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SoniC_eu
Denmark1008 Posts
On May 12 2012 05:52 Zane wrote: Mvp found the answer already. It was quite obvious tbh. I'm talking about ladder bro. Tourney is different situation completly. IF answer is cheese 24/7 then....that's not the answer lol | ||
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Belha
Italy2850 Posts
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Grampz
United States2147 Posts
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herbie
140 Posts
On May 12 2012 06:00 HolyArrow wrote: I never said that about Flash. Furthermore, "denial" implies that there's actually some overwhelming obvious truth that I'm being defensive about, while my argument is that things are not as clear-cut as they seem to some people, and that there are pieces of "evidence" that should not be used as evidence at all in a balance discussion because said evidence is itself biased (i.e Pros talking about what they think of balance). In the end, I'll say this: I don't care what you say about me, or how much people try to cloud the credibility of my argument with accusations of "denial". In the end, all my facts are there in my previous post, and as much as you try to mar my credibility, the facts thankfully remain constant: Even in the pro level, Protoss players say that Protoss is fine, while Terran players are complaining that Protoss is OP. I can boil it down to a simple analogy to make it clearer. Let's say there's a panel of 4 experts on a subject. Expert A and B say that X is true, while experts C and D claim that X is not true. What people are essentially doing here is saying, "Oh look, Experts A and B say X is true, so HA!" while simultaneously ignoring the fact that experts C and D claim that X is not true. And in the case of SC2, experts A and B actually have a personal stake in convincing others that X is true, while experts C and D have a personal stake in convincing others that X is not true, which throws the validity of their opinions (validity in the sense of how close to the truth their opinions are) even more into question. I've said my piece, trying to make logical arguments on an internet forum is a fool's errand anyway xD Did I make a claim that I was talking about you in any way? I was making a general statement using the style you had chosen. Of course I agree that terrans have confirmation bias, but protosses have a denial bias. i.e protoss wont take his opinions into any account, while terrans will take his words as gods. Your ego makes you believe that protoss players have a more realistic look on the matchup, stating its balanced, what makes you think that terrans view on the matchup is inferior? That is essentually saying expert A and Bs claims of balance are true (despite their own personal bias, if they were unbiased they may say there was imbalance), where expert C and Ds claims of imbalance are false. | ||
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beg
991 Posts
On May 12 2012 05:56 rEalGuapo wrote: He said that Colossus tech is cheap compared to the Vikings you had to get. He stated that for 2 Colossi you need about 8 Vikings and that eats too much into your Bio. 8 Vikings = 600 Gas. 2 Colossi = 800 Gas, yeah so cheap.... you obviously need the range upgrade, or you will not force Vikings. After I heard him say that 2 Colossi cost less Gas then 6-8 Vikings I shut down the stream in anger. So I could not care less about his opinion, that is like IdrA saying Vortex is imbalanced while he INTENTIONALLY moves his entire army into one only to prove his point instead of having spread his units in the first place. collossi cost 300/200 though. sorry, but lol. | ||
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Kilby
Finland1069 Posts
On May 12 2012 06:01 MCDayC wrote: Disapointed to see balance whining, I don't really like it from any player, but I was expecting better from Flash. T_T Just pretend that Flash never whined about balance. It was just an interview and they wanted at least some answers to their specific questions. Plus some of the wording might have got lost in translation. | ||
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Severian
Australia2052 Posts
On May 12 2012 06:02 Steglich wrote: Now that flash says that protoss is op. Can I finally say it too without receiving a ban? He also said Zerg was better than Terran, or are we all ignoring that bit because it doesn't fit into our narratives? | ||
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Bayyne
United States1967 Posts
He's factoring in the Thermal Lance upgrade. | ||
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SoniC_eu
Denmark1008 Posts
On May 12 2012 05:53 Jakkerr wrote: Sure, Which major tournaments were won by Protoss players in 2012? Maybe I forgot 1 or 2 but I can't think of any, also Protoss STILL is the race with the lowest overall winrate according to the statistics. Some people in this thread make it sound like Protoss is insanely OP and w/e, but I'm just gonna guess most of those people are silver league terrans that have no clue that they are still playing the race that has had the most tournament wins and highest overall winrate for the last 2 years. But well, when u lose a game it's easier to blame the game then to acknowledge that u need to improve, that's entirely true ofc. I would say that protoss players are finally adjusting to the terran style of play. Protoss have been doing well. KR stats,. TLPD for april 2012: ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/898Wwh.png) | ||
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beg
991 Posts
On May 12 2012 06:04 Severian wrote: He also said Zerg was better than Terran, or are we all ignoring that bit because it doesn't fit into our narratives? he talked about zerg allins. | ||
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rEalGuapo
Germany832 Posts
yes but you need robbotics bay and the range upgrade 200 gas each, I do not count the starport that you have anyway same as Robo itself sorry but think. | ||
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Sadistx
Zimbabwe5568 Posts
On May 12 2012 05:57 Kilby wrote: Actually, at this point in time, the opinion of Flash regarding balance is far less important than that of Naniwa, Huk or Demuslim. That depends on how you assign importance. Because importance is just as subjective as imbalance perception, you can't argue either way. It's honestly best to leave this balance shit alone for another topic and to blizzard, because god knows (not flash unfortunately), they always choose the easy/retarded way of "fixing" something, even when progamers tell them what the problem is in simple terms. | ||
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S_SienZ
1878 Posts
Still would be wrong. | ||
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Steglich
Denmark282 Posts
On May 12 2012 06:04 Severian wrote: He also said Zerg was better than Terran, or are we all ignoring that bit because it doesn't fit into our narratives? I agree, as a zerg player, that zerg is a bit better than terran at the moment. Not as much as toss though. | ||
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beg
991 Posts
it's 200 200, so 2 collossi with thermal lance still arent 800. | ||
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Severian
Australia2052 Posts
What do you think about the balance right now? Protoss is good and Zerg is second, then Terran. I think Terran is the worst, but others say they're second. Once the upcoming patch comes into effect I'm worried that Zerg might become OP as well. | ||
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DemigodcelpH
1138 Posts
On May 12 2012 06:01 MCDayC wrote: Disapointed to see balance whining, I don't really like it from any player, but I was expecting better from Flash. T_T Mmmm Protoss tears. It's not whining. It's an interview. He was asked these questions. Do not disrepect Flash. | ||
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beg
991 Posts
On May 12 2012 06:06 rEalGuapo wrote: yes but you need robbotics bay and the range upgrade 200 gas each, I do not count the starport that you have anyway same as Robo itself sorry but think. you need 2 starports really, to get/maintain a high enough medivac count. additional starport with reactor costs what? think please. also vikings dont share their upgrades with everything else, like collossi and everything else a protoss is ever gonna use. | ||
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S_SienZ
1878 Posts
On May 12 2012 06:06 rEalGuapo wrote: yes but you need robbotics bay and the range upgrade 200 gas each, I do not count the starport that you have anyway same as Robo itself sorry but think. What a terrible argument. By your logic it costs 250 minerals to make 2 lings. Name me one match-up where you don't get Colossi late game. | ||
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MCDayC
United Kingdom14464 Posts
Which as we know, are really strong against terran! -_- Terran v Zerg is at the very least balanced, at worst Terran favoured until late game. Its hard to take his balance whining seriously based on him complaining about Zerg all ins. Plus he said maruaders are good. YOU WERE THE CHOSEN ONE! YOU WERE SUPPOSED TO SAVE MECH, NOT DESTROY IT! | ||
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