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On February 19 2012 02:50 Noocta wrote:
I don't want to have to play Turtle mech + Ravens.
TvZ is fun because marines are very mobile and versatile. :/
10 years broodwar progamers were just fine with the state of tvp.
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Seeker missile is not very good anti-Brood Lord if Zerg is paying attention, but it works to make Vikings vastly more effective against all Zerg air units because not only do corruptors and mutalisks stack heavily when attacking, they are also outranged by Vikings and so will take a lot of damage in their retreat.
And I think Terrans vastly overestimate the effectiveness of this dreaded ultralisk remax that loses effectiveness entirely against a decent number of marines and medivacs, especially with with 3-4 marauders mixed in, provided you don't get fungaled too much. It does not take a hard tech transition to beat ultras; they are naturally extremely bad against medivacs, Thors (also useful against BLs), tanks which they cannot reach, and marines (at least at killing marines; it takes several seconds to kill a single marine being healed by a medivac with ultras).
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On February 19 2012 03:17 ceaRshaf wrote:Show nested quote +On February 19 2012 02:50 Noocta wrote:
I don't want to have to play Turtle mech + Ravens.
TvZ is fun because marines are very mobile and versatile. :/ 10 years broodwar progamers were just fine with the state of tvp.
Thors/Helions and Roaches make TvZ Mech sooooo much worse then it was in BW. It can be strong if the opponent doesn't know how to play against Mech and on some Maps.
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On February 19 2012 03:17 ceaRshaf wrote:Show nested quote +On February 19 2012 02:50 Noocta wrote:
I don't want to have to play Turtle mech + Ravens.
TvZ is fun because marines are very mobile and versatile. :/ 10 years broodwar progamers were just fine with the state of tvp.
Well i'm not.
Terran is fun in sc2 because both the passive turtely style and the heavy agression style work.
If i wanted to sit down and macro up without attacking before max, i'll play protoss or zerg. <<
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On February 19 2012 03:18 s3rp wrote:Show nested quote +On February 19 2012 03:17 ceaRshaf wrote:On February 19 2012 02:50 Noocta wrote:
I don't want to have to play Turtle mech + Ravens.
TvZ is fun because marines are very mobile and versatile. :/ 10 years broodwar progamers were just fine with the state of tvp. Thors make TvZ sooooo much worse then it was in BW.
lucky you're getting goliaths then eh?
good god this thread makes my head hurt to ^ guy
what's stopping you from playing an aggressive style anyway as terran?
If you've decided to transition into ghosts you're turtling in the first place so this change doesn't concern you
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On February 19 2012 02:51 FGSonata wrote:Show nested quote +On February 19 2012 01:31 Liquid`Jinro wrote:On February 18 2012 23:02 Lorch wrote:On February 18 2012 23:01 llKenZyll wrote:On February 18 2012 12:55 FinestHour wrote:
Yup looks like ghost change is going through, better start busting out the ravens friends. Spread broods? They don't do it vs mothership vortex they won't do it vs HSM. It took terrans a year to start using ghost's emp spell against a race where every unit has atleast 1/3 of health in shields, in this game it takes people a lot of time to start playing correctly. You are an idiot, terran used ghosts since DAY 1 OF BETA. I can tell yout his because I PLAYED SINCE DAY1 OF BETA. No they have not. Sorry. I played since Day 1 of beta. There might be like two terran out there who used ghosts once in a while out of curiosity. But never as a standard part of the composition until the recent metagame changes. I think you don't have the right to call people idiots until you win a game.
I don't think you have the right to tell a PROgamer who won an MLG and achieved 2 semifinal GSL appearances that they don't have a right. You played since day 1 of the beta? Was Jinro not a terran in day 1 of beta? I am pretty sure he probably made ghosts vs protoss and has a TON more credentials than you and is more qualified to talk about the subject than you ever will be.
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On February 19 2012 03:19 Denzil wrote:Show nested quote +On February 19 2012 03:18 s3rp wrote:On February 19 2012 03:17 ceaRshaf wrote:On February 19 2012 02:50 Noocta wrote:
I don't want to have to play Turtle mech + Ravens.
TvZ is fun because marines are very mobile and versatile. :/ 10 years broodwar progamers were just fine with the state of tvp. Thors make TvZ sooooo much worse then it was in BW. lucky you're getting goliaths then eh?
Still with an anti muta anti air only.
Because viking are here, they can't make thors or Warhound general anti air.
edit : the problem we will have with heavy bio build, there will be no transition possible to survive lategame, because as everyone pointed ravens don't incorpored well with a marine tanks midgame. But they can work with a mech style.
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On February 19 2012 03:19 Denzil wrote:Show nested quote +On February 19 2012 03:18 s3rp wrote:On February 19 2012 03:17 ceaRshaf wrote:On February 19 2012 02:50 Noocta wrote:
I don't want to have to play Turtle mech + Ravens.
TvZ is fun because marines are very mobile and versatile. :/ 10 years broodwar progamers were just fine with the state of tvp. Thors make TvZ sooooo much worse then it was in BW. lucky you're getting goliaths then eh? good god this thread makes my head hurt to ^ guy what's stopping you from playing an aggressive style anyway as terran? If you've decided to transition into ghosts you're turtling in the first place so this change doesn't concern you
The idea of the Warhound was that it's good against light Air Units and Mechanical Ground Units. The doesn't sound very promising tbh for TvZ. With Mech right now its very hard to expand beyond 3 Bases on so many current Maps since your army is so immobile . Planetaries do nothing against Roaches that basically 1 shot it and move away before your army arrives.
Then you have to account for possible Nydus and Drops that are almost impossible to react to without losing a ton if you play Mech.
Right now Mech has 1 mobile Unit and thats the Helion but it's utterly useless against non-light beyond overwhelmingly superior numbers .
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On February 19 2012 03:20 Non0 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 19 2012 02:51 FGSonata wrote:On February 19 2012 01:31 Liquid`Jinro wrote:On February 18 2012 23:02 Lorch wrote:On February 18 2012 23:01 llKenZyll wrote:On February 18 2012 12:55 FinestHour wrote:
Yup looks like ghost change is going through, better start busting out the ravens friends. Spread broods? They don't do it vs mothership vortex they won't do it vs HSM. It took terrans a year to start using ghost's emp spell against a race where every unit has atleast 1/3 of health in shields, in this game it takes people a lot of time to start playing correctly. You are an idiot, terran used ghosts since DAY 1 OF BETA. I can tell yout his because I PLAYED SINCE DAY1 OF BETA. No they have not. Sorry. I played since Day 1 of beta. There might be like two terran out there who used ghosts once in a while out of curiosity. But never as a standard part of the composition until the recent metagame changes. I think you don't have the right to call people idiots until you win a game. I don't think you have the right to tell a PROgamer who won an MLG and achieved 2 semifinal GSL appearances that they don't have a right. You played since day 1 of the beta? Was Jinro not a terran in day 1 of beta? I am pretty sure he probably made ghosts vs protoss and has a TON more credentials than you and is more qualified to talk about the subject than you ever will be.
That PROgamer has achieved nothing since then, because his gimmicks got figured out and the metagame evolved and he did not.
And certainly has never accomplished anything that gives him, in his very little achievement and no moral high ground, the right to call someone else an idiot.
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On February 19 2012 03:23 FGSonata wrote:Show nested quote +On February 19 2012 03:20 Non0 wrote:On February 19 2012 02:51 FGSonata wrote:On February 19 2012 01:31 Liquid`Jinro wrote:On February 18 2012 23:02 Lorch wrote:On February 18 2012 23:01 llKenZyll wrote:On February 18 2012 12:55 FinestHour wrote:
Yup looks like ghost change is going through, better start busting out the ravens friends. Spread broods? They don't do it vs mothership vortex they won't do it vs HSM. It took terrans a year to start using ghost's emp spell against a race where every unit has atleast 1/3 of health in shields, in this game it takes people a lot of time to start playing correctly. You are an idiot, terran used ghosts since DAY 1 OF BETA. I can tell yout his because I PLAYED SINCE DAY1 OF BETA. No they have not. Sorry. I played since Day 1 of beta. There might be like two terran out there who used ghosts once in a while out of curiosity. But never as a standard part of the composition until the recent metagame changes. I think you don't have the right to call people idiots until you win a game. I don't think you have the right to tell a PROgamer who won an MLG and achieved 2 semifinal GSL appearances that they don't have a right. You played since day 1 of the beta? Was Jinro not a terran in day 1 of beta? I am pretty sure he probably made ghosts vs protoss and has a TON more credentials than you and is more qualified to talk about the subject than you ever will be. That PROgamer has achieved nothing since then, because his gimmicks got figured out and the metagame evolved and he did not. And certainly has never accomplished anything that gives him, in his very little achievement and no moral high ground, the right to call someone else an idiot.
Are you better than Jinro please confirm or deny
It doesn't give him the right to call someone an idiot, but if someone makes a stupid comment and yes, it was a stupid comment then Jinro's going to call them out on it
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Sweet can't wait to play a patch with no meaningful testing whatsoever. Yay for Ghost getting slaughtered.
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On February 19 2012 03:23 FGSonata wrote:Show nested quote +On February 19 2012 03:20 Non0 wrote:On February 19 2012 02:51 FGSonata wrote:On February 19 2012 01:31 Liquid`Jinro wrote:On February 18 2012 23:02 Lorch wrote:On February 18 2012 23:01 llKenZyll wrote:On February 18 2012 12:55 FinestHour wrote:
Yup looks like ghost change is going through, better start busting out the ravens friends. Spread broods? They don't do it vs mothership vortex they won't do it vs HSM. It took terrans a year to start using ghost's emp spell against a race where every unit has atleast 1/3 of health in shields, in this game it takes people a lot of time to start playing correctly. You are an idiot, terran used ghosts since DAY 1 OF BETA. I can tell yout his because I PLAYED SINCE DAY1 OF BETA. No they have not. Sorry. I played since Day 1 of beta. There might be like two terran out there who used ghosts once in a while out of curiosity. But never as a standard part of the composition until the recent metagame changes. I think you don't have the right to call people idiots until you win a game. I don't think you have the right to tell a PROgamer who won an MLG and achieved 2 semifinal GSL appearances that they don't have a right. You played since day 1 of the beta? Was Jinro not a terran in day 1 of beta? I am pretty sure he probably made ghosts vs protoss and has a TON more credentials than you and is more qualified to talk about the subject than you ever will be. That PROgamer has achieved nothing since then, because his gimmicks got figured out and the metagame evolved and he did not. And certainly has never accomplished anything that gives him, in his very little achievement and no moral high ground, the right to call someone else an idiot.
Your a ****ing idiot, I remember watching Jinro since way back, using mech 2 base pushes when terrans never even thought about mech, even before Artosis became the spokesperson for all that is mech. I don't really like to kiss ass but when I see regular idiots insulting progamer's results and credentials it bugs the hell out of me. His play was certainly not gimmicky, it was some of the strongest terran I'd seen back then, and there was definately a point where I thought Jinro could hold a flame to the likes of MVP, MKP and SC, who were the big dick terrans back then.
I dont care if it was a year ago, RO4 is more than You, I or most people on this forum will ever accomplish once, let alone twice, same with winning an MLG.
In fact I'm pretty sure that's the farthest a foreigner has EVER made it in a GSL tournament, I think HuK went out in RO8 to MVP, iDra never cracked RO16, no other foreigner has made Code S on their own merit from these two.
And I'm guessing being paid to play a video game is a big enough acheivement in itself, not everyone can win all the time.
SO many haters nowadays, Guerilla Terran we still got your ass dawg. Drop the sunglasses and dig the beanie out, you can win still.
User was temp banned for this post.
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On February 19 2012 04:04 GeNeSiDe wrote:Show nested quote +On February 19 2012 03:23 FGSonata wrote:On February 19 2012 03:20 Non0 wrote:On February 19 2012 02:51 FGSonata wrote:On February 19 2012 01:31 Liquid`Jinro wrote:On February 18 2012 23:02 Lorch wrote:On February 18 2012 23:01 llKenZyll wrote:On February 18 2012 12:55 FinestHour wrote:
Yup looks like ghost change is going through, better start busting out the ravens friends. Spread broods? They don't do it vs mothership vortex they won't do it vs HSM. It took terrans a year to start using ghost's emp spell against a race where every unit has atleast 1/3 of health in shields, in this game it takes people a lot of time to start playing correctly. You are an idiot, terran used ghosts since DAY 1 OF BETA. I can tell yout his because I PLAYED SINCE DAY1 OF BETA. No they have not. Sorry. I played since Day 1 of beta. There might be like two terran out there who used ghosts once in a while out of curiosity. But never as a standard part of the composition until the recent metagame changes. I think you don't have the right to call people idiots until you win a game. I don't think you have the right to tell a PROgamer who won an MLG and achieved 2 semifinal GSL appearances that they don't have a right. You played since day 1 of the beta? Was Jinro not a terran in day 1 of beta? I am pretty sure he probably made ghosts vs protoss and has a TON more credentials than you and is more qualified to talk about the subject than you ever will be. That PROgamer has achieved nothing since then, because his gimmicks got figured out and the metagame evolved and he did not. And certainly has never accomplished anything that gives him, in his very little achievement and no moral high ground, the right to call someone else an idiot. Your a ****ing idiot, I remember watching Jinro since way back, using mech 2 base pushes when terrans never even thought about mech, even before Artosis became the spokesperson for all that is mech. I don't really like to kiss ass but when I see regular idiots insulting progamer's results and credentials it bugs the hell out of me. His play was certainly not gimmicky, it was some of the strongest terran I'd seen back then, and there was definately a point where I thought Jinro could hold a flame to the likes of MVP, MKP and SC, who were the big dick terrans back then. I dont care if it was a year ago, RO4 is more than You, I or most people on this forum will ever accomplish once, let alone twice, same with winning an MLG. In fact I'm pretty sure that's the farthest a foreigner has EVER made it in a GSL tournament, I think HuK went out in RO8 to MVP, iDra never cracked RO16, no other foreigner has made Code S on their own merit from these two. And I'm guessing being paid to play a video game is a big enough acheivement in itself, not everyone can win all the time. SO many haters nowadays, Guerilla Terran we still got your ass dawg. Drop the sunglasses and dig the beanie out, you can win still.
Actually Idra was in RO8, please educate yourself before posting such blatant bias. Also after Jinros amazing RO4 run he dropped to code A and then to code B and was never seen again.
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On February 18 2012 21:36 Snowbear wrote:
Toss players never found out about "upgrading quickly". Blizzard buffed their upgrade costs.
Thanks for the revisionist history. Double forge was not a response to Blizzard making upgrades cheaper. The strategy was already widely used before that buff...and it was a SLIGHT buff. Warp prisms were also being used much more frequently before the shield buff. Not as much as they are now, but it was already a trend. Please refrain from inaccurate historicizing.
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On February 19 2012 04:13 hunts wrote:Show nested quote +On February 19 2012 04:04 GeNeSiDe wrote:On February 19 2012 03:23 FGSonata wrote:On February 19 2012 03:20 Non0 wrote:On February 19 2012 02:51 FGSonata wrote:On February 19 2012 01:31 Liquid`Jinro wrote:On February 18 2012 23:02 Lorch wrote:On February 18 2012 23:01 llKenZyll wrote:On February 18 2012 12:55 FinestHour wrote:
Yup looks like ghost change is going through, better start busting out the ravens friends. Spread broods? They don't do it vs mothership vortex they won't do it vs HSM. It took terrans a year to start using ghost's emp spell against a race where every unit has atleast 1/3 of health in shields, in this game it takes people a lot of time to start playing correctly. You are an idiot, terran used ghosts since DAY 1 OF BETA. I can tell yout his because I PLAYED SINCE DAY1 OF BETA. No they have not. Sorry. I played since Day 1 of beta. There might be like two terran out there who used ghosts once in a while out of curiosity. But never as a standard part of the composition until the recent metagame changes. I think you don't have the right to call people idiots until you win a game. I don't think you have the right to tell a PROgamer who won an MLG and achieved 2 semifinal GSL appearances that they don't have a right. You played since day 1 of the beta? Was Jinro not a terran in day 1 of beta? I am pretty sure he probably made ghosts vs protoss and has a TON more credentials than you and is more qualified to talk about the subject than you ever will be. That PROgamer has achieved nothing since then, because his gimmicks got figured out and the metagame evolved and he did not. And certainly has never accomplished anything that gives him, in his very little achievement and no moral high ground, the right to call someone else an idiot. Your a ****ing idiot, I remember watching Jinro since way back, using mech 2 base pushes when terrans never even thought about mech, even before Artosis became the spokesperson for all that is mech. I don't really like to kiss ass but when I see regular idiots insulting progamer's results and credentials it bugs the hell out of me. His play was certainly not gimmicky, it was some of the strongest terran I'd seen back then, and there was definately a point where I thought Jinro could hold a flame to the likes of MVP, MKP and SC, who were the big dick terrans back then. I dont care if it was a year ago, RO4 is more than You, I or most people on this forum will ever accomplish once, let alone twice, same with winning an MLG. In fact I'm pretty sure that's the farthest a foreigner has EVER made it in a GSL tournament, I think HuK went out in RO8 to MVP, iDra never cracked RO16, no other foreigner has made Code S on their own merit from these two. And I'm guessing being paid to play a video game is a big enough acheivement in itself, not everyone can win all the time. SO many haters nowadays, Guerilla Terran we still got your ass dawg. Drop the sunglasses and dig the beanie out, you can win still. Actually Idra was in RO8, please educate yourself before posting such blatant bias. Also after Jinros amazing RO4 run he dropped to code A and then to code B and was never seen again.
Not to mention one of Jinro's ro4 was achieved by beating IdrA.
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Guerilla Terran we still got your ass dawg
lmao, suspect
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On February 19 2012 03:23 FGSonata wrote:Show nested quote +On February 19 2012 03:20 Non0 wrote:On February 19 2012 02:51 FGSonata wrote:On February 19 2012 01:31 Liquid`Jinro wrote:On February 18 2012 23:02 Lorch wrote:On February 18 2012 23:01 llKenZyll wrote:On February 18 2012 12:55 FinestHour wrote:
Yup looks like ghost change is going through, better start busting out the ravens friends. Spread broods? They don't do it vs mothership vortex they won't do it vs HSM. It took terrans a year to start using ghost's emp spell against a race where every unit has atleast 1/3 of health in shields, in this game it takes people a lot of time to start playing correctly. You are an idiot, terran used ghosts since DAY 1 OF BETA. I can tell yout his because I PLAYED SINCE DAY1 OF BETA. No they have not. Sorry. I played since Day 1 of beta. There might be like two terran out there who used ghosts once in a while out of curiosity. But never as a standard part of the composition until the recent metagame changes. I think you don't have the right to call people idiots until you win a game. I don't think you have the right to tell a PROgamer who won an MLG and achieved 2 semifinal GSL appearances that they don't have a right. You played since day 1 of the beta? Was Jinro not a terran in day 1 of beta? I am pretty sure he probably made ghosts vs protoss and has a TON more credentials than you and is more qualified to talk about the subject than you ever will be. That PROgamer has achieved nothing since then, because his gimmicks got figured out and the metagame evolved and he did not. And certainly has never accomplished anything that gives him, in his very little achievement and no moral high ground, the right to call someone else an idiot.
Jinro made the finals of the Code A Qualifiers recently, and made the Semi-Finals of the EWM just last week.
What have you done again?
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On February 19 2012 04:31 VirgilSC2 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 19 2012 03:23 FGSonata wrote:On February 19 2012 03:20 Non0 wrote:On February 19 2012 02:51 FGSonata wrote:On February 19 2012 01:31 Liquid`Jinro wrote:On February 18 2012 23:02 Lorch wrote:On February 18 2012 23:01 llKenZyll wrote:On February 18 2012 12:55 FinestHour wrote:
Yup looks like ghost change is going through, better start busting out the ravens friends. Spread broods? They don't do it vs mothership vortex they won't do it vs HSM. It took terrans a year to start using ghost's emp spell against a race where every unit has atleast 1/3 of health in shields, in this game it takes people a lot of time to start playing correctly. You are an idiot, terran used ghosts since DAY 1 OF BETA. I can tell yout his because I PLAYED SINCE DAY1 OF BETA. No they have not. Sorry. I played since Day 1 of beta. There might be like two terran out there who used ghosts once in a while out of curiosity. But never as a standard part of the composition until the recent metagame changes. I think you don't have the right to call people idiots until you win a game. I don't think you have the right to tell a PROgamer who won an MLG and achieved 2 semifinal GSL appearances that they don't have a right. You played since day 1 of the beta? Was Jinro not a terran in day 1 of beta? I am pretty sure he probably made ghosts vs protoss and has a TON more credentials than you and is more qualified to talk about the subject than you ever will be. That PROgamer has achieved nothing since then, because his gimmicks got figured out and the metagame evolved and he did not. And certainly has never accomplished anything that gives him, in his very little achievement and no moral high ground, the right to call someone else an idiot. Jinro made the finals of the Code A Qualifiers recently, and made the Semi-Finals of the EWM just last week. What have you done again?
To be fair, how good this guy is at starcraft 2, or what he has "done" is irrelevant to his critique of jinro.
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though I agree with you, his critique started with "until you win a game" so... :S
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On February 19 2012 04:38 Horseballs wrote:Show nested quote +On February 19 2012 04:31 VirgilSC2 wrote:On February 19 2012 03:23 FGSonata wrote:On February 19 2012 03:20 Non0 wrote:On February 19 2012 02:51 FGSonata wrote:On February 19 2012 01:31 Liquid`Jinro wrote:On February 18 2012 23:02 Lorch wrote:On February 18 2012 23:01 llKenZyll wrote:On February 18 2012 12:55 FinestHour wrote:
Yup looks like ghost change is going through, better start busting out the ravens friends. Spread broods? They don't do it vs mothership vortex they won't do it vs HSM. It took terrans a year to start using ghost's emp spell against a race where every unit has atleast 1/3 of health in shields, in this game it takes people a lot of time to start playing correctly. You are an idiot, terran used ghosts since DAY 1 OF BETA. I can tell yout his because I PLAYED SINCE DAY1 OF BETA. No they have not. Sorry. I played since Day 1 of beta. There might be like two terran out there who used ghosts once in a while out of curiosity. But never as a standard part of the composition until the recent metagame changes. I think you don't have the right to call people idiots until you win a game. I don't think you have the right to tell a PROgamer who won an MLG and achieved 2 semifinal GSL appearances that they don't have a right. You played since day 1 of the beta? Was Jinro not a terran in day 1 of beta? I am pretty sure he probably made ghosts vs protoss and has a TON more credentials than you and is more qualified to talk about the subject than you ever will be. That PROgamer has achieved nothing since then, because his gimmicks got figured out and the metagame evolved and he did not. And certainly has never accomplished anything that gives him, in his very little achievement and no moral high ground, the right to call someone else an idiot. Jinro made the finals of the Code A Qualifiers recently, and made the Semi-Finals of the EWM just last week. What have you done again? To be fair, how good this guy is at starcraft 2, or what he has "done" is irrelevant to his critique of jinro.
It's not a critique, it's just straight up bashing with no basis.
The guy clearly doesn't pay enough attention to the pro scene to make these judgement calls on how Jinro has achieved "nothing" since his time in the GSL.
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