• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 10:47
CEST 16:47
KST 23:47
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Power Rank - Esports World Cup 202569RSL Season 1 - Final Week9[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall15HomeStory Cup 27 - Info & Preview18Classic wins Code S Season 2 (2025)16
Community News
Google Play ASL (Season 20) Announced9BSL Team Wars - Bonyth, Dewalt, Hawk & Sziky teams10Weekly Cups (July 14-20): Final Check-up0Esports World Cup 2025 - Brackets Revealed19Weekly Cups (July 7-13): Classic continues to roll8
StarCraft 2
General
What tournaments are world championships? #1: Maru - Greatest Players of All Time Power Rank - Esports World Cup 2025 Server Blocker The GOAT ranking of GOAT rankings
Tourneys
Esports World Cup 2025 WardiTV Mondays FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $8000 live event Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2)
Strategy
How did i lose this ZvP, whats the proper response
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation #239 Bad Weather Mutation # 483 Kill Bot Wars Mutation # 482 Wheel of Misfortune Mutation # 481 Fear and Lava
Brood War
General
Google Play ASL (Season 20) Announced Simple editing of Brood War save files? (.mlx) BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Ginuda's JaeDong Interview Series [Update] ShieldBattery: 2025 Redesign
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL20] Non-Korean Championship 4x BSL + 4x China CSL Xiamen International Invitational [CSLPRO] It's CSLAN Season! - Last Chance
Strategy
[G] Mineral Boosting Does 1 second matter in StarCraft? Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Total Annihilation Server - TAForever Nintendo Switch Thread [MMORPG] Tree of Savior (Successor of Ragnarok) Path of Exile
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Stop Killing Games - European Citizens Initiative Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Post Pic of your Favorite Food!
Fan Clubs
INnoVation Fan Club SKT1 Classic Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[\m/] Heavy Metal Thread Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Korean Music Discussion
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion 2024 - 2025 Football Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Installation of Windows 10 suck at "just a moment" Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
TeamLiquid Team Shirt On Sale The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Ping To Win? Pings And Their…
TrAiDoS
momentary artworks from des…
tankgirl
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Socialism Anyone?
GreenHorizons
Eight Anniversary as a TL…
Mizenhauer
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 616 users

'TSL expelled from SC2 Conference' - Page 48

Forum Index > SC2 General
1124 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 46 47 48 49 50 57 Next
OPL3SA2
Profile Joined April 2011
United States378 Posts
August 05 2011 01:39 GMT
#941
On August 05 2011 10:29 AzTec wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 05 2011 10:07 spybreak wrote:
Did you even read the updated OP?


Yeap and I still feel this way.

Show nested quote +
On August 05 2011 10:13 Corrosive wrote:
yeah

poor guy, holding money from players that are supposed to be payed and then lying about it


So says one side, the side that happens to hold all the cards.

The ST manager is obviously going to back FD&T and he's the head of the organization holding this hearing to boot, how is that at all fair for TSL? Everything is stacked against Coach Lee in this hearing.

The original article outlines it clear as day, BOTH sides are at fault and yet 100% of the blame in this thread is being placed on Coach Lee. I never said he was a saint I said I sympathize with him because it seems like all he gets is hate when he's dealing with the very difficult situation of never seeming to have his players behind him.


He was in a room surrounded by people who support esports - a jury of his own peers. He was found guilty. Can you honestly tell me how many times in the history of mankind that a small tribunal of people in a miniscule community have condemned the actions of someone they actually love - only to be completely wrong about all of their conclusions? + Show Spoiler +
zero
Playoffs? You're talking about playoffs?
ReboundEU
Profile Joined September 2010
508 Posts
August 05 2011 01:40 GMT
#942
I guess the real face of TSL becomes visible, peace by peace.
U MAD BRO?
ETisME
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
12387 Posts
August 05 2011 01:47 GMT
#943
On August 05 2011 10:29 AzTec wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 05 2011 10:07 spybreak wrote:
Did you even read the updated OP?


Yeap and I still feel this way.

Show nested quote +
On August 05 2011 10:13 Corrosive wrote:
yeah

poor guy, holding money from players that are supposed to be payed and then lying about it


So says one side, the side that happens to hold all the cards.

The ST manager is obviously going to back FD&T and he's the head of the organization holding this hearing to boot, how is that at all fair for TSL? Everything is stacked against Coach Lee in this hearing.

The original article outlines it clear as day, BOTH sides are at fault and yet 100% of the blame in this thread is being placed on Coach Lee. I never said he was a saint I said I sympathize with him because it seems like all he gets is hate when he's dealing with the very difficult situation of never seeming to have his players behind him.

How is it fair?
The very difficult situation is caused mainly by him. Puma situation is complicated, the player wanted to leave as well as he himself enjoying the foreign scene and able to win more tournaments, EG offering him a chance for that. (even if Puma had a contract, he could leave after it is finished if he so desires and if EG still want to get him recruited.)

The coache certainly didn't do the right thing on "motivating" the players to "work harder" by doing acts like holding the wage and lying etc. How it is fair for the players?
其疾如风,其徐如林,侵掠如火,不动如山,难知如阴,动如雷震。
Jehct
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
New Zealand9115 Posts
August 05 2011 02:01 GMT
#944
It seems like Coach Lee should stick to coaching and another manager should be appointed. This is another case of unprofessionalism having serious consequences for the team (and it sucks, the team is full of talent). Regardless of personal feelings for the guy and whether what he did was unethical/wrong or justified, it wasn't legal. Lee continually puts personal actions/reactions before sponsor and player interests (and law); it isn't good practice. All the recent trouble with TSL shows the kind of impact that it can have on a team. Hope TSL sorts this stuff out.
"You seem to think about this game a lot"
neoghaleon55
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7435 Posts
August 05 2011 02:02 GMT
#945
That message from Startales manager made Coach lee look like a scammer or an extortionist.
Where did all the money go?!
moo...for DRG
metbull
Profile Joined April 2011
United States404 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-05 02:03:18
August 05 2011 02:02 GMT
#946
and people wonder why EG "Sniped" a player from TSL.......... um because the players weren't getting paid..... DUH!!
one other thing to note. minor as it may be. SlayerS is not listed as being in the SC2 Conference. nor Startale
"SC2Con members - Manager of oGs Park Sang Ik (TheWinD), Manager of Prime Park Wea Shik (Gerrard), Manager of MVP Choi Yoon Sang, Manager of NSHoseo Park Yung Sik, Manager of FXOKorea Lee Hyung Seop (Choya), Manager of ZeNEX Yoon Hee Won, Manager of IM Kang Dong Hoon and the President of SC2 Players Association Park Gyung Lak (Junwi)."
Baarn
Profile Joined April 2010
United States2702 Posts
August 05 2011 02:03 GMT
#947
On August 05 2011 10:29 AzTec wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 05 2011 10:07 spybreak wrote:
Did you even read the updated OP?


Yeap and I still feel this way.

Show nested quote +
On August 05 2011 10:13 Corrosive wrote:
yeah

poor guy, holding money from players that are supposed to be payed and then lying about it


So says one side, the side that happens to hold all the cards.

The ST manager is obviously going to back FD&T and he's the head of the organization holding this hearing to boot, how is that at all fair for TSL? Everything is stacked against Coach Lee in this hearing.

The original article outlines it clear as day, BOTH sides are at fault and yet 100% of the blame in this thread is being placed on Coach Lee. I never said he was a saint I said I sympathize with him because it seems like all he gets is hate when he's dealing with the very difficult situation of never seeming to have his players behind him.


He wouldn't be hated if he was more responsible. His players wouldn't bail if he did a better job running the team. TSL management did this to themselves.
There's no S in KT. :P
Ziggitz
Profile Joined September 2010
United States340 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-05 02:10:40
August 05 2011 02:04 GMT
#948
On August 05 2011 10:27 windsupernova wrote:
I still dont get why people are bringing up EG right now. This has nothing to do with them


Because Coach Lee ran to the press and spread lies whilst playing the victim. Many people brushed it off as him not having all the facts and taking his word for it. This new information is very much relevant because it shines a light on his real character and paints those events in a different context.

EDIT Although it should be really fucking obvious by now, let's not get the pitchforks out just yet. Let's wait a few days and see if any new information pops up, we don't need yet another unwarranted TL.net shitstorm.
TheAmazombie
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States3714 Posts
August 05 2011 02:07 GMT
#949
Wow, it seems that if what StarTale and FD are saying, Coach Lee is looking even worse after all this.
We think too much and feel too little. More than machinery, we need humanity. More than cleverness, we need kindness and gentleness. Without these qualities, life will be violent and all will be lost. -Charlie Chaplin
windsupernova
Profile Joined October 2010
Mexico5280 Posts
August 05 2011 02:11 GMT
#950
On August 05 2011 11:04 Ziggitz wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 05 2011 10:27 windsupernova wrote:
I still dont get why people are bringing up EG right now. This has nothing to do with them


Because Coach Lee ran to the press and spread lies whilst playing the victim. Many people brushed it off as him not having all the facts and taking his word for it. This new information is very much relevant because it shines a light on his real character and paints those events in a different context.

EDIT Although it should be really fucking obvious by now, let's not get the pitchforks out just yet. Let's wait a few days and see if any new information pops up, we don't need yet another unwarranted TL.net shitstorm.


What lies did he spread regarding the EG incident?
"Its easy, just trust your CPU".-Boxer on being good at games
Zarahtra
Profile Joined May 2010
Iceland4053 Posts
August 05 2011 02:12 GMT
#951
On August 05 2011 11:04 Ziggitz wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 05 2011 10:27 windsupernova wrote:
I still dont get why people are bringing up EG right now. This has nothing to do with them


Because Coach Lee ran to the press and spread lies whilst playing the victim. Many people brushed it off as him not having all the facts and taking his word for it. This new information is very much relevant because it shines a light on his real character and paints those events in a different context.

It's not really relevant at all. All the same issues hold true in the EG case. This only shines light on why Puma might've wanted to leave, but EG were still poaching Puma.

There doesn't always need to be 1 good guy and 1 bad guy, Coach Lee being a jerk(I don't really feel he is for holding the wages, but because he lied about the sponsors) doesn't automatically make EG better.
Zinthar
Profile Joined March 2011
United States394 Posts
August 05 2011 02:21 GMT
#952
On August 05 2011 10:36 OPL3SA2 wrote:
As soon as I deciphered the TSL Puma scenario, I had already figured out that Mr. Lee was a bad person who wanted to make sure that Puma's arrival in the states was not well recieved by foreign fans. he did this by running to the press with lies surrounding puma's departure.

This is just more of the same. Much of this just happened to occur before the Puma incident, we are just learning about the specifics now. To the people who feel bad for Mr. Lee - are you really that naive?


I couldn't agree more. Mr. Lee's behavior from the start has seemed, at best, uncouth. I can't say I'm surprised in the slightest that he's essentially been stealing from his own players.

I don't see TSL lasting much longer.
babylon
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
8765 Posts
August 05 2011 02:22 GMT
#953
On August 05 2011 11:02 metbull wrote:
and people wonder why EG "Sniped" a player from TSL.......... um because the players weren't getting paid..... DUH!!
one other thing to note. minor as it may be. SlayerS is not listed as being in the SC2 Conference. nor Startale
"SC2Con members - Manager of oGs Park Sang Ik (TheWinD), Manager of Prime Park Wea Shik (Gerrard), Manager of MVP Choi Yoon Sang, Manager of NSHoseo Park Yung Sik, Manager of FXOKorea Lee Hyung Seop (Choya), Manager of ZeNEX Yoon Hee Won, Manager of IM Kang Dong Hoon and the President of SC2 Players Association Park Gyung Lak (Junwi)."

The president of this association is StarTale's manager.

Teams not part of the association include WMF, SlayerS, and now TSL. WMF is probably not part of it because it is a KeSPA-sanctioned team, and it would be incredibly awkward for it to be a part of a rival organization, so to speak. Additionally, WMF doesn't really have a "real" SC2 team; all the SC2 players are actually contracted to play WC3 and pretty much dabble in SC2 in their downtime when there aren't WC3 tournaments around for them. (As an aside, yes, Moon still plays WC3. Rumors have been floating around about him playing SC2 full-time now, but that is definitely not true. He's contracted to play WC3 for WMF until sometime next year.)

No idea why SlayerS isn't in it, to be honest, though I've heard tell that they're considered "partners" of the association, whatever that means. Don't know if that's accurate though, so definitely don't quote me on that.
DarkRise
Profile Joined November 2010
1644 Posts
August 05 2011 02:24 GMT
#954
On August 05 2011 11:12 Zarahtra wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 05 2011 11:04 Ziggitz wrote:
On August 05 2011 10:27 windsupernova wrote:
I still dont get why people are bringing up EG right now. This has nothing to do with them


Because Coach Lee ran to the press and spread lies whilst playing the victim. Many people brushed it off as him not having all the facts and taking his word for it. This new information is very much relevant because it shines a light on his real character and paints those events in a different context.

It's not really relevant at all. All the same issues hold true in the EG case. This only shines light on why Puma might've wanted to leave, but EG were still poaching Puma.

There doesn't always need to be 1 good guy and 1 bad guy, Coach Lee being a jerk(I don't really feel he is for holding the wages, but because he lied about the sponsors) doesn't automatically make EG better.


Did you even read EG's comment about it?
I also think Lee also made a huge deal about Puma leaving and played the "victim". Exaggerated things on the press and made Puma/EG the villain. I'm sad for Puma for all the smashed talked he got from the community without even knowing the true side behind it.
Also how can you consider that a coach? Visiting the team house 2-3 times per MONTH?
Bear4188
Profile Joined March 2010
United States1797 Posts
August 05 2011 02:32 GMT
#955
On August 05 2011 11:22 babylon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 05 2011 11:02 metbull wrote:
and people wonder why EG "Sniped" a player from TSL.......... um because the players weren't getting paid..... DUH!!
one other thing to note. minor as it may be. SlayerS is not listed as being in the SC2 Conference. nor Startale
"SC2Con members - Manager of oGs Park Sang Ik (TheWinD), Manager of Prime Park Wea Shik (Gerrard), Manager of MVP Choi Yoon Sang, Manager of NSHoseo Park Yung Sik, Manager of FXOKorea Lee Hyung Seop (Choya), Manager of ZeNEX Yoon Hee Won, Manager of IM Kang Dong Hoon and the President of SC2 Players Association Park Gyung Lak (Junwi)."

The president of this association is StarTale's manager.

Teams not part of the association include WMF, SlayerS, and now TSL. WMF is probably not part of it because it is a KeSPA-sanctioned team, and it would be incredibly awkward for it to be a part of a rival organization, so to speak. Additionally, WMF doesn't really have a "real" SC2 team; all the SC2 players are actually contracted to play WC3 and pretty much dabble in SC2 in their downtime when there aren't WC3 tournaments around for them. (As an aside, yes, Moon still plays WC3. Rumors have been floating around about him playing SC2 full-time now, but that is definitely not true. He's contracted to play WC3 for WMF until sometime next year.)

No idea why SlayerS isn't in it, to be honest, though I've heard tell that they're considered "partners" of the association, whatever that means. Don't know if that's accurate though, so definitely don't quote me on that.


From what I remember SlayerS was formed after the association was already put into place, and would not be eligible for entry until a year passed or some silly thing like that.
"I learned very early the difference between knowing the name of something and knowing something." - R. Feynman
Zarahtra
Profile Joined May 2010
Iceland4053 Posts
August 05 2011 02:35 GMT
#956
On August 05 2011 11:24 DarkRise wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 05 2011 11:12 Zarahtra wrote:
On August 05 2011 11:04 Ziggitz wrote:
On August 05 2011 10:27 windsupernova wrote:
I still dont get why people are bringing up EG right now. This has nothing to do with them


Because Coach Lee ran to the press and spread lies whilst playing the victim. Many people brushed it off as him not having all the facts and taking his word for it. This new information is very much relevant because it shines a light on his real character and paints those events in a different context.

It's not really relevant at all. All the same issues hold true in the EG case. This only shines light on why Puma might've wanted to leave, but EG were still poaching Puma.

There doesn't always need to be 1 good guy and 1 bad guy, Coach Lee being a jerk(I don't really feel he is for holding the wages, but because he lied about the sponsors) doesn't automatically make EG better.


Did you even read EG's comment about it?
I also think Lee also made a huge deal about Puma leaving and played the "victim". Exaggerated things on the press and made Puma/EG the villain. I'm sad for Puma for all the smashed talked he got from the community without even knowing the true side behind it.
Also how can you consider that a coach? Visiting the team house 2-3 times per MONTH?

Ofcourse I've read their comments about it. It's interesting how that's the first thing people question when people disagree with them.

Maybe Lee did play the victim, but now that the dust has settled, I still feel EG was in the wrong poaching Puma like they did. If Puma wanted to leave, he should start talks with a team, else EG should go through the coach/other team management.

On the definition of coach, I feel is also pretty irrelevant. It just says he's a pretty terrible coach, which I'm not arguing against.

Like I said, I feel this is quite irrelevant. Him being a jerk, doesn't automatically change how things went down in the EG situation.
Xolo
Profile Joined December 2010
Canada107 Posts
August 05 2011 02:41 GMT
#957
I've never heard of the "SC2 Conference" before this. Perhaps I am too out of touch.
Primadog
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States4411 Posts
August 05 2011 02:42 GMT
#958
It's a sister organization with the player union. It doesn't really do much in comparison to we're used to in BW.
Thank God and gunrun.
Slago
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada726 Posts
August 05 2011 02:42 GMT
#959
all i can say is............ wow
I came here to kick ass and chew bubble gum and I'm all out of... ah forget it
jax1492
Profile Joined November 2009
United States1632 Posts
August 05 2011 02:46 GMT
#960
nothing is going well for Lee ... i almost feel bad for him
Prev 1 46 47 48 49 50 57 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
14:00
Bracket Day 1
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Hui .451
BRAT_OK 97
ProTech66
MindelVK 28
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 56968
Bisu 3350
Horang2 3056
Shuttle 2197
Flash 1963
Jaedong 1555
Barracks 1326
EffOrt 1137
BeSt 894
firebathero 450
[ Show more ]
Larva 367
Nal_rA 342
Soulkey 170
GuemChi 160
Soma 153
Rush 121
sorry 95
Hyun 75
Light 70
Last 68
Sea.KH 58
Dewaltoss 51
Shinee 47
JYJ42
sas.Sziky 41
Aegong 25
zelot 18
scan(afreeca) 18
sSak 17
Terrorterran 14
IntoTheRainbow 11
Stormgate
BeoMulf131
Dota 2
Gorgc6161
qojqva2768
XaKoH 472
XcaliburYe400
420jenkins335
LuMiX1
Counter-Strike
fl0m2893
sgares326
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor324
Other Games
singsing1976
B2W.Neo1698
Beastyqt881
Fuzer 245
kaitlyn76
KnowMe69
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH377
• Adnapsc2 22
• Dystopia_ 4
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 2728
League of Legends
• Nemesis2116
Upcoming Events
CSO Cup
1h 13m
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
3h 13m
Bonyth vs Sziky
Dewalt vs Hawk
Hawk vs QiaoGege
Sziky vs Dewalt
Mihu vs Bonyth
Zhanhun vs QiaoGege
QiaoGege vs Fengzi
FEL
18h 13m
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
23h 13m
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
1d 3h
Bonyth vs Zhanhun
Dewalt vs Mihu
Hawk vs Sziky
Sziky vs QiaoGege
Mihu vs Hawk
Zhanhun vs Dewalt
Fengzi vs Bonyth
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
Online Event
3 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
4 days
The PondCast
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
[ Show More ]
Korean StarCraft League
6 days
CranKy Ducklings
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL Xiamen Invitational
Esports World Cup 2025
Murky Cup #2

Ongoing

Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
BSL20 Non-Korean Championship
BSL Team Wars
CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CC Div. A S7
Underdog Cup #2
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25

Upcoming

ASL Season 20: Qualifier #1
ASL Season 20: Qualifier #2
ASL Season 20
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
BSL Season 21
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
SEL Season 2 Championship
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
FEL Cracov 2025
HCC Europe
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.