MVP Winning WCG= Polt qualifying for the Blizzard Cup
If MVP(IM) wins 1st place at the WCG, Polt (TSL) will be qualified for the Blizzard Cup.
On December 8th, GomTV has announced through their homepage the solution (regarding the Blizzard Cup) to a situation where a player wins more than one major tournaments. If MVP wins again this year in the WCG 2011, the last spot for the Blizzard Cup will be given to the 5th place of the GSL Point Ranking.
Therefore if MVP wins the WCG 2011, Choi "Polt" Sung Hoon will take the last spot.
The original plan for the 2011 Blizzard Cup was to give the spots only to the top 3 of the points GSL ranking from the GSL tournament. But because MVP has won 1st place in the GSL Points Ranking and also won the Blizzcon 2011, one of the spots have been given to MMA (SlayerS), who is ranked 4th in the GSL Point Ranking. If MVP wins the WCG 2011, then Polt (5th in GSL Point Ranking) will qualify for the Blizzard Cup.
I think it's a good solution to try to get more terrans, but maybe jjakji would have been a better idea eve if the "only" thing he accomplished was winning last gsl, because polt isn't in the greatest shape lately.
I don't really like it, feel that there are several better players than Polt right now who deserve it. However it is nice that we get one more terran, leaves the blizz cup with a very nice racial balance of 3 T, 4Z, 3P
Can you elaborate on the logic? To me, that last sentence " If MVP wins again, then the last spot will be given to the 5th rank in the GSL Point Ranking" comes out of fucking nowhere with no explanation.... he'll still have the highest GSL pts, and thus still qualify, no? Or, if it's not about points, he'll have won Blizzcon and still qualify?
Or does the WCG winner ALSO get a spot? That might make sense...
On December 09 2011 04:45 FabledIntegral wrote: Can you elaborate on the logic? To me, that last sentence " If MVP wins again, then the last spot will be given to the 5th rank in the GSL Point Ranking" comes out of fucking nowhere with no explanation.... he'll still have the highest GSL pts, and thus still qualify, no? Or, if it's not about points, he'll have won Blizzcon and still qualify?
Or does the WCG winner ALSO get a spot? That might make sense...
3 spots go to the highest 3 GSL in points. MVP belongs to that list.
One spot goes to the Blizzcon winner. MVP is that guy, but he's already invited, so they need another player to fill in the spot.
If MVP win WCG, he will now be qualified for a 3rd time, and so they will have to fill that spot with another guy.
The guys they are finding to fill in are the next highest in GSL points:
I kinda wish they'd still give the additional spots to players from the tournaments so they still matter (e.g. giving the blizz spot to sen instead of mma and the wcg spot to whoever finishes after mvp and doesn't have a blizzcup spot already). But oh well glad for polt just on top of my head I feel like this made the racedistribution fairly even, all assuming mvp does actually take wcg.
Bad choice. Should have been given to whoever gets 2nd place at WCG. Seems like GOM is making up whatever rules are convenient to achieve racial balance, in this case adjusting for the lack of terrans.
On December 09 2011 04:49 dAPhREAk wrote: i thought they were going to let MMA take the spot. am i wrong?
I believe MMA's taking MVP's Blizzcon spot... and Polt may take MVP's WCG spot...
MVP's screwing Gom up lol
hmmm.... they bypassed sen who took third at whatever that tournament was in favor of MMA, and now they are going to bypass whoever is runner-up at WCG to give it to another GSL point runner? why dont they just make this the GSL most valuable player cup since it does not appear they are taking the best from each of the tournaments, which is what they said they would do.
not saying the GSL players are not qualified, just saying they are destroying the purpose of the cup, but whatever... going to watch it anyways since it will be an awesome tourney.
edit: further rant, i just checked the brackets. if polt is picked based on GSL points that means that five of the ten spots (i.e., 50%) will be based on GSL points rather than other tournaments.
edit2: further further rant, this also means that there will all be koreans except naniwa and stephano. wtf GSL?
On December 09 2011 04:52 red4ce wrote: Bad choice. Should have been given to whoever gets 2nd place at WCG. Seems like GOM is making up whatever rules are convenient to achieve racial balance, in this case adjusting for the lack of terrans.
Signed. GOM always gives out spots randomly without explanations. That has happened now with the WCG spot and will happen again with the last Code S seed for GSL January. While I think it is good for entertainment value if they keep the racial distribution even I would have welcomed if the last Blizzard Cup spot would go to the WCG runner up just to increase the probabiliy of another foreigner qualifying for BlizzCup. Hell, even MKP would be a better choice than Polt because his style while not being absolutely better is more entertaining to watch.
On subject. Honestly i've never thought polt was good at all. He got a win over MMA when he choked and polt had a gimmicky strat. Other then that his results haven't been impressive. Kinda wish it went to someone else. But such is life. GL to him though.
On December 09 2011 04:52 red4ce wrote: Bad choice. Should have been given to whoever gets 2nd place at WCG. Seems like GOM is making up whatever rules are convenient to achieve racial balance, in this case adjusting for the lack of terrans.
Kinda weird because I'd say it's quite likely that MKP or SupverNova will end as WCG runner up which would achieve racial balance too :/
On December 09 2011 05:00 GMonster wrote: so did TL give up its Spoiler policy?
On subject. Honestly i've never thought polt was good at all. He got a win over MMA when he choked and polt had a gimmicky strat. Other then that his results haven't been impressive. Kinda wish it went to someone else. But such is life. GL to him though.
What is being spoiled? That MVP advanced from his group lol?
On December 09 2011 05:00 GMonster wrote: so did TL give up its Spoiler policy?
On subject. Honestly i've never thought polt was good at all. He got a win over MMA when he choked and polt had a gimmicky strat. Other then that his results haven't been impressive. Kinda wish it went to someone else. But such is life. GL to him though.
On December 09 2011 04:49 dAPhREAk wrote: i thought they were going to let MMA take the spot. am i wrong?
I believe MMA's taking MVP's Blizzcon spot... and Polt may take MVP's WCG spot...
MVP's screwing Gom up lol
hmmm.... they bypassed sen who took third at whatever that tournament was in favor of MMA, and now they are going to bypass whoever is runner-up at WCG to give it to another GSL point runner? why dont they just make this the GSL most valuable player cup since it does not appear they are taking the best from each of the tournaments, which is what they said they would do.
I don't know if that was intentional or not but i found this bit really funny
As for Polt qualifying, at least gom is being consistent with selecting people off of GSL points.
I don't think people are aware that the Blizzard Cup was originally going to be the Top 10 GSL point holders. At first, I wasn't sure whether or not I wanted MVP to win WCG, but now I definitely do.
GOM going to their ranking points has waaay more legitimacy than 2nd or 3rd or 4th at any event. Getting those points are no joke and basically proves that someone is extremely high up in skill and has proven it through months of time/effort/results against the very best. Their event, their rules and I have no problem with them doing it this way.
On December 09 2011 04:52 red4ce wrote: Bad choice. Should have been given to whoever gets 2nd place at WCG. Seems like GOM is making up whatever rules are convenient to achieve racial balance, in this case adjusting for the lack of terrans.
So instead of compensating for lack of Terrans you take 2nd place finisher from a tournament with 3x as many p and z as t? Polts a good player I don't understand why so many people are upset about this
I came in here ready to spout out the whole 'wowowowow spoilers' nonsense >.< MVP is making a mess of the blizzcon cup seedings handily... But if Polt gets in then thats a-ok with me :D
On December 09 2011 04:49 dAPhREAk wrote: i thought they were going to let MMA take the spot. am i wrong?
I believe MMA's taking MVP's Blizzcon spot... and Polt may take MVP's WCG spot...
MVP's screwing Gom up lol
hmmm.... they bypassed sen who took third at whatever that tournament was in favor of MMA, and now they are going to bypass whoever is runner-up at WCG to give it to another GSL point runner? why dont they just make this the GSL most valuable player cup since it does not appear they are taking the best from each of the tournaments, which is what they said they would do.
not saying the GSL players are not qualified, just saying they are destroying the purpose of the cup, but whatever... going to watch it anyways since it will be an awesome tourney.
edit: further rant, i just checked the brackets. if polt is picked based on GSL points that means that five of the ten spots (i.e., 50%) will be based on GSL points rather than other tournaments.
edit2: further further rant, this also means that there will all be koreans except naniwa and stephano. wtf GSL?
They already destroyed the purpose of the Cup and giving it back to the players based on points actually restores the original purpose somewhat.
It was originally meant to be ALL GSL point based then they changed it and in one of the interviews, MVP actually complains about it on behalf of the Korean players. I agree wtf GSL, but more in the sense that players in the GSL felt cheated in the sense they were told something and it didn't happen.
On December 09 2011 04:52 red4ce wrote: Bad choice. Should have been given to whoever gets 2nd place at WCG. Seems like GOM is making up whatever rules are convenient to achieve racial balance, in this case adjusting for the lack of terrans.
So instead of compensating for lack of Terrans you take 2nd place finisher from a tournament with 3x as many p and z as t? Polts a good player I don't understand why so many people are upset about this
It shouldn't have anything to do with races and it's a bit silly korea favoured for it to not go to the second place dude, unless it's a dude who's already qualified too, then it makes more sense.
On December 09 2011 05:00 ProxyKnoxy wrote: Polt isn't that great of a player lately he would probably be one of the weakest ones in the tourney
Really? Hero and Naniwa even not been able to stay in code A.
Oh, yeah cause they lost a Bo3? You do know who those 2 have beaten in the last few weeks, don't you?
Yeah? Congraz hero fan boys by mention his achievement of wining DH from bunch of foreigners + Puma... which is also a KR leftover. Not to mention he just lose to Puma again in NASL. Wait, if you are referring to Naniwa, I just have no words to say. Naniwa is a great player and we love him, but he's current no where near the top Korean level as Huk.
On December 09 2011 05:00 ProxyKnoxy wrote: Polt isn't that great of a player lately he would probably be one of the weakest ones in the tourney
Really? Hero and Naniwa even not been able to stay in code A.
Oh, yeah cause they lost a Bo3? You do know who those 2 have beaten in the last few weeks, don't you?
Hero has solid PvZ but is overall a mediocre Korean. He only looks good because he's on liquid and has the opportunity to stomp on foreigners regularly.
Naniwa has been invited to Code A three times for results in foreign tournaments and got 2-0d by Check (a mediocre Zerg) in the first round and then 2-0d by Lucky (A mediocre Zerg) twice. He essentially is 0-6 in Korean minor individual league matches. Polt on the other hand, has found great success in GSL, winning a Korean individual.
Polt, overall, is definitely much stronger than Naniwa and probably stronger than Hero.
Players who get to play "top foreigners", who are really not good compared to top Koreans, shouldn't really be compared to players who play top Koreans in Code S regularly.
I'm not to surprised by this and it's also probably the most convenient for everyone invovled. Hell if a non korean does win wcg then playing in the Blizzard cup is probably going to be inconvenient because most people probably did not make their travel plans with the idea of staying extra time in korea for another tournament.
Regardless of who ends up with the spot they end up in the group of Nestea, Naniwa, Leenock and MMA which should be a highly competitive and difficult group to make it out of.
On December 09 2011 05:00 ProxyKnoxy wrote: Polt isn't that great of a player lately he would probably be one of the weakest ones in the tourney
Really? Hero and Naniwa even not been able to stay in code A.
Naniwa has a hard time against very trained ZvPers. It doesn't help that he's gotten FXOLucky twice in a row who is known for having a very strong ZvP akin to CoCa in his prime.
On December 09 2011 05:00 ProxyKnoxy wrote: Polt isn't that great of a player lately he would probably be one of the weakest ones in the tourney
Really? Hero and Naniwa even not been able to stay in code A.
Naniwa has a hard time against very trained ZvPers. It doesn't help that he's gotten FXOLucky twice in a row who is known for having a very strong ZvP akin to CoCa in his prime.
I wouldn't say lucky is known for strong zvp. In his entire gsl history, Lucky has beat naniwa twice and lost to sage once. There's not enough data out there. The only reason naniwa said he had good zvp is because he lost to him twice. He also said check had great zvp because he lost to him too, which no offense is kind of laughable.
This is a great decision, considering the following:
-The original Blizz cup idea was to invite the Top 10 GSL players of 2011 -The basis of this event is to hold a closure tournament, with the players with the biggest splash on the year. In this regards, 5th GSL ranked player is way more important than any single 2nd or 1st place finish in any tournament. It's a testament of consistency. -Polt has being a top tier Terran throughout this year, and this is his reward. -A top GSL terran is better than any foreigners. Come on, we've known this for a while.
It would have been better to find a way to get forgg/fin into this, so much hype and I think everyone wants to see him vs the very best asap right now.
it's still ashame that only the top4 (or maybe 5) from gsl points will make it. They announced 1 year ago that the top 8 players will face each other and lots of korean progamers were looking forward to playing in this cup and now this happens.. dont get me wrong I like (almost) everyone of the players qualified and for the most part they are the best of the best but if a organizer announces format will be xyz 1 year before the tournament they shouldn't change it just to make everyone happy.
I dont like Polts playstyle and I think that he isn't even code a level but I hope he gets the spot since he deserves the spot (because of gsl points) more than anyone else.
On December 09 2011 05:39 mordk wrote: This is a great decision, considering the following:
-The original Blizz cup idea was to invite the Top 10 GSL players of 2011 -The basis of this event is to hold a closure tournament, with the players with the biggest splash on the year. In this regards, 5th GSL ranked player is way more important than any single 2nd or 1st place finish in any tournament. It's a testament of consistency. -Polt has being a top tier Terran throughout this year, and this is his reward. -A top GSL terran is better than any foreigners. Come on, we've known this for a while.
seems to me that blizzard is just subsidizing korean teams by offering a tournament that will have a huge, positive economic impact on koreans, and not foreigners. i think they tried to ameliorate that a bit by changing it from GSL points to top winners at each tournament. gom seems to be bringing it back to just gsl results again. not surprising since they are promoting their own brand. (i, of course, am just speculating because i dont know the background.)
i don't have a problem with blizzard using their money how they see fit, but its annoying that they are essentially taking a shit on foreigners once again. if anything, recent tournaments (mlg, ipl, dreamhack, nasl) have shown that the korean market is not necessary for a burgeoning e-sports scene. throw some support towards foreigners (i'll admit that blizzcon was foreigner friendly though).
On December 09 2011 05:39 mordk wrote: This is a great decision, considering the following:
-The original Blizz cup idea was to invite the Top 10 GSL players of 2011 -The basis of this event is to hold a closure tournament, with the players with the biggest splash on the year. In this regards, 5th GSL ranked player is way more important than any single 2nd or 1st place finish in any tournament. It's a testament of consistency. -Polt has being a top tier Terran throughout this year, and this is his reward. -A top GSL terran is better than any foreigners. Come on, we've known this for a while.
seems to me that blizzard is just subsidizing korean teams by offering a tournament that will have a huge, positive economic impact on koreans, and not foreigners. i think they tried to ameliorate that a bit by changing it from GSL points to top winners at each tournament. gom seems to be bringing it back to just gsl results again. not surprising since they are promoting their own brand. (i, of course, am just speculating because i dont know the background.)
i don't have a problem with blizzard using their money how they see fit, but its annoying that they are essentially taking a shit on foreigners once again. if anything, recent tournaments (mlg, ipl, dreamhack, nasl) have shown that the korean market is not necessary for a burgeoning e-sports scene. throw some support towards foreigners (i'll admit that blizzcon was foreigner friendly though).
Blizzard is in no way related to the Blizzard cup except in the useage of the company name. This is all Mr. Chae.
On December 09 2011 05:39 mordk wrote: This is a great decision, considering the following:
-The original Blizz cup idea was to invite the Top 10 GSL players of 2011 -The basis of this event is to hold a closure tournament, with the players with the biggest splash on the year. In this regards, 5th GSL ranked player is way more important than any single 2nd or 1st place finish in any tournament. It's a testament of consistency. -Polt has being a top tier Terran throughout this year, and this is his reward. -A top GSL terran is better than any foreigners. Come on, we've known this for a while.
seems to me that blizzard is just subsidizing korean teams by offering a tournament that will have a huge, positive economic impact on koreans, and not foreigners. i think they tried to ameliorate that a bit by changing it from GSL points to top winners at each tournament. gom seems to be bringing it back to just gsl results again. not surprising since they are promoting their own brand. (i, of course, am just speculating because i dont know the background.)
i don't have a problem with blizzard using their money how they see fit, but its annoying that they are essentially taking a shit on foreigners once again. if anything, recent tournaments (mlg, ipl, dreamhack, nasl) have shown that the korean market is not necessary for a burgeoning e-sports scene. throw some support towards foreigners (i'll admit that blizzcon was foreigner friendly though).
The Blizzard cup is not organized by Blizzard other than Blizzard providing the games; it's organized by Mr. Chae and those at Gom. It's basically another GSL super tournament under a different name.
None of the money is from Blizzard, it's all from GOM which is a Korean company.
EDIT: The poster above me beat me to it.
But yea, you admitted that you were speculating so I don't like how you still made those damning statements with such certainty.
On December 09 2011 05:42 RudePlague wrote: It would have been better to find a way to get forgg/fin into this, so much hype and I think everyone wants to see him vs the very best asap right now.
He can prove himself against the top next GSL, for now he's a newbie and putting him in based on next to no SC2 achievments would not be fair at all
On December 09 2011 05:39 mordk wrote: This is a great decision, considering the following:
-The original Blizz cup idea was to invite the Top 10 GSL players of 2011 -The basis of this event is to hold a closure tournament, with the players with the biggest splash on the year. In this regards, 5th GSL ranked player is way more important than any single 2nd or 1st place finish in any tournament. It's a testament of consistency. -Polt has being a top tier Terran throughout this year, and this is his reward. -A top GSL terran is better than any foreigners. Come on, we've known this for a while.
seems to me that blizzard is just subsidizing korean teams by offering a tournament that will have a huge, positive economic impact on koreans, and not foreigners. i think they tried to ameliorate that a bit by changing it from GSL points to top winners at each tournament. gom seems to be bringing it back to just gsl results again. not surprising since they are promoting their own brand. (i, of course, am just speculating because i dont know the background.)
i don't have a problem with blizzard using their money how they see fit, but its annoying that they are essentially taking a shit on foreigners once again. if anything, recent tournaments (mlg, ipl, dreamhack, nasl) have shown that the korean market is not necessary for a burgeoning e-sports scene. throw some support towards foreigners (i'll admit that blizzcon was foreigner friendly though).
The non-korean scene has more than enough support, foreigners have MLG, IPL, NASL, Dreamhack ++ while Koreans have GSL and recently KSL. Koreans use their own money (cept for MLG invited players) to travel to foreign tourneys and it is not their fault that foreigners can't win against them
On December 09 2011 05:39 mordk wrote: This is a great decision, considering the following:
-The original Blizz cup idea was to invite the Top 10 GSL players of 2011 -The basis of this event is to hold a closure tournament, with the players with the biggest splash on the year. In this regards, 5th GSL ranked player is way more important than any single 2nd or 1st place finish in any tournament. It's a testament of consistency. -Polt has being a top tier Terran throughout this year, and this is his reward. -A top GSL terran is better than any foreigners. Come on, we've known this for a while.
seems to me that blizzard is just subsidizing korean teams by offering a tournament that will have a huge, positive economic impact on koreans, and not foreigners. i think they tried to ameliorate that a bit by changing it from GSL points to top winners at each tournament. gom seems to be bringing it back to just gsl results again. not surprising since they are promoting their own brand. (i, of course, am just speculating because i dont know the background.)
i don't have a problem with blizzard using their money how they see fit, but its annoying that they are essentially taking a shit on foreigners once again. if anything, recent tournaments (mlg, ipl, dreamhack, nasl) have shown that the korean market is not necessary for a burgeoning e-sports scene. throw some support towards foreigners (i'll admit that blizzcon was foreigner friendly though).
The Blizzard cup is not organized by Blizzard other than Blizzard providing the games; it's organized by Mr. Chae and those at Gom. It's basically another GSL super tournament under a different name.
None of the money is from Blizzard, it's all from GOM which is a Korean company.
EDIT: The poster above me beat me to it.
But yea, you admitted that you were speculating so I don't like how you still made those damning statements with such certainty.
well that makes more sense then. its another GSL under a different GSL name. so, i retract what i said about blizzard.
On December 09 2011 05:50 robih wrote: why not wcg runner up
i dont get it
I guess they want to throw a bone to the Korean players, I remember they were very unhappy about the format changes for Blizzard Cup, because before that it apparently included more GSL players and less foreign tournament winners.
On December 09 2011 05:42 RudePlague wrote: It would have been better to find a way to get forgg/fin into this, so much hype and I think everyone wants to see him vs the very best asap right now.
fOrGG hasn't won anything yet.
Also to react to Korea hates PuMa: It's pretty know for that Koreans who leave the country are not considered koreans anymore by the people who still live there, they consider it some kind of betrayal to the country. (as you know, they're in war)
On December 09 2011 05:42 RudePlague wrote: It would have been better to find a way to get forgg/fin into this, so much hype and I think everyone wants to see him vs the very best asap right now.
fOrGG hasn't won anything yet.
Also to react to Korea hates PuMa: It's pretty know for that Koreans who leave the country are not considered koreans anymore by the people who still live there, they consider it some kind of betrayal to the country. (as you know, they're in war)
o ok so mvp gives up his GSL point slot because he fulfills the WCG slot, thus creating an open slot in the GSL slots for the next highest rank player to join (polt)
originally, mvp was in a GSL point slot since the WCG winner was not yet determined but the other slots were starting to fill
On December 09 2011 05:00 ProxyKnoxy wrote: Polt isn't that great of a player lately he would probably be one of the weakest ones in the tourney
Really? Hero and Naniwa even not been able to stay in code A.
Oh, yeah cause they lost a Bo3? You do know who those 2 have beaten in the last few weeks, don't you?
Hero has solid PvZ but is overall a mediocre Korean. He only looks good because he's on liquid and has the opportunity to stomp on foreigners regularly.
Lol, mediocre Korean? He has always been insanely good, even before joining TL. HerO has some serious nerve issues when more is at stake (e.g. GSL), but if the recent tournaments are anything to go by he is getting better and better in keeping his nerves in check.
On December 09 2011 05:50 robih wrote: why not wcg runner up
i dont get it
I guess they want to throw a bone to the Korean players, I remember they were very unhappy about the format changes for Blizzard Cup, because before that it apparently included more GSL players and less foreign tournament winners.
The runner up of WCG will probably be korean anyways lol.
On December 09 2011 06:29 canikizu wrote: MKP is ranked 6th in GSL point, does this mean he's about to get 2nd place again in qualifying for Blizz Cup?
On December 09 2011 05:00 ProxyKnoxy wrote: Polt isn't that great of a player lately he would probably be one of the weakest ones in the tourney
Really? Hero and Naniwa even not been able to stay in code A.
Oh, yeah cause they lost a Bo3? You do know who those 2 have beaten in the last few weeks, don't you?
Hero has solid PvZ but is overall a mediocre Korean. He only looks good because he's on liquid and has the opportunity to stomp on foreigners regularly.
Lol, mediocre Korean? He has always been insanely good, even before joining TL. HerO has some serious nerve issues when more is at stake (e.g. GSL), but if the recent tournaments are anything to go by he is getting better and better in keeping his nerves in check.
He has serious nerve issues when more is at stake? That's a pretty lame excuse.
The only reason he does better in foreign tournaments (with just as high stakes as GSL, DH NASl whatever all had tens of thousands of dollars over a few days) is because foreign tournaments have crap competition compared to GSL. Hero has succeeded immensely in foreign tournaments while showing unimpressive results in GSL.
Even GSL Code A is so much more stacked, especially with the new format that pits third or forth place Code S group stage drop outs against Code A players, than literally any foreign tournament except maybe MLG.
On December 09 2011 06:36 woobsauce wrote: I'm inclined to think they should pick jjakji, especially given that his performance recently greatly overshadow's Polt's.
GSL rankings isn't a "recent performance" measure, it's a measure of year-long consistency, in which Polt greatly overshadows jjakji. GOM is rewarding that consistency with Blizzard Cup invites, sounds right to me.
On December 09 2011 06:29 canikizu wrote: MKP is ranked 6th in GSL point, does this mean he's about to get 2nd place again in qualifying for Blizz Cup?
I'm laughing at this fact so much that I can barely control myself typing.right now. MKP Win th Blizzcon Cup and win the whole thing!
On December 09 2011 06:29 canikizu wrote: MKP is ranked 6th in GSL point, does this mean he's about to get 2nd place again in qualifying for Blizz Cup?
I laughed.
On December 09 2011 06:30 WesleyLok wrote: But marineking is going to get second place in wcg >.< I was hoping he would get the spot T_T
oh lol, poor MKP, he could get second place twice xD
2nd place at WCG is probably going to be MKP or Supernova anyways, both of whom are Korean Terran so they probably should've just went with 2nd place WCG to take the WCG spot.
MKP and Supernova are both better than Polt at the moment.
On December 09 2011 04:54 MetalLobster wrote: Polt is a great player but have we seriously forgotten the winner of NASL?
Winning a foreign tournament with 1-5 korean is nothing compared to winning a GSL. Sorry but Puma has not qualifier in Code A even once, he is mediocre in korea.
If GOMtvt wants to grow their business, they should have en EG player represented. Idra would attract the most additional views, but HuK or Puma might be a little more deserving. They are a bit short on Terrans and Protosses for the Blizzard cup
On December 09 2011 04:54 MetalLobster wrote: Polt is a great player but have we seriously forgotten the winner of NASL?
Winning a foreign tournament with 1-5 korean is nothing compared to winning a GSL. Sorry but Puma has not qualifier in Code A even once, he is mediocre in korea.
Puma just beat Hero 4-2 who is attending the tourney
I would have liked to see PuMa or Jakiji but I do like that they are rewarding consistency here. Polt deserves it, hes had a pretty good run this year.
On December 09 2011 04:54 MetalLobster wrote: Polt is a great player but have we seriously forgotten the winner of NASL?
Winning a foreign tournament with 1-5 korean is nothing compared to winning a GSL. Sorry but Puma has not qualifier in Code A even once, he is mediocre in korea.
Puma just beat Hero 4-2 who is attending the tourney
With your logic, hasuobs should be code S protoss since he beat huk. What a joke.
On December 09 2011 04:54 MetalLobster wrote: Polt is a great player but have we seriously forgotten the winner of NASL?
Winning a foreign tournament with 1-5 korean is nothing compared to winning a GSL. Sorry but Puma has not qualifier in Code A even once, he is mediocre in korea.
He did go boss mode in the beginning of GSTL Season 1. Also winning NASL 1 & 2 must mean something.
At the moment, Supernova/Polt/MKP are all in similar places. If either of Supernova or MKP played ForGG in Code A, they probably would have lost, too.
So yeah, MVP wins WCG, and we get Polt vs. MMA and a Polt vs. Leenock rematch. All good. The only player who has a gripe about Polt being included would be Jjakji, the GSL champion. Also, the whole point of the Blizzard Cup is Ten Champions. Nine Go Down. One Champion Stands.
Neither Supernova or MarineKing have won a big tournament yet. It wouldn't go with their champion tagline.
On December 09 2011 15:48 Fionn wrote: Right decision.
At the moment, Supernova/Polt/MKP are all in similar places. If either of Supernova or MKP played ForGG in Code A, they probably would have lost, too.
So yeah, MVP wins WCG, and we get Polt vs. MMA and a Polt vs. Leenock rematch. All good. The only player who has a gripe about Polt being included would be Jjakji, the GSL champion. Also, the whole point of the Blizzard Cup is Ten Champions. Nine Go Down. One Champion Stands.
Neither Supernova or MarineKing have won a big tournament yet. It wouldn't go with their champion tagline.
Ahhhhh.... but.... if MKP or SuperNoVa wins WCG, then no arguments right? Since they "won" a major tournament ^^
On December 09 2011 04:54 MetalLobster wrote: Polt is a great player but have we seriously forgotten the winner of NASL?
Winning a foreign tournament with 1-5 korean is nothing compared to winning a GSL. Sorry but Puma has not qualifier in Code A even once, he is mediocre in korea.
He did go boss mode in the beginning of GSTL Season 1. Also winning NASL 1 & 2 must mean something.
Don't let them fool you. Puma is a legit Code-S calibre player who could compete with the best of them. Just because he's not devoted to staying in korea and playing one tournament monthly doesn't mean he's not an incredible player (which he is).
Man, this is just more reason to hope that someone totally random wins WCG. It's boring enough to see MVP winning everything, but then a win here would let Polt into the Blizzard Cup? Nothing personal against Polt, but he hasn't been too hot, and honestly I've never thought of him as much of a star or as a particularly entertaining player to watch.
Also, it's a little unfortunate that GOM didn't have these backup plans in place ahead of time. There's inevitably going to be people suggesting that GOM is cherrypicking Polt here. For example, why not just let the 2nd place finisher at WCG go?
On December 09 2011 15:48 Fionn wrote: Right decision.
At the moment, Supernova/Polt/MKP are all in similar places. If either of Supernova or MKP played ForGG in Code A, they probably would have lost, too.
So yeah, MVP wins WCG, and we get Polt vs. MMA and a Polt vs. Leenock rematch. All good. The only player who has a gripe about Polt being included would be Jjakji, the GSL champion. Also, the whole point of the Blizzard Cup is Ten Champions. Nine Go Down. One Champion Stands.
Neither Supernova or MarineKing have won a big tournament yet. It wouldn't go with their champion tagline.
In the first AOL, which had arguably a tougher lineup than the Blizzard Cup is going to have, MKP beat Losira, Trickster, MMA and destroyed DRG when DRG's ZvT was already famous. Its no GSL championship, and it was also an online-only event but MKP is indeed a champion. I'm sure people would consider ThorZain winning the TSL 3 as making him a "champion."
The winner of an Arena of Legends tournament seems reasonable to "go with their champion tagline". Not saying theres any reason for MKP to be in the Blizz Cup unless he wins WCG, but your last statement is weak.
On December 09 2011 16:41 Fighter wrote: Man, this is just more reason to hope that someone totally random wins WCG. It's boring enough to see MVP winning everything, but then a win here would let Polt into the Blizzard Cup? Nothing personal against Polt, but he hasn't been too hot, and honestly I've never thought of him as much of a star or as a particularly entertaining player to watch.
Also, it's a little unfortunate that GOM didn't have these backup plans in place ahead of time. There's inevitably going to be people suggesting that GOM is cherrypicking Polt here. For example, why not just let the 2nd place finisher at WCG go?
Polt is one of the highest watched streams on TL. Outside of MC, I'm pretty sure he gets the second most views as a Korean.
MarineKing hasn't made a semifinal since the Super Tournament and SuperNova has never made a semifinal. All three of them lost in the first round of last season's Code S (Supernova going 0-2 and MKP/Polt 1-2) and then SuperNova/MKP got through Code A while Polt got ForGG.
If either of them win WCG, then I am 100% cool with them going to Blizzard Cup. If not, then Polt deserves his shot. I want to see MMA/Polt again. Also Polt and Nestea always have great games on stream, so that could be fun, too.
In the first AOL, which had arguably a tougher lineup than the Blizzard Cup is going to have, MKP beat Losira, Trickster, MMA and destroyed DRG when DRG's ZvT was already famous. Its no GSL championship, but I think it should rank at least as high as any non-GSL tournament victory (probably only IPL3 or MLG Providence top if for foreign tournaments).
The winner of an Arena of Legends tournament seems reasonable to "go with their champion tagline". Not saying theres any reason for MKP to be in the Blizz Cup unless he wins WCG, but your last statement is weak.
Eh, AoL.
Eh. Some people see it as a competitive high-level tournament, but I saw it as a run-of-the-mill players practicing more for GSL/GSTL and playing like it was ladder tournament. MKP is a good player, though, and deserves his shot if he wins WCG.
On December 09 2011 15:48 Fionn wrote: Right decision.
At the moment, Supernova/Polt/MKP are all in similar places. If either of Supernova or MKP played ForGG in Code A, they probably would have lost, too.
So yeah, MVP wins WCG, and we get Polt vs. MMA and a Polt vs. Leenock rematch. All good. The only player who has a gripe about Polt being included would be Jjakji, the GSL champion. Also, the whole point of the Blizzard Cup is Ten Champions. Nine Go Down. One Champion Stands.
Neither Supernova or MarineKing have won a big tournament yet. It wouldn't go with their champion tagline.
Neither did NaNiwa. And they were in the semi final and final of WCG qualifiers, which were almost as hard as a GSL (same bad bo1 groupstages etc)
On December 09 2011 15:48 Fionn wrote: Right decision.
At the moment, Supernova/Polt/MKP are all in similar places. If either of Supernova or MKP played ForGG in Code A, they probably would have lost, too.
So yeah, MVP wins WCG, and we get Polt vs. MMA and a Polt vs. Leenock rematch. All good. The only player who has a gripe about Polt being included would be Jjakji, the GSL champion. Also, the whole point of the Blizzard Cup is Ten Champions. Nine Go Down. One Champion Stands.
Neither Supernova or MarineKing have won a big tournament yet. It wouldn't go with their champion tagline.
It makes me smile that while people complain about GOM "gaming the system" in favor of whoever, these same people also are asking GOM to arbitrarily give someone like Sen a spot in the tournament, which seems much more suspect than moving down the GSL Point line.
Polt hasn't been placing well, but don't confuse that with Polt hasn't been playing well.
If you only count the games against ForGG then yeah, he looked kinda shitty for a former Code S player. But his games in the group stage were for the most part great (wonderful power build in Game 1, one early micro mistake in Game 2 put him behind until the end, Game 3 started with a bad opener and spiraled out of control). By no means is he in a slump or whatever.
I still don't understand how the F someone like Polt who won the final once and pretty much never went far any other time, has more points than MKP who was runner-up 3 times, and was ro4 many many times... wtf
He's better than pretty much every other possible player for Blizzard Cup mentioned in this thread, although I understand people being blase about Korean Terrans. He makes intelligent plays and with bio or biomech doing very well matchup wise, I'm sure he'll deliver some great games with marine-tank or pure bio.
Plus 2012 will belong to fOrGG, so one last hurrah for everyone else.
On December 09 2011 18:45 michielbrands wrote: MVP & MKP are already both on the same side of the bracket, so it never will be a MKP Vs. MVP Final
So I guess it's a duel of the fates. Which is the stronger one? MKP's destiny for silver, or MVP's fate as the destroyer of all things (except Leenock).
5th place points is a fine choice and gives the more qualified player anyways. GOM cant be blamed for foreigners inability to stop MVP in anything. And the most likely runner-up in the case of an MVP win would be SuperNova by far
On December 09 2011 17:55 sunman1g wrote: I still don't understand how the F someone like Polt who won the final once and pretty much never went far any other time, has more points than MKP who was runner-up 3 times, and was ro4 many many times... wtf
News flash: Polt made a final and semifinal in the last few months. MKP hasn't been past the Ro16 in Code S since the Super Tournament which Polt won.
On December 09 2011 19:15 Alvis wrote: I think blizzard cup will be more interesting if jjakji or forgg can qualify instead.
Why? The Blizzard Cup is supposed to be a year's summary from the best players over the year. Fin/Jjakji have recently picked up steam (though you can't really say anything about how Fin matches up to the best of the best yet) but they haven't been major players over the year.
Almost everyone in the list that's been invited so far have been hyped all year to some extent at least. They got their wins and they qualified.
I also don't like the decision. It just feels uninspired. You could take the winner of a major tournament, but instead you keep digging lower and lower in the GSL Rankings. I love GSL, don't get me wrong. It's pretty much all i watch. But this tournament felt like it was going to be more than GSL, and if you're taking fifth in rankings.... Since when the hell does 5th place mean anything ever?
At least he's a solid player, could be a lot lot worse.
On December 09 2011 17:55 sunman1g wrote: I still don't understand how the F someone like Polt who won the final once and pretty much never went far any other time, has more points than MKP who was runner-up 3 times, and was ro4 many many times... wtf
News flash: Polt made a final and semifinal in the last few months. MKP hasn't been past the Ro16 in Code S since the Super Tournament which Polt won.
do you realize you just validated my point even more ? so polt has 1 final (won)+ 1 semi final, while MKP has 3, THREE finals, at least 2 ro4 that I can remember and I think in the first GSL MC won he got ro8... During all this we did not even know who Polt was.. so yeah, I still do not get it. Did they change points regulations or points attributed to players at one point in time ? Or is it just that winning a GSL gives you just SOOOO many points that a 3 times runner up + several times ro4/8 is below that.
Anyway, I think giving the spot to the 5th in the GSL ranking point is pretty fucking dumb regardless. I think it's cooler if they picked people from different tournament. They should have given the spot to the 2nd place guy in case MVP wins WCG.
On a side note, and this may be completely subjective, I think Polt pulled an Inca. I do not think he is bad or lucky or anything, I just think his bracket in the super tournament and the way some of his opponents played made him the winner that particular time but we won't see that anytime soon. In fact, MKP is still way more dominant than Polt even if he did not win a GSL yet, just look at recent results, MKP has been placing really high left and right in online and offline tournaments while Polt is struggling heavily since he won that title. That is why I like MKP, yeah he has been slumping a while ago but overall he is super consistent as a player. Super strong play. I think he's only second to MVP as skill, but his mindset while playing on big stages fucks him up. No wonder online and from the comfort of his Prime home he's a beast and no one wants to face him :D
On December 09 2011 17:55 sunman1g wrote: I still don't understand how the F someone like Polt who won the final once and pretty much never went far any other time, has more points than MKP who was runner-up 3 times, and was ro4 many many times... wtf
News flash: Polt made a final and semifinal in the last few months. MKP hasn't been past the Ro16 in Code S since the Super Tournament which Polt won.
do you realize you just validated my point even more ? so polt has 1 final (won)+ 1 semi final, while MKP has 3, THREE finals, at least 2 ro4 that I can remember and I think in the first GSL MC won he got ro8... During all this we did not even know who Polt was.. so yeah, I still do not get it. Did they change points regulations or points attributed to players at one point in time ? Or is it just that winning a GSL gives you just SOOOO many points that a 3 times runner up + several times ro4/8 is below that.
Anyway, I think giving the spot to the 5th in the GSL ranking point is pretty fucking dumb regardless. I think it's cooler if they picked people from different tournament. They should have given the spot to the 2nd place guy in case MVP wins WCG.
On a side note, and this may be completely subjective, I think Polt pulled an Inca. I do not think he is bad or lucky or anything, I just think his bracket in the super tournament and the way some of his opponents played made him the winner that particular time but we won't see that anytime soon. In fact, MKP is still way more dominant than Polt even if he did not win a GSL yet, just look at recent results, MKP has been placing really high left and right in online and offline tournaments while Polt is struggling heavily since he won that title. That is why I like MKP, yeah he has been slumping a while ago but overall he is super consistent as a player. Super strong play. I think he's only second to MVP as skill, but his mindset while playing on big stages fucks him up. No wonder online and from the comfort of his Prime home he's a beast and no one wants to face him :D
Oh well
I can't see why you possibly think that MKP is second to skill to MVP. That's ridiculous and unfair to every other terran in Code S.
Would you really class any of them in the same league as MVP, Nestea, MMA, Stephano, Naniwa, MC, Hero, DRG and Leenock? Because frankly, I wouldn't, and I think Polt is a much better pick if you consider this is supposed to be the 'year summary' of tournament winners. Every one of the invited players has won it big time, and so had Polt. He deserves it.
On December 09 2011 17:55 sunman1g wrote: I still don't understand how the F someone like Polt who won the final once and pretty much never went far any other time, has more points than MKP who was runner-up 3 times, and was ro4 many many times... wtf
News flash: Polt made a final and semifinal in the last few months. MKP hasn't been past the Ro16 in Code S since the Super Tournament which Polt won.
do you realize you just validated my point even more ? so polt has 1 final (won)+ 1 semi final, while MKP has 3, THREE finals, at least 2 ro4 that I can remember and I think in the first GSL MC won he got ro8... During all this we did not even know who Polt was.. so yeah, I still do not get it. Did they change points regulations or points attributed to players at one point in time ? Or is it just that winning a GSL gives you just SOOOO many points that a 3 times runner up + several times ro4/8 is below that.
Anyway, I think giving the spot to the 5th in the GSL ranking point is pretty fucking dumb regardless. I think it's cooler if they picked people from different tournament. They should have given the spot to the 2nd place guy in case MVP wins WCG.
On a side note, and this may be completely subjective, I think Polt pulled an Inca. I do not think he is bad or lucky or anything, I just think his bracket in the super tournament and the way some of his opponents played made him the winner that particular time but we won't see that anytime soon. In fact, MKP is still way more dominant than Polt even if he did not win a GSL yet, just look at recent results, MKP has been placing really high left and right in online and offline tournaments while Polt is struggling heavily since he won that title. That is why I like MKP, yeah he has been slumping a while ago but overall he is super consistent as a player. Super strong play. I think he's only second to MVP as skill, but his mindset while playing on big stages fucks him up. No wonder online and from the comfort of his Prime home he's a beast and no one wants to face him :D
Oh well
No you're just being extremely biased. Apparently it's affecting your memory as well.
MarineKing was knocked out in the semi-finals of the Super Tournament and besides his Ro8 in Open Season 3, that's his only "middle of the road" result. He reached the finals of Code S January, World Championship (which wouldn't count because it was a special event), and Code A August (worth less than a spot in Code S). Every other time he failed to advance from his Ro32 group. He has not even gotten to the Ro16 since the Super Tournament. That hardly counts as "way more dominant".
Polt barely plays in foreign tournaments but he has done really well in them (he had an incredible run at MLG Orlando). MarineKing is quite talented and has won a lot of tournaments, but that just reinforces his inheritance to the Kong Line. Yellow could win all the special events he wanted but he could never take home the gold in the event that truly matters. And as of now MarineKing can't even get to the finals.
Nestea pulled an Inca for his GSL May victory (his competition played right into his hands). Jjakji pulled an Inca to win GSL November (a weird set of circumstances and luck propelled him into the finals). MvP has won three competitions against an opponent whom he psychologically dominates (MarineKing). Every winner of every Starcraft tournament has had the cards fall their way, whether the composition of their group stage or a slump in their opponent's play. Fantasy might have been the most recent OSL winner if Soo beat Jangbi/Baby won his group/Fantasy didn't utterly fail his all-in in the finals. You don't really have a point.
Would you really class any of them in the same league as MVP, Nestea, MMA, Stephano, Naniwa, MC, Hero, DRG and Leenock? Because frankly, I wouldn't, and I think Polt is a much better pick if you consider this is supposed to be the 'year summary' of tournament winners. Every one of the invited players has won it big time, and so had Polt. He deserves it.
Would you really class any of them in the same league as MVP, Nestea, MMA, Stephano, Naniwa, MC, Hero, DRG and Leenock? Because frankly, I wouldn't, and I think Polt is a much better pick if you consider this is supposed to be the 'year summary' of tournament winners. Every one of the invited players has won it big time, and so had Polt. He deserves it.
On December 09 2011 17:55 sunman1g wrote: I still don't understand how the F someone like Polt who won the final once and pretty much never went far any other time, has more points than MKP who was runner-up 3 times, and was ro4 many many times... wtf
News flash: Polt made a final and semifinal in the last few months. MKP hasn't been past the Ro16 in Code S since the Super Tournament which Polt won.
do you realize you just validated my point even more ? so polt has 1 final (won)+ 1 semi final, while MKP has 3, THREE finals, at least 2 ro4 that I can remember and I think in the first GSL MC won he got ro8... During all this we did not even know who Polt was.. so yeah, I still do not get it. Did they change points regulations or points attributed to players at one point in time ? Or is it just that winning a GSL gives you just SOOOO many points that a 3 times runner up + several times ro4/8 is below that.
Anyway, I think giving the spot to the 5th in the GSL ranking point is pretty fucking dumb regardless. I think it's cooler if they picked people from different tournament. They should have given the spot to the 2nd place guy in case MVP wins WCG.
On a side note, and this may be completely subjective, I think Polt pulled an Inca. I do not think he is bad or lucky or anything, I just think his bracket in the super tournament and the way some of his opponents played made him the winner that particular time but we won't see that anytime soon. In fact, MKP is still way more dominant than Polt even if he did not win a GSL yet, just look at recent results, MKP has been placing really high left and right in online and offline tournaments while Polt is struggling heavily since he won that title. That is why I like MKP, yeah he has been slumping a while ago but overall he is super consistent as a player. Super strong play. I think he's only second to MVP as skill, but his mindset while playing on big stages fucks him up. No wonder online and from the comfort of his Prime home he's a beast and no one wants to face him :D
Oh well
bullshit 1. MKP is ultra consistent agree. He never made it pass ro32 since January lol. I can name 10 terrans that did better than MKP. 2. Polt road to ST crowd: LosirA (2nd best zerg) Huk (foreigner jesus) Alicia (2nd best toss at that time) TOP (simply top terran) MMA (mlgchampsonofboxerhottestterraninthemarket). Only mvp pulled a more impressive run in GSL August 3. Btw what has MKP done recently to make him "dominant left and right" ?
Anyway I recommend you to buy a premium ticket. Lots of things happened since March.
Would you really class any of them in the same league as MVP, Nestea, MMA, Stephano, Naniwa, MC, Hero, DRG and Leenock? Because frankly, I wouldn't, and I think Polt is a much better pick if you consider this is supposed to be the 'year summary' of tournament winners. Every one of the invited players has won it big time, and so had Polt. He deserves it.
Would you really class any of them in the same league as MVP, Nestea, MMA, Stephano, Naniwa, MC, Hero, DRG and Leenock? Because frankly, I wouldn't, and I think Polt is a much better pick if you consider this is supposed to be the 'year summary' of tournament winners. Every one of the invited players has won it big time, and so had Polt. He deserves it.
I'd send kiwi
Seriously?
ofc. Not so much as a favourite to win, I'd just be enthralled to see how his play fairs in such a high calibre environment.
On December 09 2011 17:55 sunman1g wrote: I still don't understand how the F someone like Polt who won the final once and pretty much never went far any other time, has more points than MKP who was runner-up 3 times, and was ro4 many many times... wtf
News flash: Polt made a final and semifinal in the last few months. MKP hasn't been past the Ro16 in Code S since the Super Tournament which Polt won.
do you realize you just validated my point even more ? so polt has 1 final (won)+ 1 semi final, while MKP has 3, THREE finals, at least 2 ro4 that I can remember and I think in the first GSL MC won he got ro8... During all this we did not even know who Polt was.. so yeah, I still do not get it. Did they change points regulations or points attributed to players at one point in time ? Or is it just that winning a GSL gives you just SOOOO many points that a 3 times runner up + several times ro4/8 is below that.
Anyway, I think giving the spot to the 5th in the GSL ranking point is pretty fucking dumb regardless. I think it's cooler if they picked people from different tournament. They should have given the spot to the 2nd place guy in case MVP wins WCG.
On a side note, and this may be completely subjective, I think Polt pulled an Inca. I do not think he is bad or lucky or anything, I just think his bracket in the super tournament and the way some of his opponents played made him the winner that particular time but we won't see that anytime soon. In fact, MKP is still way more dominant than Polt even if he did not win a GSL yet, just look at recent results, MKP has been placing really high left and right in online and offline tournaments while Polt is struggling heavily since he won that title. That is why I like MKP, yeah he has been slumping a while ago but overall he is super consistent as a player. Super strong play. I think he's only second to MVP as skill, but his mindset while playing on big stages fucks him up. No wonder online and from the comfort of his Prime home he's a beast and no one wants to face him :D
MKP has had 3 deep runs this year, polt has had 2. One of polts deep runs netted him the tourney. polt does slightly better in the other events. Therefore polt has slightly more points.
Would you really class any of them in the same league as MVP, Nestea, MMA, Stephano, Naniwa, MC, Hero, DRG and Leenock? Because frankly, I wouldn't, and I think Polt is a much better pick if you consider this is supposed to be the 'year summary' of tournament winners. Every one of the invited players has won it big time, and so had Polt. He deserves it.
And you don't think placing second in a worldwide tournament where you have to climb your way way out of a local pool of people who know you, then beat the best of the best from other countries doesn't qualify better than 5th place ranking in GSL career?
On December 09 2011 17:55 sunman1g wrote: I still don't understand how the F someone like Polt who won the final once and pretty much never went far any other time, has more points than MKP who was runner-up 3 times, and was ro4 many many times... wtf
Check liquidpidea..... you done? Now tell me again now that you are informed.
Would you really class any of them in the same league as MVP, Nestea, MMA, Stephano, Naniwa, MC, Hero, DRG and Leenock? Because frankly, I wouldn't, and I think Polt is a much better pick if you consider this is supposed to be the 'year summary' of tournament winners. Every one of the invited players has won it big time, and so had Polt. He deserves it.
And you don't think placing second in a worldwide tournament where you have to climb your way way out of a local pool of people who know you, then beat the best of the best from other countries doesn't qualify better than 5th place ranking in GSL career?
Nop I dont WCG is not that heavy stacked with the world top placers. 3 koreans the tournament is basially like ESWC. ofcourse still a big win for any of the players participating in it however polt did win GSL and that count for alot more so yea Polt should defiantly get the spot
Polt will always be a clown to me, because of that time where he taunted Jinro saying he was not good (YOU CAN'T DO THAT MAN) and got bashed by our hero. I would have preferred a non korean, there are a bit too much in the tournament imo.
Would you really class any of them in the same league as MVP, Nestea, MMA, Stephano, Naniwa, MC, Hero, DRG and Leenock? Because frankly, I wouldn't, and I think Polt is a much better pick if you consider this is supposed to be the 'year summary' of tournament winners. Every one of the invited players has won it big time, and so had Polt. He deserves it.
And you don't think placing second in a worldwide tournament where you have to climb your way way out of a local pool of people who know you, then beat the best of the best from other countries doesn't qualify better than 5th place ranking in GSL career?
Yeah, 5th place in GSL rankings (on top of winning the Super Tournament) is a much better indicator of skill over the year than being lucky in brackets (which is the reason Huk/MKP cant get 2nd if MVP beats them whereas the players I listed can).
On December 09 2011 23:21 Azarkon wrote: Aren't we forgetting HuK? I don't see him on there.
Huk and MKP are both on MVP's side of the bracket. If MVP wins (which is what this situation is about) then the runner up cant be either of them.
Yea, It would be cool if they had last gsl winner to get hte last spot, to have some fresh up and coming blood in the tournament instead of a bunch of "golden oldies". Just my oppinion!
On December 09 2011 23:51 WhiteDog wrote: Polt will always be a clown to me, because of that time where he taunted Jinro saying he was not good (YOU CAN'T DO THAT MAN) and got bashed by our hero. I would have preferred a non korean, there are a bit too much in the tournament imo.
Koreans are the best first of all. Their professional players routinely win foreign tournaments while a non-Korean has yet to ever win a GSL the closest anyone has gotten was Jinro who managed to make top 4.
It's hosted by a Korean company GOM second of all, they make the decisions on who to invite.
Third, the way they're doing it makes total sense.
MVP would qualify as WCG champion, Nestea would qualify as Blizzcon runner up considering MVP was the champion of that, while their spots get transferred to the 4th and 5th ranking GSL players MMA and Polt both of whom have won a GSL Code S title.
Which makes a hell of a lot more sense than inviting Sen who won 3rd place at Blizzcon or inviting the runner up to WCG.
On December 09 2011 04:52 red4ce wrote: Bad choice. Should have been given to whoever gets 2nd place at WCG. Seems like GOM is making up whatever rules are convenient to achieve racial balance, in this case adjusting for the lack of terrans.
Giving spots to the top GSL players are not so bad.. those points is hard to come by.
On December 09 2011 17:55 sunman1g wrote: I still don't understand how the F someone like Polt who won the final once and pretty much never went far any other time, has more points than MKP who was runner-up 3 times, and was ro4 many many times... wtf
News flash: Polt made a final and semifinal in the last few months. MKP hasn't been past the Ro16 in Code S since the Super Tournament which Polt won.
do you realize you just validated my point even more ? so polt has 1 final (won)+ 1 semi final, while MKP has 3, THREE finals, at least 2 ro4 that I can remember and I think in the first GSL MC won he got ro8... During all this we did not even know who Polt was.. so yeah, I still do not get it. Did they change points regulations or points attributed to players at one point in time ? Or is it just that winning a GSL gives you just SOOOO many points that a 3 times runner up + several times ro4/8 is below that.
Anyway, I think giving the spot to the 5th in the GSL ranking point is pretty fucking dumb regardless. I think it's cooler if they picked people from different tournament. They should have given the spot to the 2nd place guy in case MVP wins WCG.
On a side note, and this may be completely subjective, I think Polt pulled an Inca. I do not think he is bad or lucky or anything, I just think his bracket in the super tournament and the way some of his opponents played made him the winner that particular time but we won't see that anytime soon. In fact, MKP is still way more dominant than Polt even if he did not win a GSL yet, just look at recent results, MKP has been placing really high left and right in online and offline tournaments while Polt is struggling heavily since he won that title. That is why I like MKP, yeah he has been slumping a while ago but overall he is super consistent as a player. Super strong play. I think he's only second to MVP as skill, but his mindset while playing on big stages fucks him up. No wonder online and from the comfort of his Prime home he's a beast and no one wants to face him :D
MKP has had 3 deep runs this year, polt has had 2. One of polts deep runs netted him the tourney. polt does slightly better in the other events. Therefore polt has slightly more points.
Polt got 5th because he won a GSL. If MKP had won a GSL, he would have been given the spot.
Anyways, MKP has nothing to complain about. He has his chance. Win the WCG and he's in. I wouldn't be surprised if he makes it.
On December 09 2011 17:55 sunman1g wrote: I still don't understand how the F someone like Polt who won the final once and pretty much never went far any other time, has more points than MKP who was runner-up 3 times, and was ro4 many many times... wtf
News flash: Polt made a final and semifinal in the last few months. MKP hasn't been past the Ro16 in Code S since the Super Tournament which Polt won.
do you realize you just validated my point even more ? so polt has 1 final (won)+ 1 semi final, while MKP has 3, THREE finals, at least 2 ro4 that I can remember and I think in the first GSL MC won he got ro8... During all this we did not even know who Polt was.. so yeah, I still do not get it. Did they change points regulations or points attributed to players at one point in time ? Or is it just that winning a GSL gives you just SOOOO many points that a 3 times runner up + several times ro4/8 is below that.
Anyway, I think giving the spot to the 5th in the GSL ranking point is pretty fucking dumb regardless. I think it's cooler if they picked people from different tournament. They should have given the spot to the 2nd place guy in case MVP wins WCG.
On a side note, and this may be completely subjective, I think Polt pulled an Inca. I do not think he is bad or lucky or anything, I just think his bracket in the super tournament and the way some of his opponents played made him the winner that particular time but we won't see that anytime soon. In fact, MKP is still way more dominant than Polt even if he did not win a GSL yet, just look at recent results, MKP has been placing really high left and right in online and offline tournaments while Polt is struggling heavily since he won that title. That is why I like MKP, yeah he has been slumping a while ago but overall he is super consistent as a player. Super strong play. I think he's only second to MVP as skill, but his mindset while playing on big stages fucks him up. No wonder online and from the comfort of his Prime home he's a beast and no one wants to face him :D
MKP has had 3 deep runs this year, polt has had 2. One of polts deep runs netted him the tourney. polt does slightly better in the other events. Therefore polt has slightly more points.
Polt got 5th because he won a GSL. If MKP had won a GSL, he would have been given the spot.
Anyways, MKP has nothing to complain about. He has his chance. Win the WCG and he's in. I wouldn't be surprised if he makes it.
racial balance should play absolutely no role just select winners and runners up from different tourneys and forget racial balance. that would be a much better way to do this
Also, remember, the original Blizzard Cup was the top ten GSL players in terms of ranking. The whole idea and structure of the Blizzard Cup was changed only a month or two before the actual event.
Hero, Naniwa, Leenock, etc. wouldn't have even made the cut if the structure wasn't changed. Nada, MKP, Jjakji, etc. would have made it instead.
Why in the world are people complaining? It's a GOM tournament and they are using GSL points as a backup plan. How in the world does that not make complete sense?
hm back in BW WCG was really big, but that was more for the foreigners i guess, i read that to the koreans it wasn't as important as the MSL and OSL despite the WCG being all about national pride and stuff
and now that SC2 tournies are even bigger (arguable i guess, but GSL gives more money than MSL/OSL right?) I guess it makes sense to invite more GSL players than from other tournies, idk. First second and third from GSL point ranking makes sense to me though, it's just that the first 3 happen to be people who won other things lol. It's hard to say, you could say that MVP Nestea qualify for top gsl point and nestea qualifies as being top GSL point, or you could say MVP qualifies as 1st place GSL points but nestea qualifies as being top Blizzcon player, etc., same with all the other players and leagues.
But in the end it makes most sense to me that they "prioritize" other events then take all the extras from GSL. Although it would be cool to see, for example, Sen in the blizz cup, i think that it makes more sense getting more GSL players instead.
On December 10 2011 18:36 Lysanias wrote: Well last chance for Polt to show us he's not a 1 timer.
Well, I don't think Polt is championship material as he is, but he was legit code S last season. Had a tough ass group and lost out to leenock and Ganzi but beat leenock once. Then he had to go against the conqueror.
I've sat through so much GomTvT, picking a Terran player is the last thing I care about. The most qualified player (ie 2nd place WCG) should be going, not the most qualified Terran player.
i understand polt gets it because of wcg but blizzcon too... this should mean another gets added from gsl rankings if im looking at this properly since nestea was 2nd at blizzcon, bllizcon should be a wash, and add 4th and 5th from gsl rankings, unless im blind deaf or stupid
On December 11 2011 15:03 nt-rAven wrote: i understand polt gets it because of wcg but blizzcon too... this should mean another gets added from gsl rankings if im looking at this properly since nestea was 2nd at blizzcon, bllizcon should be a wash, and add 4th and 5th from gsl rankings, unless im blind deaf or stupid
MMA and Polt were added because MVP won blizzcon and WCG.
On December 11 2011 15:03 nt-rAven wrote: i understand polt gets it because of wcg but blizzcon too... this should mean another gets added from gsl rankings if im looking at this properly since nestea was 2nd at blizzcon, bllizcon should be a wash, and add 4th and 5th from gsl rankings, unless im blind deaf or stupid
You got it right, and thats exactly what happened.
MMA and Polt got in becuase MVP won't stop winning.
On December 11 2011 15:03 nt-rAven wrote: i understand polt gets it because of wcg but blizzcon too... this should mean another gets added from gsl rankings if im looking at this properly since nestea was 2nd at blizzcon, bllizcon should be a wash, and add 4th and 5th from gsl rankings, unless im blind deaf or stupid
You got it right, and thats exactly what happened.
MMA and Polt got in becuase MVP won't stop winning.
He's the terran king. He's gotta take care of his people.
Polt, MMA, Nestea, Leenock and Naniwa is going to be a fun group. Leenock is 1-1 against Polt, 2-2 against MMA, and 4-1 against Naniwa in the last month.
Not surprising imo. Titan and Supernova were the only people who in my mind had a chance of beating him in a bo3 Titan because MVP's TvP is looking a little shaky and Titan looked like the best PvT at WCG and SuperNoVa because his TvT is sick.
On December 11 2011 15:17 ptrpb wrote: Not surprising imo. Titan and Supernova were the only people who in my mind had a chance of beating him in a bo3 Titan because MVP's TvP is looking a little shaky and Titan looked like the best PvT at WCG and SuperNoVa because his TvT is sick.
I was so sad when SuperNoVa got knocked out. He was my hope for shutting down Mvp in the finals. When MarineKing got knocked out, there was pretty much no one left to take out Mvp.
On December 11 2011 15:10 Fionn wrote: Polt, MMA, Nestea, Leenock and Naniwa is going to be a fun group. Leenock is 1-1 against Polt, 2-2 against MMA, and 4-1 against Naniwa in the last month.
There are so many storylines going on in this group that every single game is going to be for more than just increasing a player's chances of making it out of groupstage. I'm certain group stage results are going to be just as important to fans as whoever ends up winning the whole thing.
Group A kinda interests me but not in the same ways.
On December 11 2011 16:41 MildSeven wrote: That's the dumbest shit ever lol.. first they have MMA now Polt, Xigua or Sen i think deserved 3rd and 4th spot
Polt's calibre in the GSL especially doesn't deserve a spot, it's like nobody gets the WCG spot at all
One couldn't get pass group stage, one lucked his way to the final facing no korean and got humiliated when he did. Dr. Chae is way smarter than random fanboys.
They really messed up the invites in my opinion. I know a lot of people want to see Naniwa, but taking Providence 2nd place over GSL Nov champion is completely nonsensical. Then Polt, completely on a level below all the other players, instead of taking Sen for Blizzcon or Xigua for WCG. Like someone else said, they basically removed WCG and Blizzcon as invites by just taking more GSL ranked players. Makes no sense.
On December 11 2011 16:51 Sorathez wrote: I really think XiGua should have been invited instead of Polt...
Why? He didn't beat any Koreans on his way to the final and then got stomped by MVP. He would then have zero time to prepare for Nestea, Leenock, MMA and Naniwa, players he probably didn't study as much since WCG was on his mind. Polt has shown he can hang with everyone in his group.
Polt is in the tournament because of his consistent good play all season, especially during the second half. Just because he went 1-1 to Leenock (the runner-up) and threw a game against a very good player in Ganzi before drawing the unlucky stick of ForGG doesn't mean he doesn't deserve a shot.
Also, the whole tagline of the Blizzard Cup is about 10 champions. Sen and XiGua haven't won a championship this season; they would have been given a spot due to getting a silver or a bronze in a competition. MMA and Polt both won a GSL title in the past six months and both went deep a second time as well.
They really messed up the invites in my opinion. I know a lot of people want to see Naniwa, but taking Providence 2nd place over GSL Nov champion is completely nonsensical. Then Polt, completely on a level below all the other players, instead of taking Sen for Blizzcon or Xigua for WCG.
How the hell is Polt below Sen or XiGua? Polt has shown time and time again he can beat MMA; he went 1-1 with Leenock last GSL; his TvP is very good and can probably stand up against Naniwa. How did XiGua become better than Polt by getting to the finals of the WCG by not beating a single Korean along the way?
How the hell is Polt below Sen or XiGua? Polt has shown time and time again he can beat MMA; he went 1-1 with Leenock last GSL; his TvP is very good and can probably stand up against Naniwa. How did XiGua become better than Polt by getting to the finals of the WCG by not beating a single Korean along the way?
I'll give you Xigua, but Sen is clearly one of the best foreigners and has consistently been near the top at multiple international tournaments. Polt hasn't done anything in months, and won the Super Tournament on more of a fluke than anything. He has never wowed with his play, to me at least. Also, it makes no sense to say, ok WCG winner and Blizzcon winner get seeds, then when MVP wins both they reach further down the GSL ranking list instead of taking the next highest placing player from those tournaments. Also, you mention taking champions, but what has Naniwa won? He beat a clearly off Nestea and MVP (both dropped games to Haypro) in the Global invitational (which was only like 2 rounds), and won MLG before any Koreans were there.
On December 11 2011 16:41 MildSeven wrote: That's the dumbest shit ever lol.. first they have MMA now Polt, Xigua or Sen i think deserved 3rd and 4th spot
Polt's caliber in the GSL especially doesn't deserve a spot, it's like nobody gets the WCG spot at all
On December 11 2011 17:00 HydroOwl wrote: They really messed up the invites in my opinion. I know a lot of people want to see Naniwa, but taking Providence 2nd place over GSL Nov champion is completely nonsensical. Then Polt, completely on a level below all the other players, instead of taking Sen for Blizzcon or Xigua for WCG. Like someone else said, they basically removed WCG and Blizzcon as invites by just taking more GSL ranked players. Makes no sense.
Having a tournament of champions without the Reigning GSL champ is a bit funny don't you think? ^-^;;;
How the hell is Polt below Sen or XiGua? Polt has shown time and time again he can beat MMA; he went 1-1 with Leenock last GSL; his TvP is very good and can probably stand up against Naniwa. How did XiGua become better than Polt by getting to the finals of the WCG by not beating a single Korean along the way?
I'll give you Xigua, but Sen is clearly one of the best foreigners and has consistently been near the top at multiple international tournaments. Polt hasn't done anything in months, and won the Super Tournament on more of a fluke than anything. He has never wowed with his play, to me at least. Also, it makes no sense to say, ok WCG winner and Blizzcon winner get seeds, then when MVP wins both they reach further down the GSL ranking list instead of taking the next highest placing player from those tournaments.
Actually I think it makes a lot of sense. Being 4th or 5th in GSL points for the entire year is a hell of a lot harder than getting second in a single tournament. Who did Xigua beat? He took two Bo1s off of Kas and Happy, then went through Snute, F91, and Titan... Polt won the Super Tournament against much better competition and was consistently Code S until this past month, where he lost to Ganzi, went 1-1 with Leenock, and then lost to fOrGG in Code A.
This thread is just making my head hurt. I don't follow the SC2 scene in China, so I don't know if Xigua has earned a reputation as being an incredible player, but apart from that I don't see how anyone could argue that getting second in WCG compares in any way to Polt's achievements in the past year. If you don't like Polt, that's fine, I'm not a particular fan of him myself -- but trying to say he doesn't deserve a spot just seems like such an unfounded insult >.>
How the hell is Polt below Sen or XiGua? Polt has shown time and time again he can beat MMA; he went 1-1 with Leenock last GSL; his TvP is very good and can probably stand up against Naniwa. How did XiGua become better than Polt by getting to the finals of the WCG by not beating a single Korean along the way?
I'll give you Xigua, but Sen is clearly one of the best foreigners and has consistently been near the top at multiple international tournaments. Polt hasn't done anything in months, and won the Super Tournament on more of a fluke than anything. He has never wowed with his play, to me at least. Also, it makes no sense to say, ok WCG winner and Blizzcon winner get seeds, then when MVP wins both they reach further down the GSL ranking list instead of taking the next highest placing player from those tournaments.
Actually I think it makes a lot of sense. Being 4th or 5th in GSL points for the entire year is a hell of a lot harder than getting second in a single tournament. Who did Xigua beat? He took two Bo1s off of Kas and Happy, then went through Snute, F91, and Titan... Polt won the Super Tournament against much better competition and was consistently Code S until this past month, where he lost to Ganzi, went 1-1 with Leenock, and then lost to fOrGG in Code A.
I do agree, but then why say you are taking the WCG and Blizzcon champion at all? And taking the Providence runner up is really dumb IMO. If Xigua beat MVP and won WCG, would he really deserve to be in Blizzard Cup? No, not really, but then that shouldn't have been an invite to begin with. Not to mention, taking the GSL Nov champion makes way more sense. Jjakji's play is leaps and bounds more impressive than Polt's ever was, and he is much more relevant in the current SC2 scene.
I have to agree with the people who are saying Xigua doesn't deserve the spot for second place. Second place doesn't even mean he did the second best in the tournament. Players like Kas or MKP may have been more deserving, but they were in the more difficult half of the bracket.
If anything Jjakji should get the spot, but Polt has shown incredible consistency up until recently, and regardless he is still a very strong player so I don't think it is the worst decision.
As for people suggestion Sen... how do you even justify picking him? "Oh he did pretty well in tournaments and stuff." You can say that about a lot of top players as well. I think the idea of this tournament is to offer positions into the tournament for winning prestigious tournaments, or being consistent in the most difficult league... the GSL. I don't think Polt is the most deserving as I've said, but I don't think this is an unreasonable choice.
Taking two seeds from MLG providence is not dumb given that MLG providence contained arguably the most massive amount of elite international SC2 players and the highest amount of skill than any other tournament BY FAR. Look at the players list and you should see what I mean.
Yay good for Polt! But he's back in university unless if the event gives lots of money (i don't think it'll be much more than if at all the normal 50k?) i don't see polt getting much incentive to train especially hard for this tourny, especially since the players will be even better.
On December 11 2011 17:27 ProxyKnoxy wrote: I don't understand why they wouldn't give the GSL 2011 winner the spot? Why give it to someone who won a tournament like a year ago (exaggeration)
On December 11 2011 17:28 Yoshi Kirishima wrote: Yay good for Polt! But he's back in university unless if the event gives lots of money (i don't think it'll be much more than if at all the normal 50k?) i don't see polt getting much incentive to train especially hard for this tourny, especially since the players will be even better.
Considering the tournament starts tomorrow, I'd assume that he'd have been training thinking he'd have a chance at getting in, especially since a lot of universities are closed now since it's end of Quarter/Semester time.
On December 11 2011 17:27 ProxyKnoxy wrote: I don't understand why they wouldn't give the GSL 2011 winner the spot? Why give it to someone who won a tournament like a year ago (exaggeration)
If the GSL winner gets more points, but they have a point.
On December 11 2011 17:21 Kcheddar wrote: @hydroowl
Taking two seeds from MLG providence is not dumb given that MLG providence contained arguably the most massive amount of elite international SC2 players and the highest amount of skill than any other tournament BY FAR. Look at the players list and you should see what I mean.
That would be a valid point had Naniwa won more than 3 best of 3's (his overall record was 7-6). Yea, he took out good players, but the runs other people had at Providence were WAY more impressive. Nestea at 20-5, MVP at 24-5, etc. Naniwa just had extremely favorable placement to due the heavy advantage given to the top 4 ranked players (which he received mostly due to winning the final MLG before Koreans arrived).
On December 09 2011 04:52 red4ce wrote: Bad choice. Should have been given to whoever gets 2nd place at WCG. Seems like GOM is making up whatever rules are convenient to achieve racial balance, in this case adjusting for the lack of terrans.
This exactly. If they gave MMA 4th ranked seed MVP's spot then MVP no longer qualified for the tournament with the seed rank. Damn gom.
On December 11 2011 17:28 Yoshi Kirishima wrote: Yay good for Polt! But he's back in university unless if the event gives lots of money (i don't think it'll be much more than if at all the normal 50k?) i don't see polt getting much incentive to train especially hard for this tourny, especially since the players will be even better.
Considering the tournament starts tomorrow, I'd assume that he'd have been training thinking he'd have a chance at getting in, especially since a lot of universities are closed now since it's end of Quarter/Semester time.
Oh yeah good point. Hopefully he was expecting MVP to win and he's not surprised he's in the Blizz Cup now :D
Oh yeah I just realized there's only 10 players haha. I was expecting like 32 or something.
THIS is Code S. Code S should be called Code A, and Code A Code B and Code B Code C ^_^. Kekek
omg this is gonna be sexy!!!
Too bad no Jjakji though But they are all great players.
We'll have to see about Polt though. Maybe he'll bring his A game. Also players like Naniwa and Stephano are great but sometimes they don't do so well (like naniwa not doing well in Code A some reason) and Stephano I would just like to see him against some koreans (or more specifically, good GSL players lol).
Hero is great too and innovative and all but he lost to Puma, who I don't think is that great. Good, but not great like the top terrans. But who knows may be he'll do well.
If it ends up MC vs MVP i would like MC to win. I really would prefer MVP not to win haha, i'm not too interested in him (in positive ways, at least). And they have been having a small little rivalry methinks Nestea beating MVP would be epic too.
But we all know that it will be a MVP vs MMA TvT finals.
On December 11 2011 18:53 CosmoK wrote: @Yoshi Kirishima: Did I miss something, or why shouldn't Leenock be there? I'm pretty certain he won MLG Providence.
Woops I'm tired. I meant Jjakji isn't there, haha.
MVP is ruining ESPORTS! by never playing badly. Seriously, this guy is insane, qualifying for arguably the most prestigious tournament on the planet... THREE TIMES!
It would have been awesome if instead of replacing MVP's multiple spots, they just seeded him into the bracket three times, basically giving him three lives. Lose a series? No problem, you're in two more spots! Semifinals would wind up being Nestea v MVP on one side of the bracket, MVP v MVP on the other.
EPT
MVP Winning WCG= 
NesTea, 
MC
he would probably be one of the weakest ones in the tourney
