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ill keep this short and simple. You say that blizzard knows how to make their own game but yet constantly say they are incompetent (paraphrasing). Besides that total change in opinion by incontrol to put a total negative connotation on the whole situation, this was a little douchey and and embarrassing to watch. I do not know why its so hard for some people to maybe admit they went a little too far, another example of kennigit's vblog on the immaturity of certain Esport figures. Only suprise
I have is that DjWheat joined in. Well, kinda sucks that it happened; just wish people could man up and say they went a little too far. Take the high road once in awhile.
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On October 24 2012 15:38 FreedomMurder wrote:
DJ wheat, tournament streaming for video games existed before starcraft 2. Are you kidding me? People watched CS 1.6, CS source, Halo 1-2-3, COD, Smash Bros, Street Fighter, Tekken all BEFORE stracraft 2 was released. ARE YOU THAT BLIND? ARE YOU STUPID? I respected you and incontrol alot before this show but honestly you both + destiny acted like little children.
Ever heard of EVO or MLG?
One could still argue that SC2 is what made esports streaming so much bigger though, although I'd still attribute that to the rise of twitch/other streaming sites than any single game.
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
On October 24 2012 15:38 Leru wrote:
Incontrol with your attitude you've proved you can be as low as the lowest members of the community , on which you frown upon.
I know you're not going to admit you behaved inappropriately ( even if you realize it ) , but just drop the "Oh, I'm being trolled by the community" act.
Can't drop that act as I am not maintaining it. And what am I going to deny? Did you think me pretending to s hit numbers into my hand was me NOT acting inappropriately? Are you trying to be as dumb as possible or does this just come natural to you?
User was warned for this post
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On October 24 2012 15:37 iNcontroL wrote:Show nested quote +On October 24 2012 15:35 AxelTVx wrote:On October 24 2012 15:30 iNcontroL wrote:On October 24 2012 15:28 AxelTVx wrote:On October 24 2012 15:18 iNcontroL wrote:On October 24 2012 15:08 AxelTVx wrote:On October 24 2012 14:47 iNcontroL wrote:
I didn't insult destiny the entire time. So tired of people being able to just post lies on forums. Yeah eyah you get ignored and nobody replies but fuck you.
I was insulting during my rant which was hammed to all fuck up. He then did the same thing during all of his rants where he injected personal insults yet I get all the credit?
ALSO what the FUCK. ONLY on the internet would a fucking high five be anything other than a stupid fucking joke. I DON'T ACTUALLY HIGH FIVE GUYS. I Haven't since highschool when I played football. STOP BEING SO NECK BEARDY What the fuck happened to "OH HERP DERP I'M NOT DOING STATE OF THE GAME BECAUSE I DON'T WANT TO CAUSE DRAMA. I'M THE MOST IMPORTANT PERSON SO I SAY WHATEVER THE FUCK I WANT, AND THAT GET'S ME IN TROUBLE" Seriously? You wanted to avoid drama, and you come up with this shit when you have no idea what the casual gamer wants. Do you really think you can speak for all the casual gamers out there? Destiny certainly can't speak for us either, but when you tried to make yourself the voice of us (similar to what steven did), you just made yourself look completely retarded. It pains me to see you act like this when you're obviously smarter than this stupid bullshit. lol It's best you don't use my own words for your evidence. I usually keep a pretty good record of the context  I am not trying to avoid ALL drama as that is impossible. Just reduce it by not being on the show that has more drama (sotg) and instead be on only one show (itg). nice try though lol. All I can say is have fun with your PR team. Said the all caps "herp derp" guy Well you're the one who's going to get in shit for all this, so why should I care really? It's pretty obvious that the PR team is going to make you apologize, regardless of your thoughts/damage control. Want to bet 500$? "The PR team" who do you think that is on EG?
You know, it's pretty funny. This situation is pretty similar to how you wen't off on avilo/naniwa. You're going to be apologizing sooner or later lol. And saying "want to bet 500$?" Really? Come on, think before you type things....
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On October 24 2012 15:37 MuR wrote:Show nested quote +On October 24 2012 15:28 MaestroSC wrote:On October 24 2012 15:23 MuR wrote:On October 24 2012 14:58 MaestroSC wrote:On October 24 2012 14:33 VanGarde wrote:On October 24 2012 14:28 MaestroSC wrote:
Destiny: Less people are watching SC2
DjWheat: WRONG! More people watch all things on twitchtv than before.
Didnt even acknowledge the question at all. im at roughly 1:20:00 in the vod if anyone wants to check...
He didnt acknowledge SC2 streams specifically at all, because Idra, Geoff, and PainUser ALL would have agreed with what Destiny said, but Wheat heard the question and substituted his own Wow did no one take elementary school math? So if I have 100 apples and I divide them evenly and put into 10 baskets. Then someone takes out all of the apples and doubles the number of apples, adds 20 extra baskets and spreads the apples out evenly in all of the baskets. Destiny: The number of apples have gone down. DjWheat: No, the number of apples have actually increased but there are less in each single basket. Dertiny: Oh really?! Well ask basket number 4 then if it has more apples in it! maybe because your from Sweden you didnt understand my basic english.... Destiny said "Less people are watching SC2" and Wheats response was "More people are watching twitchtv and video games" Destiny was talking about SC2 and Wheat said "but more people are watching other games" he didnt even address what Steven said... I am not saying that Wheat was wrong. I am not saying that spreading an equal number across a greater variety = less. I am saying, Steven was talking about SC2 stream counts. Wheat wasnt. Steven wasnt saying "nobody watches twitch" he was saying "people arent watching SC2 on twitch as much" which is true,, and Wheat ignored what he said, just like you did. Congrats on being unable to comprehend what both I and Steven said. Why are you so petty? The instance you are referring to, where Wheat "misinterpreted" what destiny said, was probably for the good, as he chose instead to elaborate on a more relevant point. By the way, I found the point in the VOD to which you are referring, and here is the dialogue. Destiny: Ya, well, compared to maybe a couple years ago, but stream viewership numbers for everything is down now compared to six months ago... And then, Wheat made his point about how viewership is now diffused amongst various games, etc, and that stream numbers overall have risen. If you're going to be pedantic, at least get it right. Also, I think you understand the math, but its significance eludes you. Because by "everything" he wasnt referring exclusively to SC2? Please see my post about context. Do you really think the man WHOSE MAIN POINT was "LoL IS GROWING AND SC2 IS DYING" is implying that ALL games/streams viewcounts are down? If you really believe that Steven was arguing for viewership about other games... then there is nothing I can do to help you understand anything. Congrats on using another quote out of context... you should be a journalist. Destiny was referring to SC2, I am aware of this, but you fabricated dialogue, which I corrected. Destiny's language was not so straightforward at that point, he said "everything", which is ambiguous, and it was misinterpreted by Wheat. The ironic thing here, my friend, is that you speak of context. If you had actually weighed in on the arguments, you would know that, despite this mishap in semantics, which is petty, DjWheat's retort was relevant to the overall argument.
So you are correcting me with "you misquoted.... but you were right"
And your second point is pretty much EVERONE's point.... DjWheat and Steven were arguing about different things...i feel like i said this in the first post of mine you quoted...
Steven was Arguing for SC2 viewership, Djwheat was arguing for game viewership (including ALL video games).
Wheat's retort was relevant to HIS argument, but not Stevens.
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On October 24 2012 15:39 iNcontroL wrote:Show nested quote +On October 24 2012 15:38 FreedomMurder wrote:
DJ wheat, tournament streaming for video games existed before starcraft 2. Are you kidding me? People watched CS 1.6, CS source, Halo 1-2-3, COD, Smash Bros, Street Fighter, Tekken all BEFORE stracraft 2 was released. ARE YOU THAT BLIND? ARE YOU STUPID? I respected you and incontrol alot before this show but honestly you both + destiny acted like little children. Go re listen. He didn't say SC2 invented online streaming. Before you lose more respect points you should fact check yourself. You completely missed his point.
He said that SC2 paved the way for tournament infrastructure, and that noone watched video game tournaments live streamed before SC2. I just watched it. Both of those statements are false. MLG and EVO ran amazing tournaments before SC2 existed.
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
I CAN'T BELIEVE DJWHEAT YELLED ON THE S HOW! I LOST RFESPECT FOR HIMS
Who the FUCK calls themselves a Djwheat fan but is upset by him yelling? That's like loving truly refined and calm debate but being an avid fan of CNN/Fox arguments. What the fuck?
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
On October 24 2012 15:41 FreedomMurder wrote:Show nested quote +On October 24 2012 15:39 iNcontroL wrote:On October 24 2012 15:38 FreedomMurder wrote:
DJ wheat, tournament streaming for video games existed before starcraft 2. Are you kidding me? People watched CS 1.6, CS source, Halo 1-2-3, COD, Smash Bros, Street Fighter, Tekken all BEFORE stracraft 2 was released. ARE YOU THAT BLIND? ARE YOU STUPID? I respected you and incontrol alot before this show but honestly you both + destiny acted like little children. Go re listen. He didn't say SC2 invented online streaming. Before you lose more respect points you should fact check yourself. You completely missed his point. He said that SC2 paved the way for tournament infrastructure, and that noone watched video game tournaments live streamed before SC2. I just watched it. Both of those statements are false. MLG and EVO ran amazing tournaments before SC2 existed.
You are once again misunderstanding his point. When he says "pave" he is talking about elevating the standards for streaming and making a "stream" culture. Players, tournaments, shows etc etc.. all being streamed and pushing for higher quality was a focal point that only arose ON THIS SCALE during the SC2 ascension. He is NOT saying there existed no good streamed events prior to SC2.
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On October 24 2012 15:28 AxelTVx wrote:Show nested quote +On October 24 2012 15:18 iNcontroL wrote:On October 24 2012 15:08 AxelTVx wrote:On October 24 2012 14:47 iNcontroL wrote:
I didn't insult destiny the entire time. So tired of people being able to just post lies on forums. Yeah eyah you get ignored and nobody replies but fuck you.
I was insulting during my rant which was hammed to all fuck up. He then did the same thing during all of his rants where he injected personal insults yet I get all the credit?
ALSO what the FUCK. ONLY on the internet would a fucking high five be anything other than a stupid fucking joke. I DON'T ACTUALLY HIGH FIVE GUYS. I Haven't since highschool when I played football. STOP BEING SO NECK BEARDY What the fuck happened to "OH HERP DERP I'M NOT DOING STATE OF THE GAME BECAUSE I DON'T WANT TO CAUSE DRAMA. I'M THE MOST IMPORTANT PERSON SO I SAY WHATEVER THE FUCK I WANT, AND THAT GET'S ME IN TROUBLE" Seriously? You wanted to avoid drama, and you come up with this shit when you have no idea what the casual gamer wants. Do you really think you can speak for all the casual gamers out there? Destiny certainly can't speak for us either, but when you tried to make yourself the voice of us (similar to what steven did), you just made yourself look completely retarded. It pains me to see you act like this when you're obviously smarter than this stupid bullshit. lol It's best you don't use my own words for your evidence. I usually keep a pretty good record of the context I am not trying to avoid ALL drama as that is impossible. Just reduce it by not being on the show that has more drama (sotg) and instead be on only one show (itg). nice try though lol. All I can say is have fun with your PR team.
seriously.
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There are people on the street's that go around with a megaphone telling everyone to repent as you will be doomed for eternity if you do not believe in God/Jesus. Being a Christian myself, it cringes me seeing those people thinking that they are actually doing the right thing. Obviously, for a good reason, it doesn't quite work out as they plan. Instead of telling people good things about God, they make it seem like he is out to get everyone and that he doesn't care about you.
My point is, is that even though someone might think they are doing something great for the community, it is instead making people more and more uneasy for Starcraft 2 in general and will sometimes make people not want to play anymore due to what they hear from others and not what they decide for themselves. Unfortunately some people will hate HOTS but others might really like it.
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On October 24 2012 15:42 iNcontroL wrote:
I CAN'T BELIEVE DJWHEAT YELLED ON THE S HOW! I LOST RFESPECT FOR HIMS
Who the FUCK calls themselves a Djwheat fan but is upset by him yelling? That's like loving truly refined and calm debate but being an avid fan of CNN/Fox arguments. What the fuck?
wow
it's like people have opinions or different perspectives or something
crazy right
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When idra started to mouth destiny about getting away from this community and said stfu wheat was giggling like a schoolgirl in the background but painuser immediately said "stop we don't need to get into that shit" because he realized it went personal and shitstorm was brewing. Then Destiny made a joke of his own and left the call, Wheat went totally psycho :D
I think it's good itg and sotg have different casts now. People can watch what they like. Sometimes i just feel painuser might be in a wrong show.
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On October 24 2012 15:42 iNcontroL wrote:
I CAN'T BELIEVE DJWHEAT YELLED ON THE S HOW! I LOST RFESPECT FOR HIMS
Who the FUCK calls themselves a Djwheat fan but is upset by him yelling? That's like loving truly refined and calm debate but being an avid fan of CNN/Fox arguments. What the fuck?
i NEVER was a DJwheat fan. this only made me view the guy as a arrogant 13 year old, just like you are making yourself out to be like a arrogant internet tough guy on the forums.
infact TBH ive seen no difference at all between you, destiny, and DJwheat. you all acted in the same way.
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On October 24 2012 15:35 1handsomE wrote:Show nested quote +On October 24 2012 15:33 JPSke wrote:
Why don't we spend 14 more pages talking about bullshit and drama instead of addressing the real issue at hand.
SC2 is in comparative if not actual decline. It went from a flagship for E-sports to a major competitor to a somewhat nostalgic tertiary figure in 18 months. Its direct competitors have out-innovated it, out-marketed it, and out-positioned it with a free to play model, integrated advertising, LAN support, and a social integration within their client.
More importantly, the developers behind the two games dominating the current E-Sports market are incredibly responsive and engage with their playerbase regularly. Riot, much like Blizzard, develops at a glacial pace, but they do so while, for the most part, keeping their customers in the loop and maintaining a positive relationship. Blizzard's quality of game has fallen off a cliff, they don't listen to literally anyone, and for their last four releases I would wager to say customer satisfaction has been majorly lacking.
What does this all have to do with Destiny's point, and ITG's reaction? Well everyone on the show agreed that Blizzard sucks, they aren't communicative, and that they would like changes to be made. However the crux of their argument seemed to be that Destiny went about advocating for that change in the wrong way. He was over the top. He was doom and gloom. He made up statistics. This is all fine, but their corrective measures seemed to be to tell Destiny that "This isn't the way to do it". The problem is that the way the ITG guys are advocating is the way they've been trying to do it for two years, and it clearly isn't working. So maybe Destiny made some mistakes in how he framed his argument, but his overall point about the need to somehow spur Blizzard into action remains. While the SC2 scene certainly isn't going to disappear it is going to be left further and further behind by existing and up and coming competitors who are being actively developed for, who do bring in casual players, who do monetize their product without a major up front cost, and who understand the power of integration within the game client itself.
So I ask those of you who care about the Starcraft scene, what can we do about it? It seems to be that now, when Blizzard is finishing development and starting their marketing campaign for a new, premium expansion, is the exact right time to apply a little pressure. They want to sell those boxes, yet they refuse to engage with the community in any meaningful sort of way and address the concerns that are dragging this game down. When, if not now, are we going to figure out a way to get the support from Blizzard we need? Or is it as IdrA said, a lost cause, Blizzard won't change no matter what we do, and we're all wasting our time playing/following/spectating on a game that has very little development support and no real hope of long term growth?
Or, you know, keep calling each other shitheads and worrying about who started it. Do you like LoL better than SC2? Your argument hinges on it, so I am curious.
I probably played more LoL in the last year than SC2, mostly because my friends play LoL. But I follow the SC2 scene much more closely, I watch far more tournaments, and I much prefer it overall as a game to LoL, in large part because I think the quality of the SC2 community is second to none and I think the strategy is deeper.
That's the real problem in a nutshell. All my friends play LoL, it's fun and addictive to grind more points and open up new champs, and they all buy stupid avatars and goof around in it. SC2 has none of that, so even though I prefer it as a game it's hard to play it unless I am in a certain, primarily solo, frame of mind.
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Also... iNcontroL... Im a big fan...but all of you acted like asshats on todays ITG.
Still think your rants are mostly hilarious, and I thought it was actually a nice change of pace for you to be so "raw" on ITG.... everyone is so worried about being reported to sponsors that everyone is afraid to say or do anything original....
I was always a fan of you because of your personality and humor, good to see people still being honest in the scene its refreshing.
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On October 24 2012 15:42 iNcontroL wrote:
I CAN'T BELIEVE DJWHEAT YELLED ON THE S HOW! I LOST RFESPECT FOR HIMS
Who the FUCK calls themselves a Djwheat fan but is upset by him yelling? That's like loving truly refined and calm debate but being an avid fan of CNN/Fox arguments. What the fuck?
it's because he's usually amusing to listen to when he yells. this time it was just dumb.
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
On October 24 2012 15:41 AxelTVx wrote:Show nested quote +On October 24 2012 15:37 iNcontroL wrote:On October 24 2012 15:35 AxelTVx wrote:On October 24 2012 15:30 iNcontroL wrote:On October 24 2012 15:28 AxelTVx wrote:On October 24 2012 15:18 iNcontroL wrote:On October 24 2012 15:08 AxelTVx wrote:On October 24 2012 14:47 iNcontroL wrote:
I didn't insult destiny the entire time. So tired of people being able to just post lies on forums. Yeah eyah you get ignored and nobody replies but fuck you.
I was insulting during my rant which was hammed to all fuck up. He then did the same thing during all of his rants where he injected personal insults yet I get all the credit?
ALSO what the FUCK. ONLY on the internet would a fucking high five be anything other than a stupid fucking joke. I DON'T ACTUALLY HIGH FIVE GUYS. I Haven't since highschool when I played football. STOP BEING SO NECK BEARDY What the fuck happened to "OH HERP DERP I'M NOT DOING STATE OF THE GAME BECAUSE I DON'T WANT TO CAUSE DRAMA. I'M THE MOST IMPORTANT PERSON SO I SAY WHATEVER THE FUCK I WANT, AND THAT GET'S ME IN TROUBLE" Seriously? You wanted to avoid drama, and you come up with this shit when you have no idea what the casual gamer wants. Do you really think you can speak for all the casual gamers out there? Destiny certainly can't speak for us either, but when you tried to make yourself the voice of us (similar to what steven did), you just made yourself look completely retarded. It pains me to see you act like this when you're obviously smarter than this stupid bullshit. lol It's best you don't use my own words for your evidence. I usually keep a pretty good record of the context I am not trying to avoid ALL drama as that is impossible. Just reduce it by not being on the show that has more drama (sotg) and instead be on only one show (itg). nice try though lol. All I can say is have fun with your PR team. Said the all caps "herp derp" guy Well you're the one who's going to get in shit for all this, so why should I care really? It's pretty obvious that the PR team is going to make you apologize, regardless of your thoughts/damage control. Want to bet 500$? "The PR team" who do you think that is on EG? You know, it's pretty funny. This situation is pretty similar to how you wen't off on avilo/naniwa. You're going to be apologizing sooner or later lol. And saying "want to bet 500$?" Really? Come on, think before you type things....
Nice dodge! Let me know when you grow a pair and want to back up _any_ of your claims.. at least you are smart enough to realize you are talking out of your ass and instead of putting money where your mouth is you dodge. The PR team for EG? Where do you get this stuff lol
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Painuser did a great job this episode, I respect him a lot for trying to see destiny's point of view and try to come up with solutions instead of just saying everything's fine.
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
On October 24 2012 15:45 TheDraken wrote:Show nested quote +On October 24 2012 15:42 iNcontroL wrote:
I CAN'T BELIEVE DJWHEAT YELLED ON THE S HOW! I LOST RFESPECT FOR HIMS
Who the FUCK calls themselves a Djwheat fan but is upset by him yelling? That's like loving truly refined and calm debate but being an avid fan of CNN/Fox arguments. What the fuck? it's because he's usually amusing to listen to when he yells. this time it was just dumb.
That is your opinion. Wheat is emotional. He yells. If you were waiting for an emotionally charged feeling for him to have to become "less of a fan" than you are an idiot. Sorry. And not a real fan. It's like being a fan of Lebron James but FUCK if he misses a free through THAT'S IT!
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On October 24 2012 15:45 iNcontroL wrote:Show nested quote +On October 24 2012 15:41 AxelTVx wrote:On October 24 2012 15:37 iNcontroL wrote:On October 24 2012 15:35 AxelTVx wrote:On October 24 2012 15:30 iNcontroL wrote:On October 24 2012 15:28 AxelTVx wrote:On October 24 2012 15:18 iNcontroL wrote:On October 24 2012 15:08 AxelTVx wrote:On October 24 2012 14:47 iNcontroL wrote:
I didn't insult destiny the entire time. So tired of people being able to just post lies on forums. Yeah eyah you get ignored and nobody replies but fuck you.
I was insulting during my rant which was hammed to all fuck up. He then did the same thing during all of his rants where he injected personal insults yet I get all the credit?
ALSO what the FUCK. ONLY on the internet would a fucking high five be anything other than a stupid fucking joke. I DON'T ACTUALLY HIGH FIVE GUYS. I Haven't since highschool when I played football. STOP BEING SO NECK BEARDY What the fuck happened to "OH HERP DERP I'M NOT DOING STATE OF THE GAME BECAUSE I DON'T WANT TO CAUSE DRAMA. I'M THE MOST IMPORTANT PERSON SO I SAY WHATEVER THE FUCK I WANT, AND THAT GET'S ME IN TROUBLE" Seriously? You wanted to avoid drama, and you come up with this shit when you have no idea what the casual gamer wants. Do you really think you can speak for all the casual gamers out there? Destiny certainly can't speak for us either, but when you tried to make yourself the voice of us (similar to what steven did), you just made yourself look completely retarded. It pains me to see you act like this when you're obviously smarter than this stupid bullshit. lol It's best you don't use my own words for your evidence. I usually keep a pretty good record of the context I am not trying to avoid ALL drama as that is impossible. Just reduce it by not being on the show that has more drama (sotg) and instead be on only one show (itg). nice try though lol. All I can say is have fun with your PR team. Said the all caps "herp derp" guy Well you're the one who's going to get in shit for all this, so why should I care really? It's pretty obvious that the PR team is going to make you apologize, regardless of your thoughts/damage control. Want to bet 500$? "The PR team" who do you think that is on EG? You know, it's pretty funny. This situation is pretty similar to how you wen't off on avilo/naniwa. You're going to be apologizing sooner or later lol. And saying "want to bet 500$?" Really? Come on, think before you type things.... Nice dodge! Let me know when you grow a pair and want to back up _any_ of your claims.. at least you are smart enough to realize you are talking out of your ass and instead of putting money where your mouth is you dodge. The PR team for EG? Where do you get this stuff lol
didn't realise you needed $500 to bet to back up your claims
you're meeting irrationality with irrationality, which has ended in stupidity.
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EPT
