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Mod Edit: GSL Spoilers in this thread
(This might belong in custom maps, but I think the issue here is a more general one and maps are just the solution. Mods can move the thread if they feel otherwise.)
After seeing today's GSL games I thought the spying of match histories might be a huge issue for current and future leagues. Since Blizzard doesn't want to give the option to hide our score screen and builds in any kind of game, I experimented a bit with the map editor. Sure enough it just took a few simple changes to break the score screen so that your strategies remain hidden. I did it for all the 1v1 ladder maps except Delta Quadrant, which I didn't manage to find the original map file for (added DQ now). The maps are currently published on EU and US and you can find them by going to Multiplayer -> Create Game and typing "BO hider" in the search box. If someone wants to make hidden versions of other maps, here are the quick instructions:
+ Show Spoiler +1) Open the map file in editor.
2) Map -> Map Info and set the new name/author/description, copy to all locales.
3) Map -> Game Variants, add a variant with name "Hidden build" or something, get rid of the other variants.
4) Data Editor (F7), Set Data Type to Score Results.
5) Click Build Order and make a change to the data on the right side, like checking the Hidden checkbox.
6) Back on the left side on the screen, right click Build Order and select Remove Object.
7) Repeat 5 and 6 for Economy Breakdown, Units and Graphs.
8) Click Standard on the left side, then on the right side under Headers delete everything except Score Summary.
9) Save your map. File -> Publish, login to bnet if needed, set the parameters correctly (like Release: Private or Public, Locked/Unlocked).
10) Click Ok, accept the terms and let the map upload.
What happens when someone wants to view that match in your match history (also what you see after game):
![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/5zDMP.jpg)
Here's a link to the maps themselves, you DON'T need to download this if you play on EU or US
http://www.mediafire.com/?az8ntpotbjhnpiv
If you have questions or find something that I screwed up (or a better way to do this) post them here.
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wow you are FAST... so so fast at coming up with these
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Very interesting.. thanks for sharing!
I know a few players that as soon as they see who they are playing in a tournament will go to that players match history and start lurking and see what they are practicing against certain matchups. As unfair as this is.. its available to everyone.. I am not necessarily convinced this is something blizz should take out of the game.
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Aotearoa39261 Posts
Awesome  might save pros shelling out for a practice account
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Very interesting, but wouldn't someone who wanted to know your build order be able to find out anyway by watching the replay?
Edit: NM I just realized this is for people who are spying on your games. Hopefully this helps any future readers with any confusion 
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That's brilliant! Thanks a lot, I hated the whole idea of this spying thing!
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Excellent find. I think people will be using this quite a bit.
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sick, this is going to be used heaps lol..
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On September 15 2010 22:55 Plexa wrote:Awesome might save pros shelling out for a practice account
Indeed. Especially as famous players might get outed pretty quickly and have to spend even more moeny on new accounts.
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Cool
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Teddyman is so awesome, gj
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Awesome idea, hadn't even realized that was possible. Lightning fast also
Guess it will save the pro's for having to ask their mother, brother, ex-babysitter and dogwalker for their Korean ID's to register on the KR ladder...
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Good job. I hope this will get more popular among progamers.
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Just noticed that this also ruins replays - you don't get a replay saved anywhere after playing a game on one of these maps. If someone figures out a way to do this and keep replays working, it would be great. In addition, I don't know if this prevents your computer from getting the data for the game or if it just doesn't show it. In the latter case it would theoretically be possible to use a packet sniffer to see the builds anyway.
Does anyone have the map file name (in the b.net cache) or download site for Delta Quadrant?
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only works if you play it with practice partners. Problem is alot of players like IdrA play ladder to practice so obviously this isn't useful to him
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Germany767 Posts
Is it possible for somebody to post the already changed maps?
That stuff would be pretty good for the whole house here
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He already posted the source maps. I reckon someone would just have to download and then publish them on your realm via the map editor.
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This is totally yet another thing that you should have sent to TLO and told us about after the GSL was over 
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On September 16 2010 00:16 Liquid`TLO wrote:Is it possible for somebody to post the already changed maps? That stuff would be pretty good for the whole house here
TLO u feeling better?? hope so
on topic: I think this is really great as that whole spying thing seems really cheap and annoying,
+ Show Spoiler +and im pretty sure thats wat lost IdrA game 2
User was warned for this post
Edit: spoilered the GSL spoiler, my bad, apologize, won't happen again
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Now that is pretty awesome. It's great for those who are practicing in clans/houses.
Great job.
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On September 16 2010 00:16 Liquid`TLO wrote:Is it possible for somebody to post the already changed maps? That stuff would be pretty good for the whole house here
I think there is a source map link on the OP, haven't checked what's in it though.
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Germany767 Posts
oh think I just misunderstood... ignore me, I am stupid! ^^
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If only this could be used for bnet games. I'm not high enough for this to really matter but for the pros...
Nice work there Mr. OP
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On September 16 2010 00:54 Liquid`TLO wrote:
oh think I just misunderstood... ignore me, I am stupid! ^^
no sir, you are the great white hope!
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Sounds nice and wow, that was really fast
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On September 16 2010 00:58 mcneebs wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2010 00:54 Liquid`TLO wrote:
oh think I just misunderstood... ignore me, I am stupid! ^^
no sir, you are the great white hope!
+ Show Spoiler +Only foreigner left in the GSL, he speaks the truth.
User was warned for this post
Edit: Fixed, sorry, didn't even think about the possibility that someone didn't watch the GSLs live. :o
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This is nice, too bad Blizzard doesn't just include an option to just hide your build for both ladder and custom.
Still, this is an awesome contribution. Thanks a lot!
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On September 16 2010 00:15 Teddyman wrote:
Just noticed that this also ruins replays - you don't get a replay saved anywhere after playing a game on one of these maps. If someone figures out a way to do this and keep replays working, it would be great. In addition, I don't know if this prevents your computer from getting the data for the game or if it just doesn't show it. In the latter case it would theoretically be possible to use a packet sniffer to see the builds anyway.
Does anyone have the map file name (in the b.net cache) or download site for Delta Quadrant?
For someone competetive, that's probably a good thing. Replays leaking out always was a bit of an issue for pro's in sc, and now with b.net 2.0...
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I think there's a real difference between not wanting replays leaked and not possessing them. Analysis through replays is sure to exist in the high end of gaming. While leaks are certainly an issue, literally not being able to obtain them is a huge detriment imo.
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This is really great. Thanks for sharing this! i appreciate it
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I have 9 open map slots on US, since it looks like no one's started over here yet I'll throw up as many as I can. Thanks for discovering this!
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On September 16 2010 00:58 mcneebs wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2010 00:54 Liquid`TLO wrote:
oh think I just misunderstood... ignore me, I am stupid! ^^
no sir, you are the great white hope!
TLO FITIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIING
Get better soon.
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wow sick! very nice for teams that in-house a lot!
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+ Show Spoiler +On September 16 2010 00:21 PlaGuE_R wrote:
on topic: I think this is really great as that whole spying thing seems really cheap and annoying, and im pretty sure thats wat lost IdrA game 2
If anything, from what I've read, it almost went the other way...
+ Show Spoiler +it sounded like IdrA was the one spying BO's and was discovered, so his opponent changed his strategy at the last minute... I originally prepared a different build. I was going to do a fast Colossus followed by an all-in. However, I learned early this morning Idra was preparing against my build order and preparing against another team's Protoss players. The Protoss player was using a build I was going to use. So I saw that with Hyungjoo Hyung, and so I quickly adjusted my build.
-from http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=153148
User was warned for this post
Edit: Sorry, didn't mean to have the spoiler up. My bad, won't happen again.
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wow thanks!
its a shame im not good enough for my builds to matter :/
(in-fact i would love it and be honored if people wanted to steal builds from me hahaha)
but pros will love you forever
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This is an amazing idea!!
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wow this is amazing
I love how you people can just whip this shit up like its nothing, golly
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I was in a 2v2 tourney with blabber and we always looked at the match history of our opponents to see their builds. For example we found out one person teched to quick ghosts if they had shared mains, etc. Helped in the Bo5 which we bareyl won (jesus ghosts mixed in MM early game are strong when they EMP toss army and are also very good at hitting zerg units!).
Also used it to check if people did 6rax reaper and 10pools (or 6 pools), etc.
Thought the feature was retarded.
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On September 16 2010 00:15 Teddyman wrote:
Does anyone have the map file name (in the b.net cache) or download site for Delta Quadrant?
Here you can download all blizzard maps - Delta Quadrant included
http://www.sc2portal.org/maps/
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On September 16 2010 01:02 Achillean wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2010 00:58 mcneebs wrote:On September 16 2010 00:54 Liquid`TLO wrote:
oh think I just misunderstood... ignore me, I am stupid! ^^
no sir, you are the great white hope! [edited for spoilers] We're all rooting for you TLO!
FFS. Thanks for the spoilers :/
User was warned for this post
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Apologies, the following quote contains someone's spoiler of a GSL match from the previous night:
+ Show Spoiler +On September 16 2010 01:57 samalie wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2010 00:21 PlaGuE_R wrote:
on topic: I think this is really great as that whole spying thing seems really cheap and annoying, and im pretty sure thats wat lost IdrA game 2 If anything, from what I've read, it almost went the other way... it sounded like IdrA was the one spying BO's and was discovered, so his opponent changed his strategy at the last minute... Show nested quote +I originally prepared a different build. I was going to do a fast Colossus followed by an all-in. However, I learned early this morning Idra was preparing against my build order and preparing against another team's Protoss players. The Protoss player was using a build I was going to use. So I saw that with Hyungjoo Hyung, and so I quickly adjusted my build.
-from http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=153148
When the GSL went live last night, Tasteless said that IdrA had viewed his opponent's build order recently. However, he also mentioned that the several Korean players were teaming up to share replays and information on IdrA to try to knock him out of the tournament early.
Take what you will from that.
On September 16 2010 02:25 Noital wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2010 00:15 Teddyman wrote:
Does anyone have the map file name (in the b.net cache) or download site for Delta Quadrant? Here you can download all blizzard maps - Delta Quadrant included link
I don't know if it's just me, but that site won't load. According to google cache, it's a site that works on SC2 cracks, anyways. Might want to reconsider linking to it.
User was warned for this post
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On September 16 2010 02:25 Noital wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2010 00:15 Teddyman wrote:
Does anyone have the map file name (in the b.net cache) or download site for Delta Quadrant? Here you can download all blizzard maps - Delta Quadrant included http://www.sc2portal.org/maps/
Thanks, updated OP and published it.
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Great stuff Teddyman! That's what i call community effort!
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Good to see the foolishness of build order spying will be stopped cold- great work.
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Cool trick, very nice having info and cool tricks popping up so often.
+ Show Spoiler +If only this info had come out 3 weeks ago, maybe Idra could've been more sneaky
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Alright, there's an enUS locale up for Blistering Sands on US servers, I'll just do that to the other 8 maps and they should all be up within 20 minutes or so.
You can find them by searching the popular list for "BO Hider".
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this is great nice job where do you save the map files if you download it from the mediafire link?
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Man, he should have pm'd TLO the maps, so he could roflstomp the koreans
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On September 16 2010 03:24 avilo wrote:this is great nice job where do you save the map files if you download it from the mediafire link?
Maps on your computer can only be played via Test Map, which doesn't show in Battle.net anyways.
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Amazing work! Like you said earlier, I think this is only a temporary fix because of the missing replay function, but it will probably get some players through the next few rounds of the GSL uncompromised while some other wizards work on a more permanent solution.
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Katowice25012 Posts
This is a really great initiative, thanks
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On September 16 2010 02:51 FireHazard wrote:Cool trick, very nice having info and cool tricks popping up so often. + Show Spoiler +If only this info had come out 3 weeks ago, maybe Idra could've been more sneaky
You mean less sneaky, since the issue was that his attempt to exploit this backfired on him.
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Very nice find indeed. Just a small note, gold mineral patches and Xel'Naga towers have disappeared from the maps. Do you know how to fix that?
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Alright! All of the standard maps are available on US servers with Teddyman's miracle voodoo applied. He's been credited via the author variable in the editor but I don't even know where that ends up showing, so sorry if that's not clear.
Shoot me a PM if one of the maps isn't doing what it should since I applied the changes manually, I'll go over it ASAP.
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On September 16 2010 03:41 nukkuj wrote:
Very nice find indeed. Just a small note, gold mineral patches and Xel'Naga towers have disappeared from the maps. Do you know how to fix that?
Wow, that's more like a large note. I'll look into it but I just picked up the editor so I have no idea what could be causing that.
Update: Delta Quadrant seems to have those, so I guess I just managed to download some fucked up maps. I'll be going over them one by one.
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On September 16 2010 03:46 Teddyman wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2010 03:41 nukkuj wrote:
Very nice find indeed. Just a small note, gold mineral patches and Xel'Naga towers have disappeared from the maps. Do you know how to fix that? Wow, that's more like a large note. I'll look into it but I just picked up the editor so I have no idea what could be causing that.
The maps were probably taken from before they changed what units High Yield and Towers were. Just delete the invisible ones and place down new ones.
Edit: Metalopolis was the only old one in my batch which I pulled from my own cache files. All of your maps may be fine. Just open up each one to see if the minerals/towers are invisible and tagged as (unknown).
The problem's fixed on US servers. Have fun!
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this is awesome...im sure players in the GSL will use this to their advantage
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f-ing awesome contribution man, great work!
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On September 16 2010 03:46 Teddyman wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2010 03:41 nukkuj wrote:
Very nice find indeed. Just a small note, gold mineral patches and Xel'Naga towers have disappeared from the maps. Do you know how to fix that? Wow, that's more like a large note. I'll look into it but I just picked up the editor so I have no idea what could be causing that. Update: Delta Quadrant seems to have those, so I guess I just managed to download some fucked up maps. I'll be going over them one by one.
2.0 versions seem to work well. Cheers!
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Wow, managed to upload Scrap Station as Steppes of War... 3.0 incoming.
All of them should work now with towers and gold expansions, download has been updated.
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On September 16 2010 04:16 Teddyman wrote:
Wow, managed to upload Scrap Station as Steppes of War... 3.0 incoming.
If you tick Minor revision as opposed to Major revision on the publishing screen, you'll be editing v2.14 a week from now instead of v114.0.
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are these up on us server yet? I don't see em
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Wow that was super fast. Nice job Teddy!
+ Show Spoiler +On September 16 2010 00:21 PlaGuE_R wrote:
on topic: I think this is really great as that whole spying thing seems really cheap and annoying, and im pretty sure thats wat lost IdrA game 2 IdrA lost to poor scouting and a player who outsmarted him, enough said.
User was warned for this post
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On September 16 2010 04:19 avilo wrote:are these up on us server yet? I don't see em
As posted previously, search for "BO Hider".
Er, search for "BO Hider" after I remember to make them public. Which is now.
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Hey, sounds kool, anyway to know for sure this isnt bannable for editing files? or is this only altering saved files not changing the game files?
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On September 16 2010 04:22 noproblem wrote:Wow that was super fast. Nice job Teddy! Show nested quote +On September 16 2010 00:21 PlaGuE_R wrote:
on topic: I think this is really great as that whole spying thing seems really cheap and annoying, and im pretty sure thats wat lost IdrA game 2 IdrA lost to poor scouting and a player who outsmarted him, enough said.
i agree. Idra didnt lose because of that. Idra lost because he chose to blindly follow the other players "usual" build in that situation. Putting himself at a huge risk and losing because of it.
User was warned for this post
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On September 16 2010 04:26 Pure.Calm wrote:
Hey, sounds kool, anyway to know for sure this isnt bannable for editing files? or is this only altering saved files not changing the game files?
It's completely legal. No one's game files are being edited, just new maps are being made that are edited from old maps.
Clarity edit: Your BO will still show up on all other maps. To hide your build order, you must search for and play on BO Hider maps specifically.
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AMAZING job Thanks so much for this! Best map ever! (well. Obviously it's arguable..) lol
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Thanks, this is absolutely needed for practicing.
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Very awesome response to the privacy problem!
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How are the BO's parsed, is this on Blizzard's servers or is this part of the map file that generates them? Is it possible to modify the BO after the match is done? That would up the metagame stakes considerably.
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On September 16 2010 05:11 vesicular wrote:
How are the BO's parsed, is this on Blizzard's servers or is this part of the map file that generates them? Is it possible to modify the BO after the match is done? That would up the metagame stakes considerably.
The map tracks all information and delivers it to B.Net after the game is over. Teddyman broke it simply by finding a way to remove the tracker in the map, which it normally won't let you do.
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On September 16 2010 00:21 PlaGuE_R wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2010 00:16 Liquid`TLO wrote:Is it possible for somebody to post the already changed maps? That stuff would be pretty good for the whole house here TLO u feeling better?? hope so on topic: I think this is really great as that whole spying thing seems really cheap and annoying, and im pretty sure thats wat lost IdrA game 2
Wow dude, thank you so very much for spoiling a game for me! Really... I appreciate it...
Use a spoiler tag for god sakes please next time.
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For the few who need this. This is great
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I've always wanted to hide my BO, and with BO hider, my BO is virtually non-existant
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On September 16 2010 05:25 pat965 wrote:
I've always wanted to hide my BO, and with BO hider, my BO is virtually non-existant
I laughed, thanks.
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+ Show Spoiler +I actually loved how people spying on their opponents BO turned out badly for those spying anyways. Torch, Idra. Both got knocked out by their opponent figuring out they knew their build orders.
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Well done OP! Very appreciated!
Blizzard are retarded for ignoring the users about privacy issues and no chat rooms. Really annoying.
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Sweet, thanks for the maps! This is pretty big.
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This will be brilliant for people with practice partners for sure.
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United States7166 Posts
this is great for customs but ladder games you still have build orders available, they really need to add an option to hide it from the public
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I am happy that no more BO spying possible but at the same time I am sad that I won't be able to see replays if all tournaments start using this.
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Nice find! This should be good for BO hiding.
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On September 16 2010 06:16 positron. wrote:
I am happy that no more BO spying possible but at the same time I am sad that I won't be able to see replays if all tournaments start using this.
It doesn't kill your replays...and I wouldn't bet on tournaments using anything other than an official map.
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too bad this couldn't have helped IdrA...
User was warned for this post
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Is it possible to add things to the score screen? ex: adding APM chart to the graph section?
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For the love of god people, stop the freaking spoiling already. There's still people that don't know Idra got kicked out of GSL. Use the spoiler tag.
User was warned for this post
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10387 Posts
If Activision-Blizzard is as greedy as it is said to be, then expect to see a patch that nulls this map so that pros have to buy another account lololol
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On September 16 2010 08:52 ArvickHero wrote:
If Activision-Blizzard is as greedy as it is said to be, then expect to see a patch that nulls this map so that pros have to buy another account lololol
They're the same people who've allowed ICCup to exist, I don't think they have a problem with allowing competitive stimulus.
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Somebody's going to get banned for modifying the game files.
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On September 16 2010 09:19 Wolfpox wrote:
Somebody's going to get banned for modifying the game files.
No game files have been modified in the making of these maps, nor are your game files or engine at risk from the use of these maps. They are simply maps produced using only the Blizzard-made Galaxy Editor.
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On September 16 2010 09:15 urashimakt wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2010 08:52 ArvickHero wrote:
If Activision-Blizzard is as greedy as it is said to be, then expect to see a patch that nulls this map so that pros have to buy another account lololol They're the same people who've allowed ICCup to exist, I don't think they have a problem with allowing competitive stimulus.
they allowed iccup to exist... what? 6 years after release? where they considered BW dead?
they finally realized... hey, maybe starcraft is still kicking? So lets kill BW esports to force SC2 down our throats
bullshit.
they were lazy about bw
can you imagine them letting ICCUP to exist on sc2? their main cash cow?
screw that, they will shut it down
don't think they are the generous people that you think they are
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On September 16 2010 09:27 Garaman wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2010 09:15 urashimakt wrote:On September 16 2010 08:52 ArvickHero wrote:
If Activision-Blizzard is as greedy as it is said to be, then expect to see a patch that nulls this map so that pros have to buy another account lololol They're the same people who've allowed ICCup to exist, I don't think they have a problem with allowing competitive stimulus. they allowed iccup to exist... what? 6 years after release? where they considered BW dead? they finally realized... hey, maybe starcraft is still kicking? So lets kill BW esports to force SC2 down our throats bullshit. they were lazy about bw can you imagine them letting ICCUP to exist on sc2? their main cash cow? screw that, they will shut it down don't think they are the generous people that you think they are
It's completely possible that they just ignored ICCup because it didn't conflict with their flow of cash, and I'd expect that if it had they would have cut it off. But since it didn't conflict with profit to any large degree and this doesn't conflict with profit to any large degree, the point still stands that they probably won't see anything wrong with a competitive tool.
An ICCup for SC2 would conflict very much with their profits since they want to sell you their ladder, which makes sense.
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On September 16 2010 09:33 urashimakt wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2010 09:27 Garaman wrote:On September 16 2010 09:15 urashimakt wrote:On September 16 2010 08:52 ArvickHero wrote:
If Activision-Blizzard is as greedy as it is said to be, then expect to see a patch that nulls this map so that pros have to buy another account lololol They're the same people who've allowed ICCup to exist, I don't think they have a problem with allowing competitive stimulus. they allowed iccup to exist... what? 6 years after release? where they considered BW dead? they finally realized... hey, maybe starcraft is still kicking? So lets kill BW esports to force SC2 down our throats bullshit. they were lazy about bw can you imagine them letting ICCUP to exist on sc2? their main cash cow? screw that, they will shut it down don't think they are the generous people that you think they are It's completely possible that they just ignored ICCup because it didn't conflict with their flow of cash, and I'd expect that if it had they would have cut it off. But since it didn't conflict with profit to any large degree and this doesn't conflict with profit to any large degree, the point still stands that they probably won't see anything wrong with a competitive tool. An ICCup for SC2 would conflict very much with their profits since they want to sell you their ladder, which makes sense.
i'm not sure if they care if you play on their ladder or somewhere else as long as
A) you have to buy the game (or subscribe w/e)
B) as long as there are no micro-transactions in the game yet.
it might actually help selling the game to people who did not buy the game because of horrible, horrible bnet2.0 (if those people actually exist).
and tough one could say more about this topic it is not really what this thread is about now is it? =)
i hope blizz will add an option to hide your match history (even the ppl you played, as one could just PM them and ask them what BO was used) or at least will let us use maps like these.
but im not sure if the faith put in to blizzard is well placed.
time will tell.
At any event: thank you for those maps.
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On September 16 2010 09:19 Wolfpox wrote:
Somebody's going to get banned for modifying the game files.
I didn't know that you can get banned for playing custom maps...
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Awesome work man! This is a great fix for the match-history viewing problem. Hopefully Blizzard will come to their senses and fix that problem soon enough! =0
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The topic title should be edited to
"How to practice with privacy - Hide BO"
so it's easy to find with google.
pro:
-) more exposure for tl
-) more exposure for the author
-) more people finding this and beeing able to hide their practice game bo's
cons:
-) none?
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Nice, that's a creative solution!
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+ Show Spoiler +On September 16 2010 08:52 marcusklaas wrote:
For the love of god people, stop the freaking spoiling already. There's still people that don't know Idra got kicked out of GSL. Use the spoiler tag.
User was warned for this post
Says the guy who spoils it himself?
durrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
On topic : It's a shame that it's gonna come down to doing something "technical" like this or having to buy an extra account to avoid getting spied on...
It would be nicer if they just added an option to make your account "private", like only visible to your friends list, or even no one. (people you added)
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On September 16 2010 09:27 Garaman wrote:
sc2? their main cash cow?
Guess you haven't heard of this little thing called "World of WarCraft."
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Can you still watch replay of these games?
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On September 16 2010 12:31 Dox wrote:Guess you haven't heard of this little thing called "World of WarCraft."
I wasn't gonna bring that up.
On September 16 2010 12:44 TheKing wrote:
Can you still watch replay of these games?
You absolutely can, sir. It only affects your match history records of that game.
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Great idea, good work. I got a question though, in regards to maps, we all know Blizzard's maps suck for high level play, so why are none of the leagues/tourneys starting to put custom ones out akin to KeSPA maps.
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On September 16 2010 13:32 SichuanPanda wrote:
Great idea, good work. I got a question though, in regards to maps, we all know Blizzard's maps suck for high level play, so why are none of the leagues/tourneys starting to put custom ones out akin to KeSPA maps.
I'd like to see it happen too, but who would be in charge of that? We don't have an SC2 version of ICCup or Proleague to hand out maps they deem "good". Some entity has to arise and be approved of to hand out map ultimatums, preferably one with better taste than Blizzard.
And yes, the praise of Teddyman should be endless.
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How about get another account, use that secret account to practice, and use ur famous account to stomp in tournament?
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On September 16 2010 15:29 MoriyaGXP wrote:How about get another account, use that secret account to practice, and use ur famous account to stomp in tournament?
Pros:
-You can ladder privately like this
Cons:
-People can still check your build orders, they just might not have a name to tie it to
-If you play practice games against your known teammates on their main accounts or known smurfs, it's pretty obvious anyways
-You're out $60 + expansions (in the future) every time someone leaks your identity
Teddyman's BO Hider is free and fixes all the cons, but just doesn't have that 1 pro. If you're super serious about practicing on both ladder and against teammates, I'd suggest using a single smurf account solely for ladder and do all non-ladder activities on your main account with BO Hider.
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On September 16 2010 15:29 MoriyaGXP wrote:How about get another account, use that secret account to practice, and use ur famous account to stomp in tournament?
your account is gonna get leaked eventually even if you only ladder (if you even need to keep your builds a secret you are probably capable of getting #1 on ladder... not a very good secret)
and if you practice with good practice partners i'm sure somebody would be smart enough to do detective work and check out a lot of pro match histories
this method seems far more reliable and less expensive
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Buying another account doesn't work particularly well unless your practice partners also buy their own 2nd accounts.
Example: Let's say I'm Morrow, and I'm about to play an important Bo5 vs. Dimaga. Dimaga spends the entire day before the match practicing ZvT with DeMusliM, with DeMusliM on his main account and Dimaga on a smurf. As Morrow, I now see several hours of practice matches between DeMusliM and some random unknown Zerg account with few to no ladder games played, and a style of play reminiscent of Dimaga's, and it's pretty easy to connect the dots from there.
Ok, so what if DeMusliM also gets a smurf account? Sure, that'd work for this particular instance. But what happens if a month down the line Dimaga and DeMusliM are going to face each other in an important match? What do they do now? Do they both need to get a THIRD account just so that they can practice . . . and so on.
Anyways, fortunately these maps exist for pro players who are concerned about this.
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These will probably be some of the most important custom maps made. Amazing job!
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Great idea!
This is a feature that should've been in B.net in the first place. T T
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On September 16 2010 00:16 Liquid`TLO wrote:Is it possible for somebody to post the already changed maps? That stuff would be pretty good for the whole house here
indeed it would be...
great idea OP...
and TLO... GL in your games.. hope you're feeling better
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This is excellent work, OP. I'm very glad to see someone taking the time to help the community with this. I'm sure every single professional-level player will appreciate this greatly.
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I'm pretty sure top players have multiple accounts anyway
Nice work regardless
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On September 17 2010 07:37 Bleb wrote:
I'm pretty sure top players have multiple accounts anyway
Nice work regardless
This doesn't work. You are Z1, you practice with P2, P3 and P4 prior to a game series you are going to do.
You are Z1, you face P2 in a series. P2 knows of your other account.
It just takes longer the more accounts you have.
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On September 15 2010 22:55 Plexa wrote:Awesome might save pros shelling out for a practice account
Pretty Much.
Hopefully Blizzard enables a way to toggle the match history, on and off :/
But thanks for sharing, will be helpful for lans and such ^^
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Two things.
1) Happy birthday
2) Thank you for discovering this. You've made a lot of people happy.
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On September 16 2010 15:10 urashimakt wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2010 13:32 SichuanPanda wrote:
Great idea, good work. I got a question though, in regards to maps, we all know Blizzard's maps suck for high level play, so why are none of the leagues/tourneys starting to put custom ones out akin to KeSPA maps. I'd like to see it happen too, but who would be in charge of that? We don't have an SC2 version of ICCup or Proleague to hand out maps they deem "good". Some entity has to arise and be approved of to hand out map ultimatums, preferably one with better taste than Blizzard. And yes, the praise of Teddyman should be endless.
Actually some tournaments HAVE used some of the non ladder Blizzard maps, such as Crossfire, Jungle Basin, and Agria Valley. Given, MLG, ESL, and GSL haven't.
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On September 16 2010 10:03 Nightfall.589 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2010 09:19 Wolfpox wrote:
Somebody's going to get banned for modifying the game files. I didn't know that you can get banned for playing custom maps...
I misunderstood the original post. I thought he was talking about modifying files to break the game score or whatever
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On September 17 2010 14:53 Tump wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2010 15:10 urashimakt wrote:On September 16 2010 13:32 SichuanPanda wrote:
Great idea, good work. I got a question though, in regards to maps, we all know Blizzard's maps suck for high level play, so why are none of the leagues/tourneys starting to put custom ones out akin to KeSPA maps. I'd like to see it happen too, but who would be in charge of that? We don't have an SC2 version of ICCup or Proleague to hand out maps they deem "good". Some entity has to arise and be approved of to hand out map ultimatums, preferably one with better taste than Blizzard. And yes, the praise of Teddyman should be endless. Actually some tournaments HAVE used some of the non ladder Blizzard maps, such as Crossfire, Jungle Basin, and Agria Valley. Given, MLG, ESL, and GSL haven't.
I'm sure that's true, but it's also not what was being discussed! Individual tourneys can do whatever they want with a map pool and that's perfectly fine. We were on the topic of a map-making organization distributing widely to tournaments, a la KeSPA.
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This is a pretty awesome fix since a lot of players practice on customs a lot. Maybe Blizzard can include a checkbox in your profile or something about autohiding BO's on your match list but until then this is awesome.
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Even better idea, switch accounts with your teammates when laddering and practicing. When your enemies try to counter your builds, they will be countering the wrong builds and will be at a significant disadvantage.
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You are amazing dude. Seriously, amazing. GJ On this. I think this will really help the pros there, although there isn't much use of it for the regular laddering people.
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Football teams look other team's matches to analize their play, and that's usual.
I think using this kind of "hider" is kinda dirty...
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On September 18 2010 13:13 Ivanero wrote:
Football teams look other team's matches to analize their play, and that's usual.
I think using this kind of "hider" is kinda dirty...
It is literally illegal to film and analyze an NFL team's practice sessions. Anyone can watch their previous performances, just like you can watch anyone's VOD or tournament replay, but watching their private practice shouldn't be allowed. Poor analogy.
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On September 18 2010 13:16 urashimakt wrote:Show nested quote +On September 18 2010 13:13 Ivanero wrote:
Football teams look other team's matches to analize their play, and that's usual.
I think using this kind of "hider" is kinda dirty... It is literally illegal to film and analyze an NFL team's practice sessions. Anyone can watch their previous performances, just like you can watch anyone's VOD or tournament replay, but watching their private practice shouldn't be allowed. Poor analogy.
Actually his analogy was correct, but it just proves the opposite argument of his lolol
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On September 18 2010 13:13 Ivanero wrote:
Football teams look other team's matches to analize their play, and that's usual.
I think using this kind of "hider" is kinda dirty...
Problem with that analogy is that there are way too many variables in that compared to SC2. You also have those damn refs ha ha. There are tendencies in sports, but the fact that it's team sports (where they actually have film and analyze, also both teams do it knowingly, not a secret), it's just hard to commit against a specific game plan. Yeah, you'll know what they do, but the skill of each individual player matters, + random breakout plays from one player. I can see your point, but it's just not close enough.
Hiding as dirty? I can agree with that...but hey, the game is young...
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On September 18 2010 13:19 EliteAzn wrote:Show nested quote +On September 18 2010 13:13 Ivanero wrote:
Football teams look other team's matches to analize their play, and that's usual.
I think using this kind of "hider" is kinda dirty... Problem with that analogy is that there are way too many variables in that compared to SC2. You also have those damn refs ha ha. There are tendencies in sports, but the fact that it's team sports (where they actually have film and analyze, also both teams do it knowingly, not a secret), it's just hard to commit against a specific game plan. Yeah, you'll know what they do, but the skill of each individual player matters, + random breakout plays from one player. I can see your point, but it's just not close enough. Hiding as dirty? I can agree with that...but hey, the game is young...
How is it dirty? You might as well argue that picking terran is dirty.
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On September 18 2010 13:24 Half wrote:Show nested quote +On September 18 2010 13:19 EliteAzn wrote:On September 18 2010 13:13 Ivanero wrote:
Football teams look other team's matches to analize their play, and that's usual.
I think using this kind of "hider" is kinda dirty... Problem with that analogy is that there are way too many variables in that compared to SC2. You also have those damn refs ha ha. There are tendencies in sports, but the fact that it's team sports (where they actually have film and analyze, also both teams do it knowingly, not a secret), it's just hard to commit against a specific game plan. Yeah, you'll know what they do, but the skill of each individual player matters, + random breakout plays from one player. I can see your point, but it's just not close enough. Hiding as dirty? I can agree with that...but hey, the game is young... How is it dirty? You might as well argue that picking terran is dirty.
I'm not sure where the Terran part comes in, but yeah, most people would tell you that privacy is a pretty cool idea.
Well, maybe not if they work for a government.
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On September 18 2010 13:27 urashimakt wrote:Show nested quote +On September 18 2010 13:24 Half wrote:On September 18 2010 13:19 EliteAzn wrote:On September 18 2010 13:13 Ivanero wrote:
Football teams look other team's matches to analize their play, and that's usual.
I think using this kind of "hider" is kinda dirty... Problem with that analogy is that there are way too many variables in that compared to SC2. You also have those damn refs ha ha. There are tendencies in sports, but the fact that it's team sports (where they actually have film and analyze, also both teams do it knowingly, not a secret), it's just hard to commit against a specific game plan. Yeah, you'll know what they do, but the skill of each individual player matters, + random breakout plays from one player. I can see your point, but it's just not close enough. Hiding as dirty? I can agree with that...but hey, the game is young... How is it dirty? You might as well argue that picking terran is dirty. I'm not sure where the Terran part comes in, but yeah, most people would tell you that privacy is a pretty cool idea. Well, maybe not if they work for a government.
The thing is, the player is going out of his/her way to hide his/her data...that's the only shady part about it.
It's just something Blizzard didn't think about when releasing the game (the fact that this data is open to everyone)
@half, Plus, i'm not THAT stupid to start mentioning Terran when there is no relationship to it whatsoever, that was just random of you.
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On September 18 2010 13:30 EliteAzn wrote:Show nested quote +On September 18 2010 13:27 urashimakt wrote:On September 18 2010 13:24 Half wrote:On September 18 2010 13:19 EliteAzn wrote:On September 18 2010 13:13 Ivanero wrote:
Football teams look other team's matches to analize their play, and that's usual.
I think using this kind of "hider" is kinda dirty... Problem with that analogy is that there are way too many variables in that compared to SC2. You also have those damn refs ha ha. There are tendencies in sports, but the fact that it's team sports (where they actually have film and analyze, also both teams do it knowingly, not a secret), it's just hard to commit against a specific game plan. Yeah, you'll know what they do, but the skill of each individual player matters, + random breakout plays from one player. I can see your point, but it's just not close enough. Hiding as dirty? I can agree with that...but hey, the game is young... How is it dirty? You might as well argue that picking terran is dirty. I'm not sure where the Terran part comes in, but yeah, most people would tell you that privacy is a pretty cool idea. Well, maybe not if they work for a government. The thing is, the player is going out of his/her way to hide his/her data...that's the only shady part about it. It's just something Blizzard didn't think about when releasing the game (the fact that this data is open to everyone) @half, Plus, i'm not THAT stupid to start mentioning Terran when there is no relationship to it whatsoever, that was just random of you.
If you are of the opinion that they shouldn't have to go out of their way to hide their practice sessions, it's probably easier to believe that it's no big deal that they do go out of their way. Everyone looks at everything differently, though.
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On September 18 2010 13:36 urashimakt wrote:Show nested quote +On September 18 2010 13:30 EliteAzn wrote:On September 18 2010 13:27 urashimakt wrote:On September 18 2010 13:24 Half wrote:On September 18 2010 13:19 EliteAzn wrote:On September 18 2010 13:13 Ivanero wrote:
Football teams look other team's matches to analize their play, and that's usual.
I think using this kind of "hider" is kinda dirty... Problem with that analogy is that there are way too many variables in that compared to SC2. You also have those damn refs ha ha. There are tendencies in sports, but the fact that it's team sports (where they actually have film and analyze, also both teams do it knowingly, not a secret), it's just hard to commit against a specific game plan. Yeah, you'll know what they do, but the skill of each individual player matters, + random breakout plays from one player. I can see your point, but it's just not close enough. Hiding as dirty? I can agree with that...but hey, the game is young... How is it dirty? You might as well argue that picking terran is dirty. I'm not sure where the Terran part comes in, but yeah, most people would tell you that privacy is a pretty cool idea. Well, maybe not if they work for a government. The thing is, the player is going out of his/her way to hide his/her data...that's the only shady part about it. It's just something Blizzard didn't think about when releasing the game (the fact that this data is open to everyone) @half, Plus, i'm not THAT stupid to start mentioning Terran when there is no relationship to it whatsoever, that was just random of you. If you are of the opinion that they shouldn't have to go out of their way to hide their practice sessions, it's probably easier to believe that it's no big deal that they do go out of their way. Everyone looks at everything differently, though.
Funny thing is that it's already dirty enough for the opponent to look at private practices lol.
like for me on the dirty scale (1 is dust, 10 is full blow mud), hiding data is like 1.5, while researching other's private practices is like 9...Not saying it's super dirty, but I can agree that it can be looked at as dirty...really dirty? not really
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Nice find :-) I hope a lot of players read this thread ^^
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Absolutely awesome idea. Hopefully this BO sniffing bs will see a decrease. I always found prolevel SC1 to be reminiscent of chess, You learn what the other's favored openings in certain situations are, as well as their particular style of play in different parts of the game. However, it is a bit hard to come across all the practice games of a chess player, so players, in anticipation of their rivals, would just go through tournament level games, and other readily accessible games. I found that to be a perfect balance. It bred quite a bit of mindgames in SC1, with players countering the counter that they expect in the finals, and the like. But all this BO finding crap... ugh, just makes my stomach hurt.
/rant
Thank you, OP.
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Cool post
wasn't it also possible to "hide" your builds with yabot and resetting?
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On September 18 2010 13:13 Ivanero wrote:
Football teams look other team's matches to analize their play, and that's usual.
I think using this kind of "hider" is kinda dirty...
Lol Pats fans...
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On September 19 2010 01:03 Cybren wrote:
Cool post
wasn't it also possible to "hide" your builds with yabot and resetting?
You could just use Yabot in offline mode to accomplish this as well.
The new version that allows online play is nice, but it's just way too buggy for me. It tends to freeze on me a lot.
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Has Desert Oasis been updated?
btw, remember how in BW there was a regular version and an OBS version for every map?
Well people should make a regular one and a BOH version now.
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Updating it in the U.S. now, sorry. I got lazy and was waiting for someone to say they were actually using it.
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Hey, are these still on EU? I cant find them.
edit nvm, found them when i searched for "bohide", was searching for "BO Hider"
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^ I can't find them with either terms, im guessing this is due to bnet 2.0 failings. Can anyone shed any light on this? ty
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EU map search has been broken since 1.1... If you spam the search, it might work once in 50 times or something depending on how the servers are that day.
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wow, i guess TLO and NonY will be so happy right now
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Whatever happen to mixing up your strategy so build orders didnt matter? I mean like if you need to play BO hidden maps aren't you being to predictable?
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^ say you have an awesome idea and want to save it for a big tournament, how do you practice it with your teammates in secret without your opponent being able to see it in advance?
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I've not experienced the EU search problem deal, but I know that right now if you search for "bo hider" in the US you'll pull up all maps containing the string "bo", which isn't something that happened before. Oddly, searching "bohider" as one word works. Worst search system ever!
On October 01 2010 19:56 Yilar wrote:
Whatever happen to mixing up your strategy so build orders didnt matter? I mean like if you need to play BO hidden maps aren't you being to predictable?
That's good to do so that your opponent doesn't adapt to your one strategy that you use over and over again, but in sports (from football to chess) the privacy of strategy development is protected. The first time you unveil a brand new strategy, it should be absolutely unpredictable!
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I hope people take advantage of this for the next gsl and come up with some really sneaky builds =D
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Has anyone who has used these maps come up with any replay bugs? As far as I can tell, the replays work completely fine. However, Plexa said earlier that the BO Hider maps bug replays. Since I can't find this, I can't fix it, but if someone else knows any issues with them I can take a whack at it.
As soon as I'm back in town I'd like to fix up the BO Hider maps so that they are completely devoid of information, like ending games in a tie instead of win/loss. Even if TL doesn't use this for their own replay castings, smaller tournaments who can't get their hands on unlimited guest passes could.
So, to reiterate, if you've personally witnessed a bug with BO Hider replays please PM or reply here!
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well, i have problems with replays. they dont save automatically and i cant save them manually after the match.
i´m using the maps of teddybear found on bnet
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EPT
