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Everytime anyone pays for something they are basically voting. They are saying I like this product I want it to continue being made.
and like exactly like elections, you rarely get what you voted for.
nearly half the games i own (console and pc) are extremely shitty, yet were hyped in magazines, forums or had a really good 1st part.
so they already collected my money, regardless i enjoyed their product or not. There is no way to honor a good game, because the sames system honors bad games too.
I am less concerned with films. I go to the cinema and if i like the film i buy it on DvD. If i didnt see it in the cinema i can still ask a friend. Not much damage done to my moneybag.
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I download lots of stuff that i don't pay. I just don't undestand why i should buy a game 50-60€ with 15 hours content, or 20-30€ for a movie i'll see just once, so i download it. However, i didn't mind at all to pay 50€ for sc2 because of multiplayer and especially ladder.
I understand Blizzard with not implementing LAN, but on the other hand a lot of people want to play on Blizzard's ladder and not on some shitty ladder with no one to play on your level. (Same as WoW private servers)
Piracy mainly concerns games which doesn't justify their value.
(sorry for my english)
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Free to play games will kill piracy, it's a beautiful circle of life.
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1. ANY sort of LAN implementation is going to be cracked. There is no method to safely introduce it into the game and crackers wont find it.
2. In poor countries like Romania, Bulgaria where a salary is around 300/400euros no one is paying 50 euros for a game. Except few others like me, that can afford it with a bit of sacrifice.
I rarely see people here to buy games. Usually they are buying it for multiplayer. And this is the ONLY reason someone is buying that. Even internet coffee's use pirated software here. And they use only the ones that have multiplayer in them.
Talking why Blizz didnt introduce it is pointless. Because any of u had a software/gaming company u will do anything to prevent piracy. It's like working and not getting paid.
Also this non lan thing has it's advantages also. Look at wc3 and eurobnet. I think it has more users than bnet ever had. So. why would u buy a game if it is for free?
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On June 23 2011 07:35 Ribbon wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 07:27 branflakes14 wrote:
That's a poor excuse for no LAN, especially when games like League of Legends and Quake Live ARE available for free. And remember Brood War? How did that game even sell a single copy when it had LAN!? I literally downloaded a pirate copy of BW from ICCUP because I was too lazy to find where I put the disc. That's how easy it is to do. You can make a server that tricks a game client into thinking it's a LAN. Remember, ICCUP is technically an illegal pirate server, so it's not like there isn't precedent. What if Blizz made LAN, and then ICCUP or somebody made a pirate server with a private ladder using GSL Maps? You think that wouldn't be really popular? Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 07:30 MilesTeg wrote:
"you're convincing the wrong people"
Then who are we supposed to convince, pirates? Yes.
You are confusing LAN with emulated/reverse engineered Bnet server software. LAN has nothing to do with anything you wrote here.
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I wish there was LAN, but a business is a business. S2 can't afford to lose any sales. They can't handle it financially. Blizzard may be able to, but why would they want to? They would be extremely generous in doing so. Yea, it would be nice, but I don't expect it. It's really too bad there's not some other way atm.
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On June 23 2011 21:59 MasterJack wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 19:11 lorkac wrote:On June 23 2011 18:52 Deadlyfish wrote:On June 23 2011 18:40 lorkac wrote:On June 23 2011 18:28 Slegg wrote:
Pirates are not stealing from companies
Sure, to take it literally they are but a lot of them would never buy your game.
They should a must be thought of as potential customers, not people who steal, companies should try to motivate them to buy their games, not fight against them and piss of their fans in the process.
People who intend to steal never intend to buy the product--that is why they steal. This sentence is aggravating to hear because it means absolutely nothing. . Yea, but when you steal you're taking something away from someone. With pirating you are just copying it, which is why the argument "i wouldnt have bought it anyways" is a good one, but one which you cant apply to stealing. So many games today you can just pirate, but they still make tons and tons of money, pirating doesnt mean that you wont sell any games. And actually i think often times pirating helps to sell games by sort of spreading the word. And sc2 not having LAN probably means that a lot of people wont buy it as well. It *is* stealing. Stealing is not the act of someone losing something. It is the act of taking something from someone that he did not intend for you to have. If I raped your sister, and then told you "I didn't kill her, you still get her back" it would not be acceptable at all. If I licked your burger and told you "I just wanted to taste it in case I wanted to buy one" it would not be acceptable at all. If I hotwired your car and drove it around for a few months and gave it back--IT WOULD NOT BE OKAY. The logic of "I left something behind so it's okay" is bad logic. Those analogies are terrible. It's more like "I took a picture of your sister and masturbated to her." She wasn't harmed in the process, but it's still not pleasant.
Actually no. My analogy is still more accurate.
The reason is because in your analogy is more akin to getting a demo of a game. It's more akin to being given a poster or reading an article of a game where you need to use your imagination in order to get the full experience.
Piracy is when you take the game, rip it, use it to your liking for as long as you want, then toss it back where you found it feeling good about yourself because you didn't have to take her out on a date to fuck her--even bragging to yourself that you saved $60 to get a damn good or damn bad fucking. When asked why you raped her, you reply "I wouldn't have gone out with her anyway."
Fast Food companies copyright the flavors of their food so that if someone starts giving away burgers and fries that tastes like theirs, they can legally sue them for it. Do people complain about that? No. Why? Because unlike Gaming Companies, people respect the rights of fast food places MUCH MUCH more than they respect the artists and programers that try to make good game products.
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All I know, is that I live in Japan right now... So does my Friend. I come from Europe, He comes from Canada.. I can't play SC2 against him, either online or offline, despite living close enough I could probably hit his front door with a book from my balcony. LAN would solve that problem, so would Region free online. Blizzard aren't providing either, and it can't be to keep the online experience good for people, because I get better connection from here to Europe than I do from the UK to Europe. So that excuse is total bollocks too.
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On June 23 2011 23:42 Gingerninja wrote:
All I know, is that I live in Japan right now... So does my Friend. I come from Europe, He comes from Canada.. I can't play SC2 against him, either online or offline, despite living close enough I could probably hit his front door with a book from my balcony. LAN would solve that problem, so would Region free online. Blizzard aren't providing either, and it can't be to keep the online experience good for people, because I get better connection from here to Europe than I do from the UK to Europe. So that excuse is total bollocks too.
Is Blizzard's choice to not have LAN a good idea? Maybe, maybe not. That's subjective.
Is Blizzard crazy for worrying about piracy? No they're not.
I wish they were harsher on pirates through punishment (financial punishment) instead of making their game more secure. But that's me personally, I'm not Blizzard. I'm not the one shelling out the money to make a game. I'm just the consumer.
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On June 23 2011 23:38 lorkac wrote:
Fast Food companies copyright the flavors of their food so that if someone starts giving away burgers and fries that tastes like theirs, they can legally sue them for it. Do people complain about that? No. Why? Because unlike Gaming Companies, people respect the rights of fast food places MUCH MUCH more than they respect the artists and programers that try to make good game products.
It has little to do with respect, if a business steals another business's food recipe simply because of the legal process of created a business they have made a big target out of themselves while also risking whatever profits they got from the recipe. Compare that to the pirating gamer who is a much smaller target (my friend did it, I left my wifi open, etc.) who at the same time likely has little money which means even if they do press charges there will be little returned to them to even compensate for the legal fees. In the same way if I copy McDonald's food in the privacy of my own home they aren't going to give a shit about it, it's only when if I made a business out of it and started making a profit that they would take notice.
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On June 23 2011 23:55 lorkac wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 23:42 Gingerninja wrote:
All I know, is that I live in Japan right now... So does my Friend. I come from Europe, He comes from Canada.. I can't play SC2 against him, either online or offline, despite living close enough I could probably hit his front door with a book from my balcony. LAN would solve that problem, so would Region free online. Blizzard aren't providing either, and it can't be to keep the online experience good for people, because I get better connection from here to Europe than I do from the UK to Europe. So that excuse is total bollocks too. Is Blizzard's choice to not have LAN a good idea? Maybe, maybe not. That's subjective. Is Blizzard crazy for worrying about piracy? No they're not. I wish they were harsher on pirates through punishment (financial punishment) instead of making their game more secure. But that's me personally, I'm not Blizzard. I'm not the one shelling out the money to make a game. I'm just the consumer.
I'm just a consumer, and my enjoyment of the product is being totally stopped dead in it's tracks by blizzards stance on that issue, in what is an industry standard feature not being present.
Sure they have every right to worry about piracy, but as a legit customer (for every blizzard game I own.. every steam game, every console game.. I don't even use an R4 card or w/e the hell it's called on the DS all my games are legit. ) I reserve the right to be annoyed when a feature is denied to me because someone else is stealing. Not my problem, I paid you my money, yet I can't play the "Multiplayer" with a friend, who lives next to me. No amount of sales talk can sidestep that fact. Me (a legit customer) and my friend (another legit customer) cannot play the "Multiplayer" option together. Either Online or Offline.
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This is total BS looking at it from Blizzards perspective. I would agree with the notion if it was some small indie company trying to make some money and a name for themselves. But if it is the monster of acti-blizzard it absolute bs they are a huuuuuuge company and yes while LAN will make then take a small financial hit it shouldn't matter THAT much blizzard essentially has free money from all of us for a very long time, they don't even have to produce the best quality at this point cause theyre brand name is so engrained into everyone. Good companies take these small hits all the time to keep customers happy and keep future business.
If i was blizzard i would rather have someone playing my game for free if it keeps them from playing some other companies game. LAN is a very big deal and a huge factor into why many PC games lasted for so long and are still being played today.
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On June 24 2011 00:04 Gingerninja wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 23:55 lorkac wrote:On June 23 2011 23:42 Gingerninja wrote:
All I know, is that I live in Japan right now... So does my Friend. I come from Europe, He comes from Canada.. I can't play SC2 against him, either online or offline, despite living close enough I could probably hit his front door with a book from my balcony. LAN would solve that problem, so would Region free online. Blizzard aren't providing either, and it can't be to keep the online experience good for people, because I get better connection from here to Europe than I do from the UK to Europe. So that excuse is total bollocks too. Is Blizzard's choice to not have LAN a good idea? Maybe, maybe not. That's subjective. Is Blizzard crazy for worrying about piracy? No they're not. I wish they were harsher on pirates through punishment (financial punishment) instead of making their game more secure. But that's me personally, I'm not Blizzard. I'm not the one shelling out the money to make a game. I'm just the consumer. I'm just a consumer, and my enjoyment of the product is being totally stopped dead in it's tracks by blizzards stance on that issue, in what is an industry standard feature not being present. Sure they have every right to worry about piracy, but as a legit customer (for every blizzard game I own.. every steam game, every console game.. I don't even use an R4 card or w/e the hell it's called on the DS all my games are legit. ) I reserve the right to be annoyed when a feature is denied to me because someone else is stealing. Not my problem, I paid you my money, yet I can't play the "Multiplayer" with a friend, who lives next to me. No amount of sales talk can sidestep that fact. Me (a legit customer) and my friend (another legit customer) cannot play the "Multiplayer" option together. Either Online or Offline.
In the same way, not their problem that you are dissatisfied. Especially when you still purchased the product knowing there wouldn't be LAN, that is only more incentive for them to stick to their guns. If people really want LAN the best thing they can do is not purchase Heart of the Swarm and Legacy of the Void and hope enough people do it for Blizzard to start caring, based on the so called Modern Warfare 2 boycotts this isn't likely to happen. Gamers cave easily.
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I hate this kind of attitude, where they are hurting paying costumers because they have a silly fear of no one buying their product. If everyone downloads your product, that means it was so bad that they weren't willing to pay money for it.
If that's the case, you have a lot bigger problem on your hands, your game/movie/music/whathaveyou isn't good(and it's unlikely it'd have gotten good reviews, so people wouldn't have bought it anyway).
A company should only fear piracy if they are producing bad products.
Edit:On June 23 2011 23:38 lorkac wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 21:59 MasterJack wrote:On June 23 2011 19:11 lorkac wrote:On June 23 2011 18:52 Deadlyfish wrote:On June 23 2011 18:40 lorkac wrote:On June 23 2011 18:28 Slegg wrote:
Pirates are not stealing from companies
Sure, to take it literally they are but a lot of them would never buy your game.
They should a must be thought of as potential customers, not people who steal, companies should try to motivate them to buy their games, not fight against them and piss of their fans in the process.
People who intend to steal never intend to buy the product--that is why they steal. This sentence is aggravating to hear because it means absolutely nothing. . Yea, but when you steal you're taking something away from someone. With pirating you are just copying it, which is why the argument "i wouldnt have bought it anyways" is a good one, but one which you cant apply to stealing. So many games today you can just pirate, but they still make tons and tons of money, pirating doesnt mean that you wont sell any games. And actually i think often times pirating helps to sell games by sort of spreading the word. And sc2 not having LAN probably means that a lot of people wont buy it as well. It *is* stealing. Stealing is not the act of someone losing something. It is the act of taking something from someone that he did not intend for you to have. If I raped your sister, and then told you "I didn't kill her, you still get her back" it would not be acceptable at all. If I licked your burger and told you "I just wanted to taste it in case I wanted to buy one" it would not be acceptable at all. If I hotwired your car and drove it around for a few months and gave it back--IT WOULD NOT BE OKAY. The logic of "I left something behind so it's okay" is bad logic. Those analogies are terrible. It's more like "I took a picture of your sister and masturbated to her." She wasn't harmed in the process, but it's still not pleasant. Actually no. My analogy is still more accurate. The reason is because in your analogy is more akin to getting a demo of a game. It's more akin to being given a poster or reading an article of a game where you need to use your imagination in order to get the full experience. Piracy is when you take the game, rip it, use it to your liking for as long as you want, then toss it back where you found it feeling good about yourself because you didn't have to take her out on a date to fuck her--even bragging to yourself that you saved $60 to get a damn good or damn bad fucking. When asked why you raped her, you reply "I wouldn't have gone out with her anyway."
That's a stupid analogy, since in yours you are actually hurting the girl. You can't really use analogy with living things, since no matter what you do, you'd be doing damage(which you don't do with a computer game, movie etc). Hence his analogy with the picture is a lot better.
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sorry accidental post 
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It doesn't matter how much money Blizzard has overall. Starcraft 2 has to be profitable by itself for them to continue developing it while being responsible to their investors. "Blizzard has enough money" is a foolish argument. They aren't going to start developing out of charity because they make a ton of money off of WoW.
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A company should only fear piracy if they are producing bad products.
So let me get this straight, if you make a quality product less people will pirate it? Its the other way around
Look at various torrent sites ( i know you know them) and see what the most popular games and movies are pirated, it is usually high profile games that cost millions to make.
The most popular game to get a N64 emulator for are OoT and Mario 64, how many people do you think tried to snag a Superman 64 rom? Only the few demented people who wanted to see just how horrible it is.
I agree that it is sad we cant have LAN, but the reasoning makes perfect sense.
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Player tries to save money by pirating--says its his right to do so.
Company tries to save money by adding features to hinder pirating--is then called heartless and soulless.
The truth: Both the consumer and the producer are trying to save money. The consumer is pissed off that the producer is acting exactly like the consumer.
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On June 24 2011 00:14 Tyree wrote:So let me get this straight, if you make a quality product less people will pirate it? Its the other way around Look at various torrent sites ( i know you know them) and see what the most popular games and movies are pirated, it is usually high profile games that cost millions to make. The most popular game to get a N64 emulator for are OoT and Mario 64, how many people do you think tried to snag a Superman 64 rom? Only the few demented people who wanted to see just how horrible it is. I agree that it is sad we cant have LAN, but the reasoning makes perfect sense.
My point is, if the product is good enough, people will buy it.
A lot of people might download it, don't get me wrong, but if they were ever going to buy the game, they would likely do so even if they downloaded it.
If they would never have bought the game no matter, then you've just reached out to one more customer, which *might* buy it, but in the least(assuming the product is good) have a positive attitude towards the game/company when talking about it.
So yes, a good product might be downloaded more, but that's not really something to fear, while a bad one has a good reason to fear it.
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EPT
