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Forum Index > SC2 General
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hacpee
Profile Joined November 2007
United States752 Posts
August 29 2010 02:19 GMT
#1581
They need to revert the zealot change, significantly increase banshee cloak research time and nerf broodlords.
Black Gun
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Germany4482 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-29 02:29:53
August 29 2010 02:23 GMT
#1582
On August 29 2010 11:10 kickinhead wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 29 2010 11:04 ziteNiA wrote:
OH good nerf MMM


Why?

bio is balanced in tvz and prooss rapes bio with speedlots and storm... Don't whine about balance when protoss is simply playing stupid...





no one claims mmm would be op once u have chargelots and storms out. (although 4 or 8 marauder drops still are ridiculous at nexus sniping, but w/e.)

what is imba in tvp atm is the timing window when the terran has a big bio ball of marines and tons of marauders with concussive shell and stim while the toss does not have chargelots/clossi with range/storms out. during this timing window, they have absolute and undisputed mapcontrol which can be used to safely expand while the toss is contained to onebase play. the imbalance during this timing window is so huge that they dont even have to produce any hard to maintain it. if he was pumping lots of marauders by then, e.g. after going 3 rax, the only thing preventing us tosses from dying instantly and every single time to it are forcefields on the ramp. but this only delays the death against competent Ts as they are gonna roll u with the macro from a 2 to 1 base advantage.

vrs arent viable on every map/every starting location, so no general answer to this problem.
"What am I supposed to do against this?" - "Lose!" :-]
ziteNiA
Profile Joined April 2010
Sweden73 Posts
August 29 2010 03:08 GMT
#1583
I think they should fix protoss anitair cuz its really bad if a zerg goes massmutta and harass you all time.
Day9 for President
charlie420247
Profile Joined November 2009
United States692 Posts
August 29 2010 03:10 GMT
#1584
i already 8 pool nearly every single game in zvp on stepps of war for the 3 min win. now its just gonna be that much easier.
there are 10 types of people in this world, those who understand binary and those who dont.
swanized
Profile Blog Joined September 2009
Canada2480 Posts
August 29 2010 03:12 GMT
#1585
love th BC nerf, BC are such a boring unit to watch, I hope no one ever gets those out
Writer
DooMDash
Profile Joined May 2010
United States1015 Posts
August 29 2010 03:15 GMT
#1586
On August 29 2010 12:12 swanized wrote:
love th BC nerf, BC are such a boring unit to watch, I hope no one ever gets those out

What? Really? I hope you're kidding.
S1 3500+ Master T. S2 1600+ Master T.
Half
Profile Joined March 2010
United States2554 Posts
August 29 2010 03:19 GMT
#1587
On August 29 2010 10:55 Scope wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 29 2010 10:45 kickinhead wrote:
On August 29 2010 10:42 DTown wrote:
On August 29 2010 10:41 kickinhead wrote:
On August 29 2010 10:33 DTown wrote:

But seriously, I think 40 + 10 would be ok.. but 35 +15 is a little too far. Maybe the siege tank should be 10 dmg/per shot with 5 attacks, so 50dmg in total that way it kills immortals.

So you want sieged tanks to be super-effective against the exact unit which is essentially designed to counter tanks...?


...which is?....

Immortals are specifically designed to counter siege tanks.


zealots in patch 1.1 will pwn tnks so hard no1 will even think about making immos...



Like in BW you mean?


Zealots have charge in BW?

Fuck...time to switch races.
Too Busy to Troll!
charlie420247
Profile Joined November 2009
United States692 Posts
August 29 2010 03:23 GMT
#1588
On August 28 2010 04:42 RxN wrote:
People are really saying 6 pool is going to be OP? Give me a break. It's awful and anyone with a brains knows it. It's so bad that you can still have your pool building as the lings arrive at your base in a ZvZ and still hold it off, even with them dropping a spine crawler on top of it.



anyone who 6 pools a zerg is an idiot. the reason 6 pool will be so powerful now is because its already extremely strong against protoss on small maps like stepps.
there are 10 types of people in this world, those who understand binary and those who dont.
xnub
Profile Joined August 2009
Canada610 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-29 03:35:11
August 29 2010 03:31 GMT
#1589
On August 29 2010 09:00 Ascendant13 wrote:
So... No changes to stim? EMP? Marauders? Anything really? Good lord, does Blizzard play this game?



They do but not in your copper leagues : P
Loving the beta !! Weeeeeeee
Knutzi
Profile Joined July 2009
Norway664 Posts
August 29 2010 03:35 GMT
#1590
if these are the only changes then good bye protoss race
Ascendant13
Profile Joined August 2010
66 Posts
August 29 2010 03:45 GMT
#1591
On August 29 2010 12:31 xnub wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 29 2010 09:00 Ascendant13 wrote:
So... No changes to stim? EMP? Marauders? Anything really? Good lord, does Blizzard play this game?



They do but not in your copper leagues : P


700+ diamond, so I have some vague idea how to play, lol.
WniO
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States2706 Posts
August 29 2010 03:48 GMT
#1592
On August 29 2010 12:08 ziteNiA wrote:
I think they should fix protoss anitair cuz its really bad if a zerg goes massmutta and harass you all time.

really? just get stalkers/sentries and maybe a cannon or two at your expos. the anti air is very reasonable compared to zergs queens/spores early on.
arb
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
Noobville17922 Posts
August 29 2010 03:49 GMT
#1593
On August 29 2010 12:08 ziteNiA wrote:
I think they should fix protoss anitair cuz its really bad if a zerg goes massmutta and harass you all time.

This, playing as protoss the only thing i lose against regularly is mutaling, mutas are just so fucking cost effective in mass vs protoss its retarded, and storm is shit and so archons, sure you can get a bunch of phoenix but they just get more lings and your small ass ground army gets skull fucked and you lose

Protoss needs a good AA unit or somethign to deter this mass muta bullshit
Artillery spawned from the forges of Hell
doffe
Profile Joined June 2010
Sweden636 Posts
August 29 2010 03:49 GMT
#1594
actually im quite confused. If you ask me as a zerg player the tanks was not the biggest problem. Well, on the other hand I can now use hydras against terran wich ive never done so far but anyhow. Seeing VODs of top tier players it just have seemed like 90% of all terrans in TvP goes 100% bio, even lategame. Maybe some ghosts there to emp the templars but thats it. And its ridicolously effective against anything the toss can put out. Zure, storm + chargelots are a good counter but tbh, of all the toptier games ive seen the terran mostly wins. Since I do not play neither terran nor protoss I cant really give any depth to this but I really thought some small nerf to bio (longer/late/more expensive tech) was more important then the tanks. Well see what this brings. And the ultranerf seems abit silly, has it ever been overpowered? Sure it demolishes some armys but really, so do alot of other units and if you just scout it correctly ultras is not that big of a problem but hey, its not a big nerf so w/e. Just would have wished they could have made it abit smaller aswell, its more or less unmicroable as of now =)
FuryX
Profile Joined April 2010
Australia495 Posts
August 29 2010 03:49 GMT
#1595
Idra finds out about 1.1 patch!
doffe
Profile Joined June 2010
Sweden636 Posts
August 29 2010 03:53 GMT
#1596
protoss AA against mutas? with good "micro" (good not really needed) one phoenix can kill so many mutas.. get 4-5 phoenix and be active with them and you will more or less shut down all muta harass, atleast until he gets either corruptors or infestors to hold ur silly autoshooting phoenixes in place. And sure, mutas are decent against stalkers actually but not really cost effective against the, the same amount of resources of stalkers will own the mutas and with blink you can snipe some every time he attacks. Imo nothing wrong with mutas or toss AA
xNaquada
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada19 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-29 03:58:54
August 29 2010 03:55 GMT
#1597
Cant say I agree with the Battlecruiser and Zealot nerf (where did these come from?). WarpGates still make gateways completely obsolete from the 3rd-4th unit on. My understanding of the Ultralisk "nerf" is that its actually a buff since its doing same ~dmg but gains +2 area/splash damage. All we loose is (i assume) the ram animation.(Someone can correct me here...)

Siegetanks got absolutely nerfed to hell, and yet people are still complaining about Terran. My god play the patch first before you condemn the balance changes. Still curious as to the unsieged damage values of the tank...but then again whats the point in building them (for roaming) when a marauder is cheaper/easier in techtree to reach, costs less supply, has concussive and stims? (serious question...) At least Hydralisks might be used more....

IMO. Siegetanks are now arguably on par/slightly nerfed with broodwar, (since it costs 1 more supply which is a huge deal) when the cost of 3 tanks HAS to include a supply depot(+buildtime if you are pushing out early). Everyone seems to forget that part. Of course I fully admit the "smarter AI" is a bit of a wildcard that should be accounted for.. however the surround and movement AI and the ability to queue attack orders/per unit should also benefit the units attacking the tanks as well (specifically zealots/lings (after this patch).

IN the end all we can do is wait and play and see what happens.

But yes lets all complain non stop about Terran.
Pertinacious
Profile Joined May 2010
United States82 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-29 04:01:06
August 29 2010 03:55 GMT
#1598
Zealot change makes no sense. Don't think Ultralisk or BC nerf was needed either.

I think changing Reaper range to 4 or 3.5 would be a better nerf for them. Interested to see how the tank change plays out.
Random
esaul17
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada547 Posts
August 29 2010 04:02 GMT
#1599
On August 29 2010 09:01 PrinceXizor wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 29 2010 07:11 esaul17 wrote:

Siege tank nerf was was good, and the other nerfs seem good for TvZ, I feel like PvT's early to midgame makes it very hard for toss to make it to late game without a disadvantage, and by late game they are barely even at best anyway.

Yeah the PvT situation you mention seems alot like the PvZ situation that caused the zealot nerf.


Since I'm a P player I obviously have a bias, but I generally felt like 2-gate openings at worst would force a zerg to not early-expand on a 2 player short rush distance map. I feel like as soon as they got roaches up, it was fine. Same with if they got banelings. It just may deny an early expand.

With PvT, I feel like P needs Tier 3 to really be "okay" in that way.
Reubachi
Profile Joined January 2008
United States40 Posts
August 29 2010 04:04 GMT
#1600
Now, I'm no expert, but wasn't the main problem across all the races the Terran bio ball? Where's that nerf? And with the zealot and tank nerf, mmm is now much more viable. Like somebody else said, doesn't Blizzard play their game?
A raisin in the sun is a lot less of a grape than a regular raisin.
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