Patch 1.4.3 - Preview Blog - Page 211

On February 16 2012 10:20 Renegade_Doc wrote:
The arguments about the snipe nerf reminds me of the MASSIVE outcry at the blueflame nerf.
Remember?
When blueflame hellions were going to become 100% useless?
That totally happened. Those shit blueflame hellions are useless.
Never win any games with those pieces of crap anymore, eh?

*perhaps* the nerf is too much in the form suggested right now, but that's why PTR is used.

Arguing that it is fine because the nerf would be too hard on terran endgame is *horribly* flawed.
All this, and ghosts (snipe especially) went amost *unused* until very damn recently, and terran were doing fine even without them (check your historic win ratios, terran have *never* been underpowered, and 5 raxx reaper? yeah...)
p
The argument that zerg can "techswitch in the blink of an eye" is retarded as well, especially when the tech switch cited most often is mass lings.
The endgame tech switches have shown to be weak vs heavy ghost compositions, time and time again, ultras? snipe. broodlords? snipe. back to ling/bling/muta midgame play? snipe the tech, lings vs *anything* will melt fast enough unsupported.
If lings are such a great and obvious solution to ghosts, to the point where its the only viable option, then that means terran get to know exactly what they need to play against, I'm sure the budding terran mind can come up to a counter to lings?

I dont get how tech switching is somehow free for zerg, yes, it's easier to rebuild a tailored army as zerg, but terran can just make an army that is solid vs anything and add in some flavour for the zerg to deal with.

Also take into account the strength of terran early game.
Even well timed pressure builds take games from decent zerg, or outright crush lower leaguers.
Hell, proxying barracks for bunker rushes cannot be punished by zerg. Even assuming lucky scouting, the terran doesn't really *lose* anything. (this has been shown time and again, and is why 2rax remained popular)
(idra vs alive showmatch, alive floats his raxx around to spot the OL idra needs to scout, and wins with mass hellions idra couldn't have known were coming. Should idra have assumed something tricky, yup. He definitely dint defend as well as he could, but without the necessary scouting info, he'd have been rolling dice.)

Early midgame still doesn't give a macro zerg any advantages, as the 10minute~ tank marine pushes show up as or before the first mutas pop, and even if *crushed* terran should have enough at home to prevent any reasonable counter.
Even agressive zerg run the risk of being shut down and essentially losing immediately.

Midgame is arguably in favour of muta/ling zergs as the muta ball gets to work pinning and expansions get layed down (how many terran repeatedly called for nerfs to this style? before even trying to get thors to force magic boxing, or overproducing turrets as we see a lot now? Hell, I think maruaders were still in vogue in TvZ at the time...)
Seems overall pretty balanced and fun though

Endgame, the switch to hive is tough, and teching to broods after is often nailbiting. Terran get to see all of this if they've been actively scouting, the spire and lair wont in fact sprout legs and walk off, so a scan will suffice.
The zerg however has to take head counts on units, sacc units to look at production and so on. Still not so bad, I can see a terran legitimately arguing that does not need to be changed, as tech switching for them is a bit of a ballache in lategame (early game, you switch addons like all the buildings need to catch the cooties)

That leaves a pretty big window to get stuff done, even talking just lategame.
Plenty enough to exploit. But call all things equal and zerg makes it.
Currently, any terran worth his salt has been getting ghosts.
These ghosts can now;
- EMP infectors, an essential component of the army.
- Snipe: infestors, blings, mutas, corruptors, ultas and broods, all trading not ony cost effectively, but given a decent engagement (which terran will have unless *very* unlucky) *crushingly*

Having one unit to counter them all is not good. Infestors are that for zerg.
It was patched in as a crutch because zerg could *not* deal with certain compositions and timings.
Terran do not have such problems.
And yet, when infestors became popular, a "one unit counter to everything" these forums were alight with how abusive they were, and needed nerfing.
Without
Even
Trying

Broodlord infestor endgame also means that the zerg army just became the least mobile army in the game.
We here all about exploiting slow armies dont we? I hear you like drop play...

***

People need to stop hyperbolising.
Ghost snipe is OP atm, any reasoning person can see that.
Way back when Zerg admittedly *repeatedly* that infestors were too good and probably needed nerfing and were certainly difficult to deal with, Terran are not providing the same courtesy.
After 30 minutes, you finally get to feel some of what zergs feel all game long, and it makes you every bit as whiney as the worst zerg players.
IF the nerf goes live in its current form, IF the lategame balance shifts back in zergs favour. I'd still give it a little time and see if a solid pro cant come up with an equally elegent solution, which all terrans will then adopt and start acting like the terran race is the genius that tries everything while the other races sit in their basement playing pokemon and trying to get by on their looks.

On February 16 2012 17:24 Chicken Chaser wrote:
This. Why didn't the blizzard folk address this instead of 30+25 light? I guess we'll have to wait for PTR for some high level players to play a ton of late game TvZ... lol?

On February 16 2012 17:28 fiveohfive wrote:
Hey I just realised!

More snipes required = more apm required.... thats an indirect buff to Zerg and Protoss!....

C'mon people please see the sense in this!

The terrans who didn't like the BFH nerf were against it because they preferred mech TvT over biomech. It had nothing to do with them not realizing that it was overpowered. It's not about being reactionary or self absorbed.