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From OP:
On December 22 2011 03:47 partysnatcher wrote:
If you don't want to put your account on the line to explore your “Current Skill”, a good compromise is to buy an additional SC2 “smurfing” account. Could be worth it - your smurf copy of SC2 might be a lot more fun than the first.
The smurf part probably wouldn't have been added if this post was written after patch 2.04 was released (this is a 5 years old post, in case you didn't notice), since unranked play does somewhat alleviate issues with "putting your account on the line."
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France13023 Posts
On February 14 2016 18:03 Sissors wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2016 13:08 Poopi wrote:On February 14 2016 02:21 opisska wrote:On February 14 2016 01:32 Cascade wrote:On February 13 2016 17:07 opisska wrote:Are you paid by Blizzard? "Buying a smurf account to solve ego issues" is the most insane thing I have ever read on this forum (and I have read some Shauni blogs and quite a lot of stuff from several different baskerville accounts  ). What ego issues? Nobody cares about your account in SC2! Unless you are one of like 200 recognizable progamers, your nickname is completely irrelevant to anyone. Are you seriously suggesting that people spend real-life money because they have a delusion that somebody cares who they are? What the hell is the difference between having one account that nobody cares about and two? By this logic, you would probably need to buy a new account before every game and that would get expensive pretty quickly. While the post may show a lot of your knowledge about psychology (I really don't feel qualified to judge that), the whole part about "current and future skill" is wrong and shows that you know much less about the actual game. People aren't suddenly getting worse in SC2, "metagame" is a Bronze-league excuse and the vast majority of players is going to get better by playing, not worse. Yeah, since Blizzard removed actual demotions, people are being placed lower than before at the start of a season more frequently, but that's just a sane conservative approach (ironically used to solve a totally insane issue). Probably the worst thing is your introduction when you say how brutal the ladder system is. Stop that! The system is anything but brutal, it pussies out on purpose. I know there are many people like me, who would like to have a system that would for you be ... I don't know what word would you use, because I have no idea what comes after "brutal" - but system that would bluntly tell you how good you are instead of hiding it behind silly "leagues". Posts like this only reinforce Blizzard in their stance against that system. I am pretty pissed that I can't see my own information just because some other people think that they would get hurt by it. In short, I don't like your post, because uses probably sound science to reinforce idiocy. It also contributes to the trend of "I am not lame, I have a condition". Surely, there are people who have real mental health issues (hell, my wife has been treated for clinical depression for almost 15 years and I would never dare to even imply that it's not a real illness), but it's surely not half the SC2 playerbase as they are often trying to pretend. A lot of people are not like you. I very much appreciate the east-european I-dont-take-any-shit mentality, where you are expected to shrug of whatever happens to you. I love it, it's cool. I try to adapt it at times. And I can see that ladder fear is extremely silly and a "pussy" phenomenon from that life style. And from that point of view it is a correct assessment, and I agree with it to some extent, even though I myself suffer from it at times. However, the mentality and life style that people are brought up with in much of western Europe (and I guess US), is a lot more entitled and worried. You're expected to be on top of and in control of everything in and around your life. With that life style, it can be pretty demoralising to repeatedly get confirmation from battle net that you are in fact not at all on top of the sc2 ladder. You are not able to beat that other noob. You are actually pretty crap at it, and regularly lose to other players that you consider bad at the game. That can stop people from playing sc2, and do other things that fits better with their life style. This doesn't mean that you have a psychological condition, apart from being brought up in a western society if you want to count that.  + Show Spoiler [political disclaimer] +Sorry for the stereotyping eastern/western Europeans. I hope no one is offended... I feel I have met enough of both to see this trend reliably, and many I have talked have agreed on this difference. So yes, it is an irrational feeling, and yes it is silly in a way, but you kindof have to acknowledge the empirical fact that a lot of players actually have it. Probably more so in some parts of the world than others. Blizzard may want to consider this fraction of their player base, and probably an even larger group of potential players, that doesn't play sc2 due to ladder fear. So if the OP has advice that can help, I think that's great. If you don't need it, good for you. But for those that do need it, why not let them have it? On one hand, I can agree with you (why not let anyone have any advice, after all). On the other hand, I have mentioned that I think some of the advice is not only not helpful, but outright harmful for the receiver (make a smurf), some stems from OP's ignorance of the game and some is harmful generally to the goals I have about the game (I don't like to be not able to see my MMR just because other people are too sensitive for that). But I concede that me pointing out actual flaws can be easily hidden in the surrounding ranting In a somewhat tangential note, you would be surprised how much the "western" thinking you describe has taken over the "East" in the last two decades. What you describe, while stereotypical, would have been pretty spot on in the nineties, but it's really fading. I am just old enough  I don't really see how a smurf isn't helpful. Sure now that there is unranked and that you can leave league, a smurf isn't mandatory. But before that it could be helpful to have an account where you could try strats and have shitty ranks that isn't your main. I don't think the issue is as much if it doesn't help, but if you can seriously advice people to solve your ladder anxiety by ruining the game for others. That is what making a smurf to get some easy wins is all about.
How would smurfs ruin the game for others?
If you do ladder ranked you'll have a 50%winrate given you play enough and are not bottom bronze or top gm
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On February 15 2016 06:31 Poopi wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2016 18:03 Sissors wrote:On February 14 2016 13:08 Poopi wrote:On February 14 2016 02:21 opisska wrote:On February 14 2016 01:32 Cascade wrote:On February 13 2016 17:07 opisska wrote:Are you paid by Blizzard? "Buying a smurf account to solve ego issues" is the most insane thing I have ever read on this forum (and I have read some Shauni blogs and quite a lot of stuff from several different baskerville accounts ). What ego issues? Nobody cares about your account in SC2! Unless you are one of like 200 recognizable progamers, your nickname is completely irrelevant to anyone. Are you seriously suggesting that people spend real-life money because they have a delusion that somebody cares who they are? What the hell is the difference between having one account that nobody cares about and two? By this logic, you would probably need to buy a new account before every game and that would get expensive pretty quickly. While the post may show a lot of your knowledge about psychology (I really don't feel qualified to judge that), the whole part about "current and future skill" is wrong and shows that you know much less about the actual game. People aren't suddenly getting worse in SC2, "metagame" is a Bronze-league excuse and the vast majority of players is going to get better by playing, not worse. Yeah, since Blizzard removed actual demotions, people are being placed lower than before at the start of a season more frequently, but that's just a sane conservative approach (ironically used to solve a totally insane issue). Probably the worst thing is your introduction when you say how brutal the ladder system is. Stop that! The system is anything but brutal, it pussies out on purpose. I know there are many people like me, who would like to have a system that would for you be ... I don't know what word would you use, because I have no idea what comes after "brutal" - but system that would bluntly tell you how good you are instead of hiding it behind silly "leagues". Posts like this only reinforce Blizzard in their stance against that system. I am pretty pissed that I can't see my own information just because some other people think that they would get hurt by it. In short, I don't like your post, because uses probably sound science to reinforce idiocy. It also contributes to the trend of "I am not lame, I have a condition". Surely, there are people who have real mental health issues (hell, my wife has been treated for clinical depression for almost 15 years and I would never dare to even imply that it's not a real illness), but it's surely not half the SC2 playerbase as they are often trying to pretend. A lot of people are not like you. I very much appreciate the east-european I-dont-take-any-shit mentality, where you are expected to shrug of whatever happens to you. I love it, it's cool. I try to adapt it at times. And I can see that ladder fear is extremely silly and a "pussy" phenomenon from that life style. And from that point of view it is a correct assessment, and I agree with it to some extent, even though I myself suffer from it at times. However, the mentality and life style that people are brought up with in much of western Europe (and I guess US), is a lot more entitled and worried. You're expected to be on top of and in control of everything in and around your life. With that life style, it can be pretty demoralising to repeatedly get confirmation from battle net that you are in fact not at all on top of the sc2 ladder. You are not able to beat that other noob. You are actually pretty crap at it, and regularly lose to other players that you consider bad at the game. That can stop people from playing sc2, and do other things that fits better with their life style. This doesn't mean that you have a psychological condition, apart from being brought up in a western society if you want to count that. + Show Spoiler [political disclaimer] +Sorry for the stereotyping eastern/western Europeans. I hope no one is offended... I feel I have met enough of both to see this trend reliably, and many I have talked have agreed on this difference. So yes, it is an irrational feeling, and yes it is silly in a way, but you kindof have to acknowledge the empirical fact that a lot of players actually have it. Probably more so in some parts of the world than others. Blizzard may want to consider this fraction of their player base, and probably an even larger group of potential players, that doesn't play sc2 due to ladder fear. So if the OP has advice that can help, I think that's great. If you don't need it, good for you. But for those that do need it, why not let them have it? On one hand, I can agree with you (why not let anyone have any advice, after all). On the other hand, I have mentioned that I think some of the advice is not only not helpful, but outright harmful for the receiver (make a smurf), some stems from OP's ignorance of the game and some is harmful generally to the goals I have about the game (I don't like to be not able to see my MMR just because other people are too sensitive for that). But I concede that me pointing out actual flaws can be easily hidden in the surrounding ranting In a somewhat tangential note, you would be surprised how much the "western" thinking you describe has taken over the "East" in the last two decades. What you describe, while stereotypical, would have been pretty spot on in the nineties, but it's really fading. I am just old enough I don't really see how a smurf isn't helpful. Sure now that there is unranked and that you can leave league, a smurf isn't mandatory. But before that it could be helpful to have an account where you could try strats and have shitty ranks that isn't your main. I don't think the issue is as much if it doesn't help, but if you can seriously advice people to solve your ladder anxiety by ruining the game for others. That is what making a smurf to get some easy wins is all about. How would smurfs ruin the game for others? If you do ladder ranked you'll have a 50%winrate given you play enough and are not bottom bronze or top gm
I think there is a slight misunderstanding here. "Smurf" is often associated with someone that on purpose drops many leagues to troll in the lower leagues, which arguably destroys the game for others. OP however, I think, suggests to just try a bit less hard, and maybe only drop down half or a quarter of a league as a result, which I think most agree wouldn't ruin the experience for others.
But yeah, OP was before unranked play, so I think we shouldn't get too stuck on that detail.
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Also, OP was before the ranked was different for different races. Nowadays you can learn in ranked experience with the three races and have different leagues for each. Gives a lot of perspective on what you know on each race.
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I have anger issues, and its the thing that affects my anxiety, in all online games, not just SC, and its long term problem, not something that can be fixed over night.
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On December 22 2011 04:44 Fawkes wrote:
But how do I even get myself to press that Find Match button? I haven't played since Season 1 and I only played like 40 games back then too T.T I want to play...I just fear that button, and pretty much everything you mentioned.
go into general chat or adoptanoob chat, also check out the subreddit for your race or others and ask for a practice partner around your level
it's much less taxing losing to a friend then just some random asshole, and you can share pointers and stuff after the game
and if hes better than you and you eventually learn to beat him, you instantly feel satisfaction, where as ladder is just grinding forever untill you hit gm and then quit because that's the cap for most people
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i found over my years that the feeling of love (unrequited) is the same as the feeling of fear, worry, anxiety. it's the same fucking thing. just constant adrenaline, with a context. so, i grew to hate the feeling as a painful burden, rather than enjoy it as an excitement. (like, 5+ years of unrequited love will kill you). you can choose to do the same thing with ladder anxiety, i guess - either embrace it as excitement, or loath it
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That's a really interesting read OP. I think my own ladder anxiety was a product of me not wanting to have an assessment of my true skill. In my head I was good and I didn't want to know if I was as good as I thought :D. It actually didn't help at all that I was basically only winning the few times I played 1v1 (due to mostly MMR decay of course, and me playing at master-ish level against platinums and diamonds). I knew I was not playing at my real MMR and that scared me because I knew I'd soon have to face my limits. When I stopped thinking I was any good, the anxiety went away (but I also stopped playing the game altogether, so there is that).
The problem has never been there in 2v2, where my friends and I were actually somewhat good by all available measures. It was just fun to play. Since I've moved on from SC2 I haven't had any "ladder-type" anxiety in anything else, mostly because I just stopped thinking I was good at anything. It really makes things easier.
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What a nice read, thanks man great job.
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On June 19 2017 13:46 paxconsciente wrote:Show nested quote +On December 22 2011 04:44 Fawkes wrote:
But how do I even get myself to press that Find Match button? I haven't played since Season 1 and I only played like 40 games back then too T.T I want to play...I just fear that button, and pretty much everything you mentioned. go into general chat or adoptanoob chat, also check out the subreddit for your race or others and ask for a practice partner around your level it's much less taxing losing to a friend then just some random asshole, and you can share pointers and stuff after the game and if hes better than you and you eventually learn to beat him, you instantly feel satisfaction, where as ladder is just grinding forever untill you hit gm and then quit because that's the cap for most people
You responded to a post from 2011, before chatrooms even existed in the game at all.
Just thought you might like to know.
+EDIT: Good bump though, more people should read this.
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EPT
