[MLG] Providence - Finale - Page 17
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We have issued a clarification to this article after discussion with staff, read here - Heyoka | ||
awwnuts07
United States621 Posts
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Zinjil
United States166 Posts
On November 29 2011 04:29 tree.hugger wrote: This is really silly. And I mean really silly. I'm disappointed that people can't see the obvious nuances between being a hater and being a critic. I'm especially disappointed that people think that the TL writing staff has some kind of axe to grind against EG in our front page content. That's completely nonsense, being a fan of one team or an anti-fan of another is not a pre-requisite to being on the writing staff, and if you think so, you're actually just 100% factually incorrect. I'd argue that people are realizing the difference between being a hater and being a critic, and they are correctly noting that the section of the article that is being debated is hard to place on one side of the line or the other. Some of the language in the original version wasn't so different than a post that you would find in the recesses of some LR thread with red text underneath. Starting an article with "I'm probably going to get flamed for this, but" requires a lot of reason and thought to justify, rather than just kind of plopping an opinion down and waiting for the fallout. | ||
FILM
United States663 Posts
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-_-
United States7081 Posts
On November 29 2011 02:10 Chill wrote: Please have more neutral writeups in the future. Games being played. Tournament being won. Fun being had. Nominated for Teamliquid Poster Awards in the "Moderator," "Clever, yet understated," and "Incontrol getting told" categories. | ||
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Insane
United States4991 Posts
EG is my favorite team in general, but that doesn't mean it's impossible to be critical of aspects of it. | ||
fortheGG
United Kingdom1002 Posts
On November 29 2011 05:54 -_- wrote: Nominated for Teamliquid Poster Awards in the "Moderator," "Clever, yet understated," and "Incontrol getting told" categories. LOL i miss that commentary Chill did ![]() | ||
Riking
Netherlands8 Posts
On November 28 2011 22:50 Liquid`Nazgul wrote: We want TL to have opinion pieces in our news. However this does not mean that we want to use the term opinion piece as an excuse for posting content that probably should not have been posted. We're internally reviewing the article currently, mostly with regards to how we will do things in the future. I think it is being reviewed guys, so chill. | ||
XRaDiiX
Canada1730 Posts
Great-write up lots of some-what unknowns though taking out big names.. I like that they are allowing independent/differing opinions to write articles...! | ||
Cloud9157
United States2968 Posts
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confusedcrib
United States1307 Posts
In all, I was just hoping to raise the point that EG's players are consistently under-performing from the expectations set by both the community and themselves since establishing a team house. EG's players have lost to other players with much less in the way of resources behind them. This begs the question, are the extra resources being allocated to EG's players paying off? We don't live in a fantasy world where the team houses are free, so what results should we expect? My wording was harsh, but that was very deliberate. EG is in a position where they need to figure out why they are not improving and they need to get it fixed, otherwise their huge investment into a team house, while good for the scene in general, doesn't really seem to be paying off. I tend to agree with people though that this may not have been the best place for such criticism. It's just that the results of Providence are directly related to this criticism being valid, so it would be equally weird to put it anywhere else. On a side note, I'm very sorry that I didn't mention you Illusion, when I was browsing the list of players that Slasher released you were on the Korean list so I mistakenly assumed that you were just someone from Korea I had never heard of. I later realized that you were apart of Vile during the tournament, but in the editing process I forgot to add you in to the piece about Spanishiwa, Gatored, and dde. I am truly sorry about that, and will be sure this mistake does not happen in the future. P.S. I am actually a big fan of EG. I was watching iNcontroL yesterday apparently moments before he read this article I went to sleep, and I'm currently watching Huk. I've also written things in the past that many people have flamed for being excessively biased to both iNcontroL and Idra. | ||
Juanald
United States354 Posts
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Kluey
Canada1197 Posts
On November 28 2011 16:39 heyoka wrote: [/center]Should Team Evil Geniuses Have Established a North American Team House? I'll be honest guys, I'm really afraid of getting flamed for this, but it's something that's concerned me for long enough that I'm just going to say it. EG did badly, and I can't help but feel that the team house is not paying for itself. Of course when you go to EG's coverage of the event, they point to having "solid results overall," but in reality, it's only ever their golden three that do well. Thanks to Idra, Huk, and Puma, EG always manages good PR, but the results of their other players are starting to get down right disturbing: iNcontroL lost to State and Strifecro, StrifeCro lost to syckness and RuFF13, Lzgamer lost to Catz and exMaSter. Only Machine and Axslav's results are remotely explainable, with losses to Nestea, dde, Gatored, and Violet. Even with those two players though, losses to Gatored and dde when you live in a team house are hard to justify. To be honest, if they want to justify having a team house, they need to work out a better system. While Puma and Idra seem to be practicing correctly, I can't shake the feeling that they would do well regardless of where they were living. EG needs to figure out what those two are doing right, and have everyone try to emulate it to avoid poor results. Having a team house in North America established a wonderful precedent, now they just need the results to match. All they do is ladder and custom games with each other. If they want to get better they need to start doing things that you will only find in a house. I live in my parents house and ladder+custom games are just as easy to do. They need to have an organized system with a coach, a higher hour per day maybe something like 10-12 hours, a white board with an organised schedule and calender and organised practice sessions with new strats. | ||
Redmark
Canada2129 Posts
This is an opinion I have expressed many times, but I feel it needs to be said. Chill, man. It may seem like it, but a lot of people get attacked in this community. For fuck's sake, if Idra is handling himself better than you you're doing something wrong. | ||
Hardigan
Switzerland1297 Posts
On November 29 2011 06:52 Redmark wrote: Incontrol has now surpassed Totalbiscuit (of the past, he's calmed down some since) in being the most touchy and reactive community figure. This is an opinion I have expressed many times, but I feel it needs to be said. Chill, man. It may seem like it, but a lot of people get attacked in this community. For fuck's sake, if Idra is handling himself better than you you're doing something wrong. Well, if your Team and your Team's effort is officially attacked by an other "Team" (""because it's not the players themself) than you have to react. He can't just make some assumptions without any inside information. If it would have been a random james McSmithy that would be another story. | ||
ROOTIllusion
United States1060 Posts
On November 29 2011 06:47 confusedcrib wrote: I think the best way to go about this is just to clarify a few things about my beliefs.
In all, I was just hoping to raise the point that EG's players are consistently under-performing from the expectations set by both the community and themselves since establishing a team house. EG's players have lost to other players with much less in the way of resources behind them. This begs the question, are the extra resources being allocated to EG's players paying off? We don't live in a fantasy world where the team houses are free, so what results should we expect? My wording was harsh, but that was very deliberate. EG is in a position where they need to figure out why they are not improving and they need to get it fixed, otherwise their huge investment into a team house, while good for the scene in general, doesn't really seem to be paying off. I tend to agree with people though that this may not have been the best place for such criticism. It's just that the results of Providence are directly related to this criticism being valid, so it would be equally weird to put it anywhere else. On a side note, I'm very sorry that I didn't mention you Illusion, when I was browsing the list of players that Slasher released you were on the Korean list so I mistakenly assumed that you were just someone from Korea I had never heard of. I later realized that you were apart of Vile during the tournament, but in the editing process I forgot to add you in to the piece about Spanishiwa, Gatored, and dde. I am truly sorry about that, and will be sure this mistake does not happen in the future. P.S. I am actually a big fan of EG. I was watching iNcontroL yesterday apparently moments before he read this article I went to sleep, and I'm currently watching Huk. I've also written things in the past that many people have flamed for being excessively biased to both iNcontroL and Idra. All good, would help if my TLPD name wasn't vileIllusion. Illusion is taken by zenexicecream though.. oh well | ||
desRow
Canada2654 Posts
On November 28 2011 16:53 Sadistx wrote: I'm sad that you guys didn't mention this guy, who, while not winning Providence, did at 15 years of age, come 24th in the most stacked MLG to date. + Show Spoiler + DC Nerd Baller, vileIllusion ![]() Also, wtf, is this a joke? None of these results are a surprise, except maybe Forbs breaking out. Everyone else who won was pretty much already the favorite, if you follow the scene semi-closely. Do not agree at all. And most of them aren't just top ladder either, they are on sponsored teams too, so "rise of the nonames" is quite inappropriate. same concern very disappointed illusion wasn't mention..... I don't think ruff should be listed | ||
CeriseCherries
6170 Posts
here's to better games and good luck next year | ||
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bkrow
Australia8532 Posts
On November 29 2011 02:23 iNcontroL wrote: Yeah I read those too! I love reading about my life and how it actually is from people who have no idea! LOL I am a fan of yours. And from listening to you for a long time on SotG and ITG etc i have come to respect your ability to articulate and argue a point of view. While your point in this thread is valid and requires discussion, the fact that you have successfully acted like a child in 3/4 posts in this thread is incredibly frustrating. You have a point. So express it; without being an asshole, or rude or inflammatory. I get the post made you mad, but it would be silly to think that at least some people in the community weren't thinking it? Noone is saying don't have the house, but maybe the way the house is run could be re-evaluated? Then again, any insight into how the house is actually run, sort of a day in the life of the EG house would be great. | ||
JujuXG
United States373 Posts
lol @ the fan girl with hero xD | ||
Longshank
1648 Posts
On November 29 2011 06:47 confusedcrib wrote: I think the best way to go about this is just to clarify a few things about my beliefs. [list] [*] I think that having team houses in North America is awesome, and would love if every single team could afford one. [*] The article was simply meant to question if having the team house was paying for itself in terms of player improvement, not if EG should close it's doors. I never once suggest that they should close it down, I'm only suggesting that they are not improving at a rate that the community expected, and they need to figure out why they are not improving. Sorry but "Should Team Evil Geniuses Have Established a North American Team House?" suggests that you're questioning the existence of an EG team house. If you're questioning if it should have been opened in the first place, then gives a number of examples of its' 'failure' while leaving all positive effects out, then one obviously assumes you indirectly suggest they might be better off closing it down. | ||
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