EPTOn July 22 2011 07:16 nalgene wrote:
I meant more like esports as a whole and listed sc1 as an example
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 07:03 Torpedo.Vegas wrote:
Only TossGirl? Thats it? One person in BW, not even the same game. She did a lot sure, but she got a LOT of undue crap along the way, I'm sure. SC2 has no TossGirl yet, and only a small handful of women streamers, who can probably attest that their chat logs are not really about the game. It will take time, but Eve is just exposing a much larger issue in my opinion. One that is now being focused down on her.
On July 22 2011 06:56 nalgene wrote:
Isn't there someone who plays sc1 and not a male... and doesn't get any of the abuse that you so claim... unfortunate that she couldn't qualify again...supposedly met jangbi or so...
there's no difference... not like this crude matter... only different in your mind...
hope they do well in the future and possibly not overreact to something insignificant...
On July 22 2011 06:28 Torpedo.Vegas wrote:
The problem with gender started way before this though. Female gamers get obscene amounts of crap every time they place a game. Socially ostracized and verbally abused because they are different from the "norm". Every single game is like this, so it is understandable that the talent pool for female gamers is not a profound and that of male gamers. The segregation happened a long time ago. Unless someone steps up and takes a chance, the cycle will continue and male gamers will be overwhelmingly if not the only professional gamers around.
Bringing on Eve is hopefully the first of many and is (as I see it) a kind of olive branch to other females to become more involved in eSports. Provide a tangible goal through the abuse and taunts that IS disproportionately thrown at them and perhaps steadily make females less and less "closet gamers".
Her gender is indeed (sadly) a central focus here, you are right, but instead of taking it as giving massive group of people a chance to shine, many cynically see it in a shallow sexual manner. Normally we rarely see or give a game about the gender divide in gaming, Jessica brought it to the forefront and it willing to do something about it instead of letting it remain the status quo.
Hopefully there will be enough ambitious women playing SC2 and other games that they can have the luxury of selecting them purely on merit and skill, but right now that is only a small facet of the issue here. The larger issue is finding a girl willing to stand up publicly and call herself and aspiring pro-gamer without being target and disproportionately abused by the general public. Eve is once such female and instead of backing down Jessica and SlayerS is helping her forward in the face of this prejudice. (Which looking through a lot of the posts, there definitely is in the community).
Even if Eve showed up as the super hyper Gosu bonjwa of bonjwa's, the community at large would STILL have given her abuse and taunts for being a girl in gaming. Perhaps Jessica could have handled things slightly differently with regards to the GSTL, everything is better in hind-sight, but the public's reaction while semi-expected is still unacceptable. Which is why overall I support her decision to not back down to the trolls on this one.
On July 22 2011 06:12 cz wrote:
This is part of the problem though. You are only happy to see Eve on the team because of her sexuality ("otherwise you must be gay"), and nothing more. If her sexuality is what leads you to give her a positive reaction, you can't be surprised that others attack her based on her sexuality.
It should either be respect her as a player, not a sexual creature, or not be surprised she is being targeted for her gender. Can't have it both ways.
On July 22 2011 05:59 carloselcoco wrote:
Everyone who is mad because Jessica selected Eve must be gay!
Who does not want to see female pro-gamers!! 0.o
I am loving the initiative and people should stop flaming that she was only selected because she was a girl. Why? Because Jessica said it herself that it was because she was a girl! Jessica wants to see women in SC2 and so do I! So, unless you are gay, you should stop complaining about this...
Everyone who is mad because Jessica selected Eve must be gay!
Who does not want to see female pro-gamers!! 0.o
I am loving the initiative and people should stop flaming that she was only selected because she was a girl. Why? Because Jessica said it herself that it was because she was a girl! Jessica wants to see women in SC2 and so do I! So, unless you are gay, you should stop complaining about this...
This is part of the problem though. You are only happy to see Eve on the team because of her sexuality ("otherwise you must be gay"), and nothing more. If her sexuality is what leads you to give her a positive reaction, you can't be surprised that others attack her based on her sexuality.
It should either be respect her as a player, not a sexual creature, or not be surprised she is being targeted for her gender. Can't have it both ways.
The problem with gender started way before this though. Female gamers get obscene amounts of crap every time they place a game. Socially ostracized and verbally abused because they are different from the "norm". Every single game is like this, so it is understandable that the talent pool for female gamers is not a profound and that of male gamers. The segregation happened a long time ago. Unless someone steps up and takes a chance, the cycle will continue and male gamers will be overwhelmingly if not the only professional gamers around.
Bringing on Eve is hopefully the first of many and is (as I see it) a kind of olive branch to other females to become more involved in eSports. Provide a tangible goal through the abuse and taunts that IS disproportionately thrown at them and perhaps steadily make females less and less "closet gamers".
Her gender is indeed (sadly) a central focus here, you are right, but instead of taking it as giving massive group of people a chance to shine, many cynically see it in a shallow sexual manner. Normally we rarely see or give a game about the gender divide in gaming, Jessica brought it to the forefront and it willing to do something about it instead of letting it remain the status quo.
Hopefully there will be enough ambitious women playing SC2 and other games that they can have the luxury of selecting them purely on merit and skill, but right now that is only a small facet of the issue here. The larger issue is finding a girl willing to stand up publicly and call herself and aspiring pro-gamer without being target and disproportionately abused by the general public. Eve is once such female and instead of backing down Jessica and SlayerS is helping her forward in the face of this prejudice. (Which looking through a lot of the posts, there definitely is in the community).
Even if Eve showed up as the super hyper Gosu bonjwa of bonjwa's, the community at large would STILL have given her abuse and taunts for being a girl in gaming. Perhaps Jessica could have handled things slightly differently with regards to the GSTL, everything is better in hind-sight, but the public's reaction while semi-expected is still unacceptable. Which is why overall I support her decision to not back down to the trolls on this one.
Isn't there someone who plays sc1 and not a male... and doesn't get any of the abuse that you so claim... unfortunate that she couldn't qualify again...supposedly met jangbi or so...
there's no difference... not like this crude matter... only different in your mind...
hope they do well in the future and possibly not overreact to something insignificant...
Only TossGirl? Thats it? One person in BW, not even the same game. She did a lot sure, but she got a LOT of undue crap along the way, I'm sure. SC2 has no TossGirl yet, and only a small handful of women streamers, who can probably attest that their chat logs are not really about the game. It will take time, but Eve is just exposing a much larger issue in my opinion. One that is now being focused down on her.
I meant more like esports as a whole and listed sc1 as an example
She was a good start, but a lot more needs to be done. And I think Jessica is providing the support TossGirl didn't get, which could make all the difference in the early stages of SC2.
