|
On September 21 2011 13:52 Xouh wrote:Show nested quote +On September 21 2011 13:47 Brotocol wrote:On September 21 2011 13:40 Xouh wrote:
Complexity wrote : "For the next 18 days we conducted negotiations. We would make an offer and Millenium would make a counter offer. At no point did we apply pressure other than to make it clear that we were willing to do what it would take to secure his services.'
Contradiction in bold.
Maybe Stephano finally don't want to become a Stream-singer ? France, 14 posts.Ulterior motive in bold. PS: What you bolded is not the slightest bit contradictory. (Don't care about my posts number ?) Yes this is contradiction 'cause, if you are harass with "travel around the world, and best payed player " for 18 days, you ARE under pressure.
How is that harassment. Please explain to me how offering him a high salary and the option to participate in foreign tournaments constitutes harassment.
I'm not even being snarky, I literally do not understand your logic.
|
On September 21 2011 10:07 Supter wrote:Show nested quote +On September 21 2011 09:37 Insane wrote:On September 21 2011 08:18 Supter wrote:
So, what were they suppose to do ?
Think "well, when i was sleeping, they sign my best player, but i can't try to get him back, it's bad. I'll let him leave. Too bad for me." or try to get him back ?
They chose the second option. You guys are saying "it's bad for esport, and it's bad for esport reputation". But if they had lost their best player, it would have been horrible for them.
You follow a team site for their players. Stephano is really popular in France, and Millenium is like the first esport site in France, french people don't mind as much about Lalush, Tarson, DieStar and even Adel as they do for Stephano. It would have been a HUGE lost for them. Moreover all their project (including the team one) would have been destroy.
I don't say that Millenium did good, but if you think that CoL is the good guy and Millenium is the bad guy, you are mistaken. IMO, Millenium and CoL are just doing what they have to do for their team (ie. signing a contract with a player they want and keep the player they have), and Stephano did a huge mistake.
Seriously, will you HATE Millenium because of this ? It's so childish.
If he signed a contract, then yes you say "damn, looks like we lost out on it". Alternatively, you can talk to CoL / Stephano, and see if both of those parties are interested in having Millenium buy out the contract (note that the reason you need to talk to CoL here is that they have a contract, whereas in the case of the negotiation with Millenium, there was no contract to be bought out). Regardless of how much of a bummer it is, a contract is a contract - the mere fact that it may be bad for your team to lose the player is not a valid reason for breaking a contract. Childish is doing what you want without regards for prior signed agreements. According to french law, it's not a valid contract, so, it's like there is no binding contract. I'm not saying that Millenium did well and that they are right, i'm just saying : 1. Maybe CoL is not as white as they seem to be 2. Millenium head wasnt aware of the CoL/Stephano situation, or at least, they didnt expected CoL to make them sign THAT early. 3. According to french law, there is no binding contract between CoL and Stephano : if the contract is not valid, then it's like it doesnt exist. I don't say that Millenium are good guys, but i don't think there is good guys and bad guys in this story. There is a stupid guy (Stephano) and two teams which fight for their interests and use what they can use.
So you are not saying millenium did the right thing, just implying coL may have done something wrong, and the reason for that is..??? no reason.. just a hunch uh?
|
On September 21 2011 14:35 Brotocol wrote:Show nested quote +On September 21 2011 13:52 Xouh wrote:On September 21 2011 13:47 Brotocol wrote:On September 21 2011 13:40 Xouh wrote:
Complexity wrote : "For the next 18 days we conducted negotiations. We would make an offer and Millenium would make a counter offer. At no point did we apply pressure other than to make it clear that we were willing to do what it would take to secure his services.'
Contradiction in bold.
Maybe Stephano finally don't want to become a Stream-singer ? France, 14 posts.Ulterior motive in bold. PS: What you bolded is not the slightest bit contradictory. (Don't care about my posts number ?) Yes this is contradiction 'cause, if you are harass with "travel around the world, and best payed player " for 18 days, you ARE under pressure. How is that harassment. Please explain to me how offering him a high salary and the option to participate in foreign tournaments constitutes harassment. I'm not even being snarky, I literally do not understand your logic.
Must be a french thing to feel harassed when your boss is "threatening" you with doubling your salary for the next year if you sign a new contract... yeah pretty stressing really.
|
Oh my, if my boss wanted to wine and dine me for 18 days pressuring me to take a raise... the horror!
I would be sure to say yes and sign the dotted line after enduring 18 days of this cruel and unusual punishment, only to not show up to work on the 19th day and never be heard from again.
ETA: actually it would be more like skipping the interview process when looking for a new job and being given multiple offers over the course of 18 days
|
On September 21 2011 14:40 s4life wrote:Show nested quote +On September 21 2011 14:35 Brotocol wrote:On September 21 2011 13:52 Xouh wrote:On September 21 2011 13:47 Brotocol wrote:On September 21 2011 13:40 Xouh wrote:
Complexity wrote : "For the next 18 days we conducted negotiations. We would make an offer and Millenium would make a counter offer. At no point did we apply pressure other than to make it clear that we were willing to do what it would take to secure his services.'
Contradiction in bold.
Maybe Stephano finally don't want to become a Stream-singer ? France, 14 posts.Ulterior motive in bold. PS: What you bolded is not the slightest bit contradictory. (Don't care about my posts number ?) Yes this is contradiction 'cause, if you are harass with "travel around the world, and best payed player " for 18 days, you ARE under pressure. How is that harassment. Please explain to me how offering him a high salary and the option to participate in foreign tournaments constitutes harassment. I'm not even being snarky, I literally do not understand your logic. Must be a french thing to feel harassed when your boss is "threatening" you with doubling your salary for the next year if you sign a new contract... yeah pretty stressing really.
Obvious troll is obvious...
He clearly says in his first post that there is a contradiction, "we were throwing offers constantly, but there was no pressure!" Well if there was no pressure why were they throwing offers?
Theres his logic brotocol, pretty simple to comprehend, no? , and your racist comment is quite unneeded.s4life...
|
On September 21 2011 12:45 docvoc wrote:
Millenium is in a lose lose situation, if they say we were wrong they give up stephano after possibly coercing (i say this as a jab to what they have accused CoL of doing) him to stay and then accusing CoL of coercing stephano. Stephano is really good but he won't last, his play is incredible to watch but its foreign good, not korea good, he is not even close to sen or nestea right now. He could become this good if he joins a bigger team but right now his entire livelihood hangs in the balance, if this doesn't get settled soon he won't be big on the sponsorship list since this will follow him for a while. I hope CoL either sues the living shit out of Millenium, or Millenium somehow releases a statement showing that they aren't violating a presigned contract. If none of the above happen, i hope stephano somehow makes it out with his career intact, ToD did it, now its his turn. Millenium is pretty much dead and this would be the nail in the coffin it seems.
- Mill didn't violate anything.
- CoL can't sue Mill, if anyone can get sued, it's Stephano for breaking his contract with CoL
everyone is guilty here.., that's what it makes so much drama:
CoL acted unprofessionally making Stephano sign without letting him the time ton consult M or contacting M directly.
Mill acted unprofessionally by convincing Stephano to change his mind after he signed a contract with another team.
Stephano acted unprofessionally by taking the decision to sign, and then changing his mind
and regarding the suing... you have no idea at what point the idea of suing seems ridiculous to most of the french here. good luck with getting an US contract getting applied to a french citizen in France.
But appart from that, most reactions here are due to not understanding the cultural difference between US and France :
Judicial system in US is accusatory : the defendant must prove is innocent.
Well in France it's an Inquisitorial system, the defendent is assumed innocent, and the goal is to find the truth, based on the facts.
THAT explain a lots of reactions here, from US and french ppl 
|
On September 21 2011 14:35 Brotocol wrote:Show nested quote +On September 21 2011 13:52 Xouh wrote:On September 21 2011 13:47 Brotocol wrote:On September 21 2011 13:40 Xouh wrote:
Complexity wrote : "For the next 18 days we conducted negotiations. We would make an offer and Millenium would make a counter offer. At no point did we apply pressure other than to make it clear that we were willing to do what it would take to secure his services.'
Contradiction in bold.
Maybe Stephano finally don't want to become a Stream-singer ? France, 14 posts.Ulterior motive in bold. PS: What you bolded is not the slightest bit contradictory. (Don't care about my posts number ?) Yes this is contradiction 'cause, if you are harass with "travel around the world, and best payed player " for 18 days, you ARE under pressure. How is that harassment. Please explain to me how offering him a high salary and the option to participate in foreign tournaments constitutes harassment. I'm not even being snarky, I literally do not understand your logic.
The key word is logic here. People are obviously gonna be biased based on where they are from, the biggest issue in my mind is the fact that contracts in SC2 mean shit right now and this could be a huge factor in deciding the future of progamer contracts
|
Why can't things be simple in this world anymore.... i hate all of these complex contracts and obligations and crap like that, just go with the team you want, no questions!
Seriously, even if stephano signed with another team, would he want to join them after this fiasco? i think not
|
On September 21 2011 14:46 Gwal wrote:Show nested quote +On September 21 2011 12:45 docvoc wrote:
Millenium is in a lose lose situation, if they say we were wrong they give up stephano after possibly coercing (i say this as a jab to what they have accused CoL of doing) him to stay and then accusing CoL of coercing stephano. Stephano is really good but he won't last, his play is incredible to watch but its foreign good, not korea good, he is not even close to sen or nestea right now. He could become this good if he joins a bigger team but right now his entire livelihood hangs in the balance, if this doesn't get settled soon he won't be big on the sponsorship list since this will follow him for a while. I hope CoL either sues the living shit out of Millenium, or Millenium somehow releases a statement showing that they aren't violating a presigned contract. If none of the above happen, i hope stephano somehow makes it out with his career intact, ToD did it, now its his turn. Millenium is pretty much dead and this would be the nail in the coffin it seems. - Mill didn't violate anything. - CoL can't sue Mill, if anyone can get sued, it's Stephano for breaking his contract with CoL everyone is guilty here.., that's what it makes so much drama: CoL acted unprofessionally making Stephano sign without letting him the time ton consult M or contacting M directly. Mill acted unprofessionally by convincing Stephano to change his mind after he signed a contract with another team. Stephano acted unprofessionally by taking the decision to sign, and then changing his mind and regarding the suing... you have no idea at what point the idea of suing seems ridiculous to most of the french here. good luck with getting an US contract getting applied to a french citizen in France. But appart from that, most reactions here are due to not understanding the cultural difference between US and France : Judicial system in US is accusatory : the defendant must prove is innocent. Well in France it's an Inquisitorial system, the defendent is assumed innocent, and the goal is to find the truth, based on the facts. THAT explain a lots of reactions here, from US and french ppl
No you are wrong. In the US the burden is on the prosecution to show guilt. The term we like to use "is innocent until proven guilty." Nice try.
|
On September 21 2011 14:43 Holcan wrote:Show nested quote +On September 21 2011 14:40 s4life wrote:On September 21 2011 14:35 Brotocol wrote:On September 21 2011 13:52 Xouh wrote:On September 21 2011 13:47 Brotocol wrote:On September 21 2011 13:40 Xouh wrote:
Complexity wrote : "For the next 18 days we conducted negotiations. We would make an offer and Millenium would make a counter offer. At no point did we apply pressure other than to make it clear that we were willing to do what it would take to secure his services.'
Contradiction in bold.
Maybe Stephano finally don't want to become a Stream-singer ? France, 14 posts.Ulterior motive in bold. PS: What you bolded is not the slightest bit contradictory. (Don't care about my posts number ?) Yes this is contradiction 'cause, if you are harass with "travel around the world, and best payed player " for 18 days, you ARE under pressure. How is that harassment. Please explain to me how offering him a high salary and the option to participate in foreign tournaments constitutes harassment. I'm not even being snarky, I literally do not understand your logic. Must be a french thing to feel harassed when your boss is "threatening" you with doubling your salary for the next year if you sign a new contract... yeah pretty stressing really. Obvious troll is obvious... He clearly says in his first post that there is a contradiction, "we were throwing offers constantly, but there was no pressure!" Well if there was no pressure why were they throwing offers? Theres his logic brotocol, pretty simple to comprehend, no? , and your racist comment is quite unneeded.s4life...
* I didn't make a racist comment. But it is quite suspicious that so many new French posters are defending Millenium.
* Offers are 100% voluntary. So no, that is not pressure. Nobody coerced him to sign anything.
PS: I grew up in a French community. But unlike some people, I don't let that compromise my reasoning.
|
On September 21 2011 14:46 Gwal wrote:Show nested quote +On September 21 2011 12:45 docvoc wrote:
Millenium is in a lose lose situation, if they say we were wrong they give up stephano after possibly coercing (i say this as a jab to what they have accused CoL of doing) him to stay and then accusing CoL of coercing stephano. Stephano is really good but he won't last, his play is incredible to watch but its foreign good, not korea good, he is not even close to sen or nestea right now. He could become this good if he joins a bigger team but right now his entire livelihood hangs in the balance, if this doesn't get settled soon he won't be big on the sponsorship list since this will follow him for a while. I hope CoL either sues the living shit out of Millenium, or Millenium somehow releases a statement showing that they aren't violating a presigned contract. If none of the above happen, i hope stephano somehow makes it out with his career intact, ToD did it, now its his turn. Millenium is pretty much dead and this would be the nail in the coffin it seems. - Mill didn't violate anything. - CoL can't sue Mill, if anyone can get sued, it's Stephano for breaking his contract with CoL everyone is guilty here.., that's what it makes so much drama: CoL acted unprofessionally making Stephano sign without letting him the time ton consult M or contacting M directly. Mill acted unprofessionally by convincing Stephano to change his mind after he signed a contract with another team. Stephano acted unprofessionally by taking the decision to sign, and then changing his mind and regarding the suing... you have no idea at what point the idea of suing seems ridiculous to most of the french here. good luck with getting an US contract getting applied to a french citizen in France. But appart from that, most reactions here are due to not understanding the cultural difference between US and France : Judicial system in US is accusatory : the defendant must prove is innocent. Well in France it's an Inquisitorial system, the defendent is assumed innocent, and the goal is to find the truth, based on the facts. THAT explain a lots of reactions here, from US and french ppl
Uh sorry but i believe in the US it is innocent until proven guilty. Nice try tho.
|
|
|
On September 21 2011 14:52 Bandino wrote:Show nested quote +On September 21 2011 14:46 Gwal wrote:On September 21 2011 12:45 docvoc wrote:
Millenium is in a lose lose situation, if they say we were wrong they give up stephano after possibly coercing (i say this as a jab to what they have accused CoL of doing) him to stay and then accusing CoL of coercing stephano. Stephano is really good but he won't last, his play is incredible to watch but its foreign good, not korea good, he is not even close to sen or nestea right now. He could become this good if he joins a bigger team but right now his entire livelihood hangs in the balance, if this doesn't get settled soon he won't be big on the sponsorship list since this will follow him for a while. I hope CoL either sues the living shit out of Millenium, or Millenium somehow releases a statement showing that they aren't violating a presigned contract. If none of the above happen, i hope stephano somehow makes it out with his career intact, ToD did it, now its his turn. Millenium is pretty much dead and this would be the nail in the coffin it seems. - Mill didn't violate anything. - CoL can't sue Mill, if anyone can get sued, it's Stephano for breaking his contract with CoL everyone is guilty here.., that's what it makes so much drama: CoL acted unprofessionally making Stephano sign without letting him the time ton consult M or contacting M directly. Mill acted unprofessionally by convincing Stephano to change his mind after he signed a contract with another team. Stephano acted unprofessionally by taking the decision to sign, and then changing his mind and regarding the suing... you have no idea at what point the idea of suing seems ridiculous to most of the french here. good luck with getting an US contract getting applied to a french citizen in France. But appart from that, most reactions here are due to not understanding the cultural difference between US and France : Judicial system in US is accusatory : the defendant must prove is innocent. Well in France it's an Inquisitorial system, the defendent is assumed innocent, and the goal is to find the truth, based on the facts. THAT explain a lots of reactions here, from US and french ppl Uh sorry but i believe in the US it is innocent until proven guilty. Nice try tho.
sorry I wasn't very clear.
in US, I believe The prosecution gather evidences to make a case, the defense make a statement, and they battle over facts to finding who wins no ?
I was just trying to explain that it isn't at all like that in France, the only goal is the truth.
|
On September 21 2011 14:46 Gwal wrote:Show nested quote +On September 21 2011 12:45 docvoc wrote:
Millenium is in a lose lose situation, if they say we were wrong they give up stephano after possibly coercing (i say this as a jab to what they have accused CoL of doing) him to stay and then accusing CoL of coercing stephano. Stephano is really good but he won't last, his play is incredible to watch but its foreign good, not korea good, he is not even close to sen or nestea right now. He could become this good if he joins a bigger team but right now his entire livelihood hangs in the balance, if this doesn't get settled soon he won't be big on the sponsorship list since this will follow him for a while. I hope CoL either sues the living shit out of Millenium, or Millenium somehow releases a statement showing that they aren't violating a presigned contract. If none of the above happen, i hope stephano somehow makes it out with his career intact, ToD did it, now its his turn. Millenium is pretty much dead and this would be the nail in the coffin it seems. - Mill didn't violate anything. - CoL can't sue Mill, if anyone can get sued, it's Stephano for breaking his contract with CoL everyone is guilty here.., that's what it makes so much drama: CoL acted unprofessionally making Stephano sign without letting him the time ton consult M or contacting M directly. Mill acted unprofessionally by convincing Stephano to change his mind after he signed a contract with another team. Stephano acted unprofessionally by taking the decision to sign, and then changing his mind and regarding the suing... you have no idea at what point the idea of suing seems ridiculous to most of the french here. good luck with getting an US contract getting applied to a french citizen in France. But appart from that, most reactions here are due to not understanding the cultural difference between US and France : Judicial system in US is accusatory : the defendant must prove is innocent. Well in France it's an Inquisitorial system, the defendent is assumed innocent, and the goal is to find the truth, based on the facts. THAT explain a lots of reactions here, from US and french ppl
UHHHHH im not going to get into a lot of things here but the US system the defendant does NOT need to prove he/she is innocent
Innocent until proven guilty is a big line for the US
Probably just a misunderstanding but you got our system backward
|
On September 21 2011 15:02 Gwal wrote:Show nested quote +On September 21 2011 14:52 Bandino wrote:On September 21 2011 14:46 Gwal wrote:On September 21 2011 12:45 docvoc wrote:
Millenium is in a lose lose situation, if they say we were wrong they give up stephano after possibly coercing (i say this as a jab to what they have accused CoL of doing) him to stay and then accusing CoL of coercing stephano. Stephano is really good but he won't last, his play is incredible to watch but its foreign good, not korea good, he is not even close to sen or nestea right now. He could become this good if he joins a bigger team but right now his entire livelihood hangs in the balance, if this doesn't get settled soon he won't be big on the sponsorship list since this will follow him for a while. I hope CoL either sues the living shit out of Millenium, or Millenium somehow releases a statement showing that they aren't violating a presigned contract. If none of the above happen, i hope stephano somehow makes it out with his career intact, ToD did it, now its his turn. Millenium is pretty much dead and this would be the nail in the coffin it seems. - Mill didn't violate anything. - CoL can't sue Mill, if anyone can get sued, it's Stephano for breaking his contract with CoL everyone is guilty here.., that's what it makes so much drama: CoL acted unprofessionally making Stephano sign without letting him the time ton consult M or contacting M directly. Mill acted unprofessionally by convincing Stephano to change his mind after he signed a contract with another team. Stephano acted unprofessionally by taking the decision to sign, and then changing his mind and regarding the suing... you have no idea at what point the idea of suing seems ridiculous to most of the french here. good luck with getting an US contract getting applied to a french citizen in France. But appart from that, most reactions here are due to not understanding the cultural difference between US and France : Judicial system in US is accusatory : the defendant must prove is innocent. Well in France it's an Inquisitorial system, the defendent is assumed innocent, and the goal is to find the truth, based on the facts. THAT explain a lots of reactions here, from US and french ppl Uh sorry but i believe in the US it is innocent until proven guilty. Nice try tho. sorry I wasn't very clear. in US, I believe The prosecution gather evidences to make a case, the defense make a statement, and they battle over facts to finding who wins no ? I was just trying to explain that it isn't at all like that in France, the only goal is the truth.
I have no clue what you're trying to say, that US court's goal is not to find the truth? Fact finding is done regardless, we just do it differently, but with the same end result. So no, don't point to our legal system as our cultural difference, our cultural difference would be us taking our contracts much more seriously than France.
|
On September 21 2011 15:02 Gwal wrote:Show nested quote +On September 21 2011 14:52 Bandino wrote:On September 21 2011 14:46 Gwal wrote:On September 21 2011 12:45 docvoc wrote:
Millenium is in a lose lose situation, if they say we were wrong they give up stephano after possibly coercing (i say this as a jab to what they have accused CoL of doing) him to stay and then accusing CoL of coercing stephano. Stephano is really good but he won't last, his play is incredible to watch but its foreign good, not korea good, he is not even close to sen or nestea right now. He could become this good if he joins a bigger team but right now his entire livelihood hangs in the balance, if this doesn't get settled soon he won't be big on the sponsorship list since this will follow him for a while. I hope CoL either sues the living shit out of Millenium, or Millenium somehow releases a statement showing that they aren't violating a presigned contract. If none of the above happen, i hope stephano somehow makes it out with his career intact, ToD did it, now its his turn. Millenium is pretty much dead and this would be the nail in the coffin it seems. - Mill didn't violate anything. - CoL can't sue Mill, if anyone can get sued, it's Stephano for breaking his contract with CoL everyone is guilty here.., that's what it makes so much drama: CoL acted unprofessionally making Stephano sign without letting him the time ton consult M or contacting M directly. Mill acted unprofessionally by convincing Stephano to change his mind after he signed a contract with another team. Stephano acted unprofessionally by taking the decision to sign, and then changing his mind and regarding the suing... you have no idea at what point the idea of suing seems ridiculous to most of the french here. good luck with getting an US contract getting applied to a french citizen in France. But appart from that, most reactions here are due to not understanding the cultural difference between US and France : Judicial system in US is accusatory : the defendant must prove is innocent. Well in France it's an Inquisitorial system, the defendent is assumed innocent, and the goal is to find the truth, based on the facts. THAT explain a lots of reactions here, from US and french ppl Uh sorry but i believe in the US it is innocent until proven guilty. Nice try tho. sorry I wasn't very clear. in US, I believe The prosecution gather evidences to make a case, the defense make a statement, and they battle over facts to finding who wins no ? I was just trying to explain that it isn't at all like that in France, the only goal is the truth.
Almost right, they both gather evidence to find the truth of the matter. The US system looks to find the truth of the situation, not who ever gathers more facts wins its what the truth is is supposed to win
|
I think you don't understand what I am clumsily trying to say
in US, (again, correct me If I'm wrong!) I believe the defense can force prosecution to drop a case, by blaming the victim. It happens recently in the Trial of DSK.
that's what I mean by "not finding the truth".
|
On September 21 2011 15:08 ZestyPickle wrote:Show nested quote +On September 21 2011 15:02 Gwal wrote:On September 21 2011 14:52 Bandino wrote:On September 21 2011 14:46 Gwal wrote:On September 21 2011 12:45 docvoc wrote:
Millenium is in a lose lose situation, if they say we were wrong they give up stephano after possibly coercing (i say this as a jab to what they have accused CoL of doing) him to stay and then accusing CoL of coercing stephano. Stephano is really good but he won't last, his play is incredible to watch but its foreign good, not korea good, he is not even close to sen or nestea right now. He could become this good if he joins a bigger team but right now his entire livelihood hangs in the balance, if this doesn't get settled soon he won't be big on the sponsorship list since this will follow him for a while. I hope CoL either sues the living shit out of Millenium, or Millenium somehow releases a statement showing that they aren't violating a presigned contract. If none of the above happen, i hope stephano somehow makes it out with his career intact, ToD did it, now its his turn. Millenium is pretty much dead and this would be the nail in the coffin it seems. - Mill didn't violate anything. - CoL can't sue Mill, if anyone can get sued, it's Stephano for breaking his contract with CoL everyone is guilty here.., that's what it makes so much drama: CoL acted unprofessionally making Stephano sign without letting him the time ton consult M or contacting M directly. Mill acted unprofessionally by convincing Stephano to change his mind after he signed a contract with another team. Stephano acted unprofessionally by taking the decision to sign, and then changing his mind and regarding the suing... you have no idea at what point the idea of suing seems ridiculous to most of the french here. good luck with getting an US contract getting applied to a french citizen in France. But appart from that, most reactions here are due to not understanding the cultural difference between US and France : Judicial system in US is accusatory : the defendant must prove is innocent. Well in France it's an Inquisitorial system, the defendent is assumed innocent, and the goal is to find the truth, based on the facts. THAT explain a lots of reactions here, from US and french ppl Uh sorry but i believe in the US it is innocent until proven guilty. Nice try tho. sorry I wasn't very clear. in US, I believe The prosecution gather evidences to make a case, the defense make a statement, and they battle over facts to finding who wins no ? I was just trying to explain that it isn't at all like that in France, the only goal is the truth. I have no clue what you're trying to say, that US court's goal is not to find the truth? Fact finding is done regardless, we just do it differently, but with the same end result. So no, don't point to our legal system as our cultural difference, our cultural difference would be us taking our contracts much more seriously than France.
Do you actually have any reason to state that contracts are taken more seriously in US than in France ? If you base it on this mess, then that is hardly any argument since people in this thread know basically nothing about the situation in question and never saw the contract.
|
|
|
On September 21 2011 15:21 Gwal wrote:I think you don't understand what I am clumsily trying to say in US, (again, correct me If I'm wrong!) I believe the defense can force prosecution to drop a case, by blaming the victim. It happens recently in the Trial of DSK. that's what I mean by "not finding the truth".
OHHHH you just dont have all the facts then, little misunderstanding.
The defense can blame the victim, its true, its a tactic to discredit their story but it really only works when the victim is lying.
In the case of DSK that women was lying and was never even touched by him, the defense found HUGE holes in her story and then attacked those holes (i guess you would call this blaming the victim? ) all the defense did was point out that she lied and if she lied once she can lie again.
Back on point sure the defense might "blame the victim" but most of the time the defense is just pointing out holes in the persons story
Edit: were kind of getting off point i think, to comment on the OP it seems MIL just added nothing to the conversation besides saying, dont worry we are okay we didnt do anything wrong but dont ask for details
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
