EPTMoletrap's casting for gom 'long term' - Page 30
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Facedriller
Sweden275 Posts
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Nibbler89
884 Posts
On August 10 2011 22:25 Bayyne wrote: So question for you people criticizing his commentating: Do you watch sc2 games for the caster/commentator? Because based on the non-stop criticism of him (and of other casters in the past), it seems like most people prioritize quality of casters OVER quality of games/players. And if that is the case, I honestly feel bad for you people. Edit: numerous posts saying "I won't watch GSL anymore if he's casting" tells me exactly where some people's priorities are. Um under your logic why are there any casters at all? some casters add to the quality of watching sc2 some detract from it. It sucks watching a good game between good players and being intermittently distracted by some inaccurate drivel. Yes you can mute but you shouldn't have to watch a game without sound just to be able to enjoy the play. Yes, I first and foremost watch sc2 for the quality of the games / players so when someone distracts from the viewing experience and makes it worse(for reasons I explained in previous post) I want them to improve so they stop doing that. I still watch the games and it's not like nails on chalkboard bad but every time I hear a bs analysis I think "why is he even saying that". (You'll probably say if you truly watch for the players/ quality of game it won't matter but that's not really a valid point, as I said before then you might as well just get rid of all the casters to make it a non issue then we won't have people that "Watch sc2 games for the caster / commentator") | ||
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karpo
Sweden1998 Posts
On August 10 2011 22:41 quiet noise wrote: Remember though, there will always be people who lack what we call critical thinking and the ability to recognize problems. Anything that includes a man talking about starcraft 2 is good enough for them. What is seriously fucked up is that modern corporate and business culture rewards this so called un-critical "Yes man" attitude. There's a difference between being a good community member providing constructive criticism and just being a a-hole complaining about shit. Also the whole "us versus them" shtick is retarded as you know nothing about the ones you claim "lack critical thinking". I see some problems in his cast but overall he's decent, if he sticks around for another month without improving it's a problem. | ||
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quiet noise
599 Posts
On August 10 2011 22:53 karpo wrote: There's a difference between being a good community member providing constructive criticism and just being a a-hole complaining about shit. Also the whole "us versus them" shtick is retarded as you know nothing about the ones you claim "lack critical thinking". I see some problems in his cast but overall he's decent, if he sticks around for another month without improving it's a problem. I never said that you or anyone else in partuclar around here lack critical thinking. I just said some people, in general, do. Just because you dont think moletrap is a big problem to gom.tv doesnt mean you lack it, i know that. | ||
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NASAmoose
United States231 Posts
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hooktits
United States972 Posts
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karpo
Sweden1998 Posts
On August 10 2011 22:59 quiet noise wrote: I never said that you or anyone else in partuclar around here lack critical thinking. I just said some people, in general, do. Just because you dont think moletrap is a big problem to gom.tv doesnt mean you do, i know that. I didn't take offence. I think that your whole reasoning is stupid. I'm pretty sure there's more idiots who just bandwagon on the latest hatetrain than there are your "yes men" people. | ||
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quiet noise
599 Posts
On August 10 2011 23:00 NASAmoose wrote: I wish I could pinpoint what it is about him that I don't like, but I agree he's just not a caster I enjoy. Seems like a nice guy though, maybe it's his voice? I watched a ton of Code A last night and just found myself much more interested in what Wolf had to say. For me its the fact that he just loves to hear the sound of his own voice, and most of the time he is either painfully obvious and shallow in his analasys, other times or he is flat out wrong and un-informed. Today he showed that he doesnt know how much a void ray costs, and that he didnt know that protoss players liked to expand behind a DT rush. | ||
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quiet noise
599 Posts
On August 10 2011 23:06 karpo wrote: I didn't take offence. I think that your whole reasoning is stupid. I'm pretty sure there's more idiots who just bandwagon on the latest hatetrain than there are your "yes men" people. Well those people that you describe are essentially yes-men too since they, as you described it, "bandwagon" on the latest hatetrain wich sort of implies that they too lack critical thinking and a real opinion of their own. Either way, this discussion is pretty stupid, but If you think the term "Yes-man" comes from me you should read some social science. Its something widely regarded by scholars and scientists as one of the biggest problems in modern societies. again this discussion is pretty off-topic, if you want to continue i suggest you to send me a PM. | ||
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Bayyne
United States1967 Posts
On August 10 2011 22:41 quiet noise wrote: Remember though, there will always be people who lack what we call critical thinking and the ability to recognize problems. Anything that includes a man talking about starcraft 2 is good enough for them. What is seriously fucked up is that modern corporate and business culture rewards this so called un-critical "Yes man" attitude. I don't even know where to begin with this comment other than don't make dumb generalizations about people and lump it in with with the word "we" in an attempt to make it seem like a winning comment. I, personally, watch SC2 games because of the games. Yes, commentators add and sometimes subtract from the quality. But if the game being casted is the likes of scFou v. Nestea, or Puma v. oGsMC, does it really fucking matter if one of the casters annoys you? Maybe you missed my point, but I was referring to the priorities people have here, which in my opinion are backwards. Will you refuse to watch the Superbowl because Dennis Miller is co-casting alongside Al Michaels? Refuse to watch the WorldCup finals because "insert annoying celebrity" is co-casting with a good caster? When I see people saying "I won't watch the GSL when moletrap is casting", I see backwards priorities. | ||
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Bayyne
United States1967 Posts
On August 10 2011 22:50 Nibbler89 wrote: Um under your logic why are there any casters at all? some casters add to the quality of watching sc2 some detract from it. It sucks watching a good game between good players and being intermittently distracted by some inaccurate drivel. Yes you can mute but you shouldn't have to watch a game without sound just to be able to enjoy the play. Yes, I first and foremost watch sc2 for the quality of the games / players so when someone distracts from the viewing experience and makes it worse(for reasons I explained in previous post) I want them to improve so they stop doing that. I still watch the games and it's not like nails on chalkboard bad but every time I hear a bs analysis I think "why is he even saying that". (You'll probably say if you truly watch for the players/ quality of game it won't matter but that's not really a valid point, as I said before then you might as well just get rid of all the casters to make it a non issue then we won't have people that "Watch sc2 games for the caster / commentator") Casters add entertainment value, education for people who don't know what's going, etc, etc, etc.. But to me, the games themselves give me enough entertainment value. I just find it odd when people actually threaten to stop watching the GSL because of a caster. | ||
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zeenix1
Sweden89 Posts
For me its the fact that he just loves to hear the sound of his own voice, and most of the time he is either painfully obvious and shallow in his analasys, other times or he is flat out wrong and un-informed. This. When he made his re-appearance in NASL Playoff-bracket with Diggity it was the nail in the coffin for me, he's not a good SC2-caster. I dont see how someone who has been casting so many games can be so ignorant to players actions, and it truly infuriates me when he criticises something just because he didnt understand what or why it happened.. and he does that ALL.. THE.. TIME! | ||
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Bluerain
United States348 Posts
On August 08 2011 06:33 MagickMan wrote: He is the worst one they have had... User was warned for this post id take kelly's horrible accent (which was bad but amusing) over this guys grating voice, bad news indeed =( | ||
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Nibbler89
884 Posts
On August 10 2011 23:33 Bayyne wrote: Casters add entertainment value, education for people who don't know what's going, etc, etc, etc.. But to me, the games themselves give me enough entertainment value. I just find it odd when people actually threaten to stop watching the GSL because of a caster. That's what they are supposed to do. It doesn't even have to be both either. While I personally don't really like DJ wheat that much I can still recognize him as a quality hype caster because he doesn't try to over analyze what he doesn't know, he does what he's good at to increase the entertainment value of the cast and for the most part that's play by play. The reason I find Moletrap frequently annoying is for the same reason I'd feel annoyed if I saw someone commentating professional hold em poker and saying that a player shouldn't play suited 89 spades because the last 3 flops have been all diamond/ hearts and high cards. It's not just a lack of knowledge it's misleading the viewers that don't know any better. Your logic is very weird you seem to think as long as its great players it doesn't matter how bad the casting is and anyone who disagrees clearly values casting over the game itself or has their priorities wrong. What if they introduced a new caster "leafblower" just a leaf blower they put next to a mic and turned on, would you still say to anyone who complains " get your priorities straight and watch the game"? Because to some people(not myself I'm not that extreme) moletrap is like a leaf blower. I wouldn't stop watching GSL or code a but I could see how some people might find it annoying enough to stop paying for vods or not watching code A all together. | ||
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quiet noise
599 Posts
On August 10 2011 23:30 Bayyne wrote: I don't even know where to begin with this comment other than don't make dumb generalizations about people and lump it in with with the word "we" in an attempt to make it seem like a winning comment. I, personally, watch SC2 games because of the games. Yes, commentators add and sometimes subtract from the quality. But if the game being casted is the likes of scFou v. Nestea, or Puma v. oGsMC, does it really fucking matter if one of the casters annoys you? Maybe you missed my point, but I was referring to the priorities people have here, which in my opinion are backwards. Will you refuse to watch the Superbowl because Dennis Miller is co-casting alongside Al Michaels? Refuse to watch the WorldCup finals because "insert annoying celebrity" is co-casting with a good caster? When I see people saying "I won't watch the GSL when moletrap is casting", I see backwards priorities. 1. Can you please explain to me who i made this dumb generalization about? i never said that you, someone who likes moletrap or people who dont care much about casters LACK CRITICAL THINKING. i was just pointing out that this group exists too. Mostly because i find critical thinking to be an interesting subject (but i dont expect to find the people who lack it on a internet forum, they probably wont care enought to bother visiting one). so you can calm down. i was not making a dumb generalization about anyone, other than pointing out that some people lack critical thinking. not you, nor anyone in this thread. Second, i really dont get what you are trying to say here. i dont see a reason to make priority lists and compare the different aspects with each others. I too think good games is the core of a good starcraft 2 tournament. But i also think a bad caster can ruin it by forcing me to mute the sound (watching a stream with no commentator is pretty lame) I dont see whats soo controversial about not wanting to watch a stream where you have to mute the casters because they annoy you so much. Dont you think being able to watch a stream without muted sound should be a pretty damn high priority? I would even go as far as to say i would rather watch a "mediocre game" casted by tasteosis than a "good" game casted by moletrap/diggity. A good Caster can make any game interesting and fun to watch. If i watch a game casted by artosis, it can be hella informative just because Artosis can dissect the builds and explain in detail why it is good and how the opponent needs to react while moletrap is more likely to say something like "ok player x is going for this build wich i think is bad because last time we saw it it got roflstomped". It makes zero entertainment and education value. | ||
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eburnsdaniel
United Kingdom69 Posts
I dont particularly care about voice tonality or accent, but a lack of understanding of the dynamics of the game and inane rambling and shouting at seemingly trivial moments does distract from the broadcast. I would much prefer calm and critical casting, without the sense that there is need to fill every silence with drivel. If gomtv made one requirement for casting the premier starcraft tournament, it should be that casters are masters level on one of the servers, I would then be happy. I have no idea what level Doa or Moletrap play the game, but it is apparent that they both lack understanding which detracts from their casting. Moletrap is worse than Doa because he dominates the cast and seems to lack restraint. Rather than having Wolf riff off him, he talks nonstop with Wolf occasionally trying to get something, usually important, out. Im not saying that to be a good caster you need to play the game at the highest level, only that goms casting choices would have been much better if they used that requirement as a rule of thumb. I accept someone could have a disability which prevented them from playing the game at the highest level, but they loved starcraft, studied it intensively and had great understanding and great casting chops. The high level requirement heuristic would eliminate the main objection many of us have about the quality of casters. | ||
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flyingbangus
United States121 Posts
.....and this is coming from a guy that finds Husky casts entertaining. Hell, I'd take Kelly and her "bwu fweym race cars". | ||
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XRaDiiX
Canada1730 Posts
It is Easy to See more than 80% of the people are in distaste and dislike of MoleTrap especially his casting His Voice is annoying to listen to. He Constantly interrupts the Other Casters. He is just plain annoying. Honestly The Real Truth is Mole Trap is Hurting(Killing) E-Sports. All Mole Trap has done is help GomTV Lose Viewers all over the Gom and TL Forums the majority of the people cannot stand Mole Trap. He just isn't a good caster. The Truth is Every other Caster GomTV has had was at-least bearable to listen to But MoleTrap ruins my and Many others viewing experiences of the matches and makes it un-enjoyable . This is 100% the Truth. After watching the Foreigners Last night i could barely watch the matches over the squealing voice of Mole Trap and his constant interruption of Poor Wolf. And his sneering of Wolfs Jokes. MoleTrap needs to have a different position at GOMTv other than being the Caster because that is honestly not what he should be doing when the majority of the people do not want him there casting. Either that or Please do not let him keep his position casting at GomTV I feel gomTV has made a grave serious and horrible decision in deciding to even entertain the idea of bringing mole trap back. Its the Biggest /FacePalm Ever I'd rather listen to Kelly casting again rather than MoleTrap. And i'M Serious Tastosis> Wolf > Jason Lee> Torch> QXC> DOA> Kelly> Mole Trap. User was warned for this post | ||
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ElvisWayCool
United States437 Posts
On August 11 2011 06:05 XRaDiiX wrote: After Deliberating about Moletrap reading Various Forums about Mole Trap It is Easy to See more than 80% of the people are in distaste and dislike of MoleTrap especially his casting His Voice is annoying to listen to. He Constantly interrupts the Other Casters. He is just plain annoying. Honestly The Real Truth is Mole Trap is Hurting(Killing) E-Sports. All Mole Trap has done is help GomTV Lose Viewers all over the Gom and TL Forums the majority of the people cannot stand Mole Trap. He just isn't a good caster. The Truth is Every other Caster GomTV has had was at-least bearable to listen to But MoleTrap ruins my and Many others viewing experiences of the matches and makes it un-enjoyable This is 100% the Truth. After watching the Foreigners Last night i could barely watch the matches over the squealing voice of Mole Trap and his constant interruption of Poor Wolf. And his sneering of Wolfs Jokes. MoleTrap needs to have a different position at GOMTv other than being the Caster because that is honestly not what he should be doing when the majority of the people do not want him there casting. Either that or Please do not let him keep his position casting at GomTV I feel gomTV has made a grave serious and horrible decision in deciding to even entertain the idea of bringing mole trap back. Its the Biggest /FacePalm Ever I'd rather listen to Kelly casting again rather than MoleTrap. And i'M Serious Tastosis> Wolf > Jason Lee> Torch> QXC> DOA> Kelly> Mole Trap. It's obvious your 80% is 100% bullshit. Mole Trap has been around for a long time, he deserves this. He used to cast in his house living off donations people would send in because he couldn't afford food but he still wanted to bring english casts of SC:BW to people who enjoyed the game. If anything, he helped grow eSports. Your 100% truth is also bullshit, because that's your opinion, so of course it's the truth. It just doesn't mean anything because it's what you think, and that doesn't really mean anything. I see him as one of the best casters. | ||
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karpo
Sweden1998 Posts
On August 11 2011 06:05 XRaDiiX wrote: After Deliberating about Moletrap reading Various Forums about Mole Trap It is Easy to See more than 80% of the people are in distaste and dislike of MoleTrap especially his casting His Voice is annoying to listen to. He Constantly interrupts the Other Casters. He is just plain annoying. Honestly The Real Truth is Mole Trap is Hurting(Killing) E-Sports. All Mole Trap has done is help GomTV Lose Viewers all over the Gom and TL Forums the majority of the people cannot stand Mole Trap. He just isn't a good caster. The Truth is Every other Caster GomTV has had was at-least bearable to listen to But MoleTrap ruins my and Many others viewing experiences of the matches and makes it un-enjoyable . This is 100% the Truth. After watching the Foreigners Last night i could barely watch the matches over the squealing voice of Mole Trap and his constant interruption of Poor Wolf. And his sneering of Wolfs Jokes. MoleTrap needs to have a different position at GOMTv other than being the Caster because that is honestly not what he should be doing when the majority of the people do not want him there casting. Either that or Please do not let him keep his position casting at GomTV I feel gomTV has made a grave serious and horrible decision in deciding to even entertain the idea of bringing mole trap back. Its the Biggest /FacePalm Ever I'd rather listen to Kelly casting again rather than MoleTrap. And i'M Serious Tastosis> Wolf > Jason Lee> Torch> QXC> DOA> Kelly> Mole Trap. This must be a troll post. No one can write this bad and use such horrible arguments. | ||
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