell people to leave the game when they have a 0.01% chance of winning because at that point both players should just get on with playing the next game, Ryung would play his next ladder game, and so would I; everyone's a winner. Staying in game at that point is just disgraceful.
Pawss
Profile Joined October 2010
United States12 Posts
May 27 2012 23:24 GMT
#65
And about BM. I tell people to leave the game when they have a 0.01% chance of winning because at that point both players should just get on with playing the next game, Ryung would play his next ladder game, and so would I; everyone's a winner. Staying in game at that point is just disgraceful.


Sounds pretty classy..
orz
FrayzZeUsher
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States225 Posts
May 28 2012 21:45 GMT
#66
On May 28 2012 08:24 Pawss wrote:
Show nested quote +
And about BM. I tell people to leave the game when they have a 0.01% chance of winning because at that point both players should just get on with playing the next game, Ryung would play his next ladder game, and so would I; everyone's a winner. Staying in game at that point is just disgraceful.


Sounds pretty classy..


No such classiness as honesty.

Does anyone have any reps they would like me to look over?
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