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On July 22 2011 01:39 doihy wrote:Show nested quote +On July 22 2011 01:32 enecateReAP wrote:
I challange each and every one of you, to stay in your current job and never move up - because then you'll be betraying your former employer!
In the real world, you don't offer a person's job to the person's boss, you offer it to the person, then it is THEIR DECISSION weather they accept. This was the case here. Without TSL, he wouldn't have a practice house Without TSL, he wouldn't have a salary Without TSL he wouldn't have gotten to show how good he is in the team league. Without TSL, he wouldn't have convenient practice partners to play with. (oh please don't list that koreans practice with ppl from other teams, they were all people who have been eliminated from the gsl, if they were still in the gsl they would have been too busy to practice from someone from another team) Without a team, he could have not entered the NASL open tournament Without TSL, he would have never gotten a plane ticket Without TSL, Puma would be a fucking nobody. So puma can just leave cause he is a sell out with lack of respect? And you people can't see anything wrong with that?
If TSL had not taken Puma another team would have for start. Its not like Puma was some giant risk player that no one had seen play before and no one was sure if he had a chance at being good. They invested in Puma and it payed off for both sides. Also to say that the only people from other teams he practiced with were people who had been eliminated from GSL is sorta silly.
If Puma practiced with a Protoss to prepare for a TvP and that protoss also had a TvP in GSL they would both want to practice together so that they could both prepare. Also several people who get eliminated early in a GSL are very very good players who you want to be preparing with. Also Puma got 500$ to get a plane ticket to the US which im sure thats only about half the cost its not like he desperately needed them to afford that ticket.
As a final point right now with the rosters as they will be can you say that TSL is a better team than EG.
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On July 22 2011 01:44 Mioraka wrote:
I like how most people think EG's move is perfectly fine and good for them, while half of thepeople hate what they did, and the reason they did it is for marketing.
If your move make half of the people hate ur brand image, that's not a good move, that's a retarded move.
Well, this is the team that has kept IdrA all this time...
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On July 22 2011 01:43 Jester1 wrote:
I wonder if other Korean teams will think twice about sending players to foreign tournaments in fear of this kind of poaching.
Its not like they are perfectly safe from poaching inside Korea. Also, preventing their players from going to foreign tournaments would probably make them unhappy because they have a much better chance of winning prize money outside Korea.
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On July 22 2011 01:46 Grimsong wrote:Show nested quote +On July 22 2011 01:44 Mioraka wrote:
I like how most people think EG's move is perfectly fine and good for them, while half of thepeople hate what they did, and the reason they did it is for marketing.
If your move make half of the people hate ur brand image, that's not a good move, that's a retarded move. Can't control peoples opinions. EG did the best for EG. Puma did the best for Puma. If TSL did the best for TSL, this thread never exists.
This is a post I can get behind.
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I am... I'm sorry "Was" an EG fan.
Along with all the people who disagree, and until EG gives out a proper reasoning for not talking to the manager of TSL first about this, I will remain that way.
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Those who are saying that Puma would be a nobody w/o TSL obviously doesnt know who Puma is lol
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On July 22 2011 01:40 fush wrote:Show nested quote +On July 22 2011 01:39 doihy wrote:On July 22 2011 01:32 enecateReAP wrote:
I challange each and every one of you, to stay in your current job and never move up - because then you'll be betraying your former employer!
In the real world, you don't offer a person's job to the person's boss, you offer it to the person, then it is THEIR DECISSION weather they accept. This was the case here. Without TSL, he wouldn't have a practice house Without TSL, he wouldn't have a salary Without TSL he wouldn't have gotten to show how good he is in the team league. Without TSL, he wouldn't have convenient practice partners to play with. (oh please don't list that koreans practice with ppl from other teams, they were all people who have been eliminated from the gsl, if they were still in the gsl they would have been too busy to practice from someone from another team) Without a team, he could have not entered the NASL open tournament Without TSL, he would have never gotten a plane ticket Without TSL, Puma would be a fucking nobody. So puma can just leave cause he is a sell out with lack of respect? And you people can't see anything wrong with that? by your logic you should stay at your own home and be a servant to your parents. or work forever at your entry level job. seems like we're all fucking sellouts with no respect.
No i agree with you, i was wrong, it's not like a pro gamer is any different from a "real job", both of them you live with your co workers, you interact with them all day, they are your friends... Oh wait....
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On July 22 2011 01:42 Loodah wrote:Show nested quote +On July 22 2011 01:28 Soap wrote:
Wouldn't be disrespectful to the player if you discuss his future with the manager who has no rights over him? Think about that. No... You talk to the player first, and then you make sure to talk to management, too. I have no problem with them talking to the player to see if there is an interest - that's always the first step. But there is no excuse not to contact TSL staff at all - not the coach, not the manager - nothing? I know how the business works to a degree - and that's now how you do business - E-sports is different I'm sure, but this is fishy.
There is absolutely no business where another company would feel compelled to contact the management of an employer they are trying to poach. Are you serious? In my industry it is very common for the clients of my employer to try to poach talent. By no means does the client EVER talk to my employer about it - and my employer would never expect them to.
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you guys are silly lol thats why i hate you people
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This is going to make Koreans start generalizing foreigners and be scared of sending their players outside of korea.
thus weakening the scene.
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On July 22 2011 01:45 enecateReAP wrote:Show nested quote +On July 22 2011 01:43 GoldenGun wrote:On July 22 2011 01:39 doihy wrote:On July 22 2011 01:32 enecateReAP wrote:
I challange each and every one of you, to stay in your current job and never move up - because then you'll be betraying your former employer!
In the real world, you don't offer a person's job to the person's boss, you offer it to the person, then it is THEIR DECISSION weather they accept. This was the case here. With EG, he has a practice house With EG, he has a salary With EG, he will show how good he is in the team league. With EG, he has convenient practice partners to play with. With EG, he can enter ANY tournament. With EG, plane ticket? lolez With EG, Puma is a sombody. I see nothing wrong about acquiring a player. I think you misread my post, that was my point exactly, everyone here is saying that this was awful, when all it is, is puma moving up in the world.
How is moving from a Korean team to a foreigner team "moving up in the world"? Its a horrible move for Puma.
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Also, time out, why does it even matter if they went to TSL first, especially if there is no legal obligation here?
EG:"Hey we're going to offer Puma a contract"
TSL:"But he plays for us"
EG: "Is he contracted"
TSL: "No"
/5 minutes later
Puma: "Hey EG offered me a contract that guarantees my lifestyle instead of being strung along as a free agent mercenary"
TSL: "Oh no"
IT changes nothing. The only way this course of action changes is if TSL doesn't tell Puma, and EG never goes to Puma privately. Then we have a whole different issue of TSL screwing Puma over. Which would you have preferred? Hm?
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On July 22 2011 01:47 doihy wrote:
no i agree with you, i was wrong, it's not like a pro gamer is any different from a "real job", both of them you live with your co workers, you interact with them all day, they are your friends... Oh wait....
if i lived with my co workers and they were my friends and i was offered a better standard of living i would leave without a seconds hesitation and so would every pragmatic adult given the same situation if it was offered to them
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ITT: A bunch of people who have no idea what playing for TSL was like and have no idea exactly how their team was structured crying over a great sc2 player pursuing a life oppurtunity that he obviously feels was a better direction to go in. In fact, they are more concerned about some COACH's feelings than the players. Seriously, the COACH...what has he won again? So pathetic.
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Liquid now needs a Korean to join their team lol.
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On July 21 2011 22:26 FaiL_SaFe wrote:Haha. On a constructive note, it is entirely possible that PuMa was under contract. However, unless the contract was properly notarized and signed it isn't legally binding. If he was under contract but it wasn't a legally binding one (aka not properly notarized and certified) then he was free to leave. It was, essentially a Gentleman's agreement. He could have left at any time he chose to. If this is the case (and to be fair I don't know if it is) then, while underhanded, it was completely legal. This is something which actually, Sir Scoots mentioned on an episode of Live on Three but I think is completely accurate, that as esports continues to grow I think we need to start taking contracts more seriously and doing things like properly notarizing them and creating a framework by which they actually become legally binding.
This isn't true in the United States. Sometimes you don't even need a written document to form a contract between two parties. And what knows what contract law is like in South Korea. I would avoid attempting to state the law unless you are formally trained in it.
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On July 22 2011 01:39 doihy wrote:Show nested quote +On July 22 2011 01:32 enecateReAP wrote:
I challange each and every one of you, to stay in your current job and never move up - because then you'll be betraying your former employer!
In the real world, you don't offer a person's job to the person's boss, you offer it to the person, then it is THEIR DECISSION weather they accept. This was the case here. Without TSL, he wouldn't have a practice house Without TSL, he wouldn't have a salary Without TSL he wouldn't have gotten to show how good he is in the team league. Without TSL, he wouldn't have convenient practice partners to play with. (oh please don't list that koreans practice with ppl from other teams, they were all people who have been eliminated from the gsl, if they were still in the gsl they would have been too busy to practice from someone from another team) Without a team, he could have not entered the NASL open tournament Without TSL, he would have never gotten a plane ticket Without TSL, Puma would be a fucking nobody. So puma can just leave cause he is a sell out with lack of respect? And you people can't see anything wrong with that?
So, do you ever plan on leaving your parent's house and do anything other than serve them?
You fucking hypocrite.
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TSL is a sinking ship and Puma was looking for a way out. Scoots came along in his life raft and saved Puma from drowing in mediocrity. I really don't see why people are villifing EG. Puma obviously wanted out of TSL. EG offered him a better deal. Puma told TSL what he was offered and he was released by TSL. Of course TSL management would be mad, they just lost their last good player. But people are making a big deal out of nothing. EG did not steal Puma.
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okay i officially hate foreigners peace out
User was temp banned for this post.
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EPT
