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On April 21 2013 00:02 skeldark wrote:One thing tho: can you check if you use the correct database. Some peopole had problems with the server, perhaps you working on the emergency database (which is total outdated) BTW: nice to still see the users of the first days 
"Download new database" doesn't change the graph, so I assume it's correct. Here are the offsets in bnet.data:
#START PROMOTE_OFFSETS
## US, EU, KR, SEA, CN
## Bronze,silver,gold,platinum,diamond,master,grandmaster,top-gm
## Strict format
0,200,385,565,750,950,1550,1950
0,200,385,565,750,950,1550,1950
0,200,385,565,750,950,1550,1950
0,200,385,565,750,950,1050,1350
0,200,385,565,750,950,1550,1950
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Does playing a mix of unranked without MMR-stats open and Ranked with MMR-stats open mess up the program? Because sometimes I check my MMR, it says 480, I play a 2 ranked games, it jumps to 650, I play and unranked, and then play another ranked, and it drops back down to 480. It says like everytime I play an unranked followed by a ranked, my MMR jumps down. I'm assuming that when I play a Ranked after playing an Unranked, MMR-stats fetches my Unranked MMR instead of my Ranked MMR, but I'm not sure. Is this the case, or is this something else? What info do you need to figure it out. Currently my graph is showing me at 480 because I just played an Unranked followed by a Ranked. Should I post screenshots of my graphs?
Please let me know, thank you!
When I say my graph jumps, I don't mean just one game, I mean the my entire MMR line changes 200 points. I don't think my opponent's MMR line changes though, but I'm not 100% sure.
So basically, depending on when I check the chart, my MMR is either 480 or 680. I'm assuming the latter because I actually play Plats in ranked sometimes, but not in Unranked. I even played a Diamond the other day.
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On April 21 2013 00:02 skeldark wrote:And this one have no cap problems at all: ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/A0lXQ2N.png) But he could have it corrected over autocorrect , that would hide the error.
No, autocorrect is off in that picture. When I turn it on, my MMR only changes very slightly in two of the early games (out of 49 total games).
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On April 21 2013 10:59 TheTrueYako wrote:
Does playing a mix of unranked without MMR-stats open and Ranked with MMR-stats open mess up the program? Because sometimes I check my MMR, it says 480, I play a 2 ranked games, it jumps to 650, I play and unranked, and then play another ranked, and it drops back down to 480. It says like everytime I play an unranked followed by a ranked, my MMR jumps down. I'm assuming that when I play a Ranked after playing an Unranked, MMR-stats fetches my Unranked MMR instead of my Ranked MMR, but I'm not sure. Is this the case, or is this something else? What info do you need to figure it out. Currently my graph is showing me at 480 because I just played an Unranked followed by a Ranked. Should I post screenshots of my graphs?
Please let me know, thank you!
When I say my graph jumps, I don't mean just one game, I mean the my entire MMR line changes 200 points. I don't think my opponent's MMR line changes though, but I'm not 100% sure.
So basically, depending on when I check the chart, my MMR is either 480 or 680. I'm assuming the latter because I actually play Plats in ranked sometimes, but not in Unranked. I even played a Diamond the other day.
From the original post (note that data for unranked matches is dropped, but there are special cases when the data has to be set 'ranked' due to false positive risk):
Question: Unranked match was recorded. How can I remove it?
Answer: Unranked detection is still not 100% as it requires that we have both pre-game & post-game data for the player himself. If the web profiles malfunction the game is set to ranked. Also matches shorter than 30 seconds (41.4 Blizzard seconds) are set to ranked by default due to false positive risk regarding web profile updates
If an unranked game is recorded it can be manually deleted: 'Config' > 'Data' > 'Refresh' > Select individual games from dropdown list > 'Delete Game'
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On April 21 2013 00:02 skeldark wrote:I agree with korona that it look very much like a cap rule mistake. A graph like this should not be possible. On the other hand, in this case all graphs would look same crasy. And this one have no cap problems at all:
I think I found the problem. A very old bug that has been ages in the tool, but has not actualized before this season (only in very special cases). And actualizes only now as Blizzard's matchmaker matches you primarily against opponents from the same league.
In old seasons when you were near or under league border you faced lots of non-capped opponents from the lower league. Now instead you get capped opponents from your league who often have lower league MMR. The bug caused some of the capped opponents to be handled as non-capped.
I will investigate the issue more. No eta on new version yet thought. Also if Blizzard's schedule holds ladders will be locked in the coming week.
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On April 21 2013 23:34 korona wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2013 10:59 TheTrueYako wrote:
Does playing a mix of unranked without MMR-stats open and Ranked with MMR-stats open mess up the program? Because sometimes I check my MMR, it says 480, I play a 2 ranked games, it jumps to 650, I play and unranked, and then play another ranked, and it drops back down to 480. It says like everytime I play an unranked followed by a ranked, my MMR jumps down. I'm assuming that when I play a Ranked after playing an Unranked, MMR-stats fetches my Unranked MMR instead of my Ranked MMR, but I'm not sure. Is this the case, or is this something else? What info do you need to figure it out. Currently my graph is showing me at 480 because I just played an Unranked followed by a Ranked. Should I post screenshots of my graphs?
Please let me know, thank you!
When I say my graph jumps, I don't mean just one game, I mean the my entire MMR line changes 200 points. I don't think my opponent's MMR line changes though, but I'm not 100% sure.
So basically, depending on when I check the chart, my MMR is either 480 or 680. I'm assuming the latter because I actually play Plats in ranked sometimes, but not in Unranked. I even played a Diamond the other day. From the original post (note that data for unranked matches is dropped, but there are special cases when the data has to be set 'ranked' due to false positive risk): Question: Unranked match was recorded. How can I remove it? Answer: Unranked detection is still not 100% as it requires that we have both pre-game & post-game data for the player himself. If the web profiles malfunction the game is set to ranked. Also matches shorter than 30 seconds (41.4 Blizzard seconds) are set to ranked by default due to false positive risk regarding web profile updates If an unranked game is recorded it can be manually deleted: 'Config' > 'Data' > 'Refresh' > Select individual games from dropdown list > 'Delete Game'
But every time I play an Unranked game I make sure that MMR-Stats AND Sc2gears is turned off. Wouldn't that mean that none of my Unranked games are recorded? Just checked in case, and indeed, none of my unranked games are on the chart.
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How many games does it take to get "Good data" ? I've only played one game at the moment
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Don't know if this has already been spotted.
I've just noticed the adjusted points ranges for each gain/loss in points have changed
What is was in WoL: http://postimg.org/image/8bny2acav/
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/BWn4S9s.jpg)
Based on the old table I would of got 14 points for the win but now getting 16?
Not that I'm complaining but thought I'd alert to the change
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On April 20 2013 16:41 leopardb wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2013 07:55 StreetWise wrote:
This tool wont work for my EU account, it keeps saying needs a game with better data. I mostly play on EU. Any suggestions? Does it work on another account of yours ? i use it on both my EU and US accounts and both work...
Yes it works fine on my NA account. Only my EU account is giving me this error.
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On April 22 2013 07:03 Aimconquest wrote:Don't know if this has already been spotted. I've just noticed the adjusted points ranges for each gain/loss in points have changed What is was in WoL: http://postimg.org/image/8bny2acav/+ Show Spoiler +Based on the old table I would of got 14 points for the win but now getting 16? Not that I'm complaining but thought I'd alert to the change
I am not sure what you are mean? The old formula still seems to function nicely (btw. the numbers in the picture still changed little bit after that). Also checked the capping values few days ago. They seemed to be the same.
Note that when you & your opponents are lower than master league you may be in capping zone when points you gain are artificially increased.
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On April 22 2013 03:15 melliano wrote:
How many games does it take to get "Good data" ? I've only played one game at the moment
Depending what your MMR is from one game to tens of games. Note that enabling memory reader increases your chances considerably.
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Does this make any sense? ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/rwAPz5U.png) Why is my rating going down for wins? Just because there haven't been any "good games" in the last 10 and it's not sure what to think? I am using the memory reader and I have found good games before this streak.
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On April 23 2013 03:53 Busybyeski wrote:Does this make any sense? + Show Spoiler +Why is my rating going down for wins? Just because there haven't been any "good games" in the last 10 and it's not sure what to think? I am using the memory reader and I have found good games before this streak. You had 4 'good games' in your last 10 that gave nearly same values that caused the graph remain at that level.
But there seems to be problem regarding cap detection in the current version. I am investigating the cause. I have a 'fix' ready, but it affects only the results and not necessarily fix possible root cause. Investigating if there is a deeper cause for the problem, but it may take time (no eta). But when fix is published it also fixes the old calculations. Usually the affected false 'good' values are around 50 above the league borders (note that master league players are never capped). In your case the 'fix' would have set all those 4 'good games' as 'capped' and estimate value for current MMR would be ~1059.
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On April 23 2013 05:32 korona wrote:
You had 4 'good games' in your last 10 that gave nearly same values that caused the graph remain at that level.
But there seems to be problem regarding cap detection in the current version. I am investigating the cause. I have a 'fix' ready, but it affects only the results and not necessarily fix possible root cause. Investigating if there is a deeper cause for the problem, but it may take time (no eta). But when fix is published it also fixes the old calculations. Usually the affected false 'good' values are around 50 above the league borders (note that master league players are never capped). In your case the 'fix' would have set all those 4 'good games' as 'capped' and estimate value for current MMR would be ~1059.
How are you able to see which games have good data? I always thought it was only "good" when the opponent's square was filled white. I also don't understand what you mean by games being "capped" more at certain values, is there more information in another of your replies as to what this bug is really doing?
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On April 23 2013 05:56 Busybyeski wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 05:32 korona wrote:
You had 4 'good games' in your last 10 that gave nearly same values that caused the graph remain at that level.
But there seems to be problem regarding cap detection in the current version. I am investigating the cause. I have a 'fix' ready, but it affects only the results and not necessarily fix possible root cause. Investigating if there is a deeper cause for the problem, but it may take time (no eta). But when fix is published it also fixes the old calculations. Usually the affected false 'good' values are around 50 above the league borders (note that master league players are never capped). In your case the 'fix' would have set all those 4 'good games' as 'capped' and estimate value for current MMR would be ~1059. How are you able to see which games have good data? I always thought it was only "good" when the opponent's square was filled white. I also don't understand what you mean by games being "capped" more at certain values, is there more information in another of your replies as to what this bug is really doing?
Press Config button and then > 'Data' > 'Mark assumptions / bad Games'
When you are in the low range of your league MMR range, Blizzard artificially increases the ladder points you get & decreases the ladder points you lose. If you are in that area your MMR cannot be calculated as Blizzard has modified your point changes. To be more clear the tool calculates your MMR from opponent's data. If the opponent is 'capped' your MMR cannot be calculated (gives wrong value). In your case the tool thought that those 4 opponents were not capped and calculated your MMR based on their data.
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Is there any simple rule to tell if an opponent is capped or is it a complex algorithm?
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On April 23 2013 06:34 Aimconquest wrote:
Is there any simple rule to tell if an opponent is capped or is it a complex algorithm?
The main rules are simple:
if players A mmr is under a spec mark relative to his league he is point-caped.
Point-Caped means that the system wants to hide from A that he is in the bottom of your league.
So it gives him points that he do not deserv.
Because he got unkown amount of undeserved points, its unkown how much points he normally would get.
Without this information, its not possible to calculate the MMR of his opponent B.
We call B DMMR-caped or short caped now.
If B is point-caped too, the chance is high that he play against point-caped guys because the system gives you equal opponents.
Thats what we call the cap-zone.
In practice you have a high chance of bad games if you are in this MMR-zone.
Only if you play a guy above the cap-zone or someone who is a league under you ( and high in this league) you get a good result again. But this is unlikely because the system search for opponents close to you = in the zone.
EDIT: with the now smaller league sizes its near half the league.
Also cap is disabled in master and gm league.
Because for some strange reason, blizzard thinks that everyone who is under master cant handle the truth.
Not that they would tell the complete truth for above master tho... they just lie a little bit less.
How to find out if this is the case in a specific game,is the real task and more complicated.
And thats what the problematic is about right now.
Can be that its a change of the cap-rule, or an old bug of my code that is only now noticeable because of the new matching-system behavior.
korona will find it out and then patch the client.
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I've won the last 3 games but the mmr graph continues it's downwards trajectory, I realise it must be wrong, but it still hurts to see 
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On April 23 2013 14:02 Whirligig wrote:I've won the last 3 games but the mmr graph continues it's downwards trajectory, I realise it must be wrong, but it still hurts to see
Based on my understanding (Korona/Skeldark/etc, correct me if I am wrong), it tells you that you are likely within the "capping" range of the league, unless there is another bug or issue. This basically means that your MMR is below the minimum divisional MMR of the league (i.e. your MMR is at the low end of your league or below your league). Once your MMR is at or above the minimum divisional MMR of your league, the capping range problem should no longer effect you. While this might be of limited help, it does tell you that your MMR is at the bottom end of your current league.
I don't know exactly what the minimal divisional MMR set offs are now, but Excalibur_Z discussed this in his articles about the league system back in WoL. With the changes since WoL, however, I don't know if this has changed.
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United States12240 Posts
On April 24 2013 04:40 FCLogan wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2013 14:02 Whirligig wrote:I've won the last 3 games but the mmr graph continues it's downwards trajectory, I realise it must be wrong, but it still hurts to see Based on my understanding (Korona/Skeldark/etc, correct me if I am wrong), it tells you that you are likely within the "capping" range of the league, unless there is another bug or issue. This basically means that your MMR is below the minimum divisional MMR of the league (i.e. your MMR is at the low end of your league or below your league). Once your MMR is at or above the minimum divisional MMR of your league, the capping range problem should no longer effect you. While this might be of limited help, it does tell you that your MMR is at the bottom end of your current league. I don't know exactly what the minimal divisional MMR set offs are now, but Excalibur_Z discussed this in his articles about the league system back in WoL. With the changes since WoL, however, I don't know if this has changed.
The minimum divisional MMR applies to your opponents and not to you. If you are below the minimum and therefore play against people who are also below the minimum, then you'll be less likely to record good games because your opponent's MMR will be replaced by the minimum. If you are above the minimum but your search range is wide enough to play against people who are below the minimum, you will be more likely to record good games, but there's always a chance that you'll meet a below-minimum player and not have a good game.
In short, if my league's MMR range is 0-500 and the minimum is 100, then anyone I meet below 100 will appear to be 100. If I'm below 100 then I'll probably meet other <100 players and because they all appear to be 100 to me, I don't know if they're really 30 or 60 or 80. If I'm 200, mostly I'll face 200 players but in the off-chance that I meet a 100, I don't know if he's 100 or <100. The further away I get from 100, the less likely I'll encounter those <100 players.
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EPT![[image loading]](http://www.lysator.liu.se/~john/mmr2.png)
![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/cZYsOpO.png)
