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- A new Grandmaster League has been added for 1v1 ladders. This league represents the Top 200 players in each region.
- Players are automatically drafted into Grandmaster League shortly after a new season starts, and will remain in the Grandmaster league until the end of the season.
So why the can't we just have the Top 200 players in one League?
How long will one ladder season be? 3 Months? No chance to get into Blizzards Top 200 during that time?
I guess you have to make everyone feel good... Why doesn't Blizzard just promote everyone that is in bronze and silver to gold without officialy removing those leagues too? Then we could all feel great because we're all gold and above players.
Can't we just have our leagues and then a Ladder that starts at 2000 and changes in real time?
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Amulet removal will also have a big effect on PvZ, where teching to amulet to counter the massive muta ball is standard.
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I'd be in favor of scrapping the current ladder and just having a standard Elo system with an average of 1500, no bonus pool shenanigans. You could even keep "placement matches" by having the first 5 games you play be worth 2-3 times the normal K-value.
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On February 27 2011 07:11 Kindred wrote:Terran Drops Are VERY effective. And so they can't be easy to pull off. Sure terran doesnt have something like that but how often does a terran get dropped on by a Protoss? Rarely. And if zerg wants to drop, it will rarely be a single Overlord, it will be a nydus or a fleet of full ovies.
Every now and then, i get a protoss opponent who does good drops. If that happens, i usually lose. As you figured, i can't warp in units in my base so i have to pull back my whole army. Just a few units is usually not enough since he can reinforce his drop with the prism.
The best reaction to a drop is scouting the drop before it happens and positioning units accordingly. That's the same for all races. It's just like terrans utilitze drops the most - probably because of medivacs secondary function. This isn't an excuse not to drop yourself.
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On February 27 2011 07:18 Despicatus wrote:
So why the can't we just have the Top 200 players in one League?
How long will one ladder season be? 3 Months? No chance to get into Blizzards Top 200 during that time?
Because realistically the bottom of the top 200 will shuffle every time they decide to update the top 200 list. Fixing it to be for an entire season makes the top 200 a showcase that the sc2 population can track and watch instead of a revolving door as people's ratings fluctuate.
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or nevermind what i am doing
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I wish there was a way to see highlighted players response to this
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can't believe people are saying an extra 5 seconds to bunker build time will do nothing, it seems like zergs kill off the building scv less than a second after it finishes the bunker usually, so five seconds is huge.
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On February 27 2011 07:03 proot wrote:Show nested quote +On February 27 2011 06:42 NecroSaint wrote:On February 27 2011 06:35 Salv wrote:On February 27 2011 06:30 hitman133 wrote:
Without khayderian amulet, there's no way protoss can stop 3 dropship full of marauders when the colossi balls are outside the expo. NEVER, unless they remove stim cuz that shit is fucking joke in this game. Scout it. I really can see this being a problem, and not just drop ships, on maps like xelnaga it is easy as hell for terran to just run small groups of marauders around the map to harrass expos etc. And this is hard to deal with if you do have khaydarian amulet, without it, gateway units just arent efficient enough to deal with small bio groups. And without any other fast responses, defending bases after your third is going to be very hard. I think they should keep the upgrade but make it so it only gives +20 damage, meaning you cant just instantly reinforce an army with storms, there is still a delay, which also makes it harder to deal with drops, but plausible without spreading your entire army around the map. If you've been watching how the high level protoss are playing, they are starting to spread their units out and gain map vision with observers/pylons. The high templar nerf is completely exaggerated by the protoss it's really funny to see. "OH MAN HOW DO WE DEAL WITH DROPS NOW?!?!?" The same way as before: scout well by building more than one observer and be careful with them, go phoenix/colossi if you really want to shut down harassment oriented terrans. The amulet was broken and needed a change, there is simply no way to argue that. HT defense was simply too good and prevented any harass options whatsoever. A 3 dropship drop is HUGE investment, it should require a portion of the protoss army to stop, not a couple of ht/zealot warpins. Top it off with HT/colossi pushes being pretty much unstoppable with storm constantly reinforcing and you can see why blizzard implemented the change. Drastic? Sure, but at least they acknowledged a broken ability and fixed it. I agree, they should have approached it a little differently, maybe buffing storm aoe to compensate, but i'm sure they'll do something to quiet down all the crying.
The amulet prevented so many harass, that we never see drops when HT are out, it's really an amazing thing! On a not sarcastic note, a lot of the times terran just kill the HT while it's morphing in, others they just move out of the storm and keep on doing damage. You know, warpgates have cooldown, and when ppl say late game you have 10 gates, it's not like they are all ready to pump out units just for the case of a drop. Besides, late game you can't just leave army scatered around the base. How many times weaker is your main army then? Do i even need to say how marauders and marines wreck cannons? If HT are broken so are planetary fortresses, or fungal growth. Each race has it way of dealing with different things.
Oh and by being careful with observeers i suppose you mean to try to dodge a scan + vikings or marines right? Seems pretty easy for me! Not to mention when those die without anything i can do now i only have to sacrifice a couple of colossus and make more obs to scatter all around the map on all the possible locations i can be dropped!
And 3 medivac drop is not an investment at all. Those units are part of your army already whether you use them for drop or not. It's not like warping in zealots with a warp prism, which are specifically made for harass, the zealots will most likely die and the warp prism won't have any other use. That is an invenstment, not terran drops. If anything for the terran it's a high risk high reward situation, where he hopes he's not noticed soon, or the army is far away and he can do damage and run away with minimal losses.
I'm sorry, try again with other (better) arguments.
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On February 27 2011 07:29 nodule wrote:
I wish there was a way to see highlighted players response to this
+1 I wish there was a way to only show highlighted posters after a thread gets to a certain size...! somone make a thread/threat about it... :-)
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United States7483 Posts
On February 27 2011 07:26 Lurk wrote:Show nested quote +On February 27 2011 07:11 Kindred wrote:Terran Drops Are VERY effective. And so they can't be easy to pull off. Sure terran doesnt have something like that but how often does a terran get dropped on by a Protoss? Rarely. And if zerg wants to drop, it will rarely be a single Overlord, it will be a nydus or a fleet of full ovies.
Every now and then, i get a protoss opponent who does good drops. If that happens, i usually lose. As you figured, i can't warp in units in my base so i have to pull back my whole army. Just a few units is usually not enough since he can reinforce his drop with the prism. The best reaction to a drop is scouting the drop before it happens and positioning units accordingly. That's the same for all races. It's just like terrans utilitze drops the most - probably because of medivacs secondary function. This isn't an excuse not to drop yourself.
It's generally because terran bio functions amazingly awesome in smallish/middle sizes, and gateway units suck. A medivac is a serious and major threat most of the time, if it's got marauders you can easily snipe buildings, marines and you'll still take a lot of damage. There really aren't any protoss units that are that threatening from a drop. Robo units are very expensive and suck on their own, making it very risky, and even immortals don't kill buildings fast enough like marauders do. Warp prisms also don't heal your drop, and have less hp than medivacs.
It's not really that warp prisms are bad, just that terran has better units to do drops with.
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United States7483 Posts
On February 27 2011 07:29 jalstar wrote:
can't believe people are saying an extra 5 seconds to bunker build time will do nothing, it seems like zergs kill off the building scv less than a second after it finishes the bunker usually, so five seconds is huge.
Yeah, it will nerf 2 racks bunker rushes. Thank god for that, that cheese was getting tiring, and I don't even play zerg.
Other than that, it won't do much of anything. Bunkers are still free -_-.
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United States15275 Posts
I'm not a fan of the fungal growth changes.
Bonus damage against armored units is nice, and increased DPS would be usually taken as a buff. However, Fungal Growth is not Storm or EMP. It dealt relatively low damage in exchange for crowd control and positioning. In that sense the insta-cast nature was essential since FG was most effective against mobile units (bioball with stim, medivac drops, banshees, blink stalkers, lings with speed, banelings with speed, etc.). You use FG to set up Baneling pushes, get surrounds on the Protoss army, prevent drops from occurring.
Now we have a FG with 9 DPS and +10.8 against armored, and the very units one would want to use FG against can dodge it with relative ease.
The bias towards the Infestor is positively palpable.
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Im gold player ( 3000+ ) and have HUGE problems with EMP's. For people who don't play that much ( like me ) taking Amulet and leaving EMP's ( click stim and kill protos ) just like it is. I don't have huge APM and can't feedback ghost's perfect... sometimes 2-3 emp's land on my army and it die in seconds... Maybe Starcraft2 is for ppl who spend more than 2 hours playing a week or 2-3 days. Maybe i shouldn't play.
Sory but nerfing spell that make demage on time, and leaving EMP with drains all energy instantly is very dumb. For you pro master players it isn't easy to fend off but for me it is much much harder. My colo die instantly from Vikings with have huge advantage and can be mass produced very quickly. That game should be redesigned. Now it leave no space for players like me.
We have 4 gate builds, mass colo against zerg with can't produce anti colo unit so quickly, and then it became useless... everything seams to be broken... Even storm now have huge dmg, low terrans have problems with it.
There should be text on the box " don't buy it if you don't have time for it "
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I'd be ok with leaving amulet the way it is and even giving templars storm for free - if they removed feedback instead. That would not impact HTs effectiveness against bio - even make it stronger since storm would be out sooner. But it would allow for more diverse play from terrans - as of right now, banshees and ravens are basically a liability to have in the lategame because they just die instantly to feedback.
What do protoss players think about this ?
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On February 27 2011 07:18 Despicatus wrote:Show nested quote +- A new Grandmaster League has been added for 1v1 ladders. This league represents the Top 200 players in each region.
- Players are automatically drafted into Grandmaster League shortly after a new season starts, and will remain in the Grandmaster league until the end of the season.
So why the can't we just have the Top 200 players in one League? How long will one ladder season be? 3 Months? No chance to get into Blizzards Top 200 during that time? I guess you have to make everyone feel good... Why doesn't Blizzard just promote everyone that is in bronze and silver to gold without officialy removing those leagues too? Then we could all feel great because we're all gold and above players. Can't we just have our leagues and then a Ladder that starts at 2000 and changes in real time?
No, that would be putting useful features in previous games and adding them to their most recent ones. They have a strict policy against that if you haven't noticed.
Edit:
On February 27 2011 07:52 Lurk wrote:
I'd be ok with leaving amulet the way it is and even giving templars storm for free - if they removed feedback instead. That would not impact HTs effectiveness against bio - even make it stronger since storm would be out sooner. But it would allow for more diverse play from terrans - as of right now, banshees and ravens are basically a liability to have in the lategame because they just die instantly to feedback.
What do protoss players think about this ?
I don't think terran players would be happy with this since storm seems to be the main concern.
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Keep in mind that neither the ghost nor infestor can combine to create a very beefy melee unit that does extra damage to bio. You neglected to put that in your spreadsheet.
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EPT
