EPT
toss get colossus. terrans get marines. where's the zerg love?
they're just good because of their mobility. if you actually fight mutas head on they blow. and for people referencing mass muta balls as unstoppable, it's just poor unit response.
[D]Are mutalisks overpowered in WOL?? - Page 94
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TheDraken
United States640 Posts
toss get colossus. terrans get marines. where's the zerg love? they're just good because of their mobility. if you actually fight mutas head on they blow. and for people referencing mass muta balls as unstoppable, it's just poor unit response. | ||
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Gelenn
United States87 Posts
On January 22 2012 07:05 Go1den wrote: lol @ Zergs complaining about how "bad" mutalisks are If you don't believe mutalisks are the most overpowered unit in the game, you either (a) don't play Protoss or (b) don't use mutalisks correctly. Or (c) play against good protoss that know how to respond to mutalisks. Or (d) think mutalisks aren't over or underpowered and this thread has turned into balance whine that gets the community nowhere. I pick D. | ||
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Ziggitz
United States340 Posts
On January 22 2012 07:04 Blasterion wrote: Phoenix don't go XY on an extreme level nor do they chain attacks, Protosses never keep making phoenixes, and if you still think the chain attack is a serious issue with mutalisks instead of realizing it's atctually worse than havew the dps straight up in one attack without any bounces then there's no hope for you. | ||
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FeyFey
Germany10114 Posts
Anyway watch recent code S tosses deal with mutas, it shows how to defend them right. I kept it bwish and use phoenix + canon to defend mutas, works perfect as phoenix > mutas when armies collide. (mutas are only better if the phoenix are alone, but since they are faster it will never happen) | ||
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happyness
United States2400 Posts
Blizzard is not making the tempest because mutas are overpowered, but because going mass mutas leads to stupid games. Does anybody like these constant base trades that mass muta forces the toss into? It leads to games that are not fun to watch and not fun to play. I'm not sure if the tempest will solve the problem, but at least blizz recognizes the problem. | ||
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LuckoftheIrish
United States4791 Posts
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Blasterion
China10272 Posts
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Tarotis
Germany1931 Posts
On January 22 2012 23:08 Blasterion wrote: Mutas aren't exactly overpowered, it's just that the races could have better ways to deal with them. Making for more interesting game play. "Mutas are fine but their counters are underpowered"? | ||
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Captain Calamity
United Kingdom38 Posts
Basically since muta counters are becoming more available I am wondering if mutas are going to get a direct or indirect buff as a result of as yet unseen/ unforseen changes to come in HOTS. | ||
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sorrowptoss
Canada1431 Posts
Furthermore, the tempest was described because Protoss players apparently had trouble with big muta switches in PvZ. I know this isn't necessairly your opinion, but rather Blizzard's, but seriously, the Tempest seems to be the most overpowered thing of all time, along with that shredder thing. The Tempest is basicly a valkyrie (BW) + storms (which by the way already work vs mutas). Soooo ridiculous. I hate how Blizzard thinks of changing the entire game by adding ridiculous units just because of a build, without even leaving some time for the players to think of a way to adapt. Nowadays, protosses counter muta based builds very well, it just took some time. Same thing goes for everything else in the game and its patches. | ||
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Blasterion
China10272 Posts
On January 22 2012 23:10 Tarotis wrote: "Mutas are fine but their counters are underpowered"? Let's just say they aren't really great at doing what they are suppose to do? The counters are bad at fighting the mobility that Mutalisks possess. Especially when you can micro a flock of 40+. I mean back then u can only micro 12. that wasn't an issue. not to mention Goliath weren't as slow as thors which is the reason for the implementation of the Warhound. Vikings don't do splash damage. I miss My Valks. Not to say they are OP but there should be more to it than Marines and Thors. of which Thors make great deterrents. Terrible counter | ||
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MrCash
United States1504 Posts
On January 22 2012 07:12 TheDraken wrote: can zerg not have just ONE unit that makes everyone shit their pants? toss get colossus. terrans get marines. where's the zerg love? they're just good because of their mobility. if you actually fight mutas head on they blow. and for people referencing mass muta balls as unstoppable, it's just poor unit response. Infestor, upgraded ultars (you forget upgrades, no one is scared), broodlords, mass banelings. | ||
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MrCash
United States1504 Posts
On January 22 2012 23:10 Tarotis wrote: "Mutas are fine but their counters are underpowered"? I somewhat agree. Mutas have little health for their cost, so they should be vulnerable, but they will either contain easily or force silly base trades. If the other races have some more mobile units that can engage them cost effectively or not require to dedicate so much supply to defenses alone, it would make for a more dynamic match up vs mutas. | ||
kurrysauce
272 Posts
On January 22 2012 07:05 Go1den wrote: lol @ Zergs complaining about how "bad" mutalisks are If you don't believe mutalisks are the most overpowered unit in the game, you either (a) don't play Protoss or (b) don't use mutalisks correctly. (c) isn't in diamond league and below . | ||
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PandaMonk
United States300 Posts
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Arisen
United States2382 Posts
I could be wrong here, as I'm no where close to the best player in the world, but I've played and seen too many games where if that third isn't super early and toss isn't going stargate, protoss can not get the gas he needs to defend his base and get on the map at the same time, so zerg gets free epos and build such a muta count that he can deny the third if the army defends a counter or can counter and do a ton of damage if he defends his third. Now, if toss opens stargate, I believe toss is adequately suited to dealing with mutalisks such that he can secure a difficult third base. Once protoss has secured three base, I don't believe you'd hear any protoss of sufficient skill being reasonable claim that mutalisks are overpowered. They are certainly strong, but can be delt with. If protoss is stuck on two base, though, mutalisks do force a situation where protoss can not really do much if the zerg plays optimally. THough, like I said, I believe that on these maps a protoss should realize this and go stargate. Terran I think is obviously adequately suited to dealing with mutalisks going bio, but I believe that if a terran wants to go mech, thors are weak in small numbers to mutalisks, so the warhound to me makes sense. The tempest, however, looks to make mass muta not an option,and from a design standpoint, I think that this is a horrendous, horrendous unit. If a small amount of a unit makes a whole strategy irrelivant, there is a problem, which looks to be the case with the tempest. If they reduced the splash significantly, however, I think the unit is OK (because you can micro your mutas/corrupters, etc to still make mass air viable) but not particularly interesting otherwise, so I don't like the unit on a whole. | ||
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Blezza
United Kingdom191 Posts
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ODKStevez
Ireland1225 Posts
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ODKStevez
Ireland1225 Posts
On January 22 2012 23:18 Captain Calamity wrote: Im going to make a guess here... Basically since muta counters are becoming more available I am wondering if mutas are going to get a direct or indirect buff as a result of as yet unseen/ unforseen changes to come in HOTS. From the tempest video, I wouldn't say so, they are showing a video with Mutas in it. If they changed the mutas so they would survive the Tempest a lot better, it would defeat the purpose. But then again, remember the Planet Cracker? xD (Mothership ability) | ||
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Lugace
United States11 Posts
My theory is the lower you are in the leagues, the stronger mutas become. They're still a great unit though that you have to treat very delicately and constantly babysit. Terran have found many different ways to deal with mutas... turrets, marine, and thor are all still good. And protoss can use blink stalker + cannons in mineral line to great affect. Not sure why people have said storm is useless as Mutas can dodge them... storm is still and AOE that will hit EVERY muta, even if it is for half a second it still does a TON of damage overall to the muta flock. Land 2 or 3 more and the mutas are in red and essentially worthless untill they regain health. Mutas aren't too much of a problem in higher leagues, but I'm assuming if lower league players put up more turrets, thors, or get storms it should be really easy to kill mutas. Have to also consider that the Zerg player controlling mutas is also in that same low league, so his control won't be all that great and they probably won't be able to magic box very well. Meaning 2 storms should kill every muta if landed correctly, and a well placed thor will do all the damage it needs to. I also don't agree with Blizzard's decision of units in the upcoming patch. If their reasoning for the tempest is to counter mutas... give players more time to come up with more ways to deal with them. Even though my previously mentioned counters work just fine as it is... | ||
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