Don't think so atm. It's a relatively new game and player's that have been performing have been being consistent. Inconsistency comes from the player in my point of view (if you're referring to GSL upset's , ofcourse), and not from the game. As you can see, player's like MC have taken 2 GSL's and a DreamHack in relatively short time. Sometime's there build order's don't work out or they just play poorly with a bad strategy against their opponent.

I don't think the GSL is very significant proof either after
(T)

MVP won the WC
MKP made it to another Final
(Z)

NesTea and (Z)

FruitDealer made it out of the group stages
A lot of the semi-finalist's are consistent in staying from Ro16-4

dartoo

India2889 Posts

April 24 2011 15:31 GMT

#562

It does feel a lot more volatile because the game is very punishing..you dont see great come backs a lot in sc2. This is because there arent too many game changer spell that can completely turn things around for a side that is losing (A lot of the things said by mahini in his what is sc2 missing post will apply here). Most games come down to a big battle, and if you dont win that or retreat at the right time, your pretty much done.
The improved control also I feel has a part to play in this, the units do exactly what you tell them to do for most part, this reduces the effect of armies being controlled to not do stupid things, so the reward for micro-ing them perfectly also diminshes and hence the outcome is basically who has the better army.

Boundless

Canada588 Posts

April 24 2011 15:54 GMT

#563

See, I don't see how people can look at the current results and think there is a "randomness" or "inconsistency" to star2 as an esport. The best players are having consistently good results, and I'm sure a statistical analysis would yield the same results. MC has won two GSL championships and a Dreamhack invitational, MVP has taken a GSL and a world championship which included the best foreigners, and Nestea has won a GSL and continues to be the go-to player for IM in really important situations (read: both teamleagues).

Sure, MC lost to Thorzain, and yes, MVP is currently in Code A, but both of them deserved to lose. It wasn't a random coin flip that decided their fates, it was their own actions and the actions of the other players.

Look at the world's best golfers, people who are considered athletes by most people in North America; they can win four tournaments in a row one month, and then miss four cuts the next. However, that same guy is going to win again, and on average, he's probably finishing in the top 50 when you consider his all tournament results. It doesn't make any sense to call golf random because things like this happen.

Neither does it make sense to call star2 random when you see the same top players succeeding in many tournaments.

Herculix

United States946 Posts

April 24 2011 16:51 GMT

#564

single elim round robin tournament openers that determine your standing for the next month or longer are too volatile. i don't like the way GSL runs their opening rounds. it makes everything highly inconsistent. at this point, code A has really strong players too so it seems like virtually anyone can be knocked out of the GSL at this point if you just have 4 bad games.

two.watup

United States371 Posts

April 24 2011 17:15 GMT

#565

On April 25 2011 00:54 Boundless wrote:
See, I don't see how people can look at the current results and think there is a "randomness" or "inconsistency" to star2 as an esport. The best players are having consistently good results, and I'm sure a statistical analysis would yield the same results. MC has won two GSL championships and a Dreamhack invitational, MVP has taken a GSL and a world championship which included the best foreigners, and Nestea has won a GSL and continues to be the go-to player for IM in really important situations (read: both teamleagues).

Sure, MC lost to Thorzain, and yes, MVP is currently in Code A, but both of them deserved to lose. It wasn't a random coin flip that decided their fates, it was their own actions and the actions of the other players.

Look at the world's best golfers, people who are considered athletes by most people in North America; they can win four tournaments in a row one month, and then miss four cuts the next. However, that same guy is going to win again, and on average, he's probably finishing in the top 50 when you consider his all tournament results. It doesn't make any sense to call golf random because things like this happen.

Neither does it make sense to call star2 random when you see the same top players succeeding in many tournaments.

MC also lost in the GSL ro32 1-2. And was 2-0ed by Ret in NASL.

CodECleaR

United States395 Posts

April 24 2011 20:40 GMT

#566

Truth be told, the game is volatile BECAUSE it's so young.
Thats why MVP and BoxeR are in Code A--because many of the matchups are volatile and their solidness doesn't necessarily translate all the time because the game isnt perfect...yet.

Tachion

Canada8573 Posts

April 24 2011 20:45 GMT

#567

That's not the game being volatile, that's the players being volatile. MVP wasn't just randomly losing to Protoss for unknown reasons, his TvP was considerably his weakest match-up, hence why he got dropped to Code A. MC getting beat recently is because MC's play is risky and able to be abused. The players themselves are not all-around solid, which is why you see their status fluctuate so much.

dani`

Netherlands2402 Posts

April 24 2011 20:46 GMT

#568

[...] and Squirtle in Code B [...]

Squirtle plays in Code A on Monday, no worries he is still around!

Lokian

United States699 Posts

April 24 2011 20:58 GMT

#569

a lot of people play starcraft 2 thats why. there's just too many good players practicing all day on a relatively new game.

because sc2 is more 'user friendly' it unlocks more potential in more players. also, its not to the point where people have figured out the game/players.

but even now, MC won two titles, MVP also won multiple titles. If you take a look at how many players compete in sc2, you have to understand how hard it is to win multiple titles. if its entirely based on luck, the chances are pretty much impossible.

Kazang

578 Posts

April 24 2011 22:30 GMT

#570

On April 25 2011 05:40 CodECleaR wrote:
Truth be told, the game is volatile BECAUSE it's so young.
Thats why MVP and BoxeR are in Code A--because many of the matchups are volatile and their solidness doesn't necessarily translate all the time because the game isnt perfect...yet.

They are in code A because they played badly and lost some games.
Losing games is not a result of the game being "volatile", it is human nature, players are always going to have off days, weeks, even months.

Just last weekend Manchester City beat Manchester United in the FA Cup semi finals, Man City are on paper a weaker team, ManU have been smashing other teams right left and centre. Then they have one bad day and lose a game they should have won. That is how sport works, football is not "volatile" because the supposedly best team doesn't win everything 100% of the time. That is normal.

Up until recently Nestea had never lost a single ZvZ in the GSL. That is volatile? That is abnormally consistent. ZvZ is one of the most fragile matchups in SC2 with the extremely low error tolerance yet top players can go on winning streaks that last months.

MKP consistently getting second place in tournament after tournament. Idra getting cheesed out of tournaments and complaining constantly. KiwiKaki placing top5 in 3 out of 4 MLG events.

That to me is the is the exact opposite of volatile. That is stable and consistent.

R0YAL

United States1768 Posts

April 24 2011 22:35 GMT

#571

You better get used to players rising and falling because its going to happen a lot, theres too much competition for anything otherwise. How many other sports have 3 totally different matchups that you need to practice for? Everyone is human, we all have our strengths and our weaknesses. If you think someone won out of luck then your playing a build that isnt refined.

OzkanTheFlip

United States246 Posts

April 24 2011 22:40 GMT

#572

@OP boy you crazy

User was warned for this post

Datum

United States371 Posts

April 24 2011 22:51 GMT

#573

On April 25 2011 07:35 R0YAL wrote:
You better get used to players rising and falling because its going to happen a lot, theres too much competition for anything otherwise. How many other sports have 3 totally different matchups that you need to practice for? Everyone is human, we all have our strengths and our weaknesses. If you think someone won out of luck then your playing a build that isnt refined.

Well golf has a new course every tournament, baseball has a new pitcher every day, football teams play completely different styles, etc.

OP: I do think that comparisons to other sports can be helpful. Aside from boxing, where every match by the champion is by definition a title defense, there isn't any sport where the "best" player is expected to win more than 70% of the time. In non-team sports, the percentage is significantly lower. The SC2 scene just looks volatile because there are so few tournaments that we can't truly observe win-loss trends.

H2OSno

United States127 Posts

April 24 2011 23:28 GMT

#574

Starcraft 2 has been out for less than a year. Starcraft 1 was played professionally for 12 years. @OP I believe your view is skewed by the overall game feeling at the end of Starcraft 1, because it was the most recent experience you had with the game. At that time, Starcraft 1 was very refined, and had a lot of time for strategies/gamestyles/players to develop. Starcraft 2 will need time to develop into the epic game, but once it does... Oh hoh! :D