EPTTSL claims Fnatic tampered with Alive, Fnatic denies - Pag…
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Discussing the controversy and stating your opinions in a constructive way is fine, but there will be bans for any player/organization bashing without anything to substantiate it. | ||
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GreyKnight
United States4720 Posts
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moonmeh
Korea (South)105 Posts
There was an article related to you today, what thoughts do you have on it? I know firstly that I was in the wrong and I clearly said that to Coach Lee and Coach Lee said that he understood. But he said that he must get the reparation fee. I contacted him on Sunday and he said that to the reporters he said that it ended well with the fee being received so I didn't need to worry. So this is what I thought I knew was bewildered by the article that came up on my game day. I guess he's saying that he understands in word only. What is the part where you think you did wrong? Cross contract seems be an over reaction, as I haven't made a contract yet. I received an offer from the translator last Sunday and on Monday he asked if I wanted to talk to the Fnatic manager and talked in detail. Later Coach Lee called me over and showed me the printed out copy of the conversation. Seeing as how the conversation was done in Skype on my computer I wonder how he got it. However I know I was in the wrong so I apologized and asked him to understand. What do you think was the problem? The fact that I didn't talk to the coach and talked to Fnatic. As for switching team, I first wanted to leave the team and then go to Fnatic. However Coach Lee found out before I told him and I think that soured him. That's why I apologized to him and prepared for the things that will happen. Many TSL players left before and we did have a contract in name after Puma left. When Clide and others left Coach said if there was any problems you could leave as well. I wanted to leave then but due to personal reasons I said I'll stay a bit longer but did not want to be a team mate. At the time I thought the coach accepted that but I guess he didn't Was the talk with Fnatic after you decided to leave the team? When Killer and Clide said that they wanted to leave me and JYP said that we wanted to leave too. I thought it would be bad to continue to stay with this team so I wanted to leave and there were good offers. Until when does the contract with TSL last? Until July Despite that why did you want to leave the team? Other teamates left and I didn't have good opinion about the team. There was some selfish thoughts as well. I thought I was getting no benefit from staying in the team so I wanted to clearly state that I wanted to leave. I got class now so I'll finish translating this. Overall it seems that Alive was kinda dumb in talking to Fnatic without telling his coach. However it's fucking shady that Coach Lee basically went into Alive's computer without permission. Fnatic also has a fair share of the blame as they should have contacted the coach not the player. Alive also is enduing due to the belief that Fnatic will take him in. Will post this later on with full interview. | ||
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bluQ
Germany1724 Posts
On January 19 2012 00:41 Kich wrote: WOO! More wild accusations by Coach Lee, this time he's got evidence! :| ... Good thing in a few days this will blow over and no one will care until it happens again. He claims he got evidence which he doesn't want to share yet. Thats what i call "empty threat". "Other teamates left and I didn't have good opinion about the team. There was some selfish thoughts as well. I thought I was getting no benefit from staying in the team so I wanted to clearly state that I wanted to leave. " So Coach Lee's actions are just a try to undermine the free-will of his players since they are running off. Instead of questioning why so many players talk not good about TSL he throws around accusations. This is just a showing of a weak personality. | ||
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Kich
United States339 Posts
On January 19 2012 00:42 GreyKnight wrote: if TSL is so terrible and poorly managed how come problems only arise when players get poached by FOREIGN teams, coach lee has no problem with his players leaving and joining korean teams. Because when a player leaves his team for a foreign team it's poaching but when they leave for a korean team, they're just leaving for a korean team? Seven players have left TSL of their own will, what other team has lost seven players like that? | ||
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Joedaddy
United States1948 Posts
Save E-Sports!! 86 the drama. | ||
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ftjust
Sweden43 Posts
On January 18 2012 14:43 TeamLiquid ESPORTS wrote: Last updated: Jan 19th, 00:37 Korean Standard Time Following a claim from Team SCV Life that Fnatic Life's Han "Alive" Lee Seok had been signed by Fnatic behind TSL management's back, a back and forth between the two sides has ensued. Though fnatic deny they acted inappropriately regarding the under-contract Alive, TSL continues to insist there was foul play. In the first salvo, Coach Lee claimed through a Gamechosun.com article that Alive had left TSL to join Fnatic, with Fnatic going behind TSL management’s back and bypassing the appropriate channels. It would have been a similar situation to Evil Geniuses' acquisition of then TSL player Lee "Puma" Ho Jun after the NASL Season 1 Grand Finals, where Coach Lee expressed his displeasure at EG's supposedly backhanded approach. In the article, coach Lee was quoted as saying "It seems he talked about transferring teams with Fnatic's translator. Fnatic is denying responsibility by saying it's something the translator did on his own, but that's nonsense. I'm angry that they didn't approach me officially, and went to the player directly." Coach Lee said he was considering taking legal measures, such as suing Alive for breach of contract. However, Fnatic replied through an official statement that Alive had not in fact joined their team, and that they would not have approached him as they knew he was under contract. Fnatic mentioned that while Alive had in fact left the TSL house, it was for reasons unrelated to Fnatic. They acknowledged talk of a move to Fnatic between Alive and Fnatic translator Brian Hyun Choi, but only as part of an informal conversation between friends. Coach Lee would speak to Gamechosun once again to make a counter-argument against Fnatic's statement. Through the new article, coach Lee claimed that Alive had talked with Fnatic translator Brian Choi and general manager Elroy Pinto while he was still living at the TSL team house. Lee claims that Alive did not talk to him about his departure from the team, and fnatic consulted only Alive while discussing a possible move. Though Coach Lee admitted that there was no official offer, he argued that Fnatic was aware of loopholes Alive was trying to exploit but stayed silent. According to Coach Lee, Alive and Brian Choi had talked about about a transfer free that might be required, and also found a method where Coach Lee could by bypassed by having Alive leave TSL officially, then join Fnatic. Though Coach Lee offered both conciliatory and threatening comments towards Fnatic: "The player is most at fault, so I don't want relations with Fnatic to grow any worse... ...I haven't heard a single word of apology from Fnatic regarding the canceled partnership or this row with Alive. Also, they made an announcement that was completely untrue. If they continue to deny the truth and refuse to apologize, I am willing to come forth with evidence." Regarding alive, Coach lee stated "I feel very betrayed, but I hope this doesn't affect his play. I didn't want this to come out before his GSL games, so I'm a sorry it came to be this way... ...I've spent over 6,000,000 won on just his foreign tournament participation. That's how much I valued him as a player, so how could I let this issue pass over easily? It's like being in a nightmare." Related to this issue was a tentative partnership between Fnatic and TSL that never came to light. According to Coach Lee, the partnership was almost a done deal, with only an official announcement left. Fnatic explained that they were indeed exploring a partnership with a Korean team, with TSL as a candidate. However, they decided that the cost was prohibitive and decided to pursue options. Full statement from Fnatic: From fnatic.com The last few hours have created a lot of discussion on Fnatic, TSL, Coach Lee and aLive. Today Coach Lee announced that Fnatic have officially contracted aLive and as such we have already taken him in our roster. He has also spoken about how we approached him about a house share, somewhere for our players to train and we ended up stealing aLive from him. We feel it is only fair to share our side of the story as a lot of accusations have come up against Fnatic stealing players The truth is that we had been talking to Coach Lee for a few months about potentially sharing his house and paying for the training and beds. Coach Lee had been most encouraging and enthusiastic with this idea and we fully respect his skills as a manager. It is also true that at this time we were approached by other Korean teams who had expressed interest in working with us. Eventually we decided to not go ahead with a house sharing deal as it was too expensive and we realised we could maybe do things in a different way for 2012. We did not even finalize our terms. aLive is a fantastic player and we admire his skill, aLive did chat to our translator - Brian Hyun Choi , who is his friend, never with a formal offer it was a casual conversation between two friends. It is important to note that we have not signed any contract with aLive as we know he has a contract with TSL. We are in fact very sad that things had to take a public recourse as communication between TSL and Fnatic had never broken down. It seems Mr Lee wants to close the door. Furthermore aLive never decided to leave TSL for Fnatic he left the team house out of his own personal reasons with Coach Lee and those are not related to us, neither do we have any interest in knowing the reasons. In conclusion we highly respect both Mr Lee and aLives talents, and from Fnatic's side we will strive to work for an amicable deal with Coach Lee. Sources: Fnatic, Gamechosun 1, Gamechosun 2 So everything coach lee says is a lie what a douche bag that guy seems to be. before calling bigger and better e-sport organisations such as fnatic thiefs, maybe he should look inwards to his own team and wonder why every player he has is leaving. and they have huge problems wasent fruitdealer and another dude allso in tsl? and left because they didnt get paid. | ||
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Kich
United States339 Posts
On January 19 2012 00:43 moonmeh wrote: Interview from This Is Game. Cross contract seems be an over reaction, as I haven't made a contract yet. I received an offer from the translator last Sunday and on Monday he asked if I wanted to talk to the Fnatic manager and talked in detail. Later Coach Lee called me over and showed me the printed out copy of the conversation. Seeing as how the conversation was done in Skype on my computer I wonder how he got it. However I know I was in the wrong so I apologized and asked him to understand. ... What the fuck? But hey guys, Coach Lee is a really nice guy right? | ||
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StrikeNova
Canada47 Posts
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BlueFlames
Germany1756 Posts
On January 19 2012 00:46 Kich wrote: ... What the fuck? But hey guys, Coach Lee is a really nice guy right? I think this would be a really good reason to breake a legal contract or lets better say force the end of the contract legally. I dont know. SC2 is so much drama lately. After a wonderful start into the sc2-year with homestorycup 4, here we go with the drama again. Not even 1 month of drama-free sc2 to enjoy. | ||
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JoeAWESOME
Sweden1080 Posts
They are truly living The SCV Life, harsch and rough | ||
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shket
23 Posts
Coach Lee claim he spent money on player.... Is he doing charity or he want carry business payback? haha, when people do investment, who can grantee it is 100% success? In Korea, if you have a legal contract with employer, there is always fine money for early leave... why coach lee just crying crying, no just show us the contract, and ask alive to pay the fine?? Cant get this Coach.. So far alive has been two foreign tournament, one is NASL 1 where organizer booked and paid the bill. -_________________- Coach Lee, rage kid | ||
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States45367 Posts
"Though Coach Lee admitted that there was no official offer..." So now he backtracks and admits that aLive hasn't been poached by Fnatic -.-' "Coach Lee offered both conciliatory and threatening comments towards Fnatic: "The player is most at fault, so I don't want relations with Fnatic to grow any worse ... Regarding Alive, Coach lee stated "I feel very betrayed, but I hope this doesn't affect his play. I didn't want this to come out before his GSL games, so I'm a sorry it came to be this way... ...I've spent over 6,000,000 won on just his foreign tournament participation. That's how much I valued him as a player, so how could I let this issue pass over easily? It's like being in a nightmare." " He sounds so two-faced, and only sees aLive as an investment and not as a person. Yeah, aLive's coach and manager calling him out on the possibility of moving to another team even though no such other contract or even offer existed totally won't affect his play. Right. That won't cause dissension at all. I feel that Coach Lee is just continuously paranoid because he doesn't know how to handle the business aspects of the team. And that's apparently a huge problem (Puma, aLive, possibly previous players). Other teams aren't even doing anything illegal and he's still making huge problems because trades may or may not occur. | ||
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taitanik
Latvia231 Posts
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PHC
United States472 Posts
On January 19 2012 00:56 taitanik wrote: i think koreans dont even have contracts lol so how can someone be stolen from them? Read the thread, Alive is contracted with TSL until July. Edit: thread. | ||
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Asha
United Kingdom38257 Posts
On January 19 2012 00:56 DarkPlasmaBall wrote: From the most recent OP update: "Though Coach Lee admitted that there was no official offer..." So now he backtracks and admits that aLive hasn't been poached by Fnatic -.-' No official offer, aLive's interview with TIG says he received one from the translator though (this is what Fnatic brush off as casual conversation between friends in their statement) | ||
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Blasterion
China10272 Posts
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GARO
United States2255 Posts
On January 19 2012 00:43 Kich wrote: Because when a player leaves his team for a foreign team it's poaching but when they leave for a korean team, they're just leaving for a korean team? Seven players have left TSL of their own will, what other team has lost seven players like that? So that's why JYP was poached by the same EG that took Puma? Oh wait. | ||
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pampelmus
Switzerland215 Posts
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jellyjello
Korea (South)664 Posts
A: At first, it was mostly my own mistakes. I told coach Lee that I screwed up which he understood, but he also said that he and his team needs to be compensated. I called him on Sunday, and he said he told the media that he'd receive a compensation fee and everything will be OK. So, I thought everything was OK, but when I saw the news today it surprised me. Q: What do you think you did wrong? A: Trying to get a deal while I was still under contract with TSL. I have not signed with Fnatic yet. Fnatic's translator told me last Sunday that they'd give me an offer. I talked to the Fnatic's management on Monday with more details. But after that, Coach Lee called me and showed me a print out of conversation I had with Fnatic's management. I was speaking with Fnatic via Skype on my computer, so I was curious how he was able to get a hold of it. However, I let coach Lee know that I made a mistake and asked him to be considerate. Q: That sounds like you are just explaining what transpired. What exactly do you think you did wrong? A: The fact that I was talking to Fnatic without talking to the coach. I wanted to talk to him about transferring to another team after I move out (or be freed of TSL), but coach found out first and it hurt his feelings. So, I told him that I screwed up and prepared myself for whatever was going to happen from that point on. I did sign the contract with TSL when many TSL members left. When Lee Ho Joon (is that Puma?) left, he didn't have a contract. Coach said we can leave the team when Clide and JYP was leaving (probably referring to when TSL was restructuring). I wanted to leave then, but I had some personnal issues so I told the coach I'd stick around a bit more but not as a team member. I thought he understood my position back then, but apparently not. Q: When you talked with the Fnatic management, was it after you said you were leaving the team? A: When Killer and Clide said they were leaving, JYP and myself also said we were leaving. I didn't think I need to stay in this team, and there were also some good offers at that time. Q: When is your contract with TSL expire? A: July this year Q: Despite that (contract), why did you insist on leaving the team? A: Other members have left and the team's image is also not good. I was also being selfish. I didn't think TSL is helping me much. That's why I said I wanted to leave the team. Q: But still, contract means an agreement between two parties. Did you ever talk about the details of your contract? A: Coach found out before I was able to tell him of my plans. (skipping one line here... doesn't make sense. he says he wanted to tell him something that happend before). I agree that it's mostly my fault on that part. I did not understand the details of the contract because I was young and naive. I also can't defend myself if you accuse me that I was being greedy. That's the gist of it. The interview also says Coach Lee is asking approximately $1000 in compensation fee, and aLive is not sure if Fnatic is going to pay that in order to acquire his service. He also says he is willing to pay that money out of his own pocket so he is officially out of TSL (so he can sign with other teams). edit: nvm...someone already beat me to it. I hate translating | ||
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ftjust
Sweden43 Posts
 LOOOOOL thanks for the mousepad coach..... coach lee seems like a douche. | ||
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